Nobody in China... - Black Panther (2018) Discussion

[–] NorrinRad (5047) 6 years ago

Not true.

Branding supersedes the all black cast for Black Panther. There is a decidedly valuable Box office base for Marvel movies overseas.

BP being already introduced in Civil War was a way to get the movie on the radar for overseas audiences that saw Civil War.

The trailer(s) have done a good job of creating interest and the trailers do not hide the mostly black characters but make an effort to showcase two Tolkien white characters in the opening narrative. Additionally shots in Korea do an excellent job of extending the invitation to view to an Asian audience.

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[–] FredBurroughs (19798) 6 years ago

What are you talking about? The Madea movies have grossed over a billion dollars in China.

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[–] actionkamen (23176) 6 years ago

I didn't know Madea movies were that popular in China. However, Madea movies are comedies. Asian loves funny black people like Eddie Murphy, Samuel L.Jackson or even Bill Cosby.

Racism in Asia is different than in the West. Here white people (and Latinos, latinos are white in Asia) is getting the "superior" racism while dark skinned people (Thai, Indian, Malays, etc. but not African blacks) get the "inferior" racism. And specifically for blacks it's "inferior" plus "jokester" racism. Nobody take black people (in movies mostly, because we don't get to meet black people often in real life) seriously. Black people are funny people.

There were no institusionalized racism againts black people in Asia (e.g., no black African slavery) so there is no hostile racism againts black people today, unlike in the US. That doesn't mean there is no hostile racism. There are plenty, like Han againts non-Han people for example, but just not really againts blacks.

People just don't really care about blacks. They are too small minority here. So making an all black cast of a huge budgeted superhero movie is obviously NOT targetting the Asian market, most importantly the China market. Which I thought was weird. It's like making, say, all Filipino cast of a blockbuster superhero movie in the USA. I can surely imagine how that will flop so hard.

But like what the below user posted, it's actually a great strategy to entice more people from every niches and demographics into Infinity Wars, and not for this movie specifically. If it succeeded in China then it's a bonus, but if not it's okay too. Nothing to lose here. Very smart actually.

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[–] crc32 (2584) 6 years ago

Look at snippets of asian TV shows and commercials. They don't think highly of black people.

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[–] NorrinRad (5047) 6 years ago

There were no institutionalized racism against black people in Asia (e.g., no black African slavery) so there is no hostile racism against black people today, unlike in the US. That doesn't mean there is no hostile racism. There are plenty, like Han against non-Han people for example, but just not really against blacks.

Asians have their own inferiority complex with Dark-Skinned people or people of color allegedly culturally below Asians as even more inferior as their own inferiority complex metastasizes. Many Asians want to be European/Caucasian rather than Asian.

Slavery isn't the sole purview of racism as you noted. Racial and skin-tone superiority is steeped in ignorance.

Eventually an Asian led superhero film will come out of Hollywood and from Disney, it will be Mulan. I'm serious.

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[–] [deleted] 4 years ago

And now Mulan is set to be released next year. Your prediction has come true!

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[–] NorrinRad (5047) 4 years ago

[–] TheOtherFella (476) 23 minutes ago
And now Mulan is set to be released next year. Your prediction has come true!

I had Zero inside knowledge. Mulan remains one of my favorite Disney animated films. It is too bad that the controversy with the female Lead actress (Yifei Liu) will blunt so many of the positive aspects of the film and it's connection to the Chinese myth of Mulan rather than the previous Disney animated feature.

Asian audiences also will be getting Shangi-Chi from Marvel Disney so it is an embarrassment of representation riches for the Middle Kingdom. Thanks for noticing and commenting. 👍

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[–] NorrinRad (5047) 4 years ago

How in the world did you stumble on a Mulan reference that I made OVER two years ago buried within a Black Panther board???!!!!

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[–] NorrinRad (5047) 6 years ago

Now that Marvel/Disney have most if not all of their Characters back, Namor The Sub-Mariner might be a possible choice for a movie with an Asian Lead. I for one would watch both a movie with Namor or even the InHuman Triton over Aquaman!

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[–] Otter (24464) 6 years ago

It's not ALL about China these days!

This is about getting every last human being in every demobraphic on Earth to come to "Infinity Wars".

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[–] actionkamen (23176) 6 years ago

So they don't care if Black Panther doesn't do good in China as long they will cash in for Infinity Wars. I never thought of that. That is very Disney-y!

