MovieChat Forums > Avatar: The Way of Water (2022) Discussion > 2 billion looks easy at this point.

2 billion looks easy at this point.


Looks like Cameron redeemed himself with this gem. My theater was full and most everyone clapped at the end which is really rare. Flopkanda doesn't stand a chance against this titan.

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redeemed himself from what, that pos Dark Fate ?

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He did not direct that. Your knowledge sucks.

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People saying that Avatar 2 would suck and that he was washed up as a director.

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its no where near as good as the first one, hes nowhere near as good as he used to be, he is washed up.

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WORLDWIDE
$1,168,717,914

2 weeks

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Exactly… the fact that this movie made over 2 billion is irrelevant. People just seem to enjoy watching garbage movies nowadays. I haven’t watched the first one and do not intend on watching this one or the next. The story concept doesn’t interest me in the slightest.
Masses and masses of people just love shoveling shit into their mouth while thinking its good.

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agree, its usually marvel movies that most people flock to.

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Yeah. Am i the only one who remembers a time when its was only geeks and nerds who liked superhero crap? I swear it wasn’t that long ago. Now it seems everyone and their mother watches that garbage.

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Yeh because there great movies

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While I never watched one. I can say with confidence that great is a very generous word.

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yeah no, that would be like saying sandpaper is good for wiping your butt...

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No its not, there mostly criticallly aclaimed by critics and audiences, far superior to dc

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Well, considering the original is the top-grossing film of all time, while this sequel is poised to lose money, those people may have a case. I'm not hearing much that's positive about this film, and it didn't have a particularly strong opening weekend stateside, so while time will tell if he's "washed up" or not, this film looks like it will turn out to be a costly vanity project.

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Why is it making so much money then?

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Because it's the sequel to Avatar.

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Not a very good sequel, it seems. The visuals, however...

To me, it's like the old argument with computer games when they became more graphically advanced in the early 1990s, where gameplay was sacrificed for graphical quality. Same with movies, except it's good plots being sacrificed for top visuals.

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I haven't seen it, but all reports I've heard are it's a lousy film as far as plot, story, and character go, but visually stunning. Not my kind of movie, but clearly the kind that will pack theaters.

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Domestic Box Office $521,106,779 Details
International Box Office $1,209,800,000 Details
Worldwide Box Office $1,730,906,779

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I heard the same about Ant-man 3, except that it isn't visually stunning. With it's sub-50 Metascore, sub-50 RT score, and B Cinemascore, it makes Avatar 3 look like a masterpiece, but you went, right?

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Worldwide Box Office $1,916,282,103

entering top 5 best movies of all time...

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Good for it.

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This aged well.

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this didnt age very well.

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Never underestimate James Cameron. He knows how to create great movies.

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No, people just know how to mindlessly flock to them.

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Same with Marvel movies. Marveltards are sheep and are instructed to watch them.

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Yup.

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if it's that easy then everyone should be making $2b movies, right?

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People latch on to a certain brand and then it becomes easy.

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If that theory was true, then why did Thor 4 flop?

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Because their movies do so well that you consider it to be flop.

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The numbers say its a flop.

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Haven't seen that.

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www.boxofficemojo.com

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No where's the link that says it flopped.

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Why was Thor: Love and Thunder a flop?
Thor: Love and Thunder, even though it was released in the summer and played in theaters up until its Disney+ release, left fans displeased and unsatisfied, angry about not living up to expectations, its use (or, more correctly, misuse) of characters, and humor that didn't land.

https://mesquite-news.com/thor-love-and-thunderdid-it-flop-or-are-fans-too-harsh/

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Is this a reply to me? This talks about how audiences didn't like it? Do you not know what a flop is?

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Yes, unless there is another gsmith9072.

Its a flop.

Budget was $250m

WORLDWIDE
$760,928,081

So you do 250 x 2.6 = 650

761 - 650 = 111

Thor 4 made an estimated $111m profit. Thats a flop.

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Oh, is this a joke or something? I don't get it.

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This is how the movie industry works. The studio doesn't get a check for $761m.

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"Thor 4 made an estimated $111m profit. Thats a flop."

If you were joking you could have just said that instead of wasting my time. Must be REALLY bored.

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Like I said 10 months ago. Thor 4 is a flop.

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No it's not loon.

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Agree to disagree

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oof you got pwawned again....

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Dunce.

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hahaha you got pwned!

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If you're talking to me you're looney.

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I am and I am. lol

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At least you're aware.

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Eh, I see people clap a lot or shout in Marvel movies. I saw a woman some seats to my left hyperventilate when she saw Henry Cavil Superman appear in Black Adam.

