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The Israeli Actions In Gaza


Have events in Gaza in any way shaped or changed your views on the Israel/Palestine conflict ?

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Not events in Gaza specifically, but the things that surfaced regarding what horrible atrocities Israel was committing over the years against the palestinians. Events in Gaza only attest to the brainwashing israelis are submitted to in order consider themselves some master race and palestinians subhumans.

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What seems indisputable is that a solid majority of Israelis now feel that Palestinians have no innate human or legal rights that need be respected. Hard to view that as other than virulent racism, or ethnic chauvinism, pick a word to suit.

The evaluation seems to be that the terrorism (but not the reprisals) have removed Palestinians beyond the moral pale. Which is, under the circumstances of the last century, beyond ironic.

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just proves that Israel is willing to kick ass...this is what happens when you poke a Alpha Lion to much...

also I asked this question in another thread but got no replies..

how come other muslim countries are not willing to help or let palestinians into their country?

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Palestinians in other countries. Btw, they're not all Muslim.

Jordan 3,240,000
Syria 630,000
Chile 500,000 - mainly Christian
Lebanon 402,582
Saudi Arabia 280,245
Egypt 270,245
Honduras 250,000 - mainly Christian
Guatemala est. 200,000 - mainly Christian
Mexico 120,000
Qatar 100,000
Germany 80,000
Kuwait 80,000
El Salvador 70,000
Brazil 59,000
Iraq 57,000
Yemen 55,000
Canada 50,975
Australia 45,000
Libya 44,000

Israel's goal is to steal ALL Palestinian land by committing genocide and ethnic cleansing. Muslim countries don't want to help Israel commit their atrocities against Palestinians.

Israel can't fight anyone without U.S. help. Eventually, the U.S. will dump Israel in the same way Cuba was dumped by Russia. That's when Palestinians will reclaim their homeland and millions will return.

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Its not about reclaiming palestinian homeland.
It is just about palestinians being treated as humans with equal rights.
Palestinians can live alongside israelis with no issues as long as they have equal rights and israeli education will stop teaching children that arabs should all be murdered.

Israel needs to be treated like nazi germany or japana after ww2.

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I had no idea you were so ignorant about the Palestinians. You don't really know anything about them. Like the rest of the Arabs, they're Islamosupremacists. The Palestinians don't want equality. They want total Muslim control over the entire land of Israel, with few if any Jews. Living in equality with millions of Jews is light-years beyond their capabilities. The Palestinians did everything they could to stop so many Jews from being there. They began complaining about zionist immigration way back in the 1890s and when the British were in charge pressured them to limit Jewish immigration to a trickle. They would have gladly let the surrounding Arab countries push the Jews into the sea in 1948.

Islamosupremacy is all the Palestinians knew prior to zionism. During Ottoman rule, Jews had to walk past Muslims on their left since the left is identified with Satan and they always had to yield the right of way to Muslims. Failure to abide by these rules often provoked a violent response. Jews had to avoid anything that reminded Muslims of Judaism so synagogues could only be located in hidden, remote areas and Jews could pray only in muted voices. Despite widespread poverty among Palestinian Jews, they had to pay a host of special protection taxes. They had to pay 100 pounds a year to the Muslim villagers of Siloam just outside Jerusalem not to disturb the graves at the Jewish cemetery on the Mount of Olives, 50 pounds a year to the Ta'amra Arabs not to deface the Tomb of Rachel on the road to Bethlehem and 10 pounds a year to Sheik Abu Gosh not to molest Jewish travelers on the road to Jerusalem, even though the Turkish authorities already paid him to maintain order on that road. Arab merchants dumped their unsold goods on their Jewish neighbors and billed them, safe in the knowledge that the Jews were so afraid of them that they wouldn't dare return the items or deny their purchase.

Islamosupremacy dominates the surrounding Arab countries. 80 years ago, there were 100,000 Jews among the 4 Arab countries bordering Israel. Due to heavy persecution over several decades, that number is now down to 32. 32! Saudi Arabia is an 830,000 square mile country that bans all non-Muslims from citizenship. The Muslims in the surrounding Arab countries have a total monopoly on power and even they don't want to live with Jews, much less live in equality with them. What makes you think the Palestinians are any different than all the surrounding Arabs? This is what Yasser Arafat said about Jews:

You understand that we plan to eliminate the State of Israel and establish a purely Palestinian state. We will make life unbearable for Jews by psychological warfare and population explosion. Jews will not want to live among Arabs. I have no use for Jews. They are and remain Jews. We now need all the help we can get from you in our battle for a united Palestine under Arab rule.


And then there's the issue of Hamas. Most Palestinians want Hamas to rule over them. Hamas are strict Islamists and it’s their understanding that the entire land of Israel is Muslim holy land that is required to be under the complete control of Muslims and they don’t have the right or privilege to give up the fight for the land until every last inch is retaken. And besides being under the full control of Muslims they also believe that the land must specifically be ruled over by strict Muslim theocracy. So equality with Jews isn't an option for them. More than that, Hamas is completely intolerant of the very presence of Jews. A Hamas representative said the following in an official broadcast in 2006:

My message to the loathed Jews is that there is no God but Allah. We will chase you everywhere. We are a nation that drinks blood, and we know that there is no blood better than the blood of the Jews. We will not leave you alone until we have quenched our thirst with your blood and our children's thirst with your blood.


