How Woke is it?
Is Bond constantly undermined, sidelined and effectively replaced by Double-O-Diversity, or does she just snipe at him every now and then but basically leave him to save the world (as he should)?
No spoilers please.
They snipe at each other, really. For the most part the movie isn’t “woke”. Bond is front and centre throughout and, ultimately, the movie kinda beats you over the head with the fact that there can only be one 007, really. Bond himself. Even the new 007 acknowledges this (although she doesn’t particularly care for the number either way).
It was a clever PR stunt to get people talking about the film. That’s what I think. I don’t see how it’s a “Bond film for the Me Too era”. I think all that was just to get people talking about the film.
Even the new 007 acknowledges this (although she doesn’t particularly care for the number either way)
Then the new 007 is a "she". Lashana Lynch is the new 007, isn't it? share
Yes but she's barely in the movie compared to Bond, it's really just a gimmick to gain a wider audience.
shareto gain a wider audience?
don't you know this will cause the exact opposite?
people aren't paying for woke shit. and those who claim they are woke, are broke
It’s hardly woke when you see it in action, though. It’s only natural that they would replace 007 and give his number to someone place. Yes she’s a black woman. So what? If she was portrayed as being superior to Bond you’d have a point but she isn’t.
shareYes she [next 007] is a black woman. So what?
Given the current zeitgeist, it heavily reinforces the argument that the franchise has converged, AKA gone Woke. share
Ultimately the proof is, as they say, in the pudding. Regardless of how the marketing seemed, the movie itself is not “woke”. Although, I guess if you’re looking for things you could interpret it to be woke. For instance (Spoiler), Q is confirmed to be gay in this movie. Is that woke in your opinion? Not to me. To me woke is when you’re being basically lectured by a movie or they’re deliberately undermining well established characters like Bond. None of that happens here. It all feels organic and natural. Nothing felt forced or out of place.
shareUltimately the proof is, as they say, in the pudding. Regardless of how the marketing seemed, the movie itself is not “woke”.
And I said I wasn't going to pay to see this crap BECAUSE of the marketing, and I've been a HUGE Bond fan since the Connery days. Everyone I know who is also a Bond fan had the exact same reaction as I did, as well as many more on another forum I visit (although some did pay for it because they and their family are Bond fans and they came back sorely disappointed due to certain events).
Q is confirmed to be gay in this movie. Is that woke in your opinion? Not to me
Was there a reason for Q to be gay in the film and is him being gay something that is pivotal to the overall plot? Because if not then it is woke. And it IS a problem for me because it's more hetero-conversion since Q was never gay before.
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Love Bond, Connery through now, but I absolutely will not watch this garbage
shareYeah that's what makes this so sad. It burns me up inside so much what they did to one of my favorite franchises.
shareThey're doing it to all our characters. This shit is planned demoralization
shareThat's true.
With Bond gone and Indiana Jones next, is there even anymore mainstream heroes left for them to ravage with their propaganda?
They've wrecked
Picard
Kirk,Bones, Spock
He-Man
Bond
Marvel/DC characters
Tolkien characters
Those are off the top of my head I'm sure I'm forgetting some
Q being gay is a combination of Woke and the silly modern obsession with a 'backstory' of the personal lives of characters. As far as I know the sexual preference of the old Q (Major Boothroyd) was never alluded to, so there's no reason for them to work it into the new version.
shareYes making someone gay FOR NO OTHER REASON THAN TO MAKE HIM GAY is woke. And especially if they do it to a character than wasn't gay before. This is the definition of PC wokeness.
shareIt’s literally one line (“he’s coming for dinner), that’s it. Hardly beating over the head with the fact Q is gay. Also, this version of Q has never stated his sexuality before and the actor who plays him is gay in real life, so if anything I always suspected this version of Q was gay,
shareYou seem very happy about it.
shareI’m indifferent about it. It doesn’t impact on the plot in any way. I mean, if Q’s boyfriend was a major character who gets kidnapped to blackmail Q or some shit, then I’d get your point, but as it is it’s completely irrelevant. Yes, perhaps it is a case of box ticking, but so long as it doesn’t impact the plot I don’t care.
shareWhat does an actor's sexuality have anything to do with it? Where is the actual need to make Q gay in the plot? There is none. They only made him so to check leftist political diversity boxes. My point stands.
share"Yes she’s a black woman. So what?"
So what?? So what?? I'll tell you so what. Black people are already way overrepresented in films like this. The new 007 should be a truly underrepresented minority, like an Uighur chick.
The actual character is what ultimately matters, and Nomi (the new 007) is an interesting character who clashes well with Bond and ultimately grows to respect him to such a degree she gives up her 00 status for him.
If she’d been portrayed as superior to Bond or having zero respect for him, etc, and her just making jabs at him and him not jabbing back, then I’d agree with you. But that isn’t the case and if you’d seen the film you’d understand. If your only problem is her ethnicity I don’t get it.
It also signals that they are ignoring the most basic premise of Bond. 00's are a specific class of spies, and Bond was simply the 7th of them, when they added another 00 agent it would have been 008, then 009 and so on.
shareUmm... in that case, 010 wouldn't be a 00 agent tho'.
shareThere have never, ever been more that 3 00 operatives: 003, 005 and 007. Ian Fleming’s novels stated that very clearly.
shareYou are flat out wrong... going strictly by Fleming's stories you have:
006 in His Majesty's Secret Service
008 in Goldfinger
009 in Thunderball
0011 in Moonraker
and of course 007 in all the Bond books...
So at the very least learn your Bond before you go babbling about things you don't know.
Also I believe when one of them perishes the 00 is assigned to another agent who is capable of fulfilling that role. I believe 006 also appeared in Everything or Nothing, but (spoiler) was killed by Willem Dafoe before Bond could save him.
shareI was only referencing the books written by Fleming as the previous post was babbling about there only being 3 double on agents in the books. Where apparently he has bothered to read all the books or has a bad memory if he did read them.
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