why is heroin so hard to quit? - The Basketball Diaries (1995) Discussion

its not really like this, the movies just make it look that way

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not according to the youtube videos of people who quit.

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Rex has no idea what they’re talking about. Heroin is incredibly difficult to kick, I’ve lost numerous friends to it over the years.
The difficulty stems from a variety of variables, for some it’s the psychological scars of having one’s sense of joy, happiness, comfort, security, purpose…., replaced with a fleeting physiological chemical reaction that can only be achieved by using again, and again and again, each time with lessening affect.
For others it’s the withdrawal, the sickness that occurs as the substance is filtered out of the body. There are a plethora of reasons to be fair, and as you said, your best way of understanding the drug is to listen to people who’ve used it personally.
And if someone has used it personally, and has no problem walking away from it and using with absolute self control, they do not speak for the masses, although kudos to them.
All of this being said, it’s not like everyone who uses Heroin becomes a dependent user over night, for many it’s a gradual process.

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[–] fc31 (4573) a year ago

From what I understand drugs including marijuana, heroin and other prescription drugs people abuse all work the same way, it is to stimulate dopamine receptors to simulate happiness, which is a natural process.

But even marijuana is more than 100 times stronger than what you body can produce, after stimulating with drugs for a while, you just can't feel happiness anymore, not without drugs.

I think fundamentally that is why drugs are hard to quit. Can you live your life without any chance of happiness?

But I have never used any form of drugs, so all that is from reading.

I am planning to use marijuana after it is legalized in Australia, but not until I am more than 60 years old AND have nothing to live for.

So my advice is that don't use drugs when you are young.

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[–] chilidoggg (13066) a year ago

I've never heard of anyone getting addicted to marijuana.

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[–] fc31 (4573) a year ago

"Those studies suggest that 9% of people who use marijuana will become dependent on it, rising to about 17% in those who start using in their teens."

https://nida.nih.gov/publications/research-reports/marijuana/marijuana-addictive

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[–] chilidoggg (13066) a year ago

From your link:

Marijuana use disorder becomes addiction when the person cannot stop using the drug even though it interferes with many aspects of his or her life. Estimates of the number of people addicted to marijuana are controversial, in part because epidemiological studies of substance use often use dependence as a proxy for addiction even though it is possible to be dependent without being addicted. Those studies suggest that 9% of people who use marijuana will become dependent on it, rising to about 17% in those who start using in their teens.

No one uses language like that when talking about alcoholism, tobacco, cocaine, or heroin. Those are unanimously understood to be devastating "when the person cannot stop using the drug even though it interferes with many aspects of his or her life."

Even if I concede that "17% of people who start using marijuana in their teens will become dependent on it," I'll bet the numbers for cocaine et al are many multiples greater than 17%.

Take a hit, you're not going to sink into "Reefer Madness." Have you ever had a beer or a glass of wine?

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[–] fc31 (4573) a year ago

It is really offensive to ask people try drugs.

I am guessing you sell this stuff.

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[–] chilidoggg (13066) a year ago

"I am planning to use marijuana after it is legalized in Australia"

Have a nice day.

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[–] fc31 (4573) a year ago

And you left out the "but not until I am more than 60 years old AND have nothing to live for" part.

I am guessing you are corrupt to the core, aren't you?

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[–] FilmBuff (6692) a year ago

I've known dozens of people who use marijuana daily, and can't function without it. It's a very addictive drug. Because usage is so widespread, and the (incorrect) perception by many is that it's harmless, marijuana addiction is typically ignored as being harmless.

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[–] Geiri (845) a year ago

Addiction doesn't necessarily mean (much) harm though. There are people out there who can't quit tea either.

But sure some people exaggarate and talk like it can do no harm. It can but its still less harmful than most illegal and legal drugs.

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[–] FilmBuff (6692) a year ago

Marijuana is far more harmless than you seem to credit it for being. There is a direct link between marijuana usage and schizophrenia, and young people who use marijuana and don't have schizophrenia are more likely to develop it than those who don't use it. There are also studies showing links between marijuana usage and dementia. It also has been shown that marijuana speeds up the aging process in the brain.