So why is it that you think that Israel of all countries should be treated like Germany or Japan after World War II rather than the surrounding Arab countries that should be treated that way?

Finally, you ought to know that Keelai certainly doesn't support equality for Jews in Israel. She's already openly celebrated on this forum the fact that hundreds of thousands of Jews fled Israel in fear after the October 7th attack. She said Israel isn't their real country. She also said that all Israeli Jews should go to Europe.

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[deleted]

I was going to reply, but you said it better than I could.

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Oh, really? His comment that got deleted for being inappropriate said it better than you could? That really doesn't speak well of you. His comment about masturbation would have been better directed at you, considering the joy you expressed over the fact that hundreds of thousands of Jews fled Israel in fear after the October 7th attack. You're such a garbage person I'll bet you still won't apologize for it.

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What the hell is wrong with you? Are you just afraid to discuss the complete inability of Palestinians to live in equality with Jews? I didn't say anything at all here about the war in Gaza but you act like I did. WarrenPeace is a bad influence on you. Don't just copy what he says.

And it's Keelai who expressed joy at the fact that hundreds of thousands of Jews fled Israel in fear after the October 7th attack. Your comments about masturbation would be better aimed at her.

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How do you try to justify with so much passion the murder and starvation of children and then have the audacity to even get remotely insulted when someone calls you out is flabbergasting.
You're almost as low as an israeli soldier.

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"Remotely" insulted? You accused me of masturbating to pictures of dead Palestinians. That's a lot more than "remotely" insulting. It's completely uncalled for and it was the entirety of your response to the several paragraphs of my comment. I said nothing at all about the war in Gaza in that comment. I only addressed your claim that Palestinians supposedly just want equal rights. You seemed to be totally incapable of actually addressing the substance of my response. Why can't you address the actual issues that you originally brought up in this discussion?

Stay on topic.

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The only goal of Zionism is to take all Palestinian land and get rid of the Palestinian people through ethnic cleansing and/or genocide in order to create a Jewish-majority state.

Israel is an ongoing Settler Colonialist Project similar to America or Australia in which the land is stolen and the indigenous people wiped out.

Zionists need to ethnic cleanse in order to maintain a Jewish majority which explains why millions of Palestinians are prevented from returning to Palestine and Israel freely kills those remaining (incremental genocide).

Democracy is impossible in Israel since the majority would be Muslim and Zionists want to empower only Jews.

"Ten Myths about Israel" by Ilan Pappé gets into the history and present situation.

According to the book, the first Jewish settlers were welcomed by Palestinians who helped shelter them, taught them to cultivate the land and created jointly-owned businesses in urban areas. They got along fine until Palestinians realized they didn't want to live alongside them, but get rid of them.

The right thing to do would've been to buy land and live with Palestinians equally from the beginning, but that didn't happen.

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What would be so terrible if the Jews kept the entire land of Israel anyway? 2 of the countries bordering Israel don't have any Jews. Saudi Arabia, an 830,000 square-mile country, completely bans non-Muslims. We can certainly have a serious debate over whether Israel is too small. But it's beyond absurd to suggest that it's anywhere close to too big.

Islam is an ongoing settler colonialist project which has already succeeded in conquering millions of square miles of land. We obviously can't rely on Keelai to resolve that problem. You see nothing wrong with it. Instead of stealing millions of square miles of land in the Middle Ages, the right thing to do would have been for Muslims to buy all of that land and live with the non-Muslims equally from the beginning. If the Muslims did that then Islam would have been an actual religion of peace, instead of a pretend one.

All the countries bordering Israel are dictatorships. Mideast democracy doesn't rise or fall with Israel.

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"What would be so terrible if the Jews kept the entire land of Israel anyway?"

You mean Palestine. Stealing and ethnic-cleansing/genocide are wrong.

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No, I mean Israel. It's not stealing because it belongs to the Jews. Even if you want to consider it stealing, you don't believe that stealing is wrong. You're totally okay with Muslims stealing all the land that they want. And you're totally okay with all the Arab countries ethnically cleansing their Jews. It would only be wrong for Jews to steal land from Muslims if the Muslims allow Jews to live in all their countries as equals and the Muslims never steal the Jews' homes or property.

Could you please answer my question again about why it would be so terrible if the Jews kept the entire land of Israel anyway? And this time don't give an answer that totally sucks and fails to explain anything. In order to really answer my question you're going to have to actually address all the facts I brought up in the 1st paragraph of my last response. The question is genuinely hard and only seems easy if you completely ignore those facts.

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No, you mean Palestine. Question was already answered - stealing and ethnic cleansing/genocide are wrong.

The land belongs to the Palestinians who have been living there for thousands of years - not European settler colonialists.

Israel is a tyrannical totalitarian dictatorship to the Palestinians who have no freedom under the Zionist regime.

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No, I mean Israel:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Israel#/media/File:Israel_-_Location_Map_(2012)_-_ISR_-_UNOCHA.svg

Israel is a necessary refuge for millions of Jews who otherwise couldn't live in the theocratic, hateful and repressive Muslim world. You can't tell me that it's wrong for Jews to take control of piece of land for themselves unless all the Muslim countries are absolutely unscrupulous about allowing Jews to live there with full equality and to have stable property rights. That's called fairness, a concept you clearly don't believe in. The fact that Israel inconveniences Palestinians doesn't change that moral equation.

