MovieChat Forums > Unfrosted (2024) Discussion > Should I Boycott This Due To Seinfeld's ...

Should I Boycott This Due To Seinfeld's Support For The IDF Slaughter Of Innocence People?


I'm not sure about this.

On one hand, it doesn't really look that funny anyway, so maybe no big deal.

On the other, I've been a huge (not literally) fan of Seinfeld for years and would normally have been all over this when it came out.

But now, since Jerry decided to remove any semblance of a neutral-ish US Jewish guy, not hugely into the Zionist question, and embarked on a personal tour endorsing the slaughtering rampage of the IDF, I feel I shouldn't be watching this.

Is there any moral way I can ignore the abhorrent behaviour of this man (to some degree a formal idol of mine) and just watch this for the comedy? Comedy, which, as said at the start, is probably going to be pretty poor anyway...

Thoughts?

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Yahhhh!...and please boycott MovieChat too!
Thanks for your cooperation. 🤘🏽​

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Please. Save your political pandering for the appropriate forum (i.e. politics). I'm hoping to propagate an interesting discussion around ethics / morality here, and how we should deal with artists holding questionable beliefs. Not indulge in usual juvenile faeces slinging seen around here.

If you want to play with the big boys, please do make a sensible comment. Otherwise, slink off back to your usual pit...

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Hallo?!
You just asked about boycotting a film for political reasons.

Warm up, wannabe "big boy".
You're dealing with a real woman right now. 😈​

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No I didn't - For more information re-read the OP.

I asked about the morality around whether you should boycott a film due to the unethical behaviour of one of the artists appearing in it.

That is something completely different, which even someone who struggles with nuances should easily be able to understand. Now, I appreciate that it probably seems tricky for yourself, but I even invited you to make a sensible comment on the ACTUAL topic at hand.

Now that has been clearly spelled out for you, please do enlighten us with your take on the subject. Thanks 👍🏽.

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Yah, you only asked an 'innocent' question. ☻
And with that you've already classified supporting Israel as "unethical".
As you constantly and everywhere incite against Israelis and Jews.

I already gave you my "take":
Please boycott MovieChat too! 🤘🏽​

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LOL. It's hilarious that you are so entrenched that you cannot appreciate that even the most ardent Israel supporter would be able to enter this discussion, if they were sufficiently intelligent enough to dissociate their prejudice position from the actual topic.

Yes, I asked about Seinfeld as that is upsetting to me, but it could just as easily have been about the works of Richard Wagner or JK Rowling's Harry Potter books. Intellectually, you should be capable of dissociating emotionally and still be able to discuss the raised topic.

But unfortunately you are clearly unable to, and therefore you are of no further use to me here. As I said to you previously, slink off back to your comfort zone and start chucking faeces around again. I'm not interested in continuing to do that here...

Good day to you Sir 👍🏽

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Do boycott Moviechat, please.

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Why? Do you require a safe space in order to feel comfortable with the current ongoing slaughter and exodus of millions of people?

LOL 😂 At least show a little back bone if you're supporting a murderous rampage!

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So you're saying Israel is giving Hamas a taste of their own medicine?

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But you're going to invite political discussion over this matter regardless.

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Well I appreciate that these guys cannot be stopped. Some of them have been repeating the same thing for months, logic be damned!

But I was really looking more for a discussion on personal ethics with regards to the arts. Unfortunately only a couple of more intelligent posters have managed to grasp the difference rather than just repeating mantra...

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I've given up on worrying about who an artist is/was as a person. I'm only interested in the art itself. The art is ultimately the audience's possession.

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It is clear since you have no idea what is really going on that you cannot process thoughts.

Palestinians have been escalating their barbarism, and promised to keep doing it. Israel has no choice. Not to mention that most of the claims as to victimhood or genocide or whatever from Hamas have turned out to be complete lies.

Sorry I don't have time to spoon-feed you Middle Eastern history, but you know nothing, and actively supporting lies makes you even worse, and dangerous.

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For more information on the ACTUAL topic here, please re-read the posts and replies above.

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You mean you actually know the Middle Eastern history? thats great ,
I've been trying to get to the bottom of this for years!

So who started this Israel / Palestine squabble and when?


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Look around the world and take an inventory of the Islamic countries, how they treat their own people and others, and think about it - do you really need to ask me that question?

