It's a lot harder than it seems. I myself am not vegan or vegetarian, and I doubt I ever will be. I'm extremely lazy and selfish, and I love meat too much. But I have no logical way to justify my choices. I am literally paying people to murder innocent, sentient beings, when I can easily survive on a vegan diet.
It's not that vegans are wrong, it's just that they're so arrogant and act like they're special because they don't eat animal products (and then they go off and purchase clothing items made of leather or wool).
shareVegans need to take supplements like B12. Humans are not meant to be vegans.
It's not easy to survive on a vegan diet since the majority of food is for meat eaters.
What's wrong with taking supplements? It's cheaper and quicker than eating meat.
shareYou missed my point. Vegans MUST take B12 or they can die or suffer severe medical problems.
Humans can only get B12 naturally from animal sources. That's the reason I said humans are meant to eat meat.
But what does that prove? It actually proves that vegans are right, that meat and animal products are unnecessary, since you can get everything you need from supplements and vegan food.
shareHumans should be able to get all nutrients from food.
shareAnd how about complete proteins? Ever tried to calculate how to get adequate complete proteins from vegetable sources, when most vegetable protein sources only provide *some* of the amino acids necessary ? What it proves is that a basic vegan diet doesn't meet human nutritional needs, and if you have the time and patience to calculate how many amino acids are in what you're eating then I do not.
Which is why I just had some lovely scrambled eggs with cheese mixed in and chives on top! Yes, vegetarianism is a compromise between ethics and a personal need to be able to just relax and enjoy some good food, which is why all the young zealots consider vegetarianism to be just too mainstream for words.
YOU ARE NOT WRONG...HUMANS ARE FLAWED CREATURES THOUGH...EGO, LAZINESS, HABIT, ETC ETC. NOEMOJI
shareBecause they have to take supplements or they suffer from anemia and vitamin deficiencies. It's not a naturally healthy sustainable lifestyle.
If you don't want to kill animals then vegetarianism is a better option.
What's wrong with taking supplements? It's cheaper and quicker than eating meat.
shareWell the OP is asking for proof that vegans are wrong. I'm just saying they cannot survive without supplements. It's really not a natural human diet. It's artificial and only possible if you live in an advanced technological society where you have access to supplements.
If society collapses - ALL VEGANS WILL DIE!!! 🤣
I don't think that's proof though. Vegans are saying meat and animal products are unnecessary, which they are, since you can get everything you need from supplements and vegan food.
shareDude, death is very solid proof! Vegans who don't take supplements suffer from crippling vitamin deficiencies. Look at India and Hindu veganism.
I'm playing devil's advocate. I've drastically cut meat from my diet. I literally eat vegan for days sometimes. I've replaced cow's milk with almond milk.
But vegans can't survive and be healthy without supplements.That tells you something. It's not a natural human diet. We're omnivores.
You mean along with the vast majority of the population that depends on such supplemental means to sustain life such as heat, medications and clean water? I guess unless you're living in a cave, hunting with a sharp stick and eating your meat raw you're living an artificial life.
shareVegetarians have to supplement, too. Especially B12.
shareKeelai, I'd say just limit the amount of dead animals you eat. 🤣 I eat meat and fish but not every day.
shareI'm a vegetarian. Nothing natural about it, but I've had a strong aversion to eating animals since I was a young child.
The best diet is plenty of fruit and veggies with a small amount of animal products. Keep track of B12, protein and iron levels if you're eating sparse amounts of animal since it's still possible to have deficiencies.
B12. Yeah, I take a supplement. Seriously if you think of meat as rotting flesh, it changes your appetite for it. I still eat meat and fish occasionally. I've just cut down drastically though.
shareB12 and folic acid are a team.
"rotting flesh"
That was my issue. I should be a vegan, but I believe that's an extreme and unhealthy. Neither am I happy about the origins of dairy and eggs, but I try to not to think about it.
Lol. That reminds me of a line from "Pink Flamingos" about chicken and eggs. "They lay them and we eat them".
I see no ethical problem with dairy and eggs. Or cheese! But they're not that healthy.
I don't like where eggs exit. And what it is. Scrambled eggs were the first thing I stopped eating. I only eat eggs as an ingredient like in cake.
Dairy grosses me out, too.
The way farm animals are treated is very inhumane:
"in nature, wild hens lay only 10 to 15 eggs per year. Modern egg hens have been intensively bred to lay between 250 to 300 eggs a year. Egg industry kills millions of newborn baby chicks every single day; more than 260 million are killed every year in the U.S. alone. Male chicks are sorted and killed shortly after birth by being ground up alive in giant macerators, gassed, or left to suffocate in garbage bags and dumpsters.."
https://freefromharm.org/eggs-what-are-you-really-eating/
"Today’s dairy cows produce up to 12 times more milk than they would naturally produce to feed a calf. Virtually all dairy calves are stolen from their mothers within hours of birth in order to maximize profit. Cows are artificially and repeatedly and forcibly impregnated year after year. Trapped in a cycle of forced impregnation, perpetual lactation and near constant confinement, most dairy cows’ overworked bodies begin producing less milk at around 4 to 5 years of age, at which point they are slaughtered. In natural conditions, cows can live 20 to 25 years."
https://freefromharm.org/dairyfacts/
I read a book about how cows and chickens are social animals with a full range of emotions and they are emotionally and physically suffering. A friend confirmed when he described how his chickens died after they began having problems laying eggs.
The OP was right when he describes them as sentient beings.
Vegans areagainst all animal products including milk
shareVegans wnat to take your freedom of choice away and put a stop to all meat eating and all leather products
Also vegans want to stop science from using rats to test out new cures for cancer
Vegans arenmore tha just vegetarians they value animal life more than human life
"Vegans wnat to take your freedom of choice away and put a stop to all meat eating and all leather products"
That's just the lunatic fringe. Most vegans know they can't control what other people do, and are content to feel superior to the rest of us.
If the cattle industry is shut down like they want then you don't need to change minds, it isn'tabout superiority, it is about he beli that humans should nt be exploiting and killing animals
Well I, for one, am NOT letting them shut down the cattle industry! Sure, I'd be happy if people stopped killing cows, but I will defend the dairy industry as long as I can draw breath and eat food!
I love cheese thaaaaat much.
Even harder challenge: Convince a tiger to not be a carnivore.
(pssst ... OP is a vegan)
vegan are weird. eat like grazing animal.
imagin having party with them and all they serve is horse food. they belong in asylum.
food. good. eat. ARGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGHHHHHHHHHHHHHH!!!
sharebeing vegan is a sign your western societys are too spoiled! retarts with all the food in the world to choose and refusing to eat proper foods! while people in my country starve! the nerve of all you pampered western infidel wuss!
can you imagine vegan christmas party in your western societys?
the vegan come out the kitchen and unveil the main ontray. but it is not giant goose or plump turkeys the size of fat woman. it is instead giant seeds!! and soy burger!!! hahahahahahh!
i would kill vegan if i have to eat at there shitty home serving hamster food. bunch of skinny retart!.