Murphy Brown attacked him as a recurring joke for being white-bread, showing how rebellious and daring she was for attacking such a mainstream musical figure, but as he is now divulging he is gay, does that make her a homophobe?
shareNo, it does not.
--<(Atheism, a wiser choice)>--
zypherix: "No, it does not."
--------------------
Bet it does.
I disagree.
--<(Atheism, a wiser choice)>--
Inside joke. Murphy was more of a rebel so something like Barry Manilow songs would most likely make her cringe. I had a wonderful woman supervisor who couldn't stand him or the Carpenters for pretty much the same reason. This was in a video store, so if we wanted to get a rise out of her, we'd put Barry or the Carpenters videos on, and she'd peak out of the office and wag her finger at us, always laughing because she knew what we were up to.
"Great theater makes you smile. Outstanding theater may make you weep."
I'm no Manilow fan, and not much of a Carps fan, either.
But it took me years to appreciate the warmth of Karen's voice. She's so calm and understated, so comfortable.
Not gonna break into some Carps thing, but she's a bit under-rated for being in the MOR crowd.
I think she was a sincere musician and not a dummy who was only trying to be famous. A chick drummer with a voice like warm chocolate. Pretty, too. What's not to like?
You can disagree all that you want, until you vanish after you die. Or you could accept The Lord into your heart, ask Him for forgiveness, and be Saved. It’s not hard to do. He loves you. Please love Him.
shareShe made fun of him for his pop music. She loved rock and soul. Think Aretha versus bubblegum
shareI like that episode when he finally came on the show and they did the scene where her son is going through the stages of life. At least I think that was the same show while Barry was singing.
share"If"?? That's like asking a question that starts with "If the Earth is round. . . " He's as gay as a picnic basket, as queer as a $3 bill. Sheesh! She’s not a homophobe. She has style, class and good taste in everything, including popular music. Manilow was kitsch on two legs. He wrote, “You deeeeserve a break today. . . . McDonald’s!” He composed and performed McMusic.
shareSome of it was McMusic, but not all of it. There was a song about a woman who was so anguished that she attempted suicide, but told from the point of view of her clueless husband. It had some depth.
shareYou’re right, nor did I say that McMusic was the entirety of his oeuvre. What I question is if a truly great composer— Gershwin, Dvorak—would even be able to write elevator music or a McDonald’s jingle. I may be wrong. Of what I’m certain is that writing the jingle leaves the composer forever after a little stained. Wealthy, but stained.
shareHe made a joke of it, which worked well in his act: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EVsXsSukGHQ
shareThere are a grand total of 3 (count them, 3) posters here on whose links I would click. There are a two reasons. First, I don’t think that a link is a post. A post entails actual words from the poster. There are some linksters who are clearly capable enough of writing actual words, so I exempt you. I exempt Catbookss, for the same reasons, plus because she is my beloved MC buddy. The third exception I will keep to myself.
Second, clicking on a link is like having unsafe sex. I don’t want a disease; neither does my iPhone!
And, yes, thank you for the link, my prejudices notwithstanding. The guy was smart, no doubt about it. You don’t get to that level of commercial success absent being some kind of smart.
Thank you for the compliment. I love catbookss, too. She's much smarter than I am -- I appear to be losing grey matter every day -- and she's as smart as a whip. As is HarvardBarbie, when she posts, which is now rarely.
But I agree. There are a lot of people who'll give you a link to some place where you either feel stupid or immediately infected. Sometimes these places are like dive pickup joints. Not being a denizen of dive pickup joints, I don't lead people into back rooms where you can get a nasty case of the worst of what's going around.
[deleted]
You know, I know classy dames when I see ‘em! You choose to travel in excellent company, Destinata. It speaks well of all three of you.
shareManilow's sexual orientation was one of the worst-kept secrets in show business. A savvy reporter couldn't figure it out? Oh, please!
Of course, today if someone attacks another's political policies and that person with the despised political policies happens to be black, the defense isn't a logical defense of said policies, it's -- "Bigot! Racist!" If a woman loses a political race, it isn't because people saw her as representative of policies they didn't want, it's -- "Misogynist!" So it would seem reasonable for a man who was lampooned regularly on a TV show when he'd come out as gay would blame it on their being homophobic, not for being a "white bread" entertainer.
Respectfully, you've completely lost me.
I don't remember a Manilow-is-gay subtext on MB mostly because I didn't watch the show very close.
But if Barely Man-Enough was widely known to be Gay, you think the Murphy Brown crowd were hassling him over it?
The way I see it, they likely were gently breaking the news for everyone so when he DID come out, no one would be shocked and surprised. They likely had his tacit approval.
I have no dog in the fight when it comes to Gay Rights, but as they say, all Rights are Human Rights.
