MovieChat Forums > J.K. Rowling Discussion > "Troubled Blood" is not a transphobic bo...

"Troubled Blood" is not a transphobic book.


So I bought a copy to support free speech, and if anyone is interested, it's not at all transphobic. There's a male serial killer character who dressed as a woman a few times to allay the suspicions of potential victims, but he's a straight cis male disguising himself as a means to an end. There is nothing in this book that a sensible person could call "transphobic", in fact, the underlying themes of the book are about sexism rather than trans issues. There's no debating or haranguing women's issues, but various forms of sexism are presented and their effects are shown, as are ways that women take personal advantage of sexist assumptions.

The book is good, although it's probably the weakest of the Strike books so far - it's involving but rather desperately needed editing. The mystery is complex and involving story, but god damn, Jo, we do NOT need to know every thought that Strike and Robin have about each other! And why the fuck didn't your editor sit you down and say "Oh come ON, readers do NOT need to know that much about Robin's search for a new perfume! Find a more succinct way to let us know how the job is changing her personality.".

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Interesting. If you read her attackers tweets, or even on this site you see a pattern. Most of them are just reacting in mob mentality mode and haven’t read the essay she wrote on why she supported Maya Forstater, much less an entire book.

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Even your defence of the book sounds like there is an underlying insinuation that men in women’s clothing are not to be trusted. I can see why people who have a beef with her would read between the lines with that character.

Glad you enjoyed the read though. Even though I don’t agree with her Twitter tirades I wish the woman no ill will. Hopefully her book sells well but I can’t say you sold it to me with that review!

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What Twitter tirades are you referring to?

And what in the OP suggests men in women’s clothes can’t be trusted? Lol

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A serial killer dressed as a woman. Duh.

I assumed Twitter is where all the blow-hards go to tirade. I wouldn’t know. Apologies if she published her thoughts in a psychology journal 🙄

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Twitter doesn't allow people enough space for proper tirades, I understand it's where people who don't have the attention span for proper tirades go to post insults.

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So... you wouldn’t know what you claimed to know. Thanks for clearing that up.
🙄

And you talk about blowhards. That’s rich.

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Charlotte why so sad 😭

If you read my original post here you will find that I was perfectly respectful to Rowling and said I do not wish her any ill will. I don’t.

Your obsession with ragging on me because I don’t take Rowling’s word as the be and end all of the debate is slightly disturbing. Give it a rest.

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You’re a joke. You can’t even keep track of your own opinions.

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Thanks Char, what a lovely thing for you to say. Of course you have no way of knowing but I’m attending a funeral today and your words of kindness were just what I needed to make it that little bit easier.

A joke, because I disagree with your poster girl. Thanks again.

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I'm sure I wouldn't agree with all of her Twitter tirades if I were on Twitter, but I do admire her willingness to say what she thinks and screw the Twitter Mobs. That takes chutzpah, and the courage of her convictions!

As for your implication that men in dresses should be trusted... why *should* they be trusted? Most human beings aren't particularly trustworthy, and in particular, it's not good sense for human females to give put much trust in adult human males they don't know. The book is complex, adult, and intelligent (even if it needs editing), it goes into relations between the sexes and how people come to trust each other, and not in a one-sided way either. It's a good book, even if the four earlier Strike books are better, and they really are excellent. Even when the "Harry Potter" books were all the rage, I know that Rowling would make a top mystery writer as there was a big element of mystery in the Potter books, and she has definitely fulfilled that promise with the Strike books. They are top-flight detective stories, grown-up and gripping.

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Otter! I’ve been a casual fan of your posts for some time and I’m gobsmacked that you would interpret my words that way. I in no way insinuated that men in women’s clothing should be intrinsically trusted, that’s absurd! I thought I was quite clear that the people who are really upset by her words (of which I am certainly not one) are obviously going to use that character as an example of her anti-trans bias. That just seems logical to me.

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Oh, thank you for your kind words and clarification, for a moment there I thought you were one of these idiots who believes all the foolishness coming out of the Trans Activist Lunatic Fringe, people who would absolutely be offended by the implication that men in dresses don't deserve complete and immediate trust.

There's a lot of misplaced trust on the Spoiled Brat Left, the whole belief in letting people "speak their truth" is foolish, as most people don't understand much about their own lives and problems. But it's the basis of most of their beliefs, and as such it's one of the reason these sheltered college kids find it impossible to say "no" to any shyster who claims to be from an oppressed group. And I'm an old Left-Leftie myself, just one who has seen a lot of real life, who understands a much bigger picture, and has some basic common sense.

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No problem, friend.