You're just incredible! You're like a segregationist in the Jim Crow South who explains that he lynched a black man accused of raping a white woman because rape is wrong. Except he doesn't really believe that rape is wrong because he never lynched any white men accused of raping black women. You do NOT believe that stealing land is wrong. You don't believe it's wrong for Muslims to steal land. You can't tell me that stealing land is wrong unless you believe that it's always wrong. You're nothing more than a one-dimensional Islamochauvinist.

Now, give me an answer to my question that doesn't totally suck. In the context that there's only 32 Jews among the 4 Arab countries bordering Israel and next to one of those countries is Saudi Arabia, which is 830,000 square miles and completely bans non-Muslims, why would it actually be so terrible if the Jews kept the entire land of Israel?

Remember, in order to properly answer my question you have to actually address the important context I included in the question.

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It's Palestine.

They came from Europe. They can always return there like the few hundred thousand did after Oct. 7.

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No, it's Israel. Look at what it says at the top of the map, stupid:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Israel#/media/File:Israel_-_Location_Map_(2012)_-_ISR_-_UNOCHA.svg

Only half of Israeli Jews trace their ancestry to Europe. All Israeli Jews have a right to live in Israel just as much all American Jews have a right to live in America.

Now, give me an answer to my question that doesn't totally suck. In the context that there's only 32 Jews among the 4 Arab countries bordering Israel and next to one of those countries is Saudi Arabia, which is 830,000 square miles and completely bans non-Muslims, why would it actually be so terrible if the Jews kept the entire land of Israel?

Remember, in order to properly answer my question you have to actually address the important context I included in the question.

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"This map of Palestine was published by National Geographic magazine in 1947, a year before the Nakba"
https://www.reddit.com/r/MapPorn/comments/12s6lq5/this_map_of_palestine_was_published_by_national/

Most Jews had no interest in going to Israel especially from Western countries. Yet Palestinians have no right to return even though they still hold deeds to homes and land.

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That wasn't a state. That was just the British Mandate. In 1948, the British left and most of that territory then became the State of Israel:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1949_Armistice_Agreements#/media/File:United_Nations_Palestine_map_showing_Armistice_Agreements_between_Israel_&_Lebanon,_Syria,_Jordan_&_Egypt_1949-1950.jpg

100% of the 630,000 Jews living in the land of Israel in 1948 wanted to stay there. Hundreds of thousands of Jews were expelled from Arab countries after Israel's establishment and they don't have a right of return. Neither do the millions of Germans expelled from eastern Europe after World War II or the millions of Hindus and Sikhs expelled from what became Pakistan and the millions of Muslims expelled from what became India after the partition of India in 1947. A right of return for refugees is very rare, even for those who still hold deeds to homes and land.

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Palestine has existed since the Ancient Romans named it.

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You're talking about Syria Palaestina. That was just a Roman province. It ceased to exist centuries ago. It was never its own country. But since 1948, it's been the State of Israel:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Israel#/media/File:Israel_-_Location_Map_(2012)_-_ISR_-_UNOCHA.svg

You still haven't answered my question. In the context that there's only 32 Jews among the 4 Arab countries bordering Israel and next to one of those countries is Saudi Arabia, which is 830,000 square miles and completely bans non-Muslims, why would it actually be so terrible if the Jews kept the entire land of Israel?

Remember, in order to properly answer my question you have to actually address the important context I included in the question.

Don't just be a total coward and run away from the question.

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You need to stop acting as if your side is all 100% innocent when we clearly see it is not with both the illegal blockade of Gaza, the ethnic cleansing of genocide and the stealing, intimidation and murder over the land Israel scum turds, with help from the terrorist Nazis of the IDF is doing to the Palestinians who have a legal right to it in the W. Bank.

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Except I don't act like Israel is 100% innocent. My pro-Israel position doesn't depend on Israel being 100% innocent. But that's the problem with Keelai. She acts like the Palestinians and even all Muslims are 100% innocent. She sees no problem with Muslims stealing millions of square miles of land in the Middle Ages, continuing to steal land and maintaining oppressive theocracies that have driven out all their Jews.

You have to approach Israel by starting with an understanding of what it really is. It's a necessary refuge for Jews in the theocratic, hateful and repressive Muslim world.

https://moviechat.org/bd0000082/Politics/65301cb5ca1d095d0bb7cf92/Israel-is-a-necessary-refuge-for-Jews-in-the-theocratic-hateful-and-repressive-Muslim-world

Israel is NOT committing genocide. The Allies killed 300,000-600,000 civilians by carpet bombing Germany during World War II and that wasn't genocide so Israel is clearly nowhere close to committing genocide. And as I've repeatedly told you, the Israeli blockade of Gaza was legal:

https://jcpa.org/text/puzzle1.pdf
(pages 19-22)

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LMAO!

You have never once criticized Israel on one thing they have done wrong.
Not one.
When their murder of innocents either in Gaza or the W. Bank has been pointed out to you.

