As big of a pig as this guy is, every victim of his assaults that accepted money to remain quiet, are just as bad - Harvey Weinstein Discussion

[–] halomaniac88 (1736) 7 years ago

Well they had to think about their careers.........do you want to be blacklisted? It is the nature of the industry.

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[–] actionkamen (23176) 7 years ago

They can keep quiet, lie in wait, and pounce at the right time while not accepting the big fat juicy check.

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[–] halomaniac88 (1736) 7 years ago

Well, I honestly don't think Weinstein deserves any better.

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[–] Stratego (29460) 7 years ago

It's not about him deserving better, it's about other women deserving better. I don't agree these women are just as much to blame as Weinstein, but they do enable scumbags like him.

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[–] not_a_virus.exe (1267) 7 years ago

It's logic like that which will ensure that nothing will ever get done. Prioritizing your career over having been sexually assaulted is the height of vanity. It's more important to save your career than to get these pigs in jail where they belong? I don't think so. How about thinking about their next victims rather than keeping quiet for the sake of your career. Disgusting. All of them.

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[–] halomaniac88 (1736) 7 years ago

Showbiz has been a cesspool from the start, do you know about the crap hitchcock did to Tippi Hedren. Women need to know that the law can protect them, the public needs to boycott disreputable actors/directors.

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[–] not_a_virus.exe (1267) 7 years ago

The law CAN protect them, but they can't if they keep their mouths shut after accepting bribe money.

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[–] jackrt (206) 7 years ago

How are they even remotely as bad as Weinstein? People love to blame victims of sexual assault.

People will accept money from people like Weinstein because a well-known person like him could not only ruin someones career, but also ruin their life.

However bad it is to accept money to stay quiet, it's not even near as bad as what he did. Disgusting that you'd even think so.

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[–] not_a_virus.exe (1267) 7 years ago

Yes it is. Because the moment they accept his money, they're telling him that what he did is acceptable for the right price. You put yourself on his level the moment you agree to keep your mouth shut for the right price. That's absolutely disgusting in every regard. To care more about your career than putting a sexual deviant behind bars is only allowing it to happen to someone else. It's selfish and immoral. And to only come clean about it after ten years or twenty years once it's "safe" is the pinnacle of cowardice. If you accepted his money, Do right by the deal and keep your mouth shut like you're supposed to. Don't come clean. You don't deserve justice. You forfeited your right to get him behind bars the moment he paid you off.

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[–] TexasJack (12515) 7 years ago

I agree. I would like for each of the women he assaulted AFTER Rose McGowan to start giving her the same kind of abuse she is so self-righteously heaping on seemingly everyone these days.

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[–] jackrt (206) 7 years ago

His victims were actresses at the start of their career. He would blackmail them. How were they to know he was going to do it to someone else? That would be why they came forward now - because everyone else was. They realised they weren't the only victims.

Harvey Weinstein is (or WAS) a powerful man in the Hollywood industry. I don't think you're taking into account that he could literally prevent you from ever working again (not just in the Hollywood industry, but any job). It's one woman's word against a powerful Hollywood executive.

"Do right by the deal and keep your mouth shut like you're supposed to. Don't come clean. You don't deserve justice."

Wow. I really hope for your sake, no member of your family goes through what those actresses did. It would be a shame for them to have the courage to come clean just for you to then call them a coward.

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[–] Stratego (29460) 7 years ago

They must've realized before that they weren't the only victims, since it was appparently an "open secret" in Hollywood.

What bothers me about someone like Rose McGowan is that she blames men like Ben Affleck for not speaking out earlier. Well, I'm pretty sure he was also concerned about his career. You don't think Weinstein would've destroyed him? And if they feared for their careers, then why sue him in the first place?

Personally, I'm not saying these women need to stay quiet. They can reveal what happened, that they got assaulted, took the money to stay quiet and then let him go on to assault other women. It doesn't make them look good, though.

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[–] jackrt (206) 7 years ago

I do agree about Rose McGowan, she's being really hypocritical.
I don't agree with the hate male actors are getting for not coming forward. Seth MacFarlane is someone who knew because his friend told him, who was one of Harvey's victims, but asked him not to say anything - she told him in confidence.

Two very famous actresses recently came clean about Weinstein - Angelina Jolie and Gwyneth Paltrow. They both said they didn't feel comfortable coming forward about it (I'm guessing due to Weinstein's powerful status). Jolie said that, after the incident occurred with her, she refused to work with him and would warn woman before starting work with him.

Ben Affleck obviously shouldn't be getting hated for coming forward about it after so many years, although i see a lot of people are complaining that he has spoken out against Weinstein but defended his brother after he sexually harassed someone.

Although it was an "open secret" in Hollywood, his victims were only just getting their start in Hollywood and i'm guessing most wouldn't have known about it until they were more famous.

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[–] Stratego (29460) 7 years ago

Rose must have known there were more when Ben supposedly said he had told Weinstein to stop with his behavior.

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[–] brux (14666) 7 years ago

Your opinions are ignorant and just plain rude.

