Why do people hate it so much? - Prometheus (2012) Discussion

[–] plusplus (467) 3 years ago

In retrospect, I think that it's the direct connection to the Alien timeline leading to a number of problems. It uses certain elements, but takes a different direction, is tonally different and leaves inconsistencies with prior movies.

I like both, the Alien movies and Prometheus, for different reasons. I see what Prometheus is trying to do, even if it sometimes fails. Expecting another Alien sequel here would probably lead to disappointment and confusion. Alien: Covenant only makes it worse.

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[–] TrentnQuarantino (8613) 3 years ago

It made no sense, and it took place in m-space ... that is, where all the human inhabitants act and make decisions like morons.

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[–] SteveG (1370) 3 years ago

IDK I loved it as a pure syfy experience with connections to the Alien universe. I was extremely disappointing when they did not continue the narrative.

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[–] Devilman (442) 3 years ago

I think because there was so much build up from the trailers and posters that people thought Ridley Scott was about to make another sci-fi masterpiece.

Originally it wasn't promoted as a prequel to Alien most people actually found that out after watching it which IMO was somewhat disappointing.

And as others mentioned the film does have a generous amount of plot stupidity.

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[–] PersistentViewer (1832) 3 years ago

I LOVE this movie.

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[–] Galactus03 (4293) 3 years ago

Same

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[–] kuatorises (7467) 3 years ago

Lots of reasons.

1. It wasn't scary. The moments that are supposed to scare, shock, and horrify you just did nothing for me. I didn't jump, shudder, gasp, or react any way you'd hope to when you go see a horror/sci fi flick. The delivery was extremely flat. You would watch this stuff happening and were like, "Well, ok....." I would like it so much more if it simply made me feel something.

2. The stupid scientists. The two idiots running around the ship are supposed to be brilliant scientists, but one panics at the drop of a hat and the other literally tries to pet a snake from another planet. He talks to it. He actually talks to it as if that is going to calm it down, LOL! A genius in his field chosen for a mission that is about to make the greatest discovery in human history talks to and tries to pet a space snake.

And the main character's boyfriend is fucking moping because they are dead? They figure out someone is responsible for creating the human race, find evidence of them, and he mopes?!

3. The tech is waaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaay too advanced too. I hate when prequels do this. They just can't help themselves.

4. Ridley really fucked up with the creature's lifecycle. We had a very clear, logical, and established thing here. Now you get xenomorphs by throwing some space snot on people? But only people, because if you drop it on Engineers, it just melts them. It's such bad writing.

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[–] aavfreak (2899) 3 years ago

3. The tech is waaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaay too advanced too. I hate when prequels do this. They just can't help themselves.

Yes and no. They've mastered FTL travel. They've mastered artificial gravity and anti-gravity. But they still drive wheeled vehicles and carry a ladder.

But your point stands. If this tech existed in Prometheus as shown, then why was the tech in Alien so primitive in comparison?

I suppose it can be explained by the budget of the expedition in Prometheus vs the budget of a commercial space tug in Alien.

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[–] kuatorises (7467) 3 years ago

The ships in Alien and Aliens vs Prometheus don't even look from the same universe. There's no justifying tech from the past looking so much more advanced. Nothing about our tech was more advanced 30 years ago.

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[–] aavfreak (2899) 3 years ago

If we stay with the analogy of the ships, compare a high end yacht from 1990 with a tug boat (from any era).

https://www.boatinternational.com/yachts/the-superyacht-directory/cloud-atlas--46973

The yacht will seem much more advanced than the tug. Every time. Even though it's 30 years older.

https://www.freeimages.com/photo/tug-boat-1449637

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[–] kuatorises (7467) 3 years ago

In what way does that yacht "seem more advanced"? The shape and paint job? What are the specs?

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[–] aavfreak (2899) 3 years ago

This was your statement: "There's no justifying tech from the past looking so much more advanced."