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yes! , for the love of god yes!
I need answers
The middle east is complicated enough without riddles and people just saying "its obvious"


'cos on the face of it it looks like Israel stole a large chunk of Palestine around '47 and has been steadily oppressing the rest of the country ever since with a form of apartheid and more land grabbing , topping it off with a genocide this year.

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So you have your answer that you are happy with, and want to bait an answer you can disagree with.

Jews have been living in that area since before there was a Mohammed or an Islam. The sheer violence and brutal expansion of Arabian Islam across the world made them a minority in their own land - like many other groups are today - Christians, Yazidis, Kurds, all treated brutally and subhumanly.

So how do you reconcile calling that stealing land?

You did enough research to find out the anti-semitic answer you are happy with, so if you are sincere - go fucking do some more real research into history. Find out who was the religious and politiical leader of this area after the Ottoman empire collapsed during WWII ... I'll give you a hint:

https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/9/9d/Bundesarchiv_Bild_146-1987-004-09A%2C_Amin_al_Husseini_und_Adolf_Hitler.jpg

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again and again I'm hearing "Arab expansion! oh no! "
meaning general complaints about arab behaviour all over the region
Is that some kind of diversion?
or did Arabs "expand" onto the ground that is now Israel at some point in the past and take it from the jews?

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It's not that any one group expanded, it is the system of death cult oppression that has made these countries and their citizens, especially non-Muslims, miserable. Not just Arabs since we are talking Iran as well.

If you disagree with that ... how about go and live in the region then.

And then go back and explain your dishonest call for help understanding when you just want to bitch, complain and argue.

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...after the Ottoman empire collapsed during WWII...

😂 Haha, fantastic!

... go fucking do some more real research into history

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It should have read

after the Ottoman empire collapsed, during WWII

And, way to miss the point.

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LOL 😂

No, it shouldn't have said that either. Just terrible...

Actually though, what you could have written there, which would have made sense, was:-

"...after the Ottoman empire collapsed, the people in the Palestinian territories who had supported the British by fighting the Ottomans in the first World War - allowing them to avoid having to open up another front - awaited the British promises of land for self determination in exchange for that support to be granted."

Then you may have educated some on why the failure to do so and in fact give a chunk of that very territory to the Zionists, has resulted in a distrust / hatred of the west, in terms of the UK and the USA, which has continued to this day.

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Your distortion of history is evident.

> the people in the Palestinian territories who had supported the British by fighting the Ottomans in the first World War

Who?

> awaited the British promises of land for self determination in exchange for that support to be granted."

"The people" got many different offers, a lot better for the Arabs then than what exists today, but the Arabs refused it. Not only that but there is no evidence that they would still not have fought to murder all the Jews as they tried many times.

The attacks by Muslims on minorities in their borders and the 2nd class slavery they force proves that Jews and any other minority in this area deserves land to be protected from the vicious barbarism of Jihadi Muslims.

Playing the victim in the Western media has sadly worked for Palestinians and this sick narrative has seeped by default into the empty uncritical minds of a lot of Westerners, but it is a lie, and the proof is the history, and the behavior of this culture all over the Muslims world.

If the deluded idiots on the Left who rally in favor of Hamas understood just how anti-Left Hamas is and what fools they are ... like Gays for Hamas, they'd feel eternal shame.

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Your distortion of history is evident


"The people" got many different offers, a lot better for the Arabs then than what exists today, but the Arabs refused it.


😂 Again, you have your World Wars mixed up!!

I guess I must be "trolling" again to point that out...

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> LOL 😂

That does not really lend much weight and credibility to your bullshit. The mark of a trolls lies.

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Hardly the mark of any "trolling" was it? It was genuine laughter at you swearing at someone and telling them to research their history, then saying the Ottoman Empire collapsed in WW2 (!!), then trying to cover for that quite poorly with your "misplaced" comma accuse...

Anyone reading the trail of posts can easily see that.

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Except I didn't say that, you're just a jackoof

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Except I didn't say that...


...after the Ottoman empire collapsed during WWII...


... go fucking do some more real research into history


You're basically trolling yourself at this point 😂.

Nevertheless I'm sure you'll see fit to make some further worthless comment. Let's see...

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I now ignore trolls - so keep it up ah.

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Go see Dr. Van Nostrand.

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Looks really, really funny to me.