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[–] sleepingtiger (712) 7 years ago

not-a-virus:
No, it's not the "height of vanity", it's about the need to make a living. There are plenty of women in other profession besides the film business who have had to put up with the same types of harrassment from their bosses or men they worked with if they wanted to keep working. So, it has nothing to do with vanity and everything to do with paying the bills.
Back in the '90, when Weinstein was a huge, successful movie mogul, he had the power to literally make or break someone's career in Hollywood. And keep in mind, he approached a lot of these actresses when they were young,and new to the business, and hadn't yet learned how to protect themselves from predators like him. So if was easy for him to groom them and pounce on them whenever he felt like it---because they really were n no position to fight him off---it would just be looked at a just a "he said, she said" situation. It's all too easy too say what you or anyone else would have done at the time, and with that situalation

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[–] not_a_virus.exe (1267) 7 years ago

And what about now that they have already been made? Angelina Jolie? Gweneth Paltrow? kate Beckinsale? Now that they could stand on their own two feet, they said nothing. Didn't even attempt to put him behind bars. It took a NOBODY with NOTHING TO LOSE to do it. These women aren't heroes for speaking out, they're opportunists. Cowardly opportunists that lied in wait for someone to do their dirty work for them. Because risking their careers wasn't worth putting him behind bars. Unbelievable.

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[–] TaRaNRoD (1579) 7 years ago

It is a fucked up world we live in if denouncing a sexual assault is a risk factor for your career.

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[–] MickyMac (2982) 6 years ago

What evidence would his victims have to end him?

Victims of an assault do have a hard time coming out due to intimidation, feelings of humiliation and shame.

Weinstein did have people who would kill allegations about him in the press.

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[–] [deleted] 7 years ago

nasty

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[–] brux (14666) 7 years ago

You're crazy.
A prostitute solicits money for sex.
That is not prostitution.
Why do so many ignorant losers like you seem to always take
every opportunity to slam women, especially if they try to stand
up for themselves.
If a women did not take money and sued she would probably lose,
but in any and all cases no one would hire her in the acting field.
I just wonder what you would do, because there are men who
get harassed by men ... assuming you are man.
This is a fault in the system, you cannot blame people for being human.
I think what these women are doing is fine and the only recourse they
ever had, and this is just a drop in the bucket as well.

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[–] not_a_virus.exe (1267) 7 years ago

They DIDN'T try to stand up for themselves. They accepted money to stay quiet. That's NOT standing up for yourself, not even close. They traded in their dignity for bribe money. They're prostitutes. And yes I'll take every opportunity to slam women who deserve it. It's people like them who allow this trend of sexual assault to propagate in Hollywood and all for nothing more than a paycheck. The idea that "this is just the industry and they couldn't do anything" is complete horseshit. If every actress or model started coming clean about sexual harassment in the industry, things would change. But because all of them are "just being human" and accepting money to keep quiet, nothing ever changes. You're goddamn right I can blame them for it. Their choice to remain quiet in exchange for money directly impacts the future of the industry. It's sleazy and shameful.

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[–] brux (14666) 7 years ago

You can't really imply their motives. You do not know what they accepted money to stay quite at all. They accepted money because they thought it was the best course of action available.

Do you even work at all or do you just gobble like a turkey online. We all trade our dignity for work, the better work we get that allows us more dignity in our private lives the more we give up at work. If you think that is not true, then maybe you are brainwashed.

You just create straw man arguments and then mow them down. One person cannot change the system, and most of them do not have the money for legal representation at the time, nor the evidence. You are just annoying and misogynistic.

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[–] not_a_virus.exe (1267) 7 years ago

Accepting money to stay quiet after being strong-armed into providing sexual favors is the best course of action available? Are you nuts? Do you even hear yourself? That's the most idiotic defense I've heard since this story broke out.

And working in exchange for money isn't trading in dignity, it's working. Let's not pretend that the act of working in exchange for remuneration is in any way shape or form, the same as being cornered into doing sexual favors, and then being paid to keep quiet about it so the cycle can continue for other unsuspecting prey. Give me a break. It's unthinkable that you would even try to equate the two.

One person can't change the system, therefore everyone should just buck up and accept it for the way it is is that it? If you can't beat'em, join'em? What a profound sentiment for the future generation to make. Just accept that you're going to be used as a sperm receptacle by Hollywood instead of the actress you want to be and own it because that's just the way the business is? And you have the audacity to call ME the misogynist? I have much higher expectations for the women in Hollywood than you clearly do.

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[–] TaRaNRoD (1579) 7 years ago

Even though I disagree when op says that they are just as bad as him, he does have a fair point. They let themselves get bribed instead of exposing him for what he is. Sorry but they do share their part of the wrong.

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[–] brux (14666) 7 years ago

The victim gets to decide what justice they are happy with, not some loudmouth on the Internet that does not know what those people face and just takes a big negative shot at them to appeal to the anti-Hollywood crowd. There's no point there at all.

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[–] not_a_virus.exe (1267) 7 years ago

Um, no. They don't. That's why we have a justice system in this country. If you get raped, the law intervenes and decides punishment. You don't get to decide "well hey I know it was bad but he did give me a pretty big paycheck to keep quiet so I guess I'm ok with it and he can continue to do what he does best to other women trying to kickstart their careers". Not by a longshot.

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[–] brux (14666) 7 years ago

You have to report it first before the law gets involved, and sadly it can be a fearful crap-shoot for the victim which is why so many end up taking money. Jerks here are claiming it is because the victims are prostitutes or what not. That is stupid, and besides even prostitutes have the right to be protected from rape and exploitation.

