I knew there was something about Spacey ... I never liked this dude. He has a sick looking face, very ugly. I hope he goes to jail.
shareGather the lynch mob! Seriously you should never do jury duty.
shareHe looks guilty, that’s good enough for me! String him up!
shareWell i remember something called "Innocent until proven guilty." I wonder what happened to that.
shareI was thinking about this and how these allegations can not be proven to be true anymore than they can be proven not to be.
So essentially he has been tried and convicted in the Media..and that's that. He's done for.
One thing for sure; he's not very well liked for some reason or he has no true friends because everything and everyone associated with him has dropped him like a hot potato.
There has been no benefit of the doubt.
Every single word spoken against him has been accepted as 100% fact.
Well you put yourself in a little bit of peril if you choose to defend someone like him because the people going after him have already decided he was guilty so to defend him would be to "ok" his activities even if that isn't remotely true.
shareYes, it is an era of absolutes even out of Hollywood. It's a difficult time to be brave when everything is always completely one way or the other and if you express any other thoughts you are perceived 180 degrees to the other extreme 100%...And then thrown to the lions too.
The trouble is that terms like pedophilia and assault are used too loosely and are becoming as diluted as rape, racism and sexism.
Well his first mistake was apologizing for something he doesn't even remember. He placed guilt upon himself, the rest has just made it worse.
The problem with something like this is a lot of people want to believe a victim of sexual assault/harassment/rape regardless of proof because their were times complaints weren't always taken as seriously as they should have been and also because they don't believe people would make something like this up. Unfortunately we do know now more than ever before people lie about this kind of stuff and in a world like Hollywood where any publicity is good publicity you are going to have some questionable reveals.
There may be a swamp of legitimate complaints but they are going to get swallowed up by metoo attention seekers.
"Well his first mistake was apologizing for something he doesn't even remember. He placed guilt upon himself"
Actually, he didn't. He said IF it happened, he didn't remember it, and IF it happened, he apologized for what he recognises is clearly inappropriate behavior.
"Unfortunately we do know now more than ever before people lie about this kind of stuff"
Do you have any proof of this? There have been and are some who are willing to lie about sexual assault, harassment, or rape, but they are in the minority. Far more never report it, and those who do too frequently aren't believed, are dismissed, even ridiculed, their motives questioned, and very often their cases aren't successfully prosecuted.
He apologized for an event he doesn't remember. He is acknowledging it could have happened, and that he is sorry for it if it did happened. So yes that does make you seem guilty of it when you are basically saying its a possibility it could have happened.
As or your second comment you yourself already admitted in your comment it happens, which is what I said. I never said how often it happens. But even a minority is way too much, it waters down the legit complaints and ruins innocent lives because the nature of it requires little proof to do its damage.
He apologised for an event IF it happened. He's not saying it did, nor did he actually say it could have. People are reading things into his statement that aren't there. Although, with more information coming out now about his (alleged) behaviour to others -- particularly to cast and crew on the set of House of Cards -- it seems apparent he knew about his many instances of inappropriate behavior and therefore did not outright deny it never happened. But that isn't what he said.
Yes, it happens. As does the far more prevalent instance of those who *are* guilty denying any guilt and lying about it to cover their asses and carry on. Isn't even a minority of that way too much? Doesn't that water down those who legitimately *aren't* guilty of anything, in exactly the same way? Aren't lives of people who are legit victims, who never report it because they fear their lives and livelihoods will be -- and have been --- ruined because those who abused them are protected by their power if they speak out just as important?
The nature of these crimes actually requires a great deal of proof for the perpetrator to be convicted and justice brought. Even in the event that a rape occurred, which is the worst, and a rape kit done, the victim *still* has to prove sex wasn't consensual. Perpetrators lie and say it was consensual. How does a legitimate victim *prove* it wasn't?