Somehow you think that each and every innocent in Gaza deserves to suffer and die just because they happen to be on the same side of Hamas even if those very same innocents are not happy or against Hamas before the genocide of them by Israel.
(No one can blame those innocents that are now on the side of Hamas since they are their only hope of any protection against the Nazi terrorists of the IDF who is committing war crimes of ethnic cleansing of their mass slaughter.)
This is like making each and every American suffer and die when our soldiers invade another country even for those, such as myself, who is against our military and war.

The blockade of Gaza legal?
LMAO, again!
If you want me to even consider to agree that the blockade was somehow legal then you will have to find it from a non biased source, such as the UN or Amnesty Itl' or any other group of neutral and legal scholars and experts who say it is instead from a biased source coming out of Israel with a bunch of amateurs, laymen and other bogus clowns pushing an opinion without doing much study.
Criminals and those on their side always think they are innocent and support them as they justify their crimes and this is no exception.
Even the Times of Israel calls the blockade illegal by reporting on it even after the actions of the Hamas freedom fighters on 10/7.
Why?
Because they know the truth of that blockade and are not afraid to say it.

https://www.timesofisrael.com/un-human-rights-chief-israels-total-siege-of-gaza-prohibited-by-international-law/

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What Volker Turk said doesn't prove anything. I was talking about the Israeli blockade of Gaza prior to the Hamas attack. He was talking about the new blockade of Gaza that began after the attack. You obviously can't use the Israeli response to the Hamas attack to justify the Hamas attack. And the "total siege" of Gaza that Volker Turk was talking about was lifted after a few days.

If you're so certain that the blockade at the time of the Hamas attack was illegal then why are you asking me to provide a non-biased source proving otherwise? If you're so certain that the blockade was illegal then you obviously assume that such an explanation proving otherwise is completely impossible. Why are you so certain that the blockade was illegal when you can't even explain to me why that is? I can explain to you why it was legal.

During the blockade, Israel allowed the flow of basic humanitarian supplies such as food, medicine and water to Gaza. Article 23 of the 4th Geneva Convention requires parties to certain conflicts to permit transit to enemy civilian populations of a limited number of items and under a limited set of conditions. However, the fighting in and around the Gaza Strip is not covered by the 4th Geneva Convention because the conflict is not one between state parties to the Convention and Gaza was not occupied territory. Therefore, Israel is not bound by Article 23.

Even if it were bound by the 4th Geneva Convention, Israel would be acting in full compliance with international law. Article 23 of the 4th Geneva Convention permits states such as Israel to cut off fuel supplies and electricity to territories such as Gaza. Article 23 only requires a party to permit passage of food, clothing and medicines intended for children under 15, expectant mothers and maternity cases. Were Article 23 to apply, Israel would still be under no obligation to permit the passage of electricity, fuel or any items other than food, clothing or medicine. Moreover, under Article 23, Israel would be under no obligation to provide anything itself. Israel would only be required not to interfere with consignments of food and so forth sent by others for the benefit of children under age 15, mothers of newborns and pregnant women. Finally, under Article 23, a party can block passage even of food, clothing and medicine even for these population groups if it has serious grounds for suspecting that the items will be intercepted before reaching their destination or that the items may benefit the enemy’s economy by substitution.

Article 70 of the 1st Protocol Additional to the Geneva Conventions of 1977 creates a slightly broader duty regarding the provision of food, medical supplies, clothing, bedding, means of shelter and "other supplies essential to the survival of the civilian population." Israel, however, is not a party to the 1st Protocol and is therefore not bound by the provisions of Article 70.

If you're so sure that the blockade was illegal then that must mean that you can easily explain to me why everything I just said is completely wrong. The 2 authors of the JCPA article, Justus Reid Weiner and Avi Bell, are both legal scholars. They are NOT “amateurs” or “laymen”. If you read the article you would know they did extensive study to reach their conclusion about the blockade. You never told me why you think they're biased and you never told me why you think the JCPA itself is biased. How do you know it's biased? Can you actually explain that to me?

You talk about the United Nations and Amnesty International as if they're not totally biased. That's the biggest joke of all. The UN is notorious for its anti-Israel bias. In 2006, the UN Human Rights Council made a review of the "human rights situation in Palestine and other occupied Arab territories" a permanent feature of every council session. No other country in the world has its human rights situation reviewed at every council session. In 2022, the UN General Assembly passed more resolutions against Israel than against all other countries combined! And that was the year that Russia invaded Ukraine! The UN is unavoidably biased. It's nothing more than the sum of the biases of all its members, who all have their own political agendas. And Amnesty International has its own well-documented anti-Israel biases. In 2013 the Amnesty International Secretary General falsely accused Israel of murdering Yasser Arafat. Last year the Amnesty International USA director said the organization is opposed to the very existence of Israel.

Calling the blockade illegal is completely asinine because your whole point in doing so is to justify the 10/7 attack. That argument doesn't work because the attack didn't end the blockade and wasn't even designed to do so. That argument also doesn't work because Hamas wants to completely destroy Israel, meaning that ending the blockade would clearly NOT have ended the conflict between Hamas and Israel.

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TL:DR

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Bullshit! You just don't want to have to admit that I'm right about everything. Your arrogantly presumed correctness on all these issues is pure fiction. You claim the JCPA essay I showed you is a joke but the real joke is your claim that it's wrong about the legality of the blockade of Gaza. You never even tried to explain why it was actually illegal. If you just give up like this then I'm going declare victory and assert that I was right about everything.

