MovieChat Forums > Avatar (2009) Discussion > Why’s it Forgotten? Avatar (2009)

Why’s it Forgotten? Avatar (2009)


https://lebeauleblog.com/2019/12/18/whys-it-forgotten-avatar-2009-2/

Today is the 10th anniversary of James Cameron’s sci-fi epic, Avatar. A decade ago, the movie was a pop culture phenomenon. But it’s appeal faded fast along with the 3-D craze it inspired. Cameron has been working on a bunch of sequels audiences may or may not have any interest in. About the only thing keeping Avatar relevant at this point is a popular theme park ride inspired by Cameron’s once-popular creation.

Kevthewriter examines why almost no one cares about Avatar anymore.

https://lebeauleblog.com/2018/05/08/whys-it-forgotten-avatar-2009/

Well I think the film fell victim to its own hype. At the time, Cameron hyped the movie up as if it was going to be one of the biggest, most important films ever. He made it seem like something that was gonna be super de duper special, something that would change cinema forever. And, at first, people bought it and they were raving about the movie.

But there was a huge backlash against the movie. While different people had different reasons for why they didn’t like the movie, the main reason many people were saying the movie wasn’t as good as Cameron was making it out to be was that it had a really cliché plot.

Now here’s the thing: many movies have cliché plots, some that end up being very popular, but they don’t get quite nearly the same amount of backlash that Avatar got.


Just look at Titanic. The plot is basically your typical “rich girl bored by high society falls for charming poor boy” plot. But that movie was heavily hyped and, while there was a backlash against it at the time too, it wasn’t quite as big as Avatar‘s. But here’s the difference: while that movie was a huge phenomenon, and while it did have a vocal hatedom after the phenomenon started, it probably wasn’t quite as huge as Avatar‘s because Cameron didn’t make it out to be the second coming like he did with Avatar. And Titanic is still remembered, quoted, and has a fanbase to this day while Avatar…not as much.

Because the thing is, for all of Cameron’s hype, I guess Avatar just wasn’t a memorable enough movie to really have a long-lasting impact in people’s minds. And, after a while, the hate died down and most people just sort’ve remembered it for the phenomenon it was at the time while forgetting the actual movie almost altogether. That made it different from Titanic: yes it was cliché. Yes it was hyped up when it came out. Yes people loved it. Yes there was a backlash. But the difference is Titanic has actually stuck with people over the years while Avatar has not.

I think the problem is expectations can kill a movie. If Avatar was promoted as just being a sci-fi action fantasy movie and nothing more, people would’ve most likely forgotten about it but it probably wouldn’t have been as hated as it eventually became.

And it’s not just Avatar. Look at the next big 3D movie after it, Alice in Wonderland. It’s basically a cliché “young person saves a fantasy land from an evil kingdom” movie set in Wonderland. But it was hugely hyped up at the time because it was Tim Burton doing a Wonderland movie and that sounded like a perfect fit. Plus he was teaming up with Johnny Depp again and, at that time, people still trusted them to do good movies together even if, by then, their movies were starting to be hit or miss. And it was the next movie to show what 3D could do. So all of these things together sounded like they should make an awesome movie and not the forgettable Narnia/Harry Potter knock off it ended up being. But, because it was that, the movie ended up pissing off a lot of people. Had it not been from those people or been a Wonderland movie, or both, audiences might’ve been more forgiven it a bit more.

Another Disney movie this happened to was Frozen. People were hyping it as being one of the biggest things ever which ended up causing a backlash from many audience members who left the movie feeling underwhelmed. And this has pretty much happened to, well, all of the new Star Wars movies (maybe not Rogue One as much). No matter how much the critics like it, if a movie gets heavily hyped, there’s probably going to be a backlash from people who weren’t so impressed by the movie.

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I still think it's great.

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Man, fuck that noise. It's one of the best movies ever made and it was just on multiple times recently.

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"IN MY CHILDISH, UTTERLY UNEDUCATED AND COMPLETELY SUBJECTIVE OPINION, Avatar is one of the best movies ever made."