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[–] not_a_virus.exe (1267) 7 years ago

Oh please don't give me that BS. Of course they have to be willing to take a chance risking their careers. No one's denying that. But to use that as a reason as to why they remained silent just makes them look like the shallow, greedy, selfish degenerates that they are. In particular the ones that boast about female empowerment while remaining silent on true sexism and misogyny in the industry like this. The idea that anyone should be sympathetic to their silence just because they were afraid to risk their careers is ludicrous. That's the kind of cowardice we should be defending? That between trying to organize themselves to get this man behind bars, they just kept their mouths shut in blissful ignorance while allowing him to continue his reign of sexual misconduct? I don't think so.

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[–] brux (14666) 7 years ago

Stop wasting my time. You are the kind of person who always thinks their opinions are fact and start off a discussion or argument calling the other person's opinion BS. You don't know what you are talking about.

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[–] not_a_virus.exe (1267) 7 years ago

If you feel your time is being wasted, then why do you continue to reply to me? You could stop at any time. You only feel the way you do because you can't support your arguments. You'd rather just dump mine out the window than articulate your own.

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[–] MagneticMonopole (286) 7 years ago

"But to use that as a reason as to why they remained silent just makes them look like the shallow, greedy, selfish degenerates that they are. "

Until you have lived life in the positions these victims were put in and experienced what it is like to be forced to make such life changing choices, you have absolutely zero moral authority or credibility to speak of. Reading your posts inclines me to think you have a child's understanding of how the adult world works in all its complexity.

And that fact that you would spend so much time condemning Weinstein's victims rather than Weinstein himself tells us all everything we need to know about your true ethical sensibilities and real agenda.

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[–] not_a_virus.exe (1267) 7 years ago

No it doesn't, as much as I'm sure you would love to pounce on the prospect of labeling me a rape apologist, I don't feel the need to condemn Weinstein because the world seems to be doing a perfectly good job of it without me. There's nothing I need to say about him that hasn't already been said.

What does need to be said however is how hypocritical this world is. And no, I don't need to "go inside the mind of a victim" in order to call them out over their silence. EVERY SINGLE TIME people like you make that defense, you basically protect them from any and all criticism.

Like the crowd that says "until you've been black, you can't understand" or "until you've been a woman, you can't understand" or "until you've practiced Islam, you can't understand" or "until you've been a minority, you can't understand". Go to hell. By that logic, I could just as easily spin that around to protect the mothers of domestic abuse that allow their children to get beaten and raped by their abusive husbands. Should we grant them the same forgiveness that you propose we do these women?

If that's the argument you want to make then we wouldn't have a justice system to speak of since no one running the law would be able to speak on anything the victims of crimes have gone through. What a juvenile argument to make.

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[–] MagneticMonopole (286) 7 years ago

"What does need to be said however is how hypocritical this world is. "

That isn't your agenda, pumpkin, as anyone with eyes can see. Your real agenda is to make victims of sexual harassment feel worse. You clearly have more sympathy for Weinstein than you do for them, and you aren't fooling anyone about that.

No one with any kind of moral intelligence would somehow equate women who took settlements with their abuser's activities. The adults in the room recognize that the real world involves grey areas and tough choices where women up against powerful men have to navigate treacherous waters if they want to have successful careers. But you aren't, mentally or ethically, much of an adult at all.

The real hypocrisy is to be found in people who claim to hold the moral high ground but who actively protected Weinstein and his activities by hounding journalists to stop them from publishing stories. If hypocrisy was ever really your agenda, you'd be restricting your comments and fake outrage to that.

But you really and obviously don't give a crap at all about the issue.

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[–] not_a_virus.exe (1267) 7 years ago

"If they want to have successful careers"

You SEE what you just said?! THIS is the kind of double standard I'm talking about. You completely understand that these women have traded in their souls to the devil in order to maintain their careers and somehow don't blame them for it?

All it would have taken is these women standing up for themselves and saying "I won't trade in my dignity for wealth". You just flat out admitted everything that I've been saying throughout this thread. That these women valued money and status and wealth and fame, over being treated like an object. And therefore they just accepted it. They allowed it to happen "for the sake of their successful careers".

They let a cancer grow inside their industry and remained silent because sacrificing their career was too much to gamble away to do the right thing.

Let's all be celebrities in Hollywood propping up women on this imaginary pedestal, but submit to the very same rape culture and toxic masculinity when it suits us.

Thank you very much for exemplifying the hypocrisy of Hollywood. And then you have the audacity to tell me the victims shouldn't be blamed? That sexual assault and rape can be ignored so long as it doesn't get in the way of high class lifestyles? Ridiculous.

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[–] MagneticMonopole (286) 7 years ago

"You completely understand that these women have traded in their souls to the devil in order to maintain their careers and somehow don't blame them for it? "

Here you go being an hysterical child who doesn't know how adult decisions are made or how the adult world works. They filed lawsuits which were settled under the condition of silence. This is quite common in and outside of the entertainment industry and only a ridiculous moron would compare it to selling their souls to the devil.

You don't know at all--AT ALL--what efforts they might have taken outside of the public eye to warn others about what Weinstein had going on. Case in point, I just listened to an interview with someone who studies workplace harassment for a living and it turns out that women often form tight knit "whispering circles" in an effort to protect one another from known predators. We know something like that was developing around this pig and almost certainly women who had won settlements were part of it.