If you're too lazy to even read a long post then you shouldn't openly say that it's "TL:DR". You just shouldn't respond at all. That would be a lot less embarrassing.

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TL: DR

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Even those measly 2 paragraphs were too long for you to read? You've responded to posts of mine that were longer than that. Do you realize that you're just showing that you know I'm right about all these issues but just don't want to admit it? Stop replying with "TL:DR". It makes you look worse than not responding at all.

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Who the hell do you think you are to try to delegitimize my pro-Israel arguments because I never criticized Israel on any specific thing when YOU never criticized the Palestinians on any specific thing either? More than that, you openly defended the 10/7 attack on the merits. You've also never criticized any of the surrounding Arab countries for their intolerant Islamosupremacy that's eliminated the presence of Jews. You've never criticized the 4 Arab countries bordering Israel for reducing their collective number of Jews from 100,000 80 years ago to a mere 32 today. You've never criticized Saudi Arabia, an 830,00 square mile country, for banning all non-Muslims from citizenship.

My argument defending Israel doesn't depend on me criticizing at least one thing Israel has done. Criticizing at least one Israeli action doesn't magically legitimize my defense of Israel. My defense of Israel stands entirely on its own merits. As I said before, I don't agree with every single thing Israel has ever done to Palestinians. For now, I will say that I completely disagree with the Baruch Goldstein massacre. Can you think of anything done by the Palestinians or any of the Arab countries that you would be willing to criticize? Anything at all?

I do NOT believe that each and every civilian in Gaza deserves to suffer and die. The war simply makes in inevitable that many of them will suffer and die. It's not just a question of what they deserve. That's just the way war is. And as I told you before, it's completely absurd for you to claim that Hamas are the Gazans' "only hope of any protection" against the IDF. Hamas isn't actually doing anything to protect Gazan civilians. Hamas hasn't stopped thousands of Palestinian civilians from being killed nor does it even seem to be trying to stop civilians from being killed. Hamas is mostly just hiding in their tunnels and fighting the IDF when it comes to them. Your claim is especially absurd because of the 10/7 attack itself. Hamas launched that attack knowing exactly what would happen to Gaza afterwards. Hamas knew this would happen. Clearly, protecting Palestinian civilians in Gaza isn't their priority.

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TL:DR

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muslim countries dont want to help anyone or any other muslim countries.

the last time I checked, Israel lived in that area before palenstians.

https://i.pinimg.com/736x/ae/96/1a/ae961ab43980fb6298a5394faed03531.jpg

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European Jews lived in Europe for millennia, therefore any claim on Palestinian land is laughable and not credible.

The land belongs to the Palestinians. Some of them still have deeds to their homes and land which they legally purchased.

It's vile that Zionists believe a Jewish New Yorker who never stepped foot in Palestine has more of a claim to the land then a Palestinian with a deed whose family lived in the same village for a minimum of a few centuries.

Palestinian Christians have been ethnic cleansed from Jesus birthplace of Bethlehem and Jerusalem.

Christians are being persecuted, also.

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the land was taken away from Israel and given to the infidels, its not their land.

hamas is fighting against The Lion of Judah, so good luck with that...

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Jews whose ancestors fled to Europe 2,000 years ago have no claim.

Some Jews remained in Palestine while some of them converted to Christianity and others to Islam. These Palestinians who have lived there continuously are the only ones with a claim to the land.

Settler colonialism is immoral and unethical. Israel will eventually be forced to end their oppression and occupation.

Hamas won the war since they have shown a spotlight on Israel's many atrocities which has created mass demonstrations around the world.

Israel depends on the U.S. for survival. With growing Jewish support for Palestinians and diminishing number of evangelicals that support has an expiration date.

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its their (Israelis) homeland and they have the claim.

if Settler colonialism is wrong. then I assume all the land taken by early americans will be given back to the native Americans?

why are you supporting a terrorist group? you are messed up lately or just trolling for attention...

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A claim based on a fairytale book and invisible friend in the sky?

If that's your only proof, it clearly tells Jews they cannot have a Jewish country until their Messiah comes which hasn't happened yet.

The settler colonialism project is happening right NOW against Palestinians - not centuries ago.

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You're lying about the Torah. I already went over this with you 2 months ago. It does NOT "clearly tell Jews they cannot have a Jewish country until their Messiah comes". The Book of Joshua proves that. The Jews invaded the land of Canaan without a Messiah. You can't actually show where the Torah says what you claim it says. You already tried and failed to do that.

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"Jews invaded the land of Canaan without a Messiah."

Which is the reason God punished them. No country before the Messiah!

"The Jews invaded the land of Canaan"

In other words, the Jews originally stole the land.

More God's rules broken by Israel:
Thou shalt not steal.
Thou shalt not covert thy neighbor's goods.
Thou shalt not kill.

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Oh my god! You are an absolute moron!!! You have no idea of the enormous level of utter ignorance and stupidy you just revealed. Jews invading the land of Canaan without a Messiah is NOT the reason God punished them. We know this because God actually commanded the Jews to invade Canaan. God obviously didn't punish the Jews for doing what he commanded them to do. This is what it says in the Book of Joshua, chapter 1, verses 2-3:

2. Moses my servant is dead. Now then, you and all these people, get ready to cross the Jordan River into the land I am about to give to them—to the Israelites. 3. I will give you every place where you set your foot, as I promised Moses.