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lol

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Cavil is vastly overrated. If he's going to cause so much fuss or so much fuss is being caused because of him, CAST SOMEONE ELSE.

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Lol, 2 billion no chance, 425 budget, flop incoming, wakanda forever wasnt a flop at all and will probably make more profit that avatar 2

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Release date: December 16, 2022 (USA)
Director: James Cameron
Budget: 250 million USD

Based on the 2.5 multiplier, Avatar 2 only has to make $625m to break even.

WORLDWIDE
$434,500,000
3 days

Should be at $1.5b after 30 days.

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According to Cameron, you're wrong.

https://variety.com/2022/film/news/avatar-2-budget-expensive-2-billion-turn-profit-1235438907/

But you know that. You're a troll, posting whatever wishful thinking comes to mind in the moment.

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avatar 2 budget
www.google.com
About 1,080,000,000 results (0.55 seconds)
Avatar: The Way of Water/Budget
250 million USD

The reported budgets are always inflated, partly to build fan interest, and partly to increase tax write-offs. However, if we take the $250 million at face value, then that's $250 million the film needs to earn to cover the cost of making it.

Well over the cost of making the film, even if the exaggerated figure of $250 million is true.

It's widely known that studios keep 65% of domestic ticket sales, 40% of international ticket sales, and only 25% of Chinese ticket sales. Google can help you verify that if you are skeptical.

Disney has partnered with advertisers so the marketing budget is basically free.

https://www.fastcompany.com/90822702/avatar-way-of-water-disney-james-cameron-marketing-genius

Looking around this week, mere days before Avatar: The Way of Water’s premiere, it’s actually hard to find any marketing beyond the teasers and trailers. In terms of brand partnerships, Kellogg’s has adapted Frosted Flakes to Pandora Flakes (featuring blueberry blue moons!), and Mercedes-Benz created both an electric concept car dubbed AVTR and a new ad aligning its sustainability goals with Avatar’s underlying ecological messages.

The ticket sales data is on
boxofficemojo.com

After 3 days:

Domestic Ticket Sales: $135,000,000
International: $301,00,000

Disney's cut:

Domestic: $88,000,000
International: $121,000,000
Total Net from Ticket Sales: $209,000,000

If the math and logic won't convince anyone, perhaps they should consider that if Disney weren't making massive profits on these films they would not continue to make 3 or 4 every years.

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there you go, using logic and math, facts and stuff again. SMH lol

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Sometimes it seems pointless. So many people seem unaware that most of the promotion for these films is free in the form of corporate partnerships. They hear some made up number-- it won't be profitable until it makes $2 billion!-- and blindly accept it as gospel.

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Lol 625 million hahaha fucking quality , you're hate for marvel deludes you, you're failure is nowcomplete.

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wakanda 2 is a failure. wont make a billion like the first movie. this has to sting....

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Its a huge hit, never expected it to make a billion, billion dollar movies are rare these days since the pandemic, sorry, you lose, failed prediction.

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just passed a billion. made more money in a week then wokeganda.

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And absolutely buried Black Adam.

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Not seen that so call movie you refered to , wakanda forever was a smash hit, boom, you predicted flop, that thread aged terribly lol

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not a smash hit, it barely broke even and didnt make a billion like you predicted. thats a fail....

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I didnt predict a billion i predicted near the 800 million mark, im right you're wrong i win.

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2.4 billion, stupendous!

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250mil? So Amazons Bored of the Rings cost 4x as much? That’s kinda shocking. Wonder where Amazon spent the money.

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That $1billion for Rings of Power is for multiple seasons.

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WORLDWIDE
$2,026,675,670

Top 5 movie of all time.

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Top 6, not 5.

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WORLDWIDE
$2,177,913,346

Top 4 movie of all time.

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WORLDWIDE
$2,310,086,370

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Flopadam

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You mean Ant-Flop?

Black Adam barely broke even but it still made money for a D level character that nobody has heard of.

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Lol it made feck all money and is not a D level character, antman is however

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$2.5 billion! I was right.

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I predict a steep drop off. I'm going to see it later this week so I don't know how it plays yet. But this movie doesn't have the buzz the first one did where people wanted to see it again and again and again and again.

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WORLDWIDE
$2,320,250,281

thats one steep drop off...lol

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true dat. the success of this movie is a little mind boggling. i only went to see it once. i didn't think it was nearly as good as the first one.