There, I fixed it for you.

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A tad overkill, don't you think? I agree with you that it's a subjective opinion but did you really have to use the words 'childish' and 'uneducated'? That's harsh, dude.

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https://c.tenor.com/zjK4AuvZbSYAAAAM/fgjfgj.gif

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What's the link for?

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That's my reply to your comment.

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I'm not clicking on it.

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https://c.tenor.com/UeNo9NX2_qIAAAAM/elmo-shrug.gif

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That's a different link.

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https://s3.amazonaws.com/CMB2/001NewsLetterMaster/You+Don%27t+Say.jpg

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I'm not clicking on any links. Can you just tell me what your reply was?

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The only troll here is you, April-151-CT.

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https://c.tenor.com/NVfzz27NtwIAAAAC/paul-reubens-pee-wee-herman.gif

BAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! 🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣

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It (April-151), in addition to being a humor-less brain-damaged troll, frequently posts links to illegal downloads of films. It should be banned posthaste.

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Maybe so, but sometimes brutal honestly is the way to go. It's how Simon Cowell makes a living

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What are you being honest about, the fact that you can't recognise that you're being unkind to someone who offered a subjective opinion? If so I completely agree!

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What's to be kind about? The OP stated a series of valid points from the attached article, yet the fellow poster (which I responded to) bluntly dismissed them and stated what he/she proclaimed to be fact with little to back it up with. It wasn't "offered", it was forced.

Can you think of a better way to respond?

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Oh for god's sake. The poster was only stating that to them this is the best movie ever. So? What does it matter to you? There was nothing about it that made it 'childish' or 'uneducated'. That fact that you felt the need to respond to an opposing opinion (as I presume you don't like the film) in such a passive-aggressive and insulting way says so much more about you than it does them.

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The poster was only stating that to them this is the best movie ever


That fact that you felt the need to respond to an opposing opinion (as I presume you don't like the film) in such a passive-aggressive and insulting way says so much more about you than it does them.


The poster said and I quote, "Man, fuck that noise. It's one of the best movies ever made and it was just on multiple times recently.", basically saying "I'm right and you're wrong, regardless of what you say.", and ignoring valid points raised by the OP. There's no mention of "opinion" anywhere, or even implied as such (unlike Forky's post at the top).

There was nothing about it that made it 'childish' or 'uneducated'.


It IS IN FACT childish and ignorant to insist your subjective opinion is fact when there are multiple arguments proving otherwise. If you can't see that, we're going to have to agree to disagree.

So? What does it matter to you?


Might I ask you the same question? This thread has already dragged on longer than it needed to thanks to you.

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Believe it or not I do completely understand where you're coming from. In fact, on another thread I was making the same argument you are now when someone said that "all women with short hair made them look ugly" and he/she had "no idea why women do that to themselves"! But in this case I really do not believe this person meant it as 'fact'. Also, they didn't insist their opinion was fact. Too many people do construct their sentences in a way that implies it's a fact but we all know that typically that is not what's intended.

Why does it matter to me? Because I hate undue rudeness.

This thread may have dragged on longer because of me, true, but you didn't have to respond.

Either way, I just believe that certain messages can still get across without rudeness and name-calling. But that's just me!

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So, you really don't consider a comment like 'Man, fuck that noise.' undue rudeness?
Also, since when did I ever engage in any name calling?

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Some of the best films of my life I don't need to watch over and over again as they are too powerful or memorable enough. Avatar is part of the modern language amongst people, in my experience among scientists and in spiritual communities, often it's part of a conversation, using it as an example for the depictions of the morals or behaviour and portrayed ideas, which have never been done before, I see some of those things in Avatar as a template for the future of mankind. It is just one of those movies that transcend cinema and become an experience that's formative - one doesn't have to return to it again, it's already changed them. Whereas Star Wars I would watch more times, even though I don't like it as much as Avatar, the difference between a pop song and an opera, easy vs challenging for the senses.

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" Avatar is part of the modern language amongst people,"

literally no one in modern culture references anything about the avatar film as some cultural force

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Why is it forgotten?