Note the use of the word "give". It wasn't stealing according to God himself. You then proceed to reveal more of your idiocy. There is no rule in the Torah that says you can't "covert" your neighbor's belongings. What does the verb form of the word "covert" even mean? And the commandment is not to murder rather than not to kill. If the commandment were not to kill then God would never have commanded the Jews to go to war and Judaism would never have had the death penalty for anything.

Haven't you now subjected this forum to enough of your utter idiocy? Will your utter idiocy ever stop? Don't you have any shame or embarrassment over your repeated idiocy? Why doesn't the repeated exposure of your utter idiocy cause you to have any humility?

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If settler colonialism is so immoral and unethical then why do you refuse to condemn the settler colonialism on which Islam was founded? Muslim conquest was responsible for the theft of millions of square miles of land in the Middle Ages. Israel can't really be that bad if you still feel you can't afford to be honest about Islam. If there was nothing wrong with what Islam did then that must mean that zionism is actually super moral and super ethical.

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"Middle Ages"

We're discussing what is happening NOW and can be stopped NOW!

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I'm discussing what's happening NOW and can be stopped NOW:

https://www.iiss.org/publications/armed-conflict-survey/2023/from-global-jihad-to-local-insurgencies/#:~:text=The%20state%20of%20play%20of%20Sub%2DSaharan%20jihadism&text=In%20the%20Sahel%2C%20jihadist%20insurgency,%2C%20the%20Liptako%2DGourma%20region.

Muslims never stopped stealing land!

And that doesn't answer my question. If settler colonialism is wrong now then it was also wrong in the Middle Ages. If settler colonialism is so immoral and unethical then why do you refuse to condemn the settler colonialism on which Islam was founded? Muslim settler colonialism created a vast empire.

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"Middle Ages"
We're discussing what is happening NOW and can be stopped NOW!

Tide is turning. U.S. abstained. I told you so. Israel will eventually be on its own without U.S. help. Israel can't fight on its own.

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I'm discussing what's happening NOW and can be stopped NOW:

https://www.iiss.org/publications/armed-conflict-survey/2023/from-global-jihad-to-local-insurgencies/#:~:text=The%20state%20of%20play%20of%20Sub%2DSaharan%20jihadism&text=In%20the%20Sahel%2C%20jihadist%20insurgency,%2C%20the%20Liptako%2DGourma%20region.

Muslims never stopped stealing land! Why won't you even condemn Muslim jihad conquests that are happening now?

Why are you trying to change the subject? Why can't you answer my question? If settler colonialism is wrong now then it was also wrong in the Middle Ages. If settler colonialism is so immoral and unethical then why do you refuse to condemn the settler colonialism on which Islam was founded?

The fact that the biggest jihad conquest, the theft of millions of square miles of land between the Northwest coast of Africa in the west and India in the east, took place over a thousand years ago doesn't in any way prevent you from condemning it now. You can at least acknowledge that that jihad conquest was evil. You can't fix Islam's enormous problems until you acknowledge those problems.

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They’re not from the tribe of Judah. They are converted Edomites.

Strictly speaking, it is incorrect to call an ancient Israelite a "Jew", or to call a contemporary Jew an "Israelite" or a "Hebrew". - The Jewish Almanac, 1980, Identity Crisis, p.3

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The Lion of Judah has long been a symbol of bravery, nobility, and strength. This symbolism is used in the bible over 150 times but is most commonly equated with the House of Judah and the descendants of the House of Judah, including Judah himself, King David, King Solomon, and Jesus.

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All true; however, modern/contemporary Jews have nothing to do with any of that.

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they are all decedents of the 12 Tribes of Israel. the terrorists are fighting against the God of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob.

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No, they are the descendants of Esau.

The 12 Tribes are descendants of Jacob (Esau's brother).

The descendants of Esau are Edomites that converted to Judaism.

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Jacob/Israel had twelve sons (and at least one daughter): these are The Twelve Tribes of Israel:

Reuben
Simeon
Levi
Judah
Issachar
Zebulun
Dan
Naphtali
Gad
Asher
Joseph
Benjamin

after they left Egypt under the leadership of Moses and, later, Joshua, and resettled in Canaan in a loose confederation of tribes. Each tribe got its own area to live in.

https://stbarnabasbible.files.wordpress.com/2013/03/12_tribes_of_israel_map.png

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Yes, I'm aware of all that; however, the modern Jews did not descend from the 12 Tribes, they descended from Esau.

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sorry, thats not even remotely true.

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Yes, they will even admit it.

Also, it's in their Jewish library, their encyclopedia, and other of their written texts/literature.

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They are problems and bring nothing to the table. That really does not contradict how those countries feel about the conflict.

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they have brought nothing to the table for 1000's of years. muslims still repress women and girls and you dont hear dems complaining about that.

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Theyre not alpha lions. They are cowardly over funded baby murdering psychopaths.

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The Lion of Judah shall reign.

maybe next time hamas shouldnt write a check their butt cant cash...