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Not sure why people think this'll surpass the gross of the original or even make 2 billion. It's numbers right now are aligned with The Batman, Doctor Strange 2, Black Panther 2, and Top Gun Maverick, none of which made 2 billion. Those first three didn't even make 1 billion.

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It has very little competition for the next two months, so it might luck out in crossing a Billion, but yeah I don't think it will go much further than that.

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You're underestimating the foreign haul. It's been out less than week and it's already made more internationally than The Batman and BP2. And it'll catch DS 2 in that category over the weekend. It'll take a bit longer to reach Top Gun 2's foreign haul, but it will.

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People clapping at cinemas is such an Americanism. Everyone online (Americans I assume) talk about people clapping at the end of movies. I have never experienced that in my life. Here in Europe we just get up and walk out as soon as the credits begin rolling (some people stay for post credit scenes if they know there will be one). Masterpiece or disaster it doesn't matter. Never heard a single clap at the cinema in my life.

The clapping doesn't serve anything really. It only lets the other people in the cinema know that you enjoyed it. Because the cast and crew who made the film are not in attendance so...I don't understand why you need to let everyone else know you liked it.

Puzzling behaviour.

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Its an American thing I guess. I dont get it but its been a thing here for a long time. On really bad movies people will get up and leave super fast. On good movies people will stick around for the credits and talk about it.

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You sound like a robot or an emotionless Vulcan.

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It's a rare thing in the US, which I've only witnessed a couple times. and by a small portion of the audience. It's As
hardly a common practice. As far as the people they are clapping for not being in attendance, it's really no different than cheering for a sports team you're watching on tv, which I absolutely know Europeans do.

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i literally watched movies in theaters every single day from 2016 to 2019 and not ONCE did I witness people clapping at the end of a movie. The only times I've ever seen it are for The Polar Express (middle school field trip, made sense), Star Wars: Episode 7, and Avengers: Endgame.

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Interesting... I see a lot of footage of foreign cinemas filled with people whooping and cheering to an extent far greater than anything I've witnessed stateside. I have even experienced this myself during trips overseas. An audience in Copenhagen applauded at the end of a film, as did one in the Prague.

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https://www.the-numbers.com/movie/Avatar-The-Way-of-Water-(2022)#tab=summary

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What does that have to do with cheering audiences?

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You said Avatar 2 was a juvenile movie and that it would flop. And now you claim you dont know anything and that you are just guessing at numbers and percentages.

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That's not accurate at all, but even if it were, what does it have to do with what's being discussed here?

I expressed my opinion that Avatar is a typically mediocre blockbuster film of the sort that I don't like. I never made any prediction that it would flop. I remarked about a quote from James Cameron that was being discussed in which he said the film needs to make $2 billion to break even, and said that if that is true, the film may have a tough time becoming profitable. Cameron has since clarified his remark, which makes the entire discussion somewhat moot, though you keep bringing it up for reasons I don't understand.

And for the umpteenth time, I've never once claimed, pretended, or stated that I am any kind of box office expert. I wrote very clearly many times that according to numbers I found by Googling, studios make different percentages of ticket sales depending upon when, and where, the tickets are sold. If you interpret that as me claiming expertise, then the problem is your reading comprehension, not my writing.

Avatar 2 is, as I clearly stated I expected from the very get-go, making a lot of money at the box office. I don't know if it will make $2 billion, but it will certainly make a lot, because, as I pointed out-- audiences eat that crap up.

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Actually, you said the foreign audience eats that crap up, as opposed to the US audience that you claim is much more demanding. You seem to leave out that distinction now. Gee, I wonder why? Is it b/c your two examples are #1 (Top Gun 2) and #2 (Avatar 2) in the US as well? I don't know where this one will end up, but it will surely surpass the combined total of two major Marvel '22 releases (DS2 + Thor: L&T = $1.7B). And with BP2 fading and going to Disney+ in the less than a month, maybe any two major Marvel '22 releases. Ouch. All that opening weekend front loading didn't save those films from eventually getting crushed under a Cameron film's legs.

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Yeah, you prefer that higher brow stuff instead. Marvel is elevated spectacle, and so is...

https://moviechat.org/tt3741700/Godzilla-King-of-the-Monsters/5ce769afde6c627ec5856de4/Only-a-Week-to-Go

Only a Week to Go!
posted 4 years ago by FilmBuff (5434)
Next Thursday night we can finally see this film. I just bought my ticket-- 9:45 show in IMAX. Can't wait!


Avatar and Top Gun 2 are so juvenile compared to giant monster movies. Just can't stand CGI without substance!

FilmBuff's consistently inconsistent.

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I know you are not an expert thats what makes reading your posts so much fun.

