MovieChat Forums > Solo: A Star Wars Story (2018) Discussion > Blame TLJ for poor Solo performance?!?!?...

Blame TLJ for poor Solo performance?!?!?!


The disgruntled group of distractors that call themselves "Star Wars fans" now pin the blame for Solo failure, and the subsequent decision to put upcoming standalone features on hold, on TLJ!?!?!?! Where's the logic in that? Solo was a poorly scripted and poorly executed movie. Rogue One was also mediocre. They both can't hold a candle to either TFA or TLJ. The Saga installments were much better movies. The other two, however, left much to be desired. So that's the story: TLJ and TFA good, Solo and Rogue One bad.

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If you can't even grasp the concept of The Last Jedi being bad in an objective fashion then I'm not sure you're qualified to discuss how Rogue One or Solo as being good or bad.

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This is incredible. You people hate Disney for all the wrong reasons. Hate them for Rogue One and Solo, not TLJ, TFA. You people are a big mess.

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I don't know who "You People" are but I'm certainly not one of them.

Doesn't surprise me that a collectivist would be on Disney's side with the weaker movies though.

Strength in numbers eh?

As you are each as weak as water on your own.

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No, I assure, you ARE one of them people.

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Yes, yes little doggie.

Run alone!

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Yes, yes little doggie.

Run alone!

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Here is the problem though, R1 was a very good movie, much better than its concept should have allowed and achieved over a billion because of it. It stand as probably the best of the new Star Wars films. TLJ fell millions short of expectations and is very much hated by a large portion of the audience (regardless of being a Star Wars fan or not) before Solo was released. Solo had a very bad opening weekend, meaning WOM did not have an effect yet and technically many that have seen it say its a pretty decent movie, better than TLJ but just as unnecessary if not more so than R1. SO R1 very good, TFA OK (Rose tinted glasses have come off for more people over time, TLJ didn't help,) Solo not bad, TLJ bad.

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You're totally wrong. TLJ (and TFA) had a beginning, middle and an end. Fairly engaging and charismatic characters. Rogue one was a mess. Solo was a mediocre mess.

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TFA is a remake, with a boring hero and rehash story. TLJ connects poorly with any of the rest of SW including TFA, brings a boring space chase, terrible humor, silly tension between a foolish Admiral and her best Pilot, an awful side quest to the casino planet, keeps Finn as a worthless character, adds the terrible Rose character. It leaves the series without a legit villain, wastes Luke's appearance, does nothing to improve the Rey character, Ren is still a weak character, and this is just a few things wrong with the movie. The films are not beginning middle and end...They are beginning and middle, unfortunately RJ left little to be excited about for the end. R1 flows pretty well into A New Hope, its not without its flaws but its unquestionably better than TLJ and I think more entertaining with mostly better characters than TFA.I have not seen Solo yet but as has been said its not Solo's overall quality that mattered, it has been looking bleak since the films directors were fired and TLJ came out the fact it bombed so badly upon release can not be completely disconnected from TLJ. There were other factors, but TLJ was definitely one of them.

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Excellent post lordbishop my only quibble is that they weren't even a beginning: JJ in his infinite wisdom decided he didn't want to tell how we got from VI to VII so we have a story that starts in the middle and has now ended before it even began.

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Well I didn't want to write forever, so I decided to focus my criticism on TLJ since I think that film is primarily at fault for the negative Star Wars reaction we are seeing today, even though TFA has it share of the blame and certainly can be picked apart as well. The world introduced in TFA has the same kind of this doesn't feel right that Luke's character has in TLJ.

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and why would he do that , and how could it do it in a 2 hour film ? didnt he say that from the ashes of the empire rose the first order, luke went into hiding because of Bens fall to the darkside ? didnt han and leia break cause of it ? he went back doing what he did best and she lead the rebels/resistance?

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Why would he tell the story of what happened after VII? You really need me to answer that? And how could he?
Talent would help.

Part VII is garbage partly because it's written as if it's part VIII and we have to just accept that the most pivotal moments in the entire saga (Ben Solo turning evil, the rise of the New Order, the construction of Star Killer, Luke's failure, Han's regression) *all* happen off screen and so have to be hand waved away with a few lines of clunky exposition. RJ then had to deal with JJ's hospital pass of a movie... he failed, of course, but I can hardly blame him.

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No, you're totally wrong. You see, TLJ had an idea, and everything in that movie, including the casino planet, served that idea. Also, whether it "connects well" or not: it's not an issue. TLJ is a separate, wholesome work of art and it should be regarded on its own merit. Hell, does ROTJ "connect well" with ESB? Who cares, it was crap. And Rogue one was a convoluted mess. The idea was lame: who cares about how they stole the plans. Why didn't they think up a whole new mission and tell a refreshing, independent story? And the characters and their motivations were so poorly developed. You complain about the casino planet in TLJ, which by the way had it's purpose in the message that TLJ was trying to send across, but what about the interrogating octopus monster in Rogue one? What was the purpose of that scene?! You're totally wrong.

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TLJ is a middle part of a trilogy its connection to the overall story is an issue lol I am going to move on as I am starting to think you are not being serious here.

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Rogue One has no reason to gloat over Solo's failure, cause it was crap, too. They were totally bad, unnecessary movies. I can't even tell which one was worse. Don't really care. I wish they stop making goshdarn prequels. Prequels is a jinx, bad idea from the start. Who cares about "Han Solo", or "Death Star plans?!" They have a whole universe to work with, can't they invent new stories and characters?