It was a long-winded sermon against corporate America, marketed and distributed by a large corporation.

Nothing more than 2009's "flavor-of-the-month".

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This pretty much sums it up. Cameron used American capitalism to become a multimillionaire, but then proceeds to be a typical Hollywood hypocrite, and shits all over America. He's an egotistical assclown to the 10th degree.

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no... its just a shit rehashed story with forgettable 2d characters. and if I dont care about the characters, I dont care about all the "amazing action packed" scenes they are in

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Because cutting edge visual effects don’t last. And while the basic plot was a good start, more in depth analysis reveals its simplistic dialog and spoon fed political agenda that is blatantly obvious to anyone over age 8.

Any questions?

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[deleted]

Who says it's forgotten? I'm watching it right now. And it's still selling well on amazon.

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I don't think its forgotten. I think people have given up on the sequels ever being made. When they come out people may or may not care.

It's like your best friend from High School calling you 10 years later. Maybe it's cool, maybe it's just been too long.

For me, Avatar was a great cinematic experience that failed to transfer to the small screen as the story wasn't great.

Other movies that were great on the big screen are great on the small screen because the story is still gripping. Avatar isn't that gripping.

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"failed to transfer to the small screen as the story wasn't great."

That's it right there. It's just not a movie you want to watch over and over and over again. That's what makes movies beloved and gets people arguing over them online forever. If the film didn't cater to genres that have cult followings, I don't think people would even remember that they're forgetting about it.

I think this could be retroactively fixed if the sequel films have an amazing epic story. All the sudden a weak film becomes instead the movie where it all started. People then will see it fondly. Time will tell.

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You know, I think a big part of it is that it just doesn't look amazing on the small screen, and after the initial release - ALL movies move to the small screen!

I mean it looked absolutely amazing on the big screen and I don't regret spending a few bucks on a couple of 3D shows, it was worth twelve bucks or whatever I paid. But the fact is, the plot is derivative, the aliens are too, and the hero is a fucking idiot I want to slap upside the head. There's nobody to crush on or even like, and the worldbuilding just wasn't imaginitive enough to get people to mentally "move in" and make it part of their fantasy lives, not the way some people have staked out a mental home in the Star Wars or "LOTR' universe.

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https://youtu.be/ykmZp5cgbkU

no. its more you cant base your entire film of special effects and CGI

and have no good characters, plot or story, etc

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Well, "Avatar" came as close as possible to basing a movie entirely on the special effects, that really was the major selling point when it all came out. And it held true when people saw the film, people paid good money to take a 3D trip to a world what was entirely unreal, which hasn't been done before in a non-animated film and which hasn't been duplicated. And it's not like the generic story, derivative aliens, or dumbass protagonist kept people coming back, the special effects were what drew people in and what sold people on repeat viewings.

And IMHO that's not something that can be done again, and it's sure as hell not something that can be done for a streaming release.

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I agree that was its major selling point, but like most films based on a gimmick, it doesnt hold up.

oh im sure the next "evolution of 3d" will be pushed by some other equally thin and non deep blockbuster and it'll be rinse in repeat.

but ya im sure we agree on avatar. im just glad there arent hordes of people actually arguing its secretly genius and amazing like they are doing with the prequels now

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Yeah, the film was a massive hit, but it didn't inspire a long-term hardcore fandom.

Well, maybe it did at first, there were people who were derisively called "Avatards" and I saw some pictures of chubby nerds painted blue and wearing loincloths, LARPing as the CGI aliens. But honestly, I haven't heard any real praise of the film for years.

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it wasnt that good.

Not only is Sam horrible and has zero charisma (as a leading man, hes done great work not leading which is weird)

but Sams character itself was so poorly conceived its truly astounding

normally your protagonist has a struggle and conflict. but the three most important things we learn about his character, play no relevance. of course the cripple joined the blue people. zero conflict


also doesnt help when the movie rode almost entirely off it being CGI porn and not things like acting, story, characters etc.

https://youtu.be/ykmZp5cgbkU

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