And to return to the beginning, why would a savvy reporter want to figure out and report on someone's sexual orientation?
To be honest, I quit watching when Eldin left, the massively talented, massively tormented Robert Pastorelli. So I missed all the Barry Manilow jokes, although I did get the "I'm so hip it hurts" routine over and over.
Back in those days some people thought it was cool to make fun of Manilow's lack of hipness, who was as believable doing covers of blues numbers from the '40's as Candace Bergen was doing blue-eyed soul or protest songs from the '60's. They did some rather fearless comedy on that show, and it's too bad someone didn't roll their eyes and tell her she was one to talk. Again, who knows? Maybe they did. I was gone to follow Robert Pastorelli (eventually) to his one season -- worth it if you can find it -- of the American version of "Cracker."
I didn't mean that she'd want to report on Manilow's sexual orientation, just that she'd know about it. But back then you could criticize a gay guy for his music or a politician for his political philosophy without checking to see if he was a member of a protected minority group that shouldn't be criticized for anything, ever.
Wasn't Manilow still living with that woman back then and pretending that he was straight as an arrow, but if he and she ever tied the knot -- they'd supposedly been living together for eons -- it would likely ruin their relationship. That story made sense to Merv Griffin, who had his own issues in that department.
I'm just saying that in an updated hip, slick, and cool, PC world of today, the liberals the show pandered to would have turned on her in a New York second. Dealing with gays and Beta Males is a delicate matter today, a point that the great Rowan Atkinson has lamented at length.
Oddly enough, I could have guessed or assumed BM was gay, but I was never given evidence or cared one way or the other. I was only a casual follower of MB so I don't recall the gay jokes. Now someone like Elton John, not that long in his career he came out proudly, and there wasn't much fuss that I recall. I'm not even sure why I'm talking about it.
All the talk about liberal agendas is ginned up nonsense from a group that wants up to live in the past, where oppression was accepted and enjoyed by a certain demographic. Oh no -- Progress ! Enlightenment ! Acceptance ! The Horror !
I was a HUGE Elton John fan back in the '70's when he came out. It wasn't so proudly. It was kind of matter-of-fact -- a reporter asked him the question point-blank, and added he could turn the tape recorder off or leave it running, the control was entirely his. Elton told him to keep it running and simply answered the question. But then the stuff did hit the fan. Most people don't remember that Elton held the #1 position in the Rock/Pop pantheon. But fuss? Heck, yeah! Girls stopped swooning and guys stopped wanting to be him, in droves. When he came out, being gay was far from accepted. That happened later, in the '80's.
If you think conservatives have an agenda and liberals don't, you are beyond naive, politically. BOTH have agendas. Oh no -- The Horror! But I do wonder why "acceptance" only goes one way with liberals. Back in the '70's there was a "back to nature" movement that even included cooking. Old methods, home canning and preserving, and a movement back to organic methods of farming for more natural produce was the rage. That's coming back, along with the realization that if women are going to stop using Drive-Thrus and processed foods it takes a lot more time in the kitchen. There are quite a number of women who are becoming full-time homemakers. And they're getting a lot of flak from their liberal friends, who don't seem to be supportive of their choices. So why is it that y'all are "accepting" so long as people are accepting YOUR choices?
Respectfully, I ain't buying what your selling. Where I have lived and the people I have known, we respect people for their choices as long as they are smart and make sense in the context of what they are trying to do.
I can't imagine wanting to be part of a group that hassles someone over wanting to be a homemaker. This sounds like something out of the movie "The Help," where a clique act like complete nasties and we can all see who's right and who's wrong.
This is something the wrong wing has been ginning up for a long time now, how oppressed they are by elite liberals. Absolute BS. If all these sincere, well-meaning neo-cons want to extend a friendly hand across the divide, it would be embraced swiftly, but that doesn't follow the playbook. Demonize your opponent and play the innocent, outrage your base and smirk at how easy it is to gin up support. Just plain ugly, and it's obvious who's pulling the strings while my side tries to play by the rules and gets scorn for trying to do the right thing.
Good for you! And yes, I'm a member of those groups, and have known a number of young women who are hassled because they aren't out there being the "feminist dream." Their choice is to stay home and be the perfect -- not joking -- fifties housewife, keeping their house clean and making it an oasis for their husband and children. At the beginning of the '60's and '70's wave of feminism, it was noted by women that if they weren't out there working, they were ridiculed. Mitt Romney's wife went from school to being Mrs. Mitt Romney, and she never held a job -- for which she was ridiculed, so someone who wants to do the '50's thing really gets it. Go ahead and tell me I don't know what I've and others have experienced.
Golly, what's the line folks yell when they corner someone? Oh, yeah -- "Believe women! They're speaking their truth!" But you don't believe women if their truth doesn't support your narrative.
Thanks for proving my point. We're done here.