The yacht from 1990 looks more advanced than the tug.

For another thing, the Prometheus was presumably state of the art for its voyage. For all we know the Nostromo 30 years later was low budget tech from the same time.

When I was in the Marines, I deployed in 2002 on a Navy ship commissioned in 1970.
When I worked logistics in 2015, we regularly shipped containers on cargo ships 40-50 years old.

Alien may have taken place 30 years later, but there's no reason the tech had to be 30 years more advanced.

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[–] kuatorises (7467) 3 years ago

I'm not talking about aesthetics, you dingus. I am talking about this:

https://www.scified.com/topics/2683928512196884.jpg
https://static.wikia.nocookie.net/avp/images/6/6b/939.png/revision/latest?cb=20180104211822

https://entertainment.time.com/wp-content/uploads/sites/3/2012/06/600_prometheus-prom-007_rgb1.jpg?w=600
https://i1.wp.com/scifiinterfaces.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/11/prometheus-188.png

The actual capabilities of the tech. That yacht is not "more advanced" than the tugboat simply because it's more aerodynamic. Give me specs. Prove to me it's actually more advanced.

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[–] aavfreak (2899) 3 years ago

These are literally your words. Emphasis mine.

"The ships in Alien and Aliens vs Prometheus don't even look from the same universe. There's no justifying tech from the past looking so much more advanced."

So, yes, you are talking about asthetics.

But let's just take your example here. The room with Mother vs. the map in the Prometheus. It is conceivable that Mother is bottom tier tech from the same time as Prometheus as state of the art. Working vessels can easily be 30 years old or more. But you seem to have ignored that entire part of my post.

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[–] kuatorises (7467) 3 years ago

You are telling me what I mean now? Are we really going to do this?

Prometheus takes place 30 years before Alien. You show me a 30 year old piece of tech that is more advanced than something current.

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[–] aavfreak (2899) 3 years ago

I'm not telling you what you mean. I'm quoting your exact words.

You reference "something current." Show me where the Sulaco was designed and built 30 years after Prometheus.

Imagine we have a movie set in 2021, with a top of the line Tesla.
Then imagine we have a movie set in 2051 with a dump truck manufactured in 2021.
Which would you expect to have the more advanced tech? The 2021 Tesla or the 30 year old 2021 dump truck?

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[–] kuatorises (7467) 3 years ago

You can't name a single piece of tech from 30 years ago that's more advanced than something today.

And now you're trying to pretend the Sulaco is from the same era as Prometheus? That's even more laughable. In no universe is the tech from the two movies the same time frame. It's like saying Beta exists at the same time of streaming services. It's a massive continuity error.

You have no argument.

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[–] aavfreak (2899) 3 years ago

-"And now you're trying to pretend the Sulaco is from the same era as Prometheus?"

No, not now. That was six posts ago. And you're still ignoring it, because clearly you have no reasonable response. You can go to any port or any mine and see equipment 30 years old. It's not uncommon at all.

For another thing, the Prometheus was presumably state of the art for its voyage. For all we know the Nostromo 30 years later was low budget tech from the same time.

When I was in the Marines, I deployed in 2002 on a Navy ship commissioned in 1970.
When I worked logistics in 2015, we regularly shipped containers on cargo ships 40-50 years old.

Alien may have taken place 30 years later, but there's no reason the tech had to be 30 years more advanced.

-"You can't name a single piece of tech from 30 years ago that's more advanced than something today."
*sigh* I've been very clear here, that I'm saying a basic freighter could have easily been built in the same time as the state of the art luxury ship 30 years earlier.

-"You have no argument."
My argument is here over and over. Yet you keep avoiding it to beat down your straw man.

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[–] kuatorises (7467) 3 years ago

Bahahahahahahaha!