The above coupled with the overall acceptance of marijuana that has taken place in recent years makes it in my mind the most dangerous drug out there. We all know cocaine, heroin, meth, fentanyl, and other drugs are dangerous, but the way marijuana is touted as being a safe, fun drug makes its usage far more widespread, and makes it seem less important to users that they lower or cease their usage.

As for tea, or coffee, caffeine has been shown to have only positive effects on people, so regular usage, even if as an addiction, isn't detrimental to individuals or to society at large.

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[–] Geiri (845) a year ago

Your feelings arent facts and correlation does not imply causation.

If everyone would switch from alcohol to marijuana it would save millions of lives.

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[–] punkrockgirl (1153) a year ago

You could argue the same thing by saying that if we got rid of alcohol and marijuana completely then it would "save millions of lives." Most people don't die from alcohol poisoning. They are alcoholics and yes, it could ruin their lives, but doesn't mean they would die from it, just live with it for the rest of their lives. While with marijuana, you're smoking and inhaling chemicals into your lungs. I would argue that marijuana is far more harmful than alcohol. That isn't to say that alcohol isn't dangerous. It very much is. It can be very damaging to your lungs as well.

If everyone were to drink small amounts that their body could handle, then they would be fine. The issue is that many people can't do that. Honestly, more of the threat would be drunk driving than an actual alcohol addiction, though I suppose it can tie in together. With marijuana, even taking just little amounts all day, I would argue is worse than taking sips of wine or beer everyday because it can be so damaging to the brain.

While even substances like caffeine can be dangerous in their own right, they're not nearly as deadly or as addictive. Marijuana is known to lead to the use of more life threatening drugs.

I'm not saying alcohol is much of a step up, but saying that switching from alcohol to marijuana is better is a pretty bold statement, when the two should probably not even be compared. Marijuana is not going to make anything better, and could in fact make things worse, your life could still be in just as much danger.

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[–] FilmBuff (6692) a year ago

Feelings have nothing to do with what I wrote. I shared facts. The only one sharing feelings is you, with your statement about switching from alcohol.

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[–] Geiri (845) a year ago

"It is estimated that alcohol contributes to around three million deaths worldwide per year. That is about five percent of all deaths each year."

Takes 5 seconds to Google this.

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[–] FilmBuff (6692) a year ago

One can find just about anything online to confirm what they wish to be true. In the same 5 seconds you Googled your alarmist pro-marijuana stat, you could also have proven that the Earth is flat, Elvis is still alive, or Stephen King murdered John Lennon.

Numerous scientific studies have demonstrated harmful effects of marijuana, even when used just once, or in moderation, including schizophrenia, dementia, and aging the brain. Many other studies have shown that alcohol in moderation has positive health effects.

Step outside the realm of "it must be true if Google tells me," and search for peer-reviewed, scientific studies about the effects of marijuana vs. the effects of alcohol.

Most anything in excess can be harmful, alcohol included, but marijuana is harmful in any dose, just as are heroin, meth, and other drugs.

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[–] moviefanatic505 (6000) a year ago

It is completely moronic for Marijuana to be illegal while alcohol is legal. If you want to take the it is not good for you stance that means all stuff bad for you should be banned. That is a foolish stance.

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[–] FilmBuff (6692) a year ago

I don't follow your reasoning.

Alcohol is safe and relatively harmless unless abused. It has health benefits when used in moderation. Maybe most significantly, it provides people with a means to relax, socialize, and enjoy themselves. The same cannot be said about marijuana.

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[–] moviefanatic505 (6000) a year ago

No the same can be said about Marijuana actually. There is a reason you see cbd oil being used. Marijuana actually can make people who are suffering from cancer feel much better. https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/books/NBK425767/

Marijuana can be helpful also if it is not abused. Alcohol causes more deaths per year than Marijuana does. Also plenty of folks use Marijuana to relax and relieve stress. You are totally wrong.