When powerful men have the ability to destroy or harm careers in a system that supports them more than their victims, and where it is incredibly difficult for them to get justice within that system, since it is run by men, sometimes this is the better option.

Your TV movie fantasy of heroic people who "do the right thing" and sacrifice their dreams is not part of the functioning world. Again, you don't know what it is like to have to make these kinds of choices. And you obviously are only pretending to care. Please, don't even put on this act where you have genuine concerns about "rape culture". You don't have anything that even approaches real empathy for women in these situations--it shows.

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[–] not_a_virus.exe (1267) 7 years ago

That would be all fine and dandy if they didn't prod themselves up as moral arbiters. You think it's acceptable to just accept sexual misconduct in the workplace in order to get your leg up? That's fine. But what you don't get to do is preach about how sexual misconduct should be eliminated and how women need to stand up to misogyny and then turn a blind eye to what's happening in your own backyard. The hypocrisy of Hollywood is what is so infuriating. The moment you turn a blind eye to the very culture you shun just because it suits your own selfish lifestyle is the moment you need to sit down and shut up about when it happens outside.

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[–] MagneticMonopole (286) 7 years ago

"That would be all fine and dandy if they didn't prod themselves up as moral arbiters."

Provide a specific example with citations from responsible journalistic sources.

"You think it's acceptable to just accept sexual misconduct in the workplace in order to get your leg up?"

No one is saying this. This is all happening in your imagination.

"The hypocrisy of Hollywood is what is so infuriating. "

What's just as infuriating is the fake outrage from sexists pigs like yourself who possess not one ounce of empathy for what real women go through in these situations.

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[–] not_a_virus.exe (1267) 7 years ago

"Provide a specific example with citations from responsible journalistic sources."

You idiot. You just need to look at Meryl Streep prancing around championing for womens rights gender pay gap this and sexual assault that and then see her speech lamenting her sadness for the fact that Roman Polanski is in jail for raping a 13yo to see the insincerity.

How how Rose Mcgowan who is now coming forward as a victim of abuse from Weinstein also defended child rapist Victor Salva for his molestation of a 12yo on the set of Clownhouse. The hypocrisy is practically embedded in Hollywood.

How about Barbara Walters criticizing Corey Feldman for shaming an entire industry when he tried to come forward about the rampant pedophilia that plagued Hollywood?

"No one is saying this. This is all happening in your imagination."

YOU DID. In your previous post you just said that these women did what they did for the sake of their careers. You just flat out admitted that as long as they get something out of it, they can turn a blind eye.

"What's just as infuriating is the fake outrage from sexists pigs like yourself who possess not one ounce of empathy for what real women go through in these situations."

Oh? And how about the 30 years of fake outrage for Hollywood itself? That doesn't bother you? How these women champion for womens rights everywhere they can but protect REAL sexual predators in their own industry for their own selfish desires? How about THAT fake outrage?

It seems that they are perfectly ok with sexual harassment in the workforce as long as the predators can buy off their silence. What kind of message do you think that sends to women? More importantly, what kind of message do you think that sends to men? That for all the whining and bitching and crying about rape culture, it can all get swept under the rug as long as you're powerful and rich?

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[–] sleepingtiger (712) 7 years ago

not a virus:
If you bothered to read through some of the women's testimonies (which you clealry didn't) a women who was hired in as a scriptwriter went directly to the police and made a complaint. Weinstein stepped in and made a settlement with her, and she wound up leaving the company and never worked in the business again. Look it up, and stop assumptions about whatever the hell you think these women should have done.

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[–] not_a_virus.exe (1267) 7 years ago

No assumptions. Flat out assertions. And if this woman never worked in Hollywood again then clearly I wasn't talking about her was I? I'm talking about the hypocrite women that kept their mouths shut and went along with it for their the sake of their careers.

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[–] sleepingtiger (712) 7 years ago

Not a virus exe:

The truth is, Weinstein had not only been paying these women off and buying their silence for years, he had also threatened to have people fired if they printed anything about the accusation against him. If it was that damn easy to call him out publicly about his sexual harassment, don't you think a hell of a lot more people would have done it already?

And, yes, you won't understand certain people go through unless you're one of them, or walk in their shoes. If you're not black, you sure as hell won't understand how hell it feels to be constantly judged and thought less of simply because your skin is black, or if you're a woman. Your male arrogance claiming that you can't is pure bull****, so fuck off. As a white male, racism and sexism is something you NEVER have to deal with, because the whole damn world cater to you simply because you're white (if you are a white male, that is.) Get off your soapbox and stop acting like you got all the damn answers. The reality is, you don't know what the hell you would have done in that situation. Why the hell should those women have to have giving up any chance to start a career because of that *sshole

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[–] not_a_virus.exe (1267) 7 years ago

"The truth is, Weinstein had not only been paying these women off and buying their silence for years, he had also threatened to have people fired if they printed anything about the accusation against him. If it was that damn easy to call him out publicly about his sexual harassment, don't you think a hell of a lot more people would have done it already? "

Well it clearly WAS that easy now wasn't it? All it took were some good lawyers, a media team, and a woman willing to speak to him with a wire. That's literally ALL it took. That could have been achieved decades ago. If every single woman benefiting off of Weinstein had got together, pooled their money and funded the best lawyer in the entire world to put this man behind bars, recorded his interactions with them, you're telling me they couldn't do together as a team of 30 victims, what this one single woman did on her own? Give me a break.