Only you can answer the question of whether or not you want to watch it. If your morality goes against that of the creators of the film - in this case, Seinfeld - and you don't want to give anything Seinfeld is part of a click, view, or dollar, then yeah, you should avoid it.

I have a friend who can't watch Woody Allen movies anymore. He finds the real world has imposed itself on Woody's films, so he can't get into them or enjoy them. It's as much a psychological block as it is a moral stance. So, if you won't be able to focus on the film or enjoy the movie because you'll be thinking about Israel and Palestine the whole time, that's another reason to not watch.

For myself, I separate art from artists and enjoy work pretty much no matter who's involved. I've watched and loved Roman Polanski movies like Carnage and Ghostwriter (although I didn't actually know the latter was Polanski until I guessed it was his style from about 1/3 of the way in). So, Polanski is as guilty as sin and of a pretty heinous crime and I still can detach enough to enjoy the films. I still think he should serve his sentence and be punished, but that doesn't mean I'm going to not appreciate art.

I'm planning to watch Unfrosted as soon as I can. I think it looks great. Of course, I'm also not anti-Israel, so it wouldn't bother me, anyway.

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Thanks for making the only legitimate reply to this topic thus far 👍

And just for clarity though, I'm not anti Israel per se. Just what is being carried out in their name at the moment. And the fact that Seinfeld allowed himself to be photographed with IDF weaponry was just a little too much for my neutral perspective.

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"neutral perspective" 🤣​

Just an example of many: ☻
https://moviechat.org/bd0000082/Politics/65ad5e76e7684563305630c1/If-the-US-Removed-All-Support-How-Quickly-Would-Israel-Be-Reined-In
OP FootOfDavros

Leastwise you planted that on the right board...Politics.

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Are you plain stupid?

Here's what I wrote:-

... just for clarity though, I'm not anti Israel per se. Just what is being carried out in their name at the moment...

Do you actually comprehend what that means? Do you understand what the term "reined in" means?

Since you're such a genius at looking through other people's posts though, I'm sure you'll have no problem finding one which actually ISN'T of a neutral perspective. For example, please do post a link to one where I say Israel shouldn't exist or slur Jewish people. Thanks 👍.

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"Are you plain stupid?"
No.

"Here's what I wrote:-"
"Over 25,000 Palestinians now executed in response for Israel's security failings."
https://moviechat.org/bd0000082/Politics/65ad5e76e7684563305630c1/If-the-US-Removed-All-Support-How-Quickly-Would-Israel-Be-Reined-In
Typical reversal of perpetrator and victim. 🤘🏽​
Palestinians (Hamas) attacked Israel and murdered innocent civilians.
There are still Israeli civilian hostages held by Hamas!
But now the Israelis (victims) have only themselves to blame because their security may've failed.
Tell that a woman who got raped, yah, she has to blame herself for not protecting herself enough and how she dared to walk in the park!
And how evil it is that Israel doesn't act like a helpless victim.

"Since you're such a genius at looking through other people's posts..."
I read the Latest Posts and if there's something interesting or extreme I store it, as I store threads in which I posted in. That's helpful if e.g. someone secretly changed his/her post to what I replied to. How dare I do that!!!
And that wasn't the first or the only time you spewed such nonsense.
Check your post history yourself, you'll easily find many more examples of your supposed "neutral perspective". 🤢​

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Sorry, I don't know if you need to sort this post out (?) but I'm not sure what your point is here?

What have you written that disproves that I hold a neutral perspective? Are you claiming that because I said because Israel ignored security warnings, leading to deaths, that means I'm bias?!!

Sorry, I genuinely do not know what you're trying to say... 🤔

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"Are you plain stupid?" 😈​

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Well I guess I must be!

Sorry pal, I can't discuss this any further as I genuinely don't understand what point you think you were making...

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Have a nice dance into May! 🐞​🕺​💃​

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I think most people see "Israel" and/or "Palestine" and immediately galvanise into a political discussion. Truth be known, I'm not sure I would have responded as on-topic as I did but for the fact that I read your responses to other people focusing on the politics; it is an almost hypnotising subject these days.

And for clarity, I don't have a definitive position on the Middle East conflicts because I think they're more complicated than the 100% Israel or 100% Palestine positions that most people take. I think Israel is in an impossible position where any action they take will lead to harm, death, and despair. But, on the other hand, I also recognise that life has been really hard in the Gaza and the West Bank, so I don't want to just say, "Oh, they should all just take it forever."