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I get that you are biased, and forego all logic to tout the films you love and denigrate those you hate, but if we can use logic for a moment, Avatar 2 is going to need to make a LOT of money to match Black Panther 2's profits. It can be done, but it's not some automatic given at this point like you claim to believe.

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How is stating my opinion biased? Based on the current numbers I think it will hit $2b. Using logic, math and facts Avatar 2 will start making a profit around $650m, although that number might change based on the facts. Just because you like BP2 and think Avatar 2 is a juvenile movie doesn't mean it will flop. People went to see BP2 because Chadwick died. It was the same phenomenon when Furious 7 was released.

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I haven't seen either film. None of this is about liking or disliking anything. It's calling you out for declaring that Black Panther 2, made for far less than Avatar 2, needs $888 billion to break even, then saying Avatar 2 will start profiting around $650 million.

When you add up all the costs of making Avatar 2-- a film that has been in the works since 2010, and on which millions were spent before production even began-- you are almost certainly looking at almost a billion dollars, or more, worth of expenditure to get that thing into theaters. Then factor in that most of its money will come from overseas, where 40-75% of the box office goes to theaters. It's unlikely the film will make money.

This isn't meant to detract from the film in any way. Profit has nothing to do with a film's quality. Avatar 2 is a vanity project, and a labor of love, from James Cameron. He made it fully prepared to take a bath and eat losses, because it's a film he wanted to make. His track record is such that he found investors willing to gamble on him. It seems that gamble won't pay off, but that's Hollywood.

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That $888m was from Google. I am sure it is wrong. My math says the breakeven is around $625 BP2.

Based on what Google says, it cost $250m to make. I am sure that number might be a bit low but we don't know the actual cost yet. It might be a billion or it might not, we don't know yet and everything is pure speculation.

Disney has negotiated a deal to get 65% of domestic and 40% international and 25% of China, although China is a non factor now. The 75% might apply to Disney Marvel movies but in this case it doesn't apply to Disney Avatar movies.

Its true that money is not a good barometer to judge the quality of a movie. But with Avatar being certified fresh by Rotten Tomatoes and also has a 93% rating by fans. Its looking like Avatar 2 will be a smash hit just like the first. Although I don't think it will make as much as the first.

We will have to check in 60 days and revisit this again. For now its looking like Hollywood still has faith in James.

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You lose all credibility of your "facts" and "math" when you suggest wakanda 2 is a flop.

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It's his M.O. No amount of fact or logic is going to sway him.

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Here is Filmbuff's "facts" and "math".

Looking at the revenue we can directly track, i.e. ticket sales, we can see that the film has so far earned in its first 20 days:

Domestic ticket sales: $374,279,837
Disney gets 65% of that: $243,281,894

International ticket sales: $308,564,937
Disney gets 40% of that: $123,425,975

That's $431,990,912 in revenue from ticket sales alone. Add in $100,000,000 from the corporate partners, which is certainly far less than it actually got, and we see:

Cost to make movie: $250 million
Cost to promote movie: $100 million (at most)

Earned so far: $532 million

Profit after 20 days: ***$182 million***

---------------------------------------------------

After 24 days:

Domestic Ticket Sales: $393,724,077
International: $339,300,000

Disney's cut:

Domestic: $255,920,650
International: $135,720,000
Total Net from Ticket Sales: $391,640,650

Well over the cost of making the film, even if the exaggerated figure of $250 million is true.

Even if you subtract $37 million in TV ads, which certainly was covered from the sponsorship income, the film has still made ***$104,640,650*** so far, with much more to come.

Profit after 20 days: ***$182 million***
After 24 days: ***$104,640,650***

Somehow the movies profits went down after 4 days. And I am the one with no credibility. Sure. 🙄



The $37 million was from the first Black Panther.

Feb 22, 2018 — Walt Disney spent significant media dollars on national TV advertising for its Marvel action movie “Black Panther.” Over $37 million in

This is my favorite comment of all time.

[–] FilmBuff (5399) 20 days ago
That isn't how it works at all.

"The reported budgets are always inflated, partly to build fan interest, and partly to increase tax write-offs." However, if we take the $250 million at face value, then that's $250 million the film needs to earn to cover the cost of making it.


MartyDeniro and myself and dealing with a troll that just makes up numbers and percentages.

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The 40% international are only realistic for markets Disney is not itself publishing, most popular example is nowadays china. But in most free markets (major), Disney nowadays publish their own movies and they also get 60% + shares most of the time. Europe was basically kept hostage during each mega release since episode 7 with shitty share raises

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