MovieChat Forums > Alien: Covenant (2017) Discussion > Tell me the story about the Space Jockey...

Tell me the story about the Space Jockey please.... (Contain Spoilers)


Ever since I saw Alien (1979), I have been dying to learn more about the creatures and not least what the heck this Space Jockey was and why it was transporting the eggs??

Aliens (1986) told me a little more about the creature and one may argue so did Predator2 and AVP. Though, I want to know the story about this dang Space Jockey too.

And say what you will about Prometheus but it finally did give me some (after 33 years of waiting) . Though not much, but it did tell me these Space Jockeys created life on earth, monitored many other planets, planned to kill us off and designed the genetics of the Alien creature etc.. holi crap, way more ambiguous than I ever dreamed.

But still; what is the story about the Space Jockey from Alien (1979)?

With Covenant, I fear I am longer from it than I thought after Prometheus. I now know that David created the Eggs and I know the Space Jockey somehow transported those (or similar) eggs over the next … I think 20 years until Ripley kicks ass…. and in the process, it crashed on LV426, died, got fossilized and sent an sos message which a Human spaceship can intercept somehow… It confuses me…

• Is David inside the space Jockey suite from Alien (1979)?
• Did he sent an SOS to be intercepted by a human spaceship, as he knows humans apparently always respond to SOS’s and thereby will inadvertently help spread his creation (he need a slower incubation time for them to board their ship first and so he increases the incubation time that we saw in Covenant)
• Did David take the colony from Covenant and creates an army of Aliens to defeat the real home world of the Engineers
• Perhaps after he destroyed the original Engineers world, he escapes hurt and head for earth but then crashes on LV426... and Alien (1979) begins?

I doubt this, but tell me the story about this Space Jockey ...

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Fossilisation takes 10,000 years. So the time line from the even prometheus is too short, so the aliens not even being made until 20 years before the original film screws that up. The fact david is leaving the engineer/space jockey planet on the covenant means he no longer has access to engineer ships and so it begs the question how did thousands of eggs get on a ship and get to wherever lv426 is?

The space jockey has been ruin in my opinion. The hulking mass we first see in the original film has been reduced to a proto human, and as such it cheapens the "alien" about it. Its no longer something that is complete unrelated to us and evolved in a complete different way to us, its just us before us.

I really liked the idea of all this stuff going on thousands maybe even millions of years before us. The idea of engineers is fine, but I think they should have been left separate from the space jockey. It all just seems to shoe horned for me. Add to the space jockey ship looks very different on the inside to the one in prometheus. The only way this could be more messy is if they put aliens vs predator back in to the canon.

That is the engineer homeworld. They are all dead now. That plot line is gone, as is any change of getting any answers to the prometheus questions.

In all honesty though, I can see what youre saying happening. It sounds like the way the story is going. Either that or someone working for the company steals the ship from david and thats why theres a signal that the company wakes up the nostromo for. Either way whats happened so far has ruined things as far as Im concerned. In the same way the star wars prequels ruined the original trilogy by shoe horning in current ideas that screwed with the over all narrative. The fact everything is related to us, and revolves around us is just a big disappointment. Once again the universe revolves around us.

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We don't know if that was their homeworld or just the last planet that the spaceship came from. There also could be many other planets and moons that they inhabit.

We haven't seen the last of the Engineers because Space Jockey and the eggs still needs to be explained.



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At the end of Prometheus shaw tells David she wants to go to where they come from, David tells her that he knows how to operate the ship. While shaw is asleep on the trip to paradise, David learns everything about the engineers. Why would he change course just to kill another off world installation? Especially when his intent is to kill them all.

That was the home planet, that is the end of the engineers and the as for the ship on lv 426 that's been sitting there for a minimum of 10,000 years. Which is weird since David only just made the aliens from that film. Like I said fossilisation takes 10,000 years. That where I get that number from. Dallas said the space jockey was fossilised which means that ship was sitting there for at least 10,000 years. Barring some bullshit revisionist history or ignoring basic science the only way that ship is turning up on LV 426 with thousands of eggs is time travel.

But let's forget that for a moment. David is off on the Covenant towards the original destination. That's another 7-8 years taking us to within 10-12 years of alien. But there's no more engineer ships. So how would an engineer if one was alive get thousands of eggs and bugger off with them to lv 426?