"And, yes, you won't understand certain people go through unless you're one of them, or walk in their shoes. If you're not black, you sure as hell won't understand how hell it feels to be constantly judged and thought less of simply because your skin is black, or if you're a woman. Your male arrogance claiming that you can't is pure bull****, so fuck off. As a white male, racism and sexism is something you NEVER have to deal with, because the whole damn world cater to you simply because you're white (if you are a white male, that is.) Get off your soapbox and stop acting like you got all the damn answers. The reality is, you don't know what the hell you would have done in that situation. Why the hell should those women have to have giving up any chance to start a career because of that *sshole"

Why? Because they have no problem spouting off their bullshit about female empowerment that's why. If you depend on predators like Weinstein to keep your careers in check, then you are neither strong nor independent. Bunch of subservient hypocrites is what they are.

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[–] Cookie.L.A. (2117) 7 years ago

<< Well it clearly WAS that easy now wasn't it? All it took were some good lawyers, a media team, and a woman willing to speak to him with a wire. That's literally ALL it took. >>

It wasn't "that easy". The tape was made 2 years ago, and didn't prompt any arrest or deeper investigation. So don't act like this was some silver-bullet solution.

The model on the tape also said that going to the press and the police had devastating effects on her.

You're really oversimplifying things, in a very uniformed way.

SEE: http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2017/10/13/italian-beauty-queen-says-life-made-misery-claiming-harassment/
.

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[–] Cookie.L.A. (2117) 7 years ago

----------------------------------------------------------------

Italian beauty queen says her life was made a misery after claiming harassment by Harvey Weinstein

Ambra Battilana Gutierrez, the 24-year-old Italian model who was sexually harassed by Harvey Weinstein, says her life was made a misery after the encounter.

She said she was crucified by the US tabloid press as a publicity seeker after she accused Weinstein of groping her breasts and putting his hand up her skirt during a meeting at his office in 2015.

She said the alleged assault, which happened in Weinstein’s offices in the Tribeca Film Center in Lower Manhattan, was all the more distressing because her father used to beat her and her mother.

“They (the press) said horrible things about me. I don’t allow myself to be touched easily, and not just because of morals. My father used to beat me and my mother. When a man stretches his arms out to me, I retreat instinctively, even if it is someone I’m in love with,” she told Italy’s La Repubblica newspaper.

She said that after making a complaint to the NYPD, she was portrayed as a blackmailer in the press – and paid the consequences.

“For months I didn’t work. Even restaurants in Soho (in New York) where the fashion world hang out closed their doors to me. I was unwelcome. It is right that women are denouncing him, even after all this time. I’m nauseated by how many there are. What happened to me really put my view of the world to the test.

“I hope that this whole business will bring me justice. Nobody will be able to say ever again that I invent things.”
.

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[–] not_a_virus.exe (1267) 7 years ago

But in the end he lost everything. It took one woman to sacrifice her career for the sake of ruining this man's empire of sexual harassment. Now imagine what could have been done if it was an organized coup between all his female victims recording their sessions with him and pooling their money together to find the best lawyers. This could have been handled decades ago. But the fact is that his existence in Hollywood benefited them. No matter how much he hurt other women. One single Italian model with no credit to Hollywood, a nobody in anyone's eyes, and two years, managed to bring this man down after en entire industry treated him as invincible. It wasn't any of the established women that made their riches by staying silent, it was a nobody. Their silence enabled him. And that's the crus of my anger. After entire generations went by with their jargon about female empowerment and toxic masculinity and rape culture and all that horseshit, they were sleeping with the enemy - figuratively and literally - for their own sake.

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[–] Cookie.L.A. (2117) 7 years ago

<< imagine what could have been done if it was an organized coup between all his female victims recording their sessions with him and pooling their money together to find the best lawyers. This could have been handled decades ago. >>

You obviously feel very strongly about organizing something like this, and I think you should fly right to Hollywood and DO IT! The town needs you!

There are many other sleazy professionals, male and female, out there and you are just the Answer Man the town needs to set everything straight.
.

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[–] not_a_virus.exe (1267) 7 years ago

Except I don't have any power, influence, money, or connections to make it happen. Hence my pointing out the hypocrisy of it all. Women like Angelina Jolie, Gweneth Paltrow, Kate Beckinsale, Ashley Judd, Glenn Close, Jane Fonda, these are EXTREMELY powerful women in the industry that, if having organized a coup to topple this monster, could have made history for women across the world "smashing the patriarchy". Did it happen? No. Why would it? They were rich. Why risk losing that money and fame to make history to establish a Hollywood that isn't founded upon rape and sexual assault? Why clean out their industry with predatory pigs for the next generation of female actors? Don't they care about the well being of women like they claim. Clearly not.

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[–] sleepingtiger (712) 7 years ago

notavirus:

No, he's only started to lose everything because practically every actress he harrassed or threatened in Hollywood over the last 25 years have finally decided to open up about what he did to them after years of silence. THAT'S what has brought him down---as dedicated as the Italian model was to taking him down, the police and DAs still decided not to move forward with the case, even with her wiretap as evidence. So,unfortunately, it wasn't her case that took him down----you got that wrong. Read the story again.