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Tell me the connection between hamas and babies and children burned alive and maimed by your cowardly "lions" and women being raped then executed by idf soldiers.
Maybe israel whould stard killing and raping

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so you are saying that hamas is 100% trustworthy? all the info we are getting is carefully scripted to make Israel look bad. maybe next time a terrorist organization will think twice before killing innocent Israeli's.

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Its witness(a woman) reports that say idf raped and killed women. 100% believable. Not hamas.

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what are the sources for this information?

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Youtube
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=d8qJ6Ig40M8

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thats just a hamas women talking. that doesnt prove anything...the terrorists are manipulating the media to make Israel look bad. no one cared about the atrocities hamas committed against the palenstians before...

Some atrocities committed during the hamas attacks are well documented and include entire families burned alive, tortured, mutilated, sexually violated, including gang rape and murder; in addition to women, children and elderly people being among those seized as hostages.

Professor Ruth Halperin-Kaddari, a legal scholar and international women’s rights advocate, after examining evidence, said at least seven women who were killed were also raped, The Guardian reported. Investigations by other international media outlets have reported identifying more than 30 killed women whose bodies bore evidence of abuse such as bloodied genitals and missing clothes.

its weird that people are supporting terrorists and also think that biden is a great president. I truly live in Bizarro World.

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Hamas is a terrorist group, who raped women and killed innocents. The true horror of hamas is that they declared that they were aware of the consequences of their attack, which underlines a plan to actually lure israel into attacking gaza. There is no doubt about that.

Yet, now everyone sees that in fact the idf is much worse than hamas, killing and raping many more, torturing, demolishing homes etc. They are both terrorist organizations that should be dismantled and brought to justice.

People are not supporting terrorists, this is the whole point. People are against terrorists, be it idf or hamas

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imo this is a large evaluation that Israel is missing. They consider that everyone, like them, draws a large distinction between Israeli & Palestinian lives, that a 30:1 kill ratio doesn't impugn their moral compass in the eyes of the larger world.

imo, again, they are wrong about that. One of the hazards of living inside an ideological hot house of unquestioned superiority & authority.

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why would anyone believe what a terrorist organization is saying? hamas is using social media to spread fake news and ignorant people are believing it. its a good thing social media didnt exist during WWII because people would be sympathetic to Hitler and Japan. all I know is that our World has gone mad.

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Good. Prove to me that woman is hamas.

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you posted the link, the burden of proof is on you...why do you support a terrorist organization?

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Your reply is just plain dumb

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so is yours, and at least I dont support Hamas or Biden.

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I was not aware of the horrid living conditions the Gazans had to endure because of the illegal blockade Israel put up.
Such as a lack of drinking water, limited access to come and go, poverty conditions and only 3 hrs. of electricity a day.
This was a prison concentration camp.
And also unaware of the illegal occupation and murder the terrorist IDF either did or supports the Jew settlers are doing to the Pals. in the W. Bank.

Fuck Israel.

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^^^ This.

The more I learn about how Palestinians are treated, the angrier I become.

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Oh c'mon Egypt is just as culpable as well. Takes two to blockade.

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Egypt was bought off along time ago.

"Both as an incentive, then a reward, for the Camp David Accords that brought peace between Israel and Egypt in 1978, the two countries quickly became the largest recipients of U.S. security assistance. Since then, the United States has provided Egypt with more than $50 billion in military aid and $30 billion in economic assistance, according to the State Department."

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One of the most disgusting things I saw - which came to light post invasion - was the Israeli practice of filling Palestian water wells with concrete to destroy their irrigation systems.

Utterly sub-human barbaric actions by people literally trying to keep rubbing those they seek to humiliate's noses in the ground.

Another thing I found incredible post the October attacks was the mindset - and I'm pretty sure it was one shared by one of the lunatic posters on here - that the Palestians should have been grateful to the Israelis for giving them work!

As you said, like a concentration camp, but I had no idea they were being rounded up in large numbers and driven into Israel to work as cheap labour in their factories / farmlands. And the Israeli viewpoint was how could have have attacked us when we were being so nice to them! Unbelievable...

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Thank you for this insight.

Being against what Israel is doing is the decent, humane, and compassionate way to be.

How there are those who are so much on the Israel/Zionist side that they find ways to excuse the abuse, genocide, and mass slaughter of the innocents is just beyond reprehensible.

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It's like a baby fighting an adult man.
The comparison of the 2 civilizations is not even close.

You have Israel scientist finding cures for cs cancers and then you have Palestinians who have not changed in hundreds of years.

They both want to fight each other, so let them fight it out so there is a clear winner and loser.

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Finding cures for cancer and starting wars all over the world.

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Can you elaborate on starting wars all over the world?

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jews control all the world events

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Do you have any examples?

Do the Jews control the Chinese? Russian? Indian?.Japanese?

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your examples are sufficient, thank you for including those 4 as they demonstrate inarguable evidence of my point

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So according to you the jews control China how??
Do they still have influence in Germany?

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You have to go back a long way.

I refer to them as Edomites.

They have converted to Romans, Judaism, Islam, Christianity, Russians, Germans, Spaniards, etc.

They have infiltrated every culture, religion, organization and country on almost every level and aspect, creating chaos and false flags everywhere.