We just have to face facts, these prequels have turned the franchise into something with more holes than block of cheese.

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"David is off on the Covenant towards the original destination." Which means that planet wasn't the homeworld.

The planet in Covenant is just where he traced the ship to. Doesn't make them both the same place.

We don't know there aren't any more ships or Engineers. We only know those on the planet David arrived at are dead, but we do know there is another ship ans space jockey.

Perhaps they have time-travel also and that is how come the space jockey is so old.

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No, we do know because that's what we see and that's what we were told they were going to. What you suggest is giving the writers a free pass for the fuck up. David told his story and made no mention that they couldn't find the planet, what he said was that he learned everything about them while shaw was sleeping.

Considering the amount of plot holes there are in this movie there's a good chance you might be right, but from everything that was said and shown that's the engineers homeworld. As for the ship, it would be some huge coincidence if David happens upon another one.

But none of address the time frame issue. Honestly I can't see anyway to explain rapid fossilisation in just 10 or even 20 years. I'm having a hard enough time believing that the nostromo crew couldn't tell the difference between a corpse and a suit. But if that true than maybe Dallas was just a dumbass who had no clue what fossilisation was?

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From the ending of Covenant, I reckon a portion of the other 2000 colonists will wake up early from cryosleep, and will cause Covenant to crash back at LV-223 again, where there are other Derelict ships. Daniels and Tennessee will either die in crash, or will have died inbetween movies from being facehuggered.

Now with David and other awoken colonists on LV-223 again, they will come across the Xenomorph birthed at the end of Prometheus. This Xenomorph turns out to be a Queen, and has been there laying eggs, and the eggs have impregnated the deceased corpses of the humans who died in Prometheus. This Xenomorph cannot be controlled by David like the ones in Covenant, so a battle between David's first ABANDONED creations and David's PERFECTED creations will occur.

David will realize the Prometheus Queen is the perfect species, and the movie will end with David trying to take off on another Derelict ship from LV-223 with the Prometheus Queen's eggs in the cargo bay, wearing the Space Jockey suit. Either he or a human takes off wearing the Space Jockey suit, while his creations and the Prometheus Queen will have or will die from fighting each other, and they'll kill off the human characters. While flying the derelict, David or main human character will have an Prometheus Queen embryo inside of them and this embryo will burst out of them, causing them to crash on LV-426. This embryo will evolve into a Queen, and will wind up being the Queen seen in James Cameron's Aliens.

Also, when has science fiction ever followed basic science or human science in general? In Predator 2, the Predator's weapons were made from an element not on the periodic table. Maybe fossilization on LV-426 occurs much quicker than on Earth.

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10,000 years vs 10 years. It would be much more probable that Dallas just didn't know what he was talking about.

As for science fiction following the rules, they all do follow the rules. The rules they set out. The alien franchise has already established its rules. And basic science is one of them. But if you are going to change something that's potentially confusing for the audience, it's best to offer some explanation as to clear the matter up. No matter how you look at it, the writing is what let's both these prequels down.

Oh, and the predator isn't part of this franchise. It was separated for very obvious reasons. But if they were canon, that would screw things up even more. Like a lot. Everything from the creation of the aliens to the foundations of the wayland corporation would be screwed up.

It sucks the writing is so garbage because Scott has created a couple of visually fantastic movie. That sound design, the atmosphere are 2nd to none. But the characters and script are poo

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The foundations of the Weyland business can be explained. I understand there is a website for Weyland Corporation that gives backstory, and completely ignores the history from AVP, but some of the details on there could be considered NOT canon, since none of the details about Peter or the company itself are in the actual Prometheus movie.

After Charles Weyland died, the company could've gone into the hands of son, Peter Weyland, when he became of age. Considering how Charles never mentions Peter, and Peter never mentions Charles, that can be simply said that they didn't have a good relationship and that's why on the website Peter just simply refers to his father as a self-taught engineer.

Also, the website says Project Prometheus began in 2073, when in the movie Charlie and Shaw didn't find anything to spark the mission until 2089. Also, our David character is a version 8 model, according to the website, which also says that David 7 was created in 2068, meaning David 8 would have to be created sometime after that, and Peter Weyland would have to be more than 78 years old when David 8 is created. Yet in the new Covenant movie, we see David 8 talking to a young Peter Weyland. This goes to show that even in his own films, Ridley Scott can't keep a consistent timeline.