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[–] not_a_virus.exe (1267) 7 years ago

They FINALLY decided to open up about it, and look at what happened to him. You're telling me they couldn't have decided to do this sooner? Like maybe 30 years sooner? Like the moment it happened sooner? Why did they wait on it for so long?

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[–] Catbookss (13664) 7 years ago

Often there's strength in numbers in instances such as this. You have to know this.

Even so, look at what happened with the women who stepped forward about Bill Cosby's abuse. Even with the few who did go to authorities. They got called liars, gold diggers, fame whores, and worse. The same thing is happening now.

First you say his victims who agreed to settlements, after attempting to get legal justice, are just as bad as he is, and now you're criticising them for not coming forward sooner. Yes, let's do blame the victims in any and every way possible, because being victimised once isn't enough.

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[–] not_a_virus.exe (1267) 7 years ago

Where's the contradiction in what I said? These women took money from him to stay quiet. Now despite cashing that check, they're coming forward. Not because it was the right thing to do, but because it's "safe". That's kind of the entire point of this thread. That coming forward about the predators in Hollywood, can't only be done when it's "trendy". If Hollywood isn't prepared to practice what they preach, then don't preach. Simple. I'm not asking for a lot, just consistency.

Also, they had the strength in numbers decades ago. It would have taken nothing for them to get together and testify against him. They just chose not to because he was good for business. The moment he wasn't, they all threw him under the bus. See how that works?

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[–] Catbookss (13664) 7 years ago

I didn't say there was any contradiction. What I'm saying is you're determined to blame them and victimise them a second time, no matter what.

How would they know there were any others decades ago? How would they have "gotten together"? They only know now, because others have stepped forward, little by little. You're making a lot of assumptions, based on … what? Do you know any of these women, do you know what their situations were and why they didn't come forward before now?

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[–] not_a_virus.exe (1267) 7 years ago

"I didn't say there was any contradiction. What I'm saying is you're determined to blame them and victimise them a second time, no matter what."

For the simple fact that these women have been vehemently outspoken against sexual harassment in the past, have flaunted their feminist BS, have taken every opportunity to attack Trump for spewing the same sexist rhetoric that Harvey Weinstein has actually practiced and said nothing about it. Yes. That warrants every bit of criticism from these two faced hypocrites as is possible. I'm not attacking them because they were victims, I'm attacking them because they're hypocrites.

"How would they know there were any others decades ago? How would they have "gotten together"? They only know now, because others have stepped forward, little by little. You're making a lot of assumptions, based on … what? Do you know any of these women, do you know what their situations were and why they didn't come forward before now?"

Based on facts. Everyone knew about him. Rose, Ben Affleck, Tarantino, Judd, Angelina Jolie even warned actresses about him. Seth McFarlane joked about it during the Oscars. for Christ's sake 30 rock made a passive joke about it! Where are you getting this idea that everyone was living in ignorance? It was an open secret among everyone in Hollywood! Are you daft?

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[–] Catbookss (13664) 7 years ago

"For the simple fact that these women have been vehemently outspoken against sexual harassment in the past, have flaunted their feminist BS, have taken every opportunity to attack Trump for spewing the same sexist rhetoric that Harvey Weinstein has actually practiced and said nothing about it."

And you know this to be true of every one of them that you're painting with the same brush?

"Based on facts. Everyone knew about him. Rose, Ben Affleck, Tarantino, Judd, Angelina Jolie even warned actresses about him. Seth McFarlane joked about it during the Oscars. for Christ's sake 30 rock made a passive joke about it! Where are you getting this idea that everyone was living in ignorance? It was an open secret among everyone in Hollywood!"

Obviously not everyone knew about him, nor would they have reason to know. McFarlane's joke was merely that women didn't have to pretend to find him attractive, not that he was a sexual predator who went WAY over the line, up to and including rape.

An "open secret," by nature, means that some knew, and many didn't. The same was said of Cosby's behaviour.

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[–] not_a_virus.exe (1267) 7 years ago

"And you know this to be true of every one of them that you're painting with the same brush?"

Anyone who my criticisms don't apply to, need not worry their precious little heads about my criticisms. Do I really need to spell this out to you? Can we please go a single argument anymore without throwing in '#notall' into the equation? Are we really so inept at having normal conversations that we have to constantly remind ourselves that not everyone applies to a bloody generalization?

"Obviously not everyone knew about him, nor would they have reason to know. McFarlane's joke was merely that women didn't have to pretend to find him attractive, not that he was a sexual predator who went WAY over the line, up to and including rape."

Your willful ignorance really is pushing the limits right now. Everyone else seems to be on the same plane of existence, and here you come with a bunch of 'what ifs' and 'maybes'.

"An "open secret," by nature, means that some knew, and many didn't. The same was said of Cosby's behaviour."

No. That's not what an open secret means.

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[–] Catbookss (13664) 7 years ago

It was my mistake for responding to you, hoping for a reasonable, rational discussion, when it was obvious from your OP, and the few other responses of yours I read, that this wasn't possible.

I'm sorry for whatever it was that happened in your life that caused you to be so angry and without compassion towards over half of the human population (specifically those who've been abused, although it's apparent your anger extends beyond them) and I mean that genuinely, although I'm certain you'll deny it. Lashing out is not the way to heal that, but again I'm certain you'll deny you're doing any such thing, and that you're absolutely fine, without any issues to deal with whatsoever.