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No, Solo is anything but a new story, it's a rehash and a prequel: exactly the kind I want to see no more.

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How is solo a rehash ? whats it rehashing ? Rogue One is the best film disney have released so far , followed by TFA and Solo , just because you disagree doesnt mean its fact or people are wrong, you are acting like a spoilt brat that cant get its own way.

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I enjoyed RO and TFA, i despised TLJ, Solo is a good Star wars movie, not great , not bad, i blame its poor performance on 2 things, being released so soon after TLJ, and TLJ being so very dissapointing.

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I wonder when people like you will be able to argue without cringe worthy fallacies. It's not a false dilemma, TLJ contributed to Solo underperforming but it was not the sole reason. The enormous fan backlash that TLJ experienced is a fact and thus factors into Solo's underperformance.

Regardless of that, the anthology films are clearly superior as they bring some new stuff structurally and content wise to the SWU, unlike the sequel trilogy wich is just milking the nostalia cow.

So that's the Star Wars story.

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Oh god, you've just affirmed that ludicrous conception. You people are really a piece of work, to say nothing about your "impeccable" taste LOL.

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considering most if not all posters disagree with you, id say its you that lacks taste being the minority and all

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Oh, and I assume you can back that up with some solid data? Because, I happen to know that all reliable evidence indicates that the vast majority of people liked TLJ. In fact, audiences in the vast majority 90%ish either liked or loved this movie.
Comscore/Screen Engine polled audience members and found an 89% positive score.

http://deadline.com/2017/12/star-wars-the-last-jedi-rotten-tomatoes-metacritic-imdb-users-cinemascore-posttrak-1202228837/

On PostTrak audiences surveyed scores it a rare "5 out of 5 stars" and 79% rated it "Definitely Recommend", while 89% gave general approval.

http://deadline.com/2017/12/the-last-jedi-star-wars-opening-box-office-records-1202228444/

CinemaScore that polled actual audience members gave it an A rating.

https://twitter.com/cinemascore/status/942037792544251904

SurveyMonkey polled people ranging from those who had just recently seen it to those that had seen it several days prior and found an 89% positive score (combination of those that said they "liked" or "loved" it). Those that described themselves as "hardcore fans" were just as likely to give a positive score, but were nearly twice as likely to say they "loved" it. So basically everyone overwhelmingly liked it. But the more hardcore fans liked it more.

http://mashable.com/2017/12/20/last-jedi-poll/#rfT9vDnPiiqT

Fans have also been voting with their wallets, with TLJ becoming the 2nd fastest movie to reach $500mil domestic of all time. It has also surpassed $1billion worldwide. While some pointed to its Christmas weekend drop (all movies suffer in the runup to Christmas as people travel and prepare for Christmas Day) it actually surpassed studio estimates for that weekend by 4.5%.

http://www.boxofficemojo.com/weekend/chart/?view=studioest&yr=2017&wknd=51&p=.htm

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It also had the biggest domestic box office take of all of 2017 despite only being out for 2-3 weeks, out-earning blockbusters like Wonder Woman and Beauty and the Beast that were in theaters for 2-4 months:

http://www.boxofficemojo.com/yearly/chart/?yr=2017&p=.htm

It has surpassed $1bil in worldwide box office and it hasn't even come out in China yet. Current projections are for it to finish around $1.5-$1.7billion, which would put at approximately 4th-6th highest grossing movie of all time:

http://www.boxofficemojo.com/alltime/world/

And of course, critics themselves agreed with audiences and approved of the movie at roughly a 90% rate as well (ranging from 86-93%).

The only place left anywhere that doesn't agree with all this evidence is websites likes Rotten Tomatoes, IMDB, and MetaCritic, where random anonymous users on the internet can easily make multiple accounts and spam the site with negative reviews. And the evidence that this happened is very strong, despite Rotten Tomatoes predictably claiming there's nothing wrong: http://birthmoviesdeath.com/2017/12/20/the-curious-case-of-the-last-jedi-and-its-rotten-tomatoes-audience-score[/url] [url]https://deadline.com/2017/12/star-wars-the-last-jedi-rotten-tomatoes-metacritic-imdb-users-cinemascore-posttrak-1202228837/[/url] [url]https://www.polygon.com/2017/12/18/16792184/star-wars-the-last-jedi-rotten-tomatoes-review-bomb

...but I suppose you have a more reliable and verifiable evidence, of course.

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I mostly agree with this. There was some interesting stuff in The Last Jedi, primarily concerning Luke-Rey-Kylo. Some people didn't like the changes in character but I felt that caused some good drama that people were now changed from what they were. Solo was just a movie that never did anything interesting. It was a soulless, assembly line product that was just really boring to watch.


Have a short review of this movie if anyone is interested- https://youtu.be/SVdMCNhBstI

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Oh god, this again. People like this actually exist. God damn.

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I disagree. Before the movie came out I said that you can't make a Han Solo movie without the real Han Solo, and that was my experience in the theater. I sat there watching this guy try and imitate Han Solo and thinking of the "real" Han and how he looked and moved and how he'd behave in this situation or that, and wondering what makes the difference between an actor who seems like a badass and an actor who does not, and pondering which roles can survive recasting and which cannot.

In other words, IMHO "Solo" failed on its own merits, or lack thereof, not because of other films.

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