Unless the David in the beginning was the the first version from 2025, that would mean Michael Fassbender technically played three different roles in the movie. And if he was, why would we need to see this for THAT version? Also, on the beginning of Covenant, David picks his name after looking at the Michelangelo statue of David, yet the website shows that the name "David" is what Peter Weyland would name his son if he had one. For now, I'll say that was supposed to be David 8, so technically, some information from the website can be considered canon while others aren't.

It's not that I want to defend the AVP films. While they do suck, I hate it when franchises retcon. It's a thing that bothers me.

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You and me both. Instead of talking about the film and its content here we are talking about what is or isnt whats actually happened. Has the original space jockey crashed on lv426 yet or will he later on? is it peter or charles that starts the wayland corporation. Did david invent the aliens or was it the predators? Or did they just evolve somewhere else? Was it now, or then? When will then be now? soon. lol Lets face it at this point the scene from spaceballs fits in as well most others at this point lol.

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I have to agree with the other guy ... the "engineers" have much more advanced technology than humans, and for longer ... so there would not just be one home world for them, they would have colonized all over the universe, or at least seeded it, like they did with Earth.

Perhaps another ship comes back, or a lot of them do, to check on the home world, if that is indeed their homes world, and they go down to see what is going on.

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Good points. But dang, I hope it all will be fitted somehow....

Let us imagine that in fact the whole world of the Engineers is long gone. Destroyed by their own ingenuity thousand of years ago by the black goo .... sort of what we learned in Prometheus.

The Engineer type people destroyed by David in Covenant were the last remains of a lost civilization. Explains why they seemed to be so primitive.

Now David will go on an adventure with our sleeping colony in the next installment and on these adventures he will crash or escape or whatever, but he will end on LV-426 somehow...

Here he finds a crashed ancient ship of the Engineers and perhaps learn more of their history. And he will start his hive egg production in the already fallen ship... as the planet offers little else... and he will just sit and wait.

Ind comes Alien (1979). He blocks their radios so they cannot talk to Nostradamus and just watches them from a distance.... role credits.

End credit scene: further more he hereafter cloaks the fallen spaceship, so he knows it will not be detected in case humans would later want to inhabit LV 426.... the reason why it was not found before it was too late in Aliens (1986)...

The above may work? Not very exciting though.

- however....... the Space Jockey was blown from its chest..... so either it knew of the facehugger, or maybe David experimented on its biological remains ... creating a egg laying queen... we later see in Aliens (1986) and that same planet... full circle?

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Regarding the fossilization:

I was just googling stills from the Alien (1979) and with the knowledge we have from Prometheus, I think it is clear that it is a space suit that Dallas looks at. Even the rips are part of this suit we see in more detail in Prometheus. If so, perhaps perhaps Dalas is just wrong?

He sees a bio suit in the dark and he mistakenly thinks it is an Elephantine looking huge alien mofo, when in fact it is a elephant looking bio suit. If so, and I think the stills could support this, we could rationalize that this space ship may after all not have crashed there millennia ago?l

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Nothing wrong with that idea. Dallas was after all just a space trucker, not a scientist. My grumble is that it takes away from the majesty of the plot. I loved the idea that thousands of years ago the species was wiped out by the alien we all know and love through whatever course of events. This need to make it all fit together around us that scott seems to have though is ruining it. Its like hes trying to make everything fit nice and neatly together. Which is weird as that the very reason he didnt want to set prometheus on lv426.

Seeing that giant and truly alien space jockey sitting there in that first movie really got the imagination going. Which I feel is something largely lost in to days cinema. Theres no need to involve your imagination like there was with star wars for example. Everything is just there laid out for you. And it really does block you from really losing yourself in a the story. And no, trying to figure out whats been revised and what hasnt doesnt count lol.

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I am with you 100%. That original Space Jockey and the mysterious Alien eggs is a huge part of why we even to this day crave this story. And indeed the path taken in both Prometheus and perhaps especially Covenant takes us in a direction that doesn't really support the hype we build up over the last 4 decades.