Let's see if this strategy works. It should, it's actually brilliant. This way nobody can accuse them of pandering only into China market (i.e., Transformers). Improves their image in domestic market as well.

I should think more of the Marvel Universe as a whole product instead of single film performances. I like DC characters more, but I admire Disney's genius planning and executions.

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[–] Otter (24464) 6 years ago

Of course I'm oversimplifying, but I really do think it's an attempt to get a wider demographic base for Marvel films in general.

Disney already did it with "STar Wars", they knew they had the white male fanboy dollar but they also wanted every little girl in the world to demand a light saber for Christmas as well as every boy. I have to say that Marvel's been a bit slow to catch onto the potential of a wider fanbase, even the idiots who make the DCEU movies are ahead of them.

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[–] actionkamen (23176) 6 years ago

You're right, it makes sense. Star Wars did show the way.

However, I don't think DCEU is ahead of Disney/Marvel. They may have tried a lot, culling in feminists demography with Wonder Woman (but amazingly not in the heavy-handed way as in Ghostbusters reboot) and emo teens demography in Suicide Squad. But that's it. And with varying success.

Even then, most women I know prefer Marvel movies than Wonder Woman and feel Justice League funny but boring. While Marvel got ALL kinds of teen demographics with Homecoming, emo or otherwise.

Adding Cyborg and Aquaman into Justice League did nothing to increase the demographics I think. They don't even have solo movies yet. Making Supes died in BvS is also a stupid stupid move. It paint themselves into a corner and pretty much killed half the excitement in Justice League.

It's true though that Marvel still doesn't have a female superhero movie. Captain Marvel will be a little bit too late now that we already got Wonder Woman. Wonder Woman is the more iconic character anyway. So that's that.

Oh. And I'm still waiting who will come up with the Chinese superhero character first.

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[–] Otter (24464) 6 years ago

Funny how everyone forgets "Suicide Squad", presumably because they've successfully blocked that mess out of their memory.

But it had a very diverse cast headed by Will Smith and Margot Robbie, and that and "Wonder Woman" gives the DCEU people the right to claim that they've done *one* thing better than Marvel.

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[–] NorrinRad (5047) 6 years ago

Oh. And I'm still waiting who will come up with the Chinese superhero character first.

China has a diverse market of films for catering to their audience already. Why would you be waiting for a movie with an Asian lead from Warner/DC or Disney/Marvel?

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[–] actionkamen (23176) 6 years ago

Well, Chinese (or Asian, but mostly Chinese) are everywhere in the world including in the US.

Marvel and others have made African American led superhero movies, which this movie is one of them, but I haven't seen one with a Chinese superhero as THE main character.

And the China movie market don't have much comicbook superhero movies. This genre is predominantly Hollywood. There are others like Japanese ones, but recent Japanese live action movies are pretty bad. Chinese don't like the Japanese anyway.

I'm not demanding a Chinese led superhero movie mind you, I'm just waiting which studio would make one first.

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[–] NorrinRad (5047) 6 years ago

And the China movie market don't have much comicbook superhero movies. This genre is predominantly Hollywood. There are others like Japanese ones, but recent Japanese live action movies are pretty bad. Chinese don't like the Japanese anyway.

Black Mask I and II with Jet Li would beg to differ with you.

The Heroic Trio with Michelle Yeoh would have words with you.

Silver Hawk with Michelle Yeoh might feel you're just ignoring her also.

===
I'm not demanding a Chinese led superhero movie mind you, I'm just waiting which studio would make one first.
===

There might even be more from China and Japan but I'm not too familiar with the products I just happen to have those three movies in my collection.

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[–] actionkamen (23176) 6 years ago

Those are '90s Hong Kong movies which were released before the China cinema market became a big deal.

But yeah, you're technically right. My bad. I'll stop waiting for a Chinese led superhero movie.

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[–] NorrinRad (5047) 6 years ago

Now that I think about it I consider Iron Monkey a Superhero Movie. The guy even has a secret identity!

But yeah, you're technically right. My bad. I'll stop waiting for a Chinese led superhero movie.

No one is asking you to stop waiting for a Chinese lead Superhero movie. The question is WHY are you waiting for one? I'm just curious.

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[–] actionkamen (23176) 6 years ago

Well, many people were waiting for Black Panther because he's a black superhero. Why would I want to wait for a movie about Chinese superhero? Silly me.

