MovieChat Forums > The Blair Witch Project (1999) Discussion > I really hate to raise the prospect of s...

I really hate to raise the prospect of sexism, but...


...I see so much unjustified blaming of, dislike for, and annoyance with Heather's character that I'm really starting to suspect that there is a sexist element to it.

I honestly don't see where she did anything wrong in this film. I think the main thing that most people will point to is that there's an appearance that she's bυllshıtting about knowing where she was going and that she got them lost. I will repeat what I wrote in another thread on this matter...

While this may be the case, it's impossible to know for sure given that they were apparently not walking through normal time and space. The fact is that, under normal circumstances, she may very well have been directing them in the right direction. When that didn't pan out as expected, she may have been confused but still confident that she knew the right way to go. It eventually became undeniable that they were lost, at which point she may have believed she screwed up, but again, she may have indeed known the way and therefore her confidence and insistence that they weren't lost at the time were justified. Had the witch not interfered with their reality, she may have directed them exactly as anticipated.

A key moment in the dialogue is when they're trying to find the graveyard on the second day and Mike says to Heather, "Let me tell you what you said to us, 'It's like two miles away. Then it's like two hours away, three hours away...'" This might sound contradictory, but it really isn't. Anyone who has hiked in the woods knows how long it can take to cover ground. It's not the same as walking down the street. You're going up and down hills, stepping carefully over rocks and roots and all manner of debris, crossing streams, all with a big, bulky pack on your back. Under certain terrain conditions, two miles can easily take two hours. Furthermore, judging by the crude look of the map, it's even more understandable that these notions of distance and location were fairly imprecise to begin with, so what looked to be about two miles on the map could have potentially been three or even four, depending on the paths taken (and bear in mind that they're not walking on trails at this point, so that opens up the possibility for meandering which would add even more time). Again, anyone who's done any considerable hiking knows how notoriously shıtty maps are of even well-established trails. A map of some obscure backwoods that nobody really goes into would likely be even worse.

Another reason people probably feel justified in laying blame on her is when she confesses to being responsible for everything in her solitary apology segment:

I just want to apologize to Mike's mom, Josh's mom, and my mom. And I'm sorry to everyone. I was very naive. I am so so sorry for everything that has happened. Because in spite of what Mike says now, it is my fault. Because it was my project and I insisted. I insisted on everything. I insisted that we weren't lost. I insisted that we keep going. I insisted that we walk south. Everything had to be my way. And this is where we've ended up and it's all because of me that we're here now - hungry, cold, and hunted. I love you mom, dad. I am so sorry.
She takes responsibility for leading them into this whole nightmare, which she did, but obviously she's not at fault for that because who could have had any reasonable expectation that things would happen like they did. I think the key sentence in here is when she says, "I insisted that we weren't lost." This might appear to some an admission that she didn't know what she was doing and kept it a secret. Again, while this might in fact be the case, we have no way of knowing that based on what we're shown. She could have known perfectly well what she was doing and where she was going, but had no chance of success due to the supernatural influences. At this point, she's been completely broken down mentally and still doesn't fully understand what's going on, but in light of the absolute nightmare that she's dragged these two guys into, she feels responsible and extremely guilty. Even though she may have not done anything wrong, the bottom line is that they were there in that situation because of her and she felt responsible for that. That's a sign of a conscience and is, in my opinion, a testament to her character.

So, perhaps the negativity towards Heather is a lack of understanding of the things I pointed out above, but to me, that only explains it to a certain degree. I definitely sense a deep, intrinsic dislike of her as a person. My theory for this is that she's a woman who's in charge of men. I think whenever a woman attempts to exert control or authority over a man, some people just have a deep, immediate, reflexive negative response. They're seen as bossy and/or arrogant, whereas if a man were to do the exact same thing in the exact same situation, he would be seen as taking charge, remaining confident in the face of adversity, and being a strong leader. There is definitely a double standard when it comes to this. I'm not saying this is the root of why everyone dislikes her, but I strongly believe that it's the reason for a large proportion of it.