A shame that they feel the need to include humans in these stories. Just tell us the Space Jockey history and show us a planet crawling with Aliens :) The shot in AvP where thousands Aliens storm a pyramid, is one of my favorite shots - even if it is only but a few seconds long and in a generally disliked movie.... alas, they wanted a human spin and here we are in Covenant. Whatever way they may take us I sincerely hope they will include the story that began it all...

I am disappointed too. But yet, I still crave satisfaction. I realize that part of the this damn prequel-pandemic, we seem to be in, removes the magic a bit. Star Wars for example. But yet, still I crave it. Anyway, I agree with your points. Difference is, I need my fix. You are wise enough to say; get away from me you .... :)

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i have this theory that back in the days when movies were mostly good, and ideas were fresh, that the people making all those decisions to make those good movies were getting amazing blowjobs. And they all retired or died, the people giving those amazing blowjobs took over. The only problem is, the only talent they have is in sucking. Which you can see from the movies they make lol.

i saw they released a couple of alien audiobooks/radio plays awhile ago and had a listen. They are actually pretty good, better than this stuff Scott is dishing out. One follows ripley as she gets woken up early after the nostromo blows up and turns out there's an alien running around the station she's on. It's a bit convenient in how it all wraps up, but it's a fun story and has that atmosphere of an alien movie. Then there's another one that explores everything that happened no the colony at lv 426 in the run up to alien. Why the colonists went out there, what happened after they did all that stuff. Acted well, and it does fit neatly into the story as a companion piece for aliens. I did find myself wanting to watch aliens after it was done lol.

The video game alien isolation, also great. Follows Amanda ripley looking for her mother. Atmosphere is there in spades. Alien can a bit dumb, but it captures the movie feel brilliantly. All of these things have been far superior to both the prequels so far. I love the world of alien. I think it's a really great fleshed out universe(over the first two films) that does need more stories in it. But oh my god we need better writers to compliment scotts imagery. Both movies are beautiful, and fit in great stylistically, but the writing as been where it falls short. A real shame.

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Surely many of the great story tellers of the day have been sucked dry. There are pearls every now and again so they cannot all be fluffers and I for one at the very least appreciate the ambition behind Prometheus.... Funny how older movies managed to tell so much more and so much deeper in so much shorter time.

But again, I agree and your theory is probably right for most businesses.... asskissers and kocksuckers are the ones taking over. Fact of life.

I have skimmed the comics series on several occasions, but never quite felt the magic. And I have read the ones where Batman and the Aliens crossed path. I thought those were great, also one where Superman meets the creature somewhere in space. Also very good, especially the ending (he had been facehugged while he was weakened, and how he overcame the chestbuster was pretty damn cool). I am even one of the few that likes AvP... all in all, most of these stories (to my knowledge) more or less supports that the Alien is an ancient mysterious creature. Which we all dig. Covenant seem to take that away, and surely I would have told that part differently. I will try and dig into the Amanda Ripley story/game. Sounds cool. Speaking of the colony on LV426: I am sure you know that Alliens - Directors cut has a scene where the Aliens are found and infects the colony. A few scenes and minutes.... but, man I love it. Again it boils down to the fact that I crave to learn more about this Space Jockey and his ship....

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Yeah river of pain expands on the colonel at lv426 in great detail. If you don't have an audible account, I'd say sign up for a free trail and grab it as your free book. It's pretty cool.

Unfortunately, I've never found anything that expanded on the space jockey. I always found it weird that the nostromo crew were more interested in the space jockey. It was like look a giant alien! Yeah but look over here, a hole! Oh let me see! Lol. Space jockey never gets any love. And Scott has now just straight up gave him the finger.

The ideas in Prometheus were good, just executed poorly. All ad campaign in the build up had me so excited for a proper hard sci fi movie. I think that might be why it gets the hate it does, because it raised expectations so much with ads, with the fact Scott was coming back. And then it all just fell apart in the end. And now this covenant thing. Again it's not a bad movie if a typical slasher flick is all you want, it's just a fucking terrible sequel to Prometheus. All that promis gone so tweets could watch dummy's get killed in fucked up ways lol.

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Don't get me wrong I just love the Alien creature and I absolutely hate it when they change on it, like the time of incubation or even the look of the eggs (Resurrection) not to mention the insanity of what they did to it in AvPII. No No NO... anyway, the SJ is absolutely amazing. Totally unique design and style when it comes to its peers in sci-fi. Even down to his chair and of course his space ship. Wild. Most definitely he does not get enough love. I remember trying to pause, pic by pic on my WHS just to get some better view on what the heck it was.... who would have known; it was Kojak all along.

