Ya know, Lucas really messed up Kenobi


Kenobi, the glorified hero of the prequels, left Anakin (a child-killing mass murderer) injured and burning, but alive, and simply walked away. He didn't even put his former friend out of his misery, he didn't take responsibility for having trained Anakin, he didn't call down some assistance to see if Anakin could be salvaged... nothing.

THEN Kenobi decides to chill out on Tatooine for 20 years while his former apprentice is out there helping to destroy the galaxy and kill the rest of the Jedi.

When he runs into Anakin's son, Kenobi shamefully LIES and says that VADER killed Luke's father, because Kenobi is too afraid to admit that HE is the one who cut down Luke's father and then left him suffering. He can't admit that he basically ensured Anakin would be angry and traumatized and seeking an even greater revenge.

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Some incongruities Lucas created by changing his story along the way:

-Kenobi lying to Luke in A New Hope. Resulted from the fact that when it was written, Vader was not related to Luke, who had a different father who Lucas later planned to bring back "still alive" in the sequel to help with the Rebellion.

-Luke "hidden" on his father's home planet with the same iconic last name of Skywalker, instead of perhaps getting the last name "Lars." Also resulted from the fact that Luke was specifically unrelated to Vader when it was written.

-Kenobi stating that Yoda is the Master who trained him. Overturned by Episode 1 and Qui-Gon.

-Leia remembering her mother. Overturned by Episode 3.

Was it really such a bad thing that Lucas sold off the property?

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Yes it was a horrible idea of Lucas to sell Star Wars.

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Lucas maybe treated his fans like whores, but Disney treats them like serfs or even slaves.

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It may have been a bad idea but I think it originated from a good place. He knew he was getting older and he wanted his company to be looked after and the people to still have their jobs after he passes. Also, I really liked this youtube video explaining why he sold Star Wars to Disney specifically (much to his regret):

PS. I'll post the link later.

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Maybe Skywalker is very common in that universe, like Smith. You don't know it isn't. Could be all early space colonists adopted that name, for example.

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My theory: Kenobi represents the repressive psychic "Super-Ego" concept - the moral authority that demand obedience and regulation, and Anakin represents the impulsive psychic "Id" desirous of unlimited power and possession of things. Kenobi can never accept the wild Id and can do nothing about it unless the "Ego" self can intervene to bring the Id back to order - as we know Anakin seemed well down the path of destruction and beyond the reason of the Ego self.

When Kenobi said that Vader killed Anakin, although the same person they are different personalities and represent different psychic states - the discipline of Super-Ego and the impulsiveness of Id. Anakin killed the "Father" within himself just as he rejected the "Father" in the form of Kenobi, which then allowed the Id to flourish in the form of Vader.

This was a failure to understand the impulsive nature of Anakin. Failure of Anakin to properly discipline, and failure of Anakin to self-discipline. It was dangerous to introduce Anakin to the Force but that is the legacy of the choices made.

Interestingly, we're seeing a replay of this with Kylo and his parental issues. He feels compelled to kill "the Father" or Super-Ego in the literal human authority figures like Han/Luke and even Snoke, but he will forever wrestle with the abstract Super-Ego (and his parental memories and socialisation) that he is trying to escape in his quest for power and respect from others. Luke said he will never leave him - this terrifies Kylo and frustrates his goals.

Kenobi ran away from things for a while but after the plea from Leia he hoped that Luke might help him and restore balance to the force by defeating Vader. Kenobi never left Luke.

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[deleted]

But first he has to win the Falcon from Lando... yeah I would say the Kessel stuff is a safe bet for a big plot thread

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Duck Tales + Hans Solo + Kessel Run = Entertainment? ;) :)

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Lucas has always been averse to doing a sequel trilogy for reasons unknown, apart from him once saying that he felt that the story ended with the redemption of Anakin. I don’t buy the latter, so I maintain that the real reason is a mystery to this day.

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I really love what Lucas did with prequels. He made the Jedi Order assholes, liars and schemers. Not these devout moral knights that we took them for in the OT. Except that's actually how they thought of themselves. They basically created Darth Vader with all their jerking Anakin around. I think it's wonderfully dark, complicated, and representing many real world governments and religions and how they rule by manipulation. But this was definitely a seriously BOLD movie that pissed a ton of people off. If you take the prequels as hard cannon, old Obi-Wan is still following that twisted discipline, still making all the same mistakes he made with Anakin. It's deliciously complex, at least to me. For others it must be utter bullshit.

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I also enjoyed that about the prequels. When people complain about the midichlorians I always bring up that they are a great way to show how the Jedi Council has become a bureaucracy in that the jedi council uses the MC count instead of their own connection with the force to evaluate potential Jedi candidates. The idea that MidiChlorians some how changed anything is preposterous as all they were explained to be was our conduit to communicate with the force. How someone got them was not explained in the films.

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I like that. About the bureaucracy and bean counting. Making everything quantifiable. The science taking away what must have once been mysticism and spirituality, and through that end the Jedi Order losing its way. Losing one's faith to the machine. Again an allegory for our modern times.

I truly hated the prequels for years, same as many. It was Clone Wars when I finally came to understand them and what Lucas was about. Revisiting the films after that, I really appreciated the story Lucas was really telling underneath all the silly stuff for kids. That and the book Darth Plagueis really pulled it all together.

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Yep, the storyline of the prequels was very well done, and one thing I think the prequels don't get enough credit for is the fantastic art design. So many great ships and locations and aliens and costumes. I loved Force Awakens, but there wasn't a lot in terms of new design, but Last Jedi certainly didn't make up for that. Those bombers in the beginning were so dull and bland looking, and new creature designs were basically Pokemon.

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You make some very interesting points, Froggy. I never thought of Kenobi in that way.


:-)

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If we compare Luke in TLJ to Obi-Wan in ANH, the biggest difference is that Luke is more honest about his feelings and his mistakes.

He even beats Yoda, who also went into hiding, and who also technically lied when he pretended to be someone else after first meeting Luke. Yoda said, "take you to him, I will," referring to himself. There was no wordplay, it was a false statement intended to make Luke believe that Yoda was someone else.

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As Dr Gregory House would say, "Everybody lies."


:-)

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Yoda had to be sure who he was, and it was a test. Therefore, Yoda beats Luke.

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[deleted]

Yeah, the prequels didn't do any favors for Obi-Wan. Qui-Gon has a lot of blame for Vader as well. In Phantom Menace, Obi-Wan thought it was a bad idea to bring Anakin along and the Jedi Council said they wouldn't train the kid because he was a potential danger. Qui-Gon ignored everyone and said he would train the boy himself. The next day, Qui-Gon gets killed and Obi-Wan is essentially guilted into training Anakin. The Council basically says "Fuck it, it's gonna happen one way or another" and goes along with the whole thing. Twenty years later, the entire galaxy lives in quaking fear of Anakin.

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