I actually found Hopper quite horrible in season 3, which is a real shame.
He started off on the wrong foot by getting joy out of sabotaging Mike and El's relationship, and I sensed total disdain for Mike through and through despite him being the one who always has his adopted daughter's back. It's quite crazy to me how he shows no regard for the rules he put in place for El as long as she isn't with Mike.
His treatment of Joyce wasn't much better, dismissing her concerns despite their history and yelling at her most of the time. They were going for humorous banter - completely unlike their characters before this - and it came across to me as so off-putting and unlikable. And although I don't care about the mayor, the way they have him using intimidation and violence Taken-style, as opposed to having to such measures only when backed into a corner, left much to be desired too. I was missing all of his best qualities in this season. He came across as an angry, immature, unwell man who didn't actually own up to anything.
People will probably focus on the letter he wrote, but this doesn't work for me. First off, this was done before he displayed most of this toxic behavior, and I would argue the message itself is more questionable than most people think. He's idolizing a time that doesn't really fit how things ever were with the characters.
At minimum, the show didn't do anything to convince me that El isn't better off with a different parent than him.
reply
share
Ryker (194)
5 years ago
I guess I was on Hop's side when it came to Mike because Mike was being disrespectful asf (whispering to El while Hop is talking) and always came across as a brat with the way he talks to his parents.
Same thing with the mayor. I disliked the mayor so I didn't care about how Hop treated him.
While Hop was angry with Joyce at first, I think he also revealed a better side of himself when he talked to her about moving and wanting to make her feel like Hawkins was still home.
I've always viewed him as a good guy who was rough around the edges. He had his moments where he went overboard but I still loved him.
reply
share
nauru-1 (160)
5 years ago
The whispering might not have been Mike and El's finest hour, even if I do think there are some extenuating circumstances including the attitude Hopper already had on display with them previously while actually respecting his rules. All that said, I don't think anything excuses how Hopper as the adult chose to deal with that. Making a kid feel like a loved one is on death's door however temporarily and then cornering them in a closed space is pretty inexcusable to me. With no regrets either. The way he talked about and to Mike, it was as if he had no regard at all for his place in El's life or their history.
I disliked the mayor too; I guess it just matters to me the lines characters draw even against obvious antagonists. I would be mortified by any of the characters resorting to torture so easily.
Don't get me wrong, I'm sure how you perceived it is more in line with what the show probably wanted something to think, but the approach they took had the exact opposite effect for me. Keep in mind for all his issues in seasons 1 and 2, I cared a lot then. To me, it was like the real Jim Hopper died in episode 1 of season 3. It's not exclusive to him; the show's framing of several matters I found quite troubling this season.
reply
share
Ryker (194)
4 years ago
Mad late reply but I can see where you're coming from. Still...fuck Mike lol
reply
share
nauru-1 (160)
4 years ago
I think they made some contrivances with him in the storyline, but to me he comes across better than most involved.
reply
share
charliekelly (1018)
5 years ago
"I guess I was on Hop's side when it came to Mike because Mike was being disrespectful asf (whispering to El while Hop is talking) and always came across as a brat with the way he talks to his parents."
This exactly. This actually made my blood boil, because it affirms to modern day children that it is okay to treat adults this way if you don't agree with them. Mid-whisper, I would've jerked that smug son of a bitch up by his thin little arm and took him home, probably for the last time, and begged his father to say anything about it.
reply
share
nauru-1 (160)
5 years ago
I don't think Stranger Things had very good lessons for any of the characters involved in this scene. If being a bit smug is all it takes for an authority figure to mislead, threaten, and blackmail a young teen boy who is mostly a good kid, that's a pretty sad world. By the sounds of Hopper in the scenes prior to this, it's also not like he had a very good attitude about El having this boy in her life in the first place despite all the history the character is well aware of. And that's despite the fact that Mike treats Eleven with so much more respect than the grown man Hopper offered Joyce most of the season.
reply
share
charliekelly (1018)
5 years ago
"And that's despite the fact that Mike treats Eleven with so much more respect than the grown man Hopper offered Joyce most of the season."
Right. This coupled with the behavior of the men at Nancy's work is more evidence of them 2019ing the hell out of 1985. They had to show that people of the new generation have all the answers and the older men in the series are pretty much all despicable. Probably the one decent man in the show, Mike's dad is portrayed as this boring/emotionless/cuck/dope type, to the point where the wife almost cheats on him, yet we're still supposed to feel sorry for her in the end, with the "someone for everyone" scene at the carnival.
I still like this show, but I very much fear for the future of it. Not in terms of success; the hard left will lap this shit up. I fear for the future of the show's quality.
reply
share
nauru-1 (160)
5 years ago
I think what confounded me the most in terms of social politics was the empowerment angle they put in with Max and El. Max was actually pretty dismissive about El's instincts with Billy, regularly speaks on her behalf, and continues to the beat the drum about El using her powers as a first solution to the girl's detriment. And despite what's going on with her brother, she also continues to devote an inordinate amount of time fixating on badmouthing Mike and Lucas all without not really acknowledging any of her shortcomings anywhere.
reply
share
Ryker (194)
5 years ago
A little confused Charlie. You seemed to be for Hop's behaviour with your reply to me, now your team Mike and also went into a whole "Anti-SJW" Joe Rogan rant.
reply
share
charliekelly (1018)
5 years ago
I'm not "team" anyone or anything. I know, in 2019, that can be a difficult concept to grasp, but you don't always have to pick a "team" and pledge blind allegiance. Believe it or not, you can actually approach life issue by issue and be honest with yourself and others about your feelings on said issue.
I don't support children being blatantly disrespectful, in any case.
"Team Mike"? I don't even know where this comes from. The only point I was making was that it was silly to act as though these children would grasp these deep social concepts at such an early age; all the while every adult male, sans Mike's dad, is portrayed to the fullest stereotype of "toxic masculinity". You just seem hell bent on finding an argument with me.
I'm definitely anti-sjw. I'm also anti-far right.
I don't know what Joe Rogan has to do with any of this.
I'm the one that's confused, and it's more than just a little. If you want to fuck with someone over the internet, at least have it make a little more sense.
reply
share
Ryker (194)
5 years ago
Your complaints about left-leaning content reminded me of Joe Rogan. The dude takes every opportunity to complain about that stuff on his podcast. The fact that you use the word "cuck" says a lot about you.
I didn't need a lecture on the team thing, but if writing that made you feel smart all the power to you. I was just pointing out you first agreed with Hopper's actions, and then indicated you also had issue with them. Your third paragraph does a better example of explaining your position.
reply
share
charliekelly (1018)
5 years ago
All of my words say a lot about me. That's the intent. The guy practically is a cuck though; I'm not sure what else you'd like to call it. He's got a bangin' wife that he pretty much ignores to do stuff like mow the lawn in the rain. And not her lawn, the front lawn. All the while, said bangin' wife is seconds away from fucking the younger, hotter lifeguard. What more do you need? Mike's dad to place Billy's penis inside his wife?
And, I have no need to "feel smart". Though, you obviously did need a lecture on the concept of the team mentality, as evidenced by "Team Mike" and your quick defense of cucks and sjws. You're the one trying to seem/feel smart. You're just failing miserably.
reply
share