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This post is in regard on the egg's incubation speed. In the first four Alien movies, the incubation period took hours or days. In the AVP movies, as well as this new Covenant movie, the incubation period is a lot quicker. However, in Covenant, we learn that these creatures were created from David experimenting with the fauna on the Engineers' Home Planet. And from what we've learned from Prometheus, these Engineers have used the black goo to create life, and they have at one point created a Xenomorph Queen, as shown in the temple on LV-223. So it can be easily implied that the Queen Xenomorph from the AVP film was created by the Engineers experimenting with Alien Fauna, and somewhere in the past, the Engineers have given the Predators that Queen to use on Earth for hunting. Because the Queen Xenomorph in AVP was created from Alien Fauna, just like the ones in Covenant, its incubation period is a lot quicker.

The incubation period for the Xenomorphs in the first four Alien movies are different from the ones in Covenant and AVP. Covenant and AVP Xenomorphs were created from Engineers experimenting with Alien fauna. The xenomorphs from the first four Alien movies were descendants of the Xenomorph birthed at the end of Prometheus, which I am guessing by the next film will be a Queen. That creature was a result of David mixing black goo into Charlie Holloway's drink. Charlie had sex with Shaw, and Shaw birthed what ended up being a giant Facehugger. The giant Facehugger impregnated an Engineer, which resulted in the Queen Xenomorph seen at the end of Prometheus.

If my speculation on the next film is correct, David will land the Covenant back at LV-223, and discover that the Prometheus Queen has a slower incubation period, and the eggs impregnated the deceased remains of the humans from Prometheus, or will perhaps will impregnate the human colonists on Covenant. David will take this Queen's eggs on another derelict ship on LV-223, and that ship will crash on LV-426.

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Avp isn't canon, buddy.

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Well, I tried, somewhat.

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Hey man nothing wrong with trying to make sense of this mess. Just dont tell me the black goo is actually food like some other person did. Yeah, its spoiled food..... LOLOLOLOLOLOL Someone didnt put the black goo in the fridge so thats how this all started according to him lol.

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Okay, unless myself or others actually find a reason to explain how black goo is spoiled food, that theory is just stupid. No offense to whoever came up with that, but I am hoping that was their attempt at a joke.

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You would think it was, but alas no. They actually think that. And theyve been saying it a lot. And you should give offence to the guy who came up with it because its really fucking stupid lol. He says the big bald dude at the start isnt sacrificing himself, hes just there for a meal, but because its contaminated he dies.

Have a read:

posted 3 days ago by Terrygg (204)
2 replies | jump to latest

I'm starting to think that it was food brought to that planet by the engineers because it was on their ship in cannisters. And in the beginning, the engineer drank the black goo and died.

So, back on that other planet where the rest of the film takes place, I think the chemical reaction between the engineers respiration and the atmosphere of the planet somehow contaminated the black goo (food). When the engineers ate the contaminated goo, they died from infection.

The contaminated black goo (food) mutates other living organisms after being ingested, like those parasitic wormlike insects that were living in the dirt, into hostile giant lifeforms that have their own reproductive cycle. And just like all other lifeforms, they go through evolution. The first face hugger was giant because it came from a giant human. The first xenomorph becomes a giant queen that looks more humanlike because its DNA sliced with the giant engineer.

Hopefully the other prequel movies will explain how subsequent xenomorphs looked more insectlike.
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And when someone else gave detailed reasons why he was wrong he said:

[–] Terrygg (204) 12 hours ago

Whatever. Who cares anymore. I'm tired of wasting my time with crazy people.

So, yeah. Give him great offence. Im all for trying to piece this stuff together and have a bit of fun with it, but sweet moses the guy is a tool lol.