I take no issue with you not liking marijuana. However you do not get to simply pick and choose in order to demonize marijuana. Fast food is bad for you period, alcohol can be bad for you when abused. Should that stuff be illegal? How about if someone is not affecting another person the law should not interfere? You want to eat a greasy burger every day it is your right to do so.

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[–] punkrockgirl (1153) a year ago

Were those deaths from drunk driving accidents or over consumption? I made that point clear earlier.

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[–] punkrockgirl (1153) a year ago

Many people are addicted to marijuana. Just because you've never heard of it doesn't mean it isn't true.

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[–] chilidoggg (13066) a year ago

I've already replied to this.

https://nida.nih.gov/publications/research-reports/marijuana/marijuana-addictive

"epidemiological studies of substance use often use dependence as a proxy for addiction even though it is possible to be dependent without being addicted. Those studies suggest that 9% of people who use marijuana will become dependent on it, rising to about 17% in those who start using in their teens."

No statistics on "addiction."

17% become dependent. Who becomes "addicted." Less than 17%? Less than 5%?

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[–] punkrockgirl (1153) a year ago

I already read what you said, and you also gave the definition of addiction. Move into the area that I live and you'll see many many people are addicted to weed. It fits completely with the definition you gave. One source you give doesn't necessarily qualify for everything or make it true.

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[–] chilidoggg (13066) a year ago

"Move into the area that I live and you'll see many many people are addicted to weed."

OK

So your personal observations beat out the article from the National Institute of Health (which was not posted by me, it was posted by the snowflake who's scared of a cup of coffee.)

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[–] Bossdog677 (1452) a year ago

I'm addicted to marijuana and so are all my friends. The ones who weren't got addicted to something else and aren't here anymore after the gateway that is marijuana. I'll believe my own eyes over studies from the Health Institute thanks

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[–] chilidoggg (13066) a year ago

What a country.

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[–] punkrockgirl (1153) a year ago

It seems like you and others are trying to argue that anything but marijuana can be addictive. The math ain't mathing.

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[–] chilidoggg (13066) a year ago

Yeah, that's exactly what I'm saying.

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[–] Bloodworth79 (5571) a year ago

I've known people that smoke weed every day for the last 30 years.
Dont how how much is by choice.
Their bodies are regulated by it.

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[–] Kowalski (58374) a year ago

THAT IS MOSTLY INCORRECT.

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[–] fc31 (4573) a year ago

How so?

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[–] [deleted] a year ago

some drugs are worse than others.

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[–] fc31 (4573) a year ago

I am guessing it is the strength.

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[–] Geiri (845) a year ago

It's not a single scale though. Mushrooms for example gives you a "stronger" high than most others but nobody OD's from them.

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[–] fc31 (4573) a year ago

I think by stronger you mean the hallucinations, but other than that I don't think they are strong since they are not a refined and concentrated form.

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[–] Geiri (845) a year ago

Its more than that. I get a high similar to MDMA on shrooms but with hallucinations as a bonus.

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[–] fc31 (4573) a year ago

Then again ecstasy is not a drug known to cause overdose.

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[–] Geiri (845) a year ago

Yeah this is why its good to be spesific. Not everyone thinks of strong and soft just by OD statistics.

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[–] SandyR (7360) a year ago

Heroin becomes a part of your blood. Removing it seems to the body like removing a vital part of the entire body.

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[–] [deleted] a year ago

i have never heard this. sounds scary.

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[–] SandyR (7360) a year ago

That's the difference between physiological addiction and psychological addiction. But make no mistake, psychological addiction may seem like a lesser problem, it's not. Our society is too childish to really examine WHY so many people in it get addicted to drugs. That is the issue that must be addressed.

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[–] Geiri (845) a year ago

Most people who try it only do it once.

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[–] punkrockgirl (1153) a year ago

I'm in an abnormal psychology class right now and we just studied substance use disorders. The rate of comorbidity with other issues like mood or anxiety disorders is common. Think of all the famous rockstars we have that died tragically from overdoses. I'm honestly appalled at some of these posts downplaying the drug epidemic we have going on in this country.