The more you speak on the matter, the more I believe we are coming from an almost identical perspective towards the whole hullabaloo.

If truth be told, my main concern with Rowling being so vocal is how it opens the virtual floodgates for every nasty individual with an agenda against not only trans people but anyone who might differ sexually from the norm to join the chorus of hate and division. I fully support her right to express her views I just wonder if she ever considered the knock-on effect it would have and how many people who she proposes to support would be inadvertently effected.

“See this intelligent writer knows a freak when she sees one too, we were right all along” you know?

I’ve said it numerous times in this thread but I’m still yet to see a post from anyone who is really attacking her here. Just a large number of people who are jumping on her bandwagon, if you will, and turning her personal opinion on trans people into something far uglier and more discriminatory.

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IMHO the people on this site skew heavily towards the socially conservative, even though there's a wide variety of political viewpoints. And that those from the Spoiled Brat Left don't stay, as they don't get any support here.

As for Rowling, the reason she's speaking up is that she's concerned about women's rights being eroded in the name of helping Transwomen, and she wants to do something about it. She's well aware that women who've spoken out in defense of their own rights have faced severe online harrassment and worse, but she's got a high IQ, a public forum, infinite chutzpah, and fuck-you money, so she's doing what a lot of feminists are afraid to do. Good for her.

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I understand her concern but personally I think it’s misplaced. When she is making such a massive deal about such a tiny portion of the population, I do wonder what compels her to to target trans women specifically when the patriarchy still rules and the majority of woes that befall women still come from the hands of straight men.

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FYI sweeping changes in the laws regarding women''s rights have been made because of this "tiny portion of the population", that's what Rowling and others like her are objecting to. I understand the concern, because for instance, women's sports are suffering. There was a huge struggle to get women's sports established and funded when I was young, and now that transwomen a.k.a. men are now being counted as women in competitive sports, actual women are losing athletic scholarships and they're afraid that interest in women's pro sports will end when big strong transwomen use theijr male strength to take over.

The whole trans rights thing has become a massive clusterfuck if you look at it close, especially regarding minors who want to transition. Some very unethical medicine is being practiced these days, don't look into it if you want peace of mind.

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I just don’t know how comfortable I would be telling a trans friend they have no right to play sport unless it’s a mans team or take a piss unless it’s at a urinal.

But you seem more versed on the matter than me. I’m probably far too simplistic. I just hate anyone being made to feel excluded because of something they have no control over. Been there myself.

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Of course I hate to make anyone feel excluded, but the whole trans rights thing is getting into some "Your right to swing my fist ends where my nose begins" dilemmas. The issues are complex, and I'm not going to go into them any further here.

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The point here isn't so much JK's feelings on trans"women". It's that she is incredibly disturbed at the amount of credence given to Tavistock and Mermaids who are feeding like candy little girls with supposed body dysphoria, puberty blocking drugs that will remove their ability to reproduce in future and giving them breast binders so they don't develop breasts, and or force double mastectomies to remove female tissues so as not to force them into puberty. This is what she's more disturbed about. She's said she could really care less if they have the sex reassignment surgery, or want to call themselves Helen instead of Kevin. She wants the forced diagnoses of body dysphoria on little girls who just happen to like playing with trucks to end. She wants those little girls to be able to decide on their own as informed young women whether they want to have the surgery. She also wants any man who receives a certificate stating they are women when they refuse surgery or drugs to end. That's what she's pissed about, but the Transgender community and "woke" idiots seem to think what she's saying is transphobic. It's not.

She also wants women's spaces to remain exclusively for biological women/girls only. I know in my country, a well known rape crisis centre renown for the work they did in helping rape victims who were predominately women and girls, lost their funding because they refused to allow men who said they were women entrance.

https://nationalpost.com/news/canada/canadas-oldest-rape-crisis-centre-stripped-of-city-funding-for-refusing-to-accept-trans-women

Trans groups are rapidly dwindling the services real-born women have in order to make what they are and have exclusionary to them only. We real-born women are going to have to keep fighting to keep things we fought for decades to get and keep via Suffrage. And what we fought for decades to get, they're getting with the playing of the "phobic" card. We women who have fought for these rights are being told once again to shut up and sit down. In effect by calling us "terfs" or "cis" it's as if they're once again saying we are second-class citizens and must submit to the namecalling when if you do the same to them, they cry discrimination.

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Male Islamists dress up as women to blow shit up. Transgender? Nothing like a burka to hide your face and bombs! Of course Islam is LGBTFRQ-phobic, but we're not supposed to say so.

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Ummm... what?