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[–] crc32 (2584) 6 years ago

The only black super hero I'm waiting for is Spawn but he's not DC or Marvel.

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[–] NorrinRad (5047) 5 years ago

[–] actionkamen (6855) 2 years ago
Those are '90s Hong Kong movies which were released before the China cinema market became a big deal.

But yeah, you're technically right. My bad. I'll stop waiting for a Chinese led superhero movie.

Well you're finally getting exactly what you requested. Maybe getting two Superheroes:

https://moviechat.org/tt9376612/Shang-Chi-and-the-Legend-of-the-Ten-Rings

Yes, I consider this a Superhero movie:

https://moviechat.org/tt4566758/Mulan

But with a lot of actor/character controversy to boot. One's not authentically Asian?? The other is too much aligned with PPC? Hopefully things will be resolved before the movies are released.

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[–] Otter (24464) 6 years ago

I have to ask if Marvel has an Asian superhero they could base a movie on. One they already own the copyrights to, of course.

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[–] NorrinRad (5047) 6 years ago

Shang-Chi Master of Kung-Fu, but why would Marvel even try to cross that threshold when the Asian market has done such a character endlessly?

Many characters are Mutants and/or would have to be forced into a dominant role with a non-canon story arc.

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[–] LebronCorleone (63) 6 years ago

You're an idiot.

NBA is HUGE in China. The NFL wants in so bad but knows there's no way they'll ever enter the Chinese consumer market. Why? Because NBA is all about hip hop and black culture, which are both nearly as much of a trend in China as it is in the US. The NFL is too white, too old fashioned. China does not want to see more pasty white people. Chinese people gobbled down Fast and Furious and xXx because those are multi-racial casts that are plain cool.

You're trying to start a troll racist post, fine.

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[–] actionkamen (23176) 6 years ago

Okay.

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[–] Satan2016 (23511) 6 years ago

You need to ask on Quora: "Would want to see all black cast of a superhero movie. Very strange decission by Disney/Marvel."

I thought it was a Chinese site, but it's Mountain View CA.

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[–] crc32 (2584) 6 years ago

I've never even heard of the black panther and with an all black cast I don't feel like I can relate to the movie. I liked Spawn, I liked blade etc etc cause it was more realistic but this.... Nah I'm good thank you though.
.

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[–] actionkamen (23176) 6 years ago

You haven't seen Captain America: Civil War?

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[–] Frogarama (12942) 6 years ago

No you might be thinking of Japanese who are notoriously racist, as much against whites as anyone.

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[–] actionkamen (23176) 6 years ago

That the Japanese are also racist that may as well true. Aren't we sometimes all? But the Japan movie market is not that big as China's so what the Japanese reception of the movie Black Panther is irrelevant.

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[–] NorrinRad (5047) 6 years ago

That the Japanese are also racist that may as well true. Aren't we sometimes all? But the Japan movie market is not that big as China's so what the Japanese reception of the movie Black Panther is irrelevant.

I personally am not, so no.

As to Marvel/Disney crafting their BP product after the source material? I think you are dead wrong in your perspective (but entitled to your opinion) that Marvel is doing so and risking the Asian market audience by NOT pandering to China.

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[–] actionkamen (23176) 6 years ago

That's why I wrote in the original post that Disney/Marvel move not pandering to the China movie market is ballsy. Because from what I saw in blockbuster movies nowadays, everyone apparently IS pandering to China.

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[–] NorrinRad (5047) 6 years ago

The Disney Marketing of BP is not Ballsy because they are not Pandering to an Asian Market. Is Avengers:Infinity War pandering to the Asian market? No it isn't.

They both have the same marketing strategy. They are being sold on the strength of the Marvel branding and interest in a good story. BP is doing nothing different in spite of or for China and neither is Avengers:Infinity War. Disney/Marvel isn't banking exclusively on the USA or domestic market for BP.

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[–] NorrinRad (5047) 6 years ago

I thought I'd come back to this topic as BP makes it's run through the international markets. The South Korea media blitz did show that Disney is indeed marketing to that audience on the back of their Brand.

So far Korea has liked the movie. Japan is a different animal though.

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[–] Renovatio (2990) 6 years ago

If it's perceived as cool or as exotic it will do well in Asia...

The thing is, unlike the media frenzy, the movie itself is surprisingly lecture free... This will play well if there is good word of mouth...

The movie had some scenes in Korea, so that helps it there...

Japan is it's own world...

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