As to Seinfeld, I haven't been following his stance one way or the other. At worst, however, if he declared himself 100% in favour of every action Israel has ever taken, I'd basically go, "Oh, it's disappointing that he lacks nuance, especially given the obvious power of his analytical mind (given his stand-up)." I'd still watch the movie. After all, there are many, many Hollywood persons who have come out unequivocally for Palestinians, and I consider that to be an overly simplistic position, as well.

Or, in short, every movie, television show, and other collaborative piece of art is almost certainly made by people one disagrees with. If you're taking a hardline stance against that, you're basically consigning yourself to writing your own novels and then reading them.

Perhaps that's too extreme a position, but it's the conclusion of the line of thinking that you won't watch something because of the politics of those involved.

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Polanski was guilty. Woody is innocent.

I don't know that what Polanski did was especially horrible, as apparently the story goes the 13 year old girl whose mother gave her, or pimped her to Roman Polanksi ... I mean, what do you say or do about that when someone's own mother runs her life and family like that? The crime Polanski was guilty of was fleeing justice as well.

Poor Woody is accused of what seems to be a ridiculous crime of decided to molest his pre-pubescent daughter one time in an attic in a house full of adults and children in his 50's with no history of such criminal activity. The hate of Woody and Jews is something that took hold in the media and keeps getting repeated and refreshed and even embellished with more and more nonsense.

As for Israel/Palestine, there is no genocide happening. Life is being made very difficult for Palestinians because of their support for Hamas, and the fact that they are being used as hostages to protect Hamas fighters. The information and videos are out there. There is actually more food trucks going into Gaza now than before the war because nothing else is being allowed in but humanitarian necessities.

The videos of Palestinians partying it up and eating, and Hamas fighters hijacking the food trucks. The realities that the Hamas reported death tolls are exaggerated by as much as 50%. Now they are finding that the mass graves are Gaza civilians who tried to stand up to Hamas to get rid of them.

Westerners are not used to and do not want to accept the staggering size of the lies and propaganda Hamas is in control of, and many Americans hear two sides of any story and want to imagine reality is in the middle - but that just ain't the case when it comes to this conflict, virtually everything that comes out of Gaza serves Hamas, while Israel controls the war zone - Israel proper has many many free press papers and channels and their people, including Arabs are free to report and editorialize.

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Oh, yeah, I brought up Polanski specifically because he is unambiguously guilty. *He* says he's guilty. My point was that I can still enjoy Chinatown and Ghostwriter because I am very much a art-not-artist person. I brought up Woody Allen because my friend abstains from his work because the real world brouhaha gets in his head; this is as opposed to cancel culture where some people would say, "I don't like Woody Allen and that means you can't watch his movies."

I absolutely agree that Woody is innocent. I would also argue that dating your girlfriend's step-daughter is not a good way to begin a relationship, but he's been with Soon-Yi for decades, so something worked. The starting point was bad, but the result seems legit. But, yeah, as far as I can tell (and I can't really, truly know for certain) the accusations of molestation against Allen are bunkum.

Whatever else is going on in the region, Hamas is evil.

I think the Israel-Palestine situation is a complex web, though, and you have two groups who are indigenous to the area (Jews and Arabs) grappling with the geopolitical equivalent of "two objects cannot occupy the same space and time." I wouldn't call the IDF's actions genocide, either, but I do lament the bombing. I hate the fact that 30,000+ people - Israeli and Palestinian - have lost their lives because of this most recent flare-up.

Of course, I also acknowledge that the situation in the Middle East has been tense for centuries, and even if we're only tracking post-WWII, the "he started it" goes back and forth and I cannot fully blame any one party. Israel was founded by the UN and immediately attacked by its neighbouring states, so the causes of conflict are even connected to many other countries like Iran, Jordan, Egypt, Syria, and all "Yea" voting UN members. Heck, we can blame the Nazis for underlining the necessity for a Jewish state in the first place.

And, yes, I know Hamas are full of lies. Of course, I'm assuming that (like all governments) the Israeli government isn't 100% truthful, either. But I'm guessing that they have a closer-to-average (for governments) truth:lie ratio, whereas Hamas are basically just ISIS with better PR.

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His support of Israel just makes me want to watch this movie even more. The best way to get myself and the vast majority of non-college-age Americans to NOT watch a movie is to blurt out that you’re in favor of Palestine/Hamas.