"The Nostromo was constructed in 2101 as an interstellar cruiser, but was refitted in 2116 as a commercial towing vehicle.[3] The ship was subsequently operated as a commercial hauler, transporting automated ore and oil refineries between outer colonies and Earth.[2] As part of this retrofit, the ship's original Saturn J-3000 engines were removed and replaced with the two immensely powerful Rolls-Royce N66 Cyclone thrust engines, with bipolar vectoring for midline lift function."

https://avp.fandom.com/wiki/USCSS_Nostromo

https://www.google.com/search?client=firefox-b-1-d&q=promtheus+year+set+in

https://www.google.com/search?client=firefox-b-1-d&q=alien+movie+year+setting

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[–] aavfreak (2899) 3 years ago

In light of this, I have no option but to concede. Well done.

That's what I get for taking a position that defends anything about this dreck.

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[–] [deleted] 3 years ago

Because it sucks ass

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[–] MickyMac (2966) 3 years ago

1. had no to little idea what was happening, 2. it was trying to recreate the original Alien beat for beat, it's like if Alien was Thriller and this is Golimaar where it looks like Thriller, it's trying to be Thriller but it's a botched rehash so it could make Thriller dollars.

With the Alien franchise we needed a big shake up but my god Prometheus and Alien Covenant shows we can never ever get out of the original Alien, that's the template we can't change the template, look how done to death it is.

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[–] BourbonKing (5662) 3 years ago

Ridley should have worked with the framework of where ALIEN3 left-off. Bussard's rendition was more of an auteur exercise injecting all of his film sensibilities so it could be considered an off-shoot like "Octopussy" is to the Roger Moore vs Sean Connery time-lines.

That being said, instead of an origin story, it would be a forensic exploration into what happened as Weyland-Utani's massive investment bust needs some reconciliation so Ridley could have taken the angle of exploring humanity's presumptuous attitude to "the Right to own Space" to another level with Weyland sponsoring an investigation. Think of it as a doomed Christopher Columbus expedition where finding gold and riches results in the very opposite. Is this an original idea? Of course not, but Ridley's oddball take on HAL-9000 with "David" as broken Dues ex machina never delivered.

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[–] MickyMac (2966) 3 years ago

Think the template of Alien (a spaceship crew going out to investigate, shit happens, a woman is the last surviving member) is kind of hard to be effective at all when it's a commonplace in pop culture, that makes Prometheus and Alien Covenant pointless because all the surprises of the original Alien aren't there, so your just watching these semi clones with all the surprises you know are coming, that's why if you gonna do a sequel or prequel you have to change the template up, you give us the same thing in a new gift wrapping we're gonna open it up and say "dude I've already got one of these".

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[–] kuatorises (7467) 3 years ago

Prometheus was always supposed to be a prequel. He couldn't used Alien 3 as a framework because he wanted to go to the past.

I am more believe it went from supposed to be about the crashed Space Jockey ship to a "search for mankind's origin".

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[–] kuatorises (7467) 3 years ago

"it's like if Alien was Thriller and this is Golimaar where it looks like Thriller, it's trying to be Thriller but it's a botched rehash so it could make Thriller dollars."

....what?

"It's a rehash" is a popular argument whenever people don't likes prequels or sequels, even if it's not an accurate complaint. Alien is about a bunch of blue collar workers who stumble upon a ship with a dead crew and slew of deadly aliens. They have no idea what is going on and were ordered to go there by their employer. Prometheus is about a rich old guy who thinks aliens created us and the key to immortality is finding them. There's still death, gore, etc., but these people are in the know. They chose to go and are made aware these creatures might have created humanity.

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[–] MickyMac (2966) 3 years ago

But it's the same basic template of a spaceship going out to investigate something, shit happens, a woman is the last surviving member. Look how done to death that template especially in the Alien franchise and Alien rip offs.

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[–] kuatorises (7467) 3 years ago

They were actually on their way home in Alien and stumbled across LV-426. In Prometheus, they intentionally went out into space looking for clues to the origins of humanity. In Alien, they are hunted by a xenomorph. No such thing happens in Prometheus.

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