So yes, they control/influence _________ fill in the blank.
Almost anything you name or list, they are behind every door and/or at the center of it.

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I can just see this as the next excuse for the pro Zionist crackpots who have their heads up their asses who refuse to see any wrongdoing of war crimes and genocide Israel is doing.

"It's OK they are killing all those innocent people. They all would have gotten cancer anyway, I'm sure. It's just Israel's way of curing their cancer."

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30k+ dead, mainly women & children, but hey - we do science. Give us a break.

There was & is another destiny available to Israel, that doesn't entail inciting & enduring terror attacks.

Its up to the Israeli eggheads to catch on to what everyone is telling them - make a Palestinian state, empower it to manage its affairs, work with it to combat terror and.... stop stealing, give back the settlement lands, forget the maximalist drive to ethnically cleanse MILLIONS of Palestinians.

Its a fools errand.

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There is time for civilians to leave...why won't any surrounding countries accept them?
Palestinians want this fight very much.

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In you logic because more German died than British, the British are worse than the Nazis.

you're an idiot

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When there is loss of innocent civilians and non-combatants on both sides than there is no clear winner.

Also, any war can escalate into a WW conflict.

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No, I'm pretty sure there is a clear winner and loser....some of the battles include rocks agaisnt tanks.......

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When there is loss of innocent life on both sides than both are losers.

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Thanks everyone, especially those who reported that the Gaza incursion (and previous atrocities by Hamas) had made some impression beyond previously held notions.

I personally was surprised at the lengths the Israelis are taking w/ civilian death, because I think it is a. inhumane, b. counter-productive. Particularly, since there is absolutely no PLAN for normalization going forward, as there was also no plan prior to the Oct attacks, or has existed since Bibi strangled Oslo in the crib. Bibi thought he could just trundle along, business as usual, his neck on the Palestinians, as he made normalization agreements with KSA, etc. And it actually looked like he might. And then...

If nothing else, besides the terrorism, retribution and ongoing man-made famine, the situation has put the Israel/Palestinian peace question back on the front burner, and finally challenged the US' un-blinking support for everything Israel does to the Palestinians, which by any objective reckoning amounts to theft/dispossession/oppression. There is a red line somewhere, maybe we're stumbling towards it, wrt unmeasured Israel military/economic/diplomatic support. These questions have clearly become, as they never quite were before, partisan issues and challenges to the general public & diaspora Jews.

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It’s exposed politicians on both sides, as well is big con, as to who their masters really are.

The fact people can’t even ask questions without being immediately cancelled says a lot.

Ask Candace.

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Yeap, they own both sides.

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Only with their supporters. I used to think both handled it the way they needed to, but I noticed that since October 7th, the pro-Palestine supporters are by far the worse of the two. Here in Toronto I have yet to see any pro-Israel supporters block traffic, but it's a daily occurrence with the other side. I also saw a group threaten a cop and the cops just stood there taking it.

Threatening a cop in Toronto:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PmgtuZNPHnA

There's the constant disruptions of politicians:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kGRU2zqXJRw (Gillibrand)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NPV423yHiAg&pp=ygUScGFsZXN0aW5lIHByb3Rlc3Rz (Clinton)

Blocking traffic:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QCATJYWWcns (Los Angeles)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y_JmGYdXzt4 (Capitol)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kG_FZbI6Aps (Academy Awards)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W5FwmmOhvAc (Rose Parade)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x4V0LDxwPAM (Virginia)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V2xXk92Bq7E (New York)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F6ubAc_MRrE (Berlin)

In New York, I saw pro-Palestine groups harass cancer patients outside of a cancer wing of a Jewish owned hospital.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M2JQWiQthts

Israel protesters aren't completely innocent, but they're a LOT less worse than pro-Palestine protesters.

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Here another left radical who didn't know anything about the conflict.
The Palestinians committed genocide on the seventh of October, something that doesn't seem to bother you. Israel is behaving exactly like any other country response to such an attack. In my opinion, Israel should be much tougher with the Nazis. Israel made the mistake of leaving Gaza and Hamas took over. The Palestinians wasting the hundreds of millions the nations give them to build a terrorist state. Israel made another mistake by letting tens of thousands of Nazis from Gaza work in Israel. Even after the massacre, the residents of Gaza continue to support Hamas and support the massacre of children, women and men. The fact that you automatically categorize the Palestinians as victims may fit racist identity politics but does not represent reality. The Palestinians are not interested in peace, they want the entire Land of Israel. Their culture worships death. They are murdering homosexuals. And what motivates them is anti-Semitism and a desire to destroy Israel. Israel needs to protect its citizens and must not lend a hand to the establishment of a Palestinian-Nazi state that would endanger its existence. just see what happen in Gaza after Israel left and it become a terrorist state.


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I know that Israel has been stealing Palestinian land since 1967, up to the present day, that Palestinians have no rights to speak of, that 32K are now dead over the last 100 days, that MILLIONS are starving/deprived of water in the here and now.

Anyone who holds Israel up to LEGITIMATE criticism gets smeared - have you noticed ?

What surprised me about the the Gaza incursion was how inept Israel has been about it, how brutal, how bereft of any actual plan, other than wholesale destruction, massive indiscriminate civilian death.

I knew it would be bad, I didn't think it would be this bad.

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