I don’t know what you’re trying to sell here Satan but I doubt I want to buy it. Something tells me you’re veering far from the topic at hand. Funnily enough, as I was saying to Otter, this is exactly the ripple effect I was talking about. One minute Rowling is “defending female rights” and the next crazy people are using it as a basis for all sorts of wacky theories and blatant attacks against people who have nothing to do with it.

Thanks JK. You did good sister.

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Regarding the review:

I recommend the five "Cormoran Strike" books to everyone with a taste for mystery books and a brain! They're all cracking good mysteries, absorbing and suspenseful all the way through. Read them! Not just to support freedom of speech, but to enjoy some damn good books!

I would not recommend reading "Troubled Blood" without reading its four predecessors. You really do need the background on the characters to understand how the characters relate to each other, it's not one of those books in a series that can totally stand on its own. And it is a damn good book, even if it does need a bit of editing.

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The whole mess really had nothing to do with the book it was about what Rowlings had said about trans men being men and not women... once she said that it wouldn't have matter what she wrote the tranny brigade was out to snipe at her no matter what she wrote.

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Yeah, pretty much. So I bought the book to say "fuck you" to the kind of idiots who burn books, and I understand that the sales of this book have outdone the other Strike books several times over, because of all the publicity. Hah!

Rowling hasn't said anything genuinely transphobic either, she's just supported women's rights where they come into conflict with trans rights. The Spoiled Brat Left has taken offense at that, but then, bit then, they do tend to spend their lives looking for reasons to be offended so they can complain about it on social media (speaking as an Old Lefty myself).

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Yep... If I recall the original context I think it had something to do with sports where the liberal nut jobs didn't seem to think it was any big deal for a former male to compete in an athletic competition with females that had never had the advantage of having muscles mass that was produced with loads of testosterone when they were growing up. Frankly it is the one area where the idiots supporting transgenders need to have their heads examined. You simply cannot remove the advantage a man has gained over his life simply by removing his testicles when he's grown up. No amount of hormone injections when they have the surgery is going to undo the way their bodies developed as males when they were still males.

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It’s not just surgically altered men who are competing with women in major sports. It’s FULL ON NON SURGICALLY ALTERED MALES who have decided that they are women with testicles, penises, muscle mass, testosterone...

I think there are far more ways in which the supporters of these men are crazy. How about putting a man who has raped women in a women’s prison? It’s happening. How about letting them into our bathrooms? How about letting them be the first “lesbian” to achieve this or that? The list goes on and on.

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Then again it give me hope... I could always try out for the women's weightlifting, I wouldn't be good enough for the men's, but hey maybe the women's

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Exactly. And you’re entitled. You just have to up and decide you’re a woman when you sign up and when you compete. Then you’re free to go back to being a man, or whatever the hell you demand the world to accept you as.

And if you have a particular love of beating women you’re free to compete in women’s MMA, etc. and you can then win a lot of money and enjoy bashing in a woman’s skull. You’re entitled. The women have no say because the mentally ill men say we have no rights.

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Well you're right on most of what you said... except it isn't the men forcing women to do this crap its the LGBT that have caused this. It was one thing when they were just pushing for gay and lesbian rights... but then they made the mistake of getting transgenders into the mix and that's what has caused this ridiculous situation.

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Actually many gay people do not agree with many of the trans claims.

Gay and lesbian people are being called bigots because they don’t consider trans people of the opposite sex to be included in their dating pools.

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Yep... but to begin with they all banded together. The problem is that when they started they were just looking in terms of job discrimination and marriage... it was only when they got their first things on the check list that the marriage between all the groups seemed to have started to breakdown.

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They didn’t all band together. It’s the media who paints the big picture. Trans people are being used by the powers that be to speed up the march towards totalitarianism. They tell us what to think and if we go against their narrative, we get censored and banned in the major social network platforms.

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I never suspected it was transphobic - on the contrary, I suspect Rowling capitalized on this narrative to create hype around her book. And it seems to have worked; everyone I know who's read the book is reading it to find out whether it's transphobic or not and, if so, to what degree. No one is saying they were interested otherwise.

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I’ve never considered that 🤔

Nah, I don’t buy it. To create such a firestorm merely to sell a few more books would make her an evil bitch. I don’t believe that’s the case.

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It wouldn't make her an evil bitch. She took an overblown situation and turned it to her advantage. And it's not a few more books - literally every single person that has mentioned reading the book has done so because of the transphobic cloud hanging over her head.

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C’mon, are you seriously saying the author of Harry Potter needs to rely on controversy in order to obtain a significant reading audience? That might ring true for an unknown but I think you underestimate her clout even without sensational comments.