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[–] Geiri (845) a year ago

Not downplaying anything. It is a fact that most people who try heroine do not become addicted. I think only caffeine and nicotine have a majority but to be fair they're easily available and people can function on them.

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[–] punkrockgirl (1153) a year ago

I'm not necessarily saying that you are downplaying, but that others are, although I believe a lot of you are missing the serious point of the issue. Where is this fact exactly? I've seen more evidence surrounding that people who try heroin once and aren't addicted is absolutely not true. Caffeine and nicotine are addictive substances in their own right, yes, but are not nearly as dangerous as heroin. Also, many of the comments on this thread are actually indeed very ignorant to the severity of drug addiction.

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[–] Geiri (845) a year ago

Nobody is addicted after just using something once, or at least not physically (they may have enjoyed the experience and want to try it again which then leads to addiction).

The reason why most people try it only once is not because it's mild but rather because it's so strong and it scares them from trying it again.

My point was never that it's harmless. I just think we should be factual here. I would personally never try it although I have tried cocaine (once).

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[–] punkrockgirl (1153) a year ago

In order to turn addicted to something, you have to try it once. You have to start somewhere. How else would one start and be addicted? I know you're not saying it's harmless, but I still disagree with you saying that people aren't so easily addicted by just trying it once. Twenty million people in the U.S. are addicted to drugs. No, not all of that involves heroin, but that sure is more than just "some" people.

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[–] Geiri (845) a year ago

Lots of people can still be a minority of ones who tried it.

And yes everybody starts somewhere, which is why the message of simply not trying is good and all that.

I remember when I was a teen they told us just trying one puff of a cigarette could make you addicted. I'm sure it kept some from trying which is great but its still a lie. A well intended lie is still a lie.

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[–] SandyR (7360) a year ago

If someone is not taking the issue as seriously as you think they should, it simply means they don't know what they're talking about.

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[–] punkrockgirl (1153) a year ago

Sure seems like many people on this thread don't know what they're talking about.

I'm not even calling anyone here dumb, I just thought people would be more knowledgeable about this topic.

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[–] fc31 (4573) a year ago

I think that is what happens when marijuana becomes a big business, they hire people from troll farms to downplay the risks on social media, some people here probably are.

I think it is like gun lobby but on a smaller scale.

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[–] Geiri (845) a year ago

I'm from a country that has never taken steps to legalize or decriminalize cannabis but we still have a higher rate of users than any of those countries/states that have.

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[–] fc31 (4573) a year ago

Clearly that is not true. According to National Center for Drug Abuse Statistics, about 45% of population in US used marijuana and I don't think any country could beat that, especially not a country where marijuana is illegal.

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[–] WileyJack (147) a year ago

Jamaica has entered the chat. ;)

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[–] fc31 (4573) a year ago

There are statistics about this already: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Adult_lifetime_cannabis_use_by_country

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[–] Kowalski (58374) a year ago

COTTON CANDY.

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[–] Bloodworth79 (5571) a year ago

I lost a lot of friends early to heroin.

Your body becomes very physically dependent on it.

Every get hunger pains, that's sort of the feeling.
When you stop for a bit your body develops flu symptoms and then the heroin makes that go away.

the people I know could not get out of bed in the morning without it. They always made sure they had some.

Many dont even feel the high anymore and do it to not get sick.
My friend had to be knocked the withdrawls were so bad.
He woke 3 days later with catheter in him
He said the black nurse ripped it out so violently he was in pain for a week

Alcohol withdrawls can be worse, deadly.

The worse I heard of was xanax withdrawal.
People said they would go into seizures without it

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[–] Luffy (794) 10 months ago

It's made from morphine. Morphine is incredibly addictive. Don't know why. The OxyContin ravage was so because the latter is made from morphine.
I'm drinking a Coke Zero right now, and the Pemberton guy who invented the drink was addicted to morphine, because he was treated with the stuff when he got stabbed in the chest in the Civil War, was it?
So that's the circle of life or something.

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