Personally, I really liked her. Assuming she wasn't lying about knowing where she was going, I find no fault in anything she did. Furthermore, she seemed like a really intelligent, fun, engaging person.

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It's not sexism if someone with a penis had done the exact same things & been called out for it.
Take for example Cloverfield, with the jack@$$ lead with the camera phone - is it sexist that I want to punch him in the mouth also?
I never had problem with her actions, it was her constant reactions which annoyed me. Sticking cameras in faces, chewing ppl out, taking stands on lies, etc. She was a poor director/documentarian.

...my essential 50 http://www.imdb.com/list/ls056413299/

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I haven't seen Cloverfield so I have no idea how that guy compares to Heather.

OK, you had a problem with her obsessive filming/documenting of events. Fair enough.

Can you elaborate, though, on her "chewing people out"? I don't remember her hardly ever doing that. In fact, I remember it was mostly her getting chewed out for her filming and for the perception that she didn't know where she was going.

Also, what does "taking stands on lies" mean?

As for her being a poor director/documentarian, what do you base that on? She never got the chance to finish her project.

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Whenever Josh or Mike called her on her wrongness, she kept spinning & spinning how she wasn't to blame at all.

I can't stand ppl like that, no matter which genitalia they're rockin'.

...my essential 50 http://www.imdb.com/list/ls056413299/

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TwoThousandOneMark:

Whenever Josh or Mike called her on her wrongness, she kept spinning & spinning how she wasn't to blame at all. I can't stand ppl like that, no matter which genitalia they're rockin'.
You can't stand people who defend themselves against false accusations?

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yes the above poster has serious control ans social issues

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You have serious spelling issues.

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"The Buck Stops Here"

Simply put: Heather was in charge. Many people believe that with authority comes responsibility for the outcome of one's decisions, intentional or otherwise. Nobody cares about her sex. Only her choices.

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OK, and what were her choices? Please elaborate.

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You've clearly seen the film and have already elaborated on many of her choices. No assistance is needed. My point is NOT that folk can and will disagree with you regarding whether her decisions worked out for good or ill, but RATHER that as team leader she ultimately bears responsibility for the outcome of her investigation. If the documentary were successful and had earned an A+ in film class, we'd be praising her ... however she and her documentary crew were killed, hence the criticism. Arguments about sex/gender/whatever are diversions from the issue, which is Heather's judgment. People need to consider not only the intent and apparent reasonableness of their choices at the time they make them but their consequences (or potential consequences) as well. I would say that her mistake was leading three people to a remote forest in pursuit of an alleged murderous supernatural entity. You might say that she couldn't have possibly expected to encounter the Blair Witch and therefore misinterpreted the level of danger. However, she and her crew DID actually cross paths with the witch and everyone died. So it turns out that was a bad decision, lol.

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Geosci: First of all, that is not the problem that the vast majority of people have with her. I've never heard anyone say, basically, that she was stupid for going into the woods because she should have anticipated that the Blair Witch was real and that they were going to be caught in some kind of death spiral. That is absurd. Also, by that logic, how are the other two any less responsible for their predicament? They knew the legend as well and went along willingly. Just because it was Heather's project and she was in charge doesn't mean they had to go along. What an absurd blame to lay on her shoulders. And I think it's irrelevant anyway because, like I said, I've never heard anyone make that criticism of her.

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I've heard that criticism. Your results may vary.

Absurdity is a matter of perspective. I believe people who go looking for something, no matter how unlikely, if dangerous, ought to have controls in place for its encounter. As we've seen, arguing that Heather "was stupid for going into the woods because she should have anticipated that the Blair Witch was real and that they were going to be caught in some kind of death spiral" would NOT have been absurd because it's exactly what happened. Anyone making this argument would have been 100% correct.

As for her culpability, individuals in positions of authority are held accountable for the endeavors in their care. If a corporation goes bankrupt, the CEO is blamed; if a ship sinks, the captain is blamed; if a country goes to war, the president is blamed. The buck stops somewhere. Generally with authority. Ergo, Heather was in charge so she takes credit for the outcome of her documentary. In this case: everyone died. What's absurd is the notion that anyone cares about her vagina! She's criticized because she was team leader and her team wound up dead.