And by evil bitch I am saying that if she made the comments specifically for the purpose of drumming up interest in her upcoming book I think that is calculating in the extreme and would mean she is willing to cause every trans woman in the world personal grief for an opportunity to throw a few more gold coins on the massive pile that already crowds her ivory tower. I can’t get my head around that and I don’t believe it’s true.

I think Rowling is genuinely concerned about the way she sees increasing trans women rights impinging on the rights of women. The stunning irony for me is when you consider how she herself caused a massive fracas by suggesting she had written Dumbledore as a gay character and the very same people for whom she is now the poster girl for “free speech” were shouting her down as just another elite leftie just a few short years ago.

The whole situation is bullshit to me. At the end of the day I can’t see how anyone really benefits or has their rights either eroded or increased by hearing her two cents. When you break it down she’s an ordinary woman who got lucky by creating a hugely successful children’s book series. That deserves praise but it hardly makes her an authority on anything other than writing successful children’s books.

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No, Rowling doesn't need to rely on controversy, since she's made all the money, but she has done it in the past. There was never any reason to retroactively make Dumbledore gay, but that's exactly what she did not too long after the final HP book was released, and that's no accident. It's also not an accident that she then based her second magical installment on the character and then purposefully excluded his sexuality in the films despite describing their relationship as an intensely sexual one.

I never suggested she made the comments regarding transgender people to stir up controversy; I'm saying that she or her publishing team saw an opportunity to use the public's outrage over them to her advantage. That's not evil imo, it's just opportunistic. I don't think it's even necessarily about money - most writers just want people to read their stories.

While I also believe Rowling is genuinely concerned for the rights of biological women, that doesn't change her impact on trans women. And whether she means to or not, the fact that she is openly against the rights of trans women in the first place is already part of causing every trans woman in the world personal grief, for free.

It's easy to see her words as un-influential, but Rowling's opinions reach millions of people who look up to her and help strengthen the mindsets of those already looking to do harm to others. This is a person whose opinions have touched the minds of generations of children. Remember that her book, The Casual Vacancy, reached various no.1 spots in sales hours after its release. She has influence.

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I dont think it is transphobic or homophobic to express your opinion that trans people are their biological gender and that they have mental problems. It is simply stating a fact. These days people want to be able to do anything they want and for society to bend over to their whims. So if I write a book about a gay serial killer I am homophobic now? You cant say anythning negative about a certain group of people or a member of a certain group? That sounds like a good way to bend the truth. I think there are good gays and trans people, my cousin is gay, but that doesnt mean it is normal behaviour because it is still deviant behaviour.

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Deviant definition “used to describe a person or behaviour that is not usual and is generally considered to be unacceptable.”

Phone your cousin and tell him he’s unacceptable to you. Call him a deviant. Tell us how that goes down.

You think this is what JK was aiming for? To give every person an avenue to broadcast their own opinion on how immoral everyone who isn’t straight or identifies as their birth gender is? How does that fit in to her defence of “real” women?

Be honest you don’t give a flying fig about her real motivations, it’s just a convenient excuse for you to say that gays are deviant. Well bully for you 👍

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Being gay by definition is deviant because it is not usual behaviour. Having incest and sex with animals is also deviant. You could say it is immoral but I jacked off to some strange pornos and still do. Guy wearing a dress and thinking he is a woman is a mental problem. If you want to help him, dont pay for his sex change but pay for therapy sessions. How is a story about a killer in a dress transphobic? So every story with a gay killer is homophobic?

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who cares if it is or isn't. Personally, I think trannies are sick and nasty individuals.

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I plan on reading the series so I don’t want to start at Troubled Blood.

I’m very curious to know though, if this serial killer who dresses as a woman comes across in the book as a convincing woman. Or does he look like a guy in drag?

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Yes, I recommend reading the series as a whole, the books are excellent detective mystery stories.

We never see the serial killer in drag. This is a "cold case" investigation, and the serial killer has been in jail for decades when the story opens.

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Ok thanks! Yes, I plan on reading them. I loved the HP books.

I just wondered if the character had convinced someone he was a woman and gained trust that way or maybe by coming across as a transsexual.

Sounds like it’s not made clear but I’ll find out down the line!

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To be fair, the claims of transphobia is that it uses the buffalo bill trope, which TRAs want to die.

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To be fair, Creed's supporting role was awfully similar to something from "Silence of the Lambs", but as he plays the notorious jailed serial killer who's visited by the protagonist... he bears more resemblance to Lechter than Buffalo Bill.

Frankly, I've seen the idea of a crossdressing male serial killer used much more prominently in other books, and nobody said anything.

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