I should have known better than to try to engage with you.

Good luck and best wishes.

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[–] not_a_virus.exe (1267) 7 years ago

Psycho-analyzing me isn't going to make you right here sweetheart. You can try as much as you like to cover your bases, but the pseudo-psychiatrist shtick isn't going to work. You don't know a thing about me. And to try and pretend that you do, and then suggest that me telling you you're wrong is just me being in denial is the height of failure. You know you have no point, which is why it took you 5 days to respond. All that time trying to conjure something up and you couldn't come up with anything. Best revert to the concerned parent tactic is that it? Spare me.

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[–] Catbookss (13664) 7 years ago

I'm certain you don't realise how predictable and transparent you are. If you did, you'd respond differently. Your words speak for themselves. Nothing but a cursory understanding of psychology is necessary. I know, you'll deny that too.

If it makes you feel better (it won't, BTW, except in a fleeting way) to think the reason I didn't respond to you earlier is because I had nothing to say, hey, whatever gets you through the night, my dear. The reality is I had a few glasses of wine last night and thought I might be able to get through to you on at least some level. A fool's errand, granted. It's unreasonable to try to reason with the unreasonable. I should have realised that from your OP, and not wasted my time, or yours, responding.

I won't be responding to you again.Be as well as you can be.

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[–] not_a_virus.exe (1267) 7 years ago

And yet here you are, after ensuring me that you have wasted your time twice now, still replying to me to remind yourself of how you're wasting your time. You are an extremely odd soul with little in the way of direction. If you don't have anything else to say, why are you still talking? I patiently await your reply knowing full well you will back out of your previous claims that you won't yet again.

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[–] Cookie.L.A. (2117) 7 years ago

Catbookss is doing what you are "sickened" others did not...speak out publicly against evil (ie, you) in the here and now. Not waiting 5 years, 10 years down the line to let everyone know your posts are evil and offesnsive, but taking a stand NOW, in the cold light of day, let the chips fall where they may.

We salute the bravery of Catbookss.

(PS: Are you the same poster as LetThemEatCake? Because they have the same ignorant way of looking at the world -- or what they've seen of the world -- as you do. If that's not you, you should look them up here; I think you would get along.)
.

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[–] not_a_virus.exe (1267) 7 years ago

You go girl MMHMM! You break that ceiling and smite evil where ever ye find it on these here message boards all over the internet! Today will be the day that generations from now find these here message on teh interwebz and clap in honor and pride that this here crusader against evil defeated it not with swords and shield or guns and nukes, but with words. Words conjured out of thin air from a keyboard that cost them less than a pizza. Let it be known that ANYONE can change the world and take a stand against evil by trading in a shift at work for their own keyboard. Such is the way of modern crusaders!

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[–] Cookie.L.A. (2117) 7 years ago

That's right.

You have been vanquished and exposed. The bells shall ring out on the 29th of each month, remembering your filthy reign.

Now leave this place, foul demon. We will have no more of you!
.

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[–] not_a_virus.exe (1267) 7 years ago

I like you. Even though I dislike you.

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[–] Cookie.L.A. (2117) 7 years ago

Well (sniff) in addition to your flattery, you used one of my favorite words ("ye") ... so I will vote for your reprieve.

We will accept you on #teammcgowan if you create a Go Fund Me page to support Her message.

You might have to speak in some high schools, too.
.

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[–] Burk48917 (11105) 6 years ago

Many of these women undoubtedly fucked him for an acting role. That's prostitution.

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[–] Stratego (29460) 7 years ago

What's disgusting is that they accepted the money, stayed quiet and just let him go on and assault other women. Especially a hypocrite like Rose McGowan who condemns Ben Affleck for doing the exact same thing as she did. I'm sure he didn't want to be blacklisted either.

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[–] not_a_virus.exe (1267) 7 years ago

Exactly. Here we are as a society striving to eliminate sexual assault in the work force and the almighty "rape culture" and the very people that champion for women's rights and gender equality keep their mouths shut allowing it to happen to other women in in return for a paycheck. The hypocrisy is nauseating. You reap what you sow. If Hollywood has a rape issue, it's because every single victim valued money more than the dignity of themselves and other women. It's infuriating.

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[–] Stratego (29460) 7 years ago

Yes, it's being enabled. But every single victim? There may be victims we never even heard of because they didn't choose the money. Or look at Victor Salvo who actually was convicted of child molestation, but was welcomed back in Hollywood not long after. Good god, Hollyweird makes me vomit.

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[–] not_a_virus.exe (1267) 7 years ago

No when I said "it's because every single victim valued money more than the dignity of themselves and other women." It was implied I was referring to the ones that got paid off to keep quiet. If they were a victim but kept quiet without accepting money, I don't like it, but at least they didn't cash out their morality.

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[–] Stratego (29460) 7 years ago

Okay, I see what you're saying.

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[–] TaRaNRoD (1579) 7 years ago

"Sorry but if you were sexually assaulted a decade ago, and accepted money to keep quiet, you have ABSOLUTELY no place complaining about it now. "

Thank you.

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[–] sleepingtiger (712) 7 years ago

tararod:
That's some bull****, and you know it. So if someone gets raped, and the rapist gets away with it, they're still not supposed to say anything about it years later, no matter how bad it affects them? That's such a stupid, ignorant and backwards thing to say. You and not a virus need to realize that life isn't as simple as you seem to think it is when it comes to matters such as sexual harassment.