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Yep. He is a bit of an odd fellow that on. His arguments are obviously and almost comically weak (in canisters, ergo food. Seen ingest it and dies, ergo food. Everyone has to eat; ergo food), and yet seem to think everyone else uses weak (or as he say "crazy") points when civilly conversing what we all find interesting and perplexing... Arh, well. Good to rock the boat every once and a while, I suppose. And who knows, might just all be a rally really bad made cup of black gooy joe? :)

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Yeah, its interesting he popped off at you for not agreeing with him by calling you crazy, yet when I called him a nutjob for continuously pushing that narrative he reported me lol. Im sure it didnt have anything to do with me proving him wrong by posting a quote by scott saying that the big guy was infact sacrificing himself at the start of the movie lol.

I dont have anything against people giving theories and having conversations, but this guy is just adamant hes right and every one else is wrong. Hes even ok with plot holes! Hes just a weird dude lol.

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I reported you because you were cursing and insulting me. Get it correct.

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I hear youve been making friends elsewhere on the boards as well. Come back here because they couldnt stand your dumb ass either?

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I was here before you were.

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Never said anyhing about who was here first. Dont know hy youre bringing that up. Not that it matters of course, being here longer doesnt give you the right to annoy everyone and expect not to get it back, dumb ass.

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And you're the arrogant dumbass. I know that sounds like an oxymoron but apparently it is possible to be dumb and arrogant. One minute you type like an educated person and then the next minute you're writing like an ignorant uneducated bully. I think you have personality issues.

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So you dont know what an oxymoron is then huh? Or you dont know what arrogant means. Because arrogance has nothing to do with intelligence.

And clearly no one gives a fuck what you think, because I dont see anyone leaping to your defence. All I see is people saying the same thing about you over and over again. Whats the old saying, if you ran into an asshole you ran into an asshole. If you run into assholes all day, youre the asshole. Or in this case, the dumb fuck. The dumb fuck that thinks that guy at the start of prometheus was having a sandwhich. the dumb fuck that thinks the black goo is food. The dumb fuck that thinks eggs and embryos are the same thing. The dumb fuck that thinks he can call other people names and not get it back. The dumb fuck that thinks just because he moans enough at mods he'll get his own way. The dumb fuck that thinks hes know better than everyone else, and anyone that disagrees is stupid.

Heres a hint, dumb fuck. Theres an ignore button at the bottom of this post. Its there for people you dont which to speak with. You dont like the truth bombs Im dropping on you, you go right ahead and click it. Running to the mods just makes you a little bitch that cant take what you give out. The fact I give it better than you can is besides the point. You think Im harassing you then push the button. But you wont do that because you are nothing more than pathetic troll that wants to "win" this back and worth. Sad little man.

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I am not sure we actually saw a Queen at the Temple in LV-223. We saw an Xenomorph looking creature indeed, but not a Queen. At least not in the type we saw in Aliens. If so, Davids part in this whole game might be that he introduced an actual living cycle of the animal. Eggs laying, facehugging, hatching... hunting... before David they were unorganized mutations, - sort of like he used them/it in Covenant.

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What if we try like this: David learned that the incubation should take longer to ensure better spread. Like a virus. The faster it kills its host the poorer its chances of spread. David want to perfect his creation and to infect the universe...

Let us imagine that in fact the whole world of the Engineers is long gone. Destroyed by their own ingenuity thousand of years ago by the black goo .... sort of what we learned in Prometheus.

The Engineer type people destroyed by David in Covenant were the last remains of a lost civilization. Explains why they seemed to be so primitive.

Now David will go on an adventure with our sleeping colony and try an perfect his eggs...on these adventures he will crash or escape or whatever, but he will end on LV-426 somehow...

Here he finds a crashed ancient ship of the Engineers that we see in Alien (1979). And he will start his hive egg production in the already fallen ship... as the planet offers little else. The fossilized Space Jockey was blown from its chest in Alien (1979)..... so maybe David experimented on its biological remains ... creating the egg laying queen we later see in Aliens (1986)..

[In Planet of the Apes (1968) one of the Astronauts (a sexy lady) instantly aged when they opened her malfunctioned sleep camper... perhaps, something similar happens to the dead Space Jokey, making him appear fossilized... or perhaps even fossilized bio remains would be enough to David]

Ind comes Alien (1979). He blocks their radios so they cannot talk to Nostradamus and just watches them from a distance.... role credits.

End credit scene: further more he hereafter cloaks the fallen spaceship, so he knows it will not be detected in case humans would later want to inhabit LV 426.... the reason why it was not found before it was too late in Aliens (1986)...

The above may work? Not very exciting though.

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