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Again, nothing to do with the topic at hand.

But I do love the required deliberate attempted conflation of Palestine / Hamas. It's very much a key tactic and you've got to respect the dogmatic approach to this as a means of allowing people to dehumanise Palestinians and turn the other cheek to their deaths / land theft.

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I don’t remember reading that the Palestinians lifted a finger to overthrow Hamas over the past seventeen years, and according to current surveys, over 80% of Gaza’s population still supports Hamas leadership. So yeah…there’s a very good reason to just lump the two together into one big deplorable basket.

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> attempted conflation of Palestine / Hamas

Something like 90% of all Palestinians support Hamas.
More support Hamas' actions on Oct. 7th than actually support the group,
but in any case both are well above 50%.

To understand this you actually have to look at some of the schools and
religion training Palestinian children get growing up. There are videos of
this online - MEMRI.org goes into these issues extensively.

Also, the son of the leader of Hamas, Mosab Hasan Yousef, who is a converted
Christian, and has written books and lectured extensively can tell about all
of this from his own personal first hand experiences growing up.

If you can imagine a society more brutal and repressive than North Korea,
Palastine would be it.

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If you can imagine a society more brutal and repressive than North Korea...

Er, the United States perhaps?

I understand protesting against and seeking divestment from evil regimes there is met by a heavy handed police state response...

Anyway, I thought you were ignoring me for "trolling" you by pointing out you keep getting your World Wars mixed up?

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So you think the US is more brutal and repressive than North Korea?

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I was obviously being facetious.

But it is quite funny that we in the west are repeatedly shown the horrors of labelled "repressive" regimes, e.g. North Korea, China, Russia, Iran, etc. And yet here we see police and state troopers being sent in to arrest / disperse kids protesting at universities in the "land of the free".

It's pretty amusing.

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You see, when you act and speak like a jerk off, facetiousness is not readily apparent.

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I appreciate that when you equate not wanting to see innocent people being slaughtered by a supposed real life, actual democracy with being a "jerk off" that you're going to struggle with what's readily apparent...

Maybe more so than you struggle with your history! 😂

(Sorry, just being a jerk off... Couldn't resist 👍)

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You are a jerk-off, why wouldn't you be a constant jerk-off?
Obviously too much effort or programming expertise to fine-time that.

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Probably sounded like a better comeback in your head than the reality of how that reads...

Are you going to tell me your dad could beat up my dad next? 😂

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print random( "Stupid Right Wing Insults ) ;

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print random( "Stupid Right Wing Insults ) ;

Error!!!

LOL, you can't even get that right! 😂

Again, my apologies, it's just too funny...

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Hamas has genocide of all Jews on their charter. Because they hate Yahweh and His chosen people. God foretold in the Bible that he would reestablish Israel and when it happened in 1948, the Muslims living there were devastated. They should take it up with Yahweh.

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Well put.

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Well, there is all that religious mumbo jumbo, but most Israeli Jews are turning secular. The ones who are controlled by a totalitarian repressive regime that
will torture and kill you if you question or leave the faith is Islam.

Any price to rid that sick society ( worse than the Taliban ) would be worth it
to ensure future Arabs in the region can live free of being dehumanized and
used as weapons and slaves to a society that cares nothing for them as
individuals.

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maybe Hamas shouldn't have attacked a far superior Country with a far superior military

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Exactly.

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Thoughts are:

When has boycotting someone's art actually changed anything? In our modern world, not like 1492 or something.

I separate art from artist a lot. In order to enjoy many things

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I don't suppose I would boycott something like this with an expectation it would change anything.

I appreciate the majority of people are simply indifferent. It's more just a case of personal ethics.

Out of interest though, what are some examples of your own separation of art from artists?

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Kevin Spacey movies

Any great films produced by weinsteins company

Stuff like that

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...dozens of "But what about Hamas not liking Jews?" posts later.......... Moviechat is a cesspool.

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... Okay, I'm going to tread carefully here to try to avoid strawman traps!

Are you trying to say it's a cesspool because they cannot help but post such irrelevancies to the topic here?

Or it's a cesspool because they post comments like that apparently oblivious to the fact that has always been the case and therefore highlighting the fact only throws shade on Israel's security failings which have costs tens of thousands of people their lives and millions their homes?

I appreciate you DIDN'T actually say either of these things, I'm just looking to find out what you were getting at...

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