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[–] therefdotcom (964) 7 years ago

not_a_virus.exe: "hi, i am only here to be as offensive as possible. i get a kick out of it."

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[–] Rorikon (16735) 7 years ago

Lots of factors I say. Trying to break out in the movie industry or make a big break so they let whatever flies I guess but women in general love money so of course they'll take that over what's right for them until he is exposed where they all come out of the nest like cockroaches as you said to get more of the dosh. They're not as bad only because they didn't do the molesting pedo moves Harvey did. Again, think women. Why you think most girls only date guys with money?

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[–] prometheus1816 (1053) 7 years ago

I'll agree with you to an extent. As a woman I feel that if these women went to a hotel, they kinda knew what was being expected. If you truly want to protect yourself do not go to a hotel. Tell them you want to meet in a banquet hall or other public area where there is the occurrence of other people being there. No private meet ups. And I agree whoever took a payout and didn't speak up are responsible for the next one who was abused. There is no excuse in this day and age. I could understand it if this were the 70s or 80s, but but the 90s "woman power" came along and women were considered more equals, this whole thing of the "casting couch" is a crutch. The have power and if they go alone to a hotel room.... what do they think is going to happen?

What pisses me off as a woman is when they claim rape or assault and they're proven to be wrong, how is it they don't face the same pariah status as the men do? Makes not one lick of sense. It's like false rape reporting, or wives who report the husbands they're divorcing for child abuse or raping their child, they don't get punished. If they want equality then they need to be equally punished not protected.

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[–] sleepingtiger (712) 7 years ago

prometheus:
Did you even read the actresses' testimonies? A lot of the things they said Weinstein did to them was were they were young and just starting out in the business two decades ago---like Angelina Jolie and others,for instance. They obviously didn't know what the hell they were getting into with Weinstein at the time, and he took advantage of their naivete----that's what predators do. That's how he was able to get them into that position in the first place----since he was a powerful mogul at the time who could make and break careers, of course they would meet him anywhere he asked them to---that's how he got them. Stop just blaming them----you seem hellbent on that and not even trying to hold Weinstein accountable for his actions. He's a pig, a predator,and you know it. He chose to try and exploit these women any way or chance he could get, because he was in a position to do exactly that. Why you don't want to fact up to that, I really don't understand. The casting couch has been around since Hollywood started and it's still very much prevalent today---that hasn't changed much,has it? Nope.

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[–] prometheus1816 (1053) 7 years ago

So what the hell happened to them telling someone? Like Jolie, why didn't she tell her dad. Same with Gwyneth Paltrow. She's Hollywood royalty with her father being the late Bruce Paltrow and her mother Blythe Danner. Both Jolie and Paltrow could have stopped this from happening to other women by telling their fathers who in turn could have ratted on him THEN. All of this coming out now is a bit like allowing the fox to escape with the hens. I hold those accountable for their actions and inactions. The casting couch has been alive for a very long time.... However, it's ridiculous that someone hasn't spoken out before now! How can all of these women have been assaulted/abused and this not come out till now? Women are not that defenseless. I'm a woman and certainly have protected myself solidly since I was raped back in 1977. Whoever didn't report this back in the 90s are responsible for every single one that came after. That's a fact some of you social justice warriors don't understand.

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[–] sleepingtiger (712) 7 years ago

Seriously? And enough with the "social justice warriors" BS. That's a term right wingers have hijacked just to shut up anyone who's not a right wing nut, like them. That has nothing to do with this subject. And real social justice advocates rarely call themselves "warriors" anyway. Tired of people interjecting politics where it dosen't even belong. You make it sound like it was so easy---the bottom line is even if they had told someone at the time, more than likely nothing would have changed. You forget that when both Paltrow and Jolie started out in the business,they were virtually unknowns,and the Weinsteins were major power brokers in Hollywood----they could make or break careers. Even if they had gone up against him, there's no guarantee that he wouldn't have crushed both their careers before they even got started (more than likely Harvey Weinstein would have, because he was that vindictive and petty, like a lot of men with some power, when he didn't get what he wanted.) And then, with no one supporting them, would they have gotten anyone to believe enough to make a case against him? I really don't think so. Especially since so many people's careers depended upon Miramax at the time. And let's be real---it would have been blown off as a "he said, she said" thing,too. If if was as easy as you think it was, Weinstein would have been gone a long, long time ago. So don't put that all on Paltrow or Jolie, neither of whom had the name recognition or power to do anything about it at the time. That's ridiculous.

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[–] MickyMac (2982) 6 years ago

No one said anything until late last year was intimidation, feelings of shame, people wanting to keep their careers and life, when dealing with sexual assault your in a situation where your unable to prove anything. People who have been in such a situation have a hard time speaking up especially if it happened to them in their youth.

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[–] ducksoup (3933) 6 years ago

This thread title is ridiculous. Reminds me of Norm MacDonald's bit about 'the worst part is the hypocrisy'. He hit the nail on the head.

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[–] MickyMac (2982) 6 years ago

Sexual assault victims have a hard time coming forward after the incident is mostly due to feelings of humiliation and too painful to relive it all again. All the accusers were young when it happened to them so they didn't have like a twenty year career and where in the vulnerable position of being called a liar if they said anything.

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