When you say people are reading into it that is what I mean about bringing guilt on himself. I reread the statement to check. He made a statement that opens himself to the possibility of guilt. Why would he say if it did happened? why would he think there is even a possibility and thus apologizes if it did happen? If he said he doesn’t remember the party he is referring to but I would never do that. That says he denies even the possibility it could have happened. I am talking about perception of guilt not actual guilt.
shareIt's not his fault if people are reading into what he said that which he didn't say. It IS his fault if he's lying and trying to cover his a**, because while he may not remember this specific incident, he's aware enough of his inappropriate and abusive behavior to know it *could have* happened and he doesn't remember it.
He hasn't said "I'd never do anything like that, so it could never have happened, and I'm so confident it never happened," that is true.
Where you and I disconnect is that for too many years predator have been able to get away with their criminal behaviour because they know they have power, wealth, and even the legal system behind them.
Again I ask you,
"As does the far more prevalent instance of those who *are* guilty denying any guilt and lying about it to cover their asses and carry on. Isn't even a minority of that way too much? Doesn't that water down those who legitimately *aren't* guilty of anything, in exactly the same way? Aren't lives of people who are legit victims, who never report it because they fear their lives and livelihoods will be -- and have been --- ruined because those who abused them are protected by their power if they speak out just as important?"
Why is it only the minority of those who lie to falsely accuse that are too much, and not those who lie to cover up their crimes and avoid legal justice, as has been going on for hundreds of years?
Hmm I never said the minority of false accusers are the only thing that is too much. I said false accusations are a problem and why I see it that way.
I never discussed rapist that lie or whether it’s ok. It’s not ok but because more rapist lie about rape does not make it ok for people to falsely claim rape. They are both wrong.
"Hmm I never said the minority of false accusers are the only thing that is too much. I said false accusations are a problem and why I see it that way."
You didn't, but you only pointed out the minority, who lie and falsely accuse, whereas you had nothing to say about the majority, who are clearly far more of a problem by virtue of the fact that they are the majority.
Of course both are wrong; it's that it's far more common, and therefore far much more of a problem, for rapists and other sexual abusers to lie about their abuse than it is for people to lie about having been raped or otherwise sexually assaulted.
You may have the impression I believe that false accusations is worse than the majority of actual rapes and rapist lying from my original post. I posted so long ago I don’t remember my intentions anymore. While I am not saying that’s what I intended to say. i believe I should say I am sorry just in case I did and forgot ;p
shareI appreciate that. Thanks.
shareHe is acknowledging it could have happened
Yeah I am not saying it did or didn’t happen. I am merely pointing out without anyone else coming forward that statement kind of left him in a gray area about something people are hypersensitive about right now. It’s not a good thing to leave people with the impression that attempting to have sex with an underage teenager was a possible outcome of his drunken behavior. Just talking perception here. Pretty much everyone I work with got the impression he did it because of the statement.
I agree with you that kid shouldn’t have been there and frankly I have questions whether this may be a stunt on his part whether true or not.
I bet we are not hearing the full story, but so what, I know enough to know that Spacey lives a lifestyle that is heavy into this and he abuses his power and fame, he is corrupt. I don't like that. Why can't we have Hollywood stars that are decent people?
I love how everyone online dumps on Hollywood, and how terrible is it, and yet when someone gets exposed for this, they all jump to his defense. I am not the inconsistent one here.
If you had a brother or sister come to you and tell you something about someone that they were a child molester, I suppose you would ignore it until it became a police matter and he was convicted?
shareIt "gets better":
Kevin Spacey tried to molest Richard Dreyfuss's son while Richard Dreyfuss was in the room
https://www.datalounge.com/thread/19954811-kevin-spacey-tried-to-molest-richard-dreyfuss-s-son-while-richard-dreyfuss-was-in-the-room
https://www.lipstickalley.com/threads/harry-dreyfuss-adds-to-the-kevin-spacey-allegations.1309097/
Or worse I guess depending on how you look at it.
Let me be more clear for the dufuses here who are attacking me or questioning me ... I hate corruption and I hate people who abuse their authority.
Ignored
share