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OK, let's put aside the matter of whether or not this argument represents a substantial amount of the criticism and vitriol directed toward her. On this matter, I just plain disagree.

I believe people who go looking for something, no matter how unlikely, if dangerous, ought to have controls in place for its encounter.
She was not looking to encounter or interact with the witch. She was just going into the woods to document the legend. I don't believe she actually believed in it. Therefore, it's not fair to say that she should have been prepared to actually deal with the witch.

It'd be like if I told you not to go to a certain restaurant tomorrow because a black hole is going to open up under the building and swallow you up into the depths of hell. You disregard my warnings as nonsense, go to the restaurant anyway, and a black hole does indeed open and swallow you up. Would you characterize yourself as stupid for going and disregarding what any reasonable person would disregard as nonsense?

Also, you don't really address the absolution of the other two's responsibility in this. Again, they know as much as Heather about what they're getting themselves into. The fact that it's Heather's project is irrelevant when it comes to this matter. It's not like before they agreed to do this they got some kind of assurance from Heather that she had a plan to deal with any kind of supernatural shıt that may arise. If, as you're implying, there was responsibility there to be prepared to deal with the supernatural, the other two were just as unconcerned as her. I wouldn't fault any of them with that because they never believed any of that shıt was possible.

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I don't see it as a question of belief so much as one of preparation. You needn't consider all possibilities equally plausible in order to control for them. Just forethought. Heather was circumspect regarding the witch. Remember that Josh asked her whether she believed or not and her response was "I don't know" while looking around the forest with suspicion. So she at least considered the possibility. As for the restaurant, I wouldn't feel stupid for ignoring your warnings UNTIL my wiener was being spaghettified by the black hole, at which point I'd feel like an idiot. Because you'd have been 100% right and - had I listened to your admonition - I would still be alive. But black holes in restaurants have no precedent whereas the Black Hills Forest has a long history of disappearances and deaths, so the danger is evident even if people with contrary views of the supernatural would debate its source. Now Josh and Mike made the choice to enter those woods too, however my point is that the blame you see directed at Heather is the result of her authority, not her sex. She was the team leader and the team died. An aspect of leadership is accepting responsibility for the outcome of your endeavors. If she deserves praise for success then she deserves criticism for failure. Nobody cares that she's a woman, they care that her idea got three people killed.

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Heather was circumspect regarding the witch. Remember that Josh asked her whether she believed or not and her response was "I don't know" while looking around the forest with suspicion.
That's a good point. I didn't put much significance to that. This makes it a tricky thing for me as, since I firmly believe that this supernatural business is not possible, I couldn't possibly fault someone for not taking it seriously, and to do so seems really absurd to me. But, yeah, you're right in the sense that, in this world where this shıt is actually possible, if she also believed it was possible, she does bear responsibility for not taking it seriously.

I still assert, though, that this is not what the vast majority of the criticism directed at her is based upon. It's mostly people criticizing her personality, that she's annoying, as well as the things I pointed out in the initial post. I feel very strongly that, had all the other elements of the story been exactly the same, there wouldn't be nearly as much backlash against her had she been more quiet, acquiescent, and demure.

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Absurdity is a matter of perspective. I believe people who go looking for something, no matter how unlikely, if dangerous, ought to have controls in place for its encounter. As we've seen, arguing that Heather "was stupid for going into the woods because she should have anticipated that the Blair Witch was real and that they were going to be caught in some kind of death spiral" would NOT have been absurd because it's exactly what happened.


It's quite obvious from the outset that Heather does not really believe in the Blair Witch for at least the first third of the film. She completely blows off Mary Brown as a nut job even though she was relaying her encounter with the witch and doesn't even really listen to what she has to say, later in the film we hear her cussing herself for not paying attention to the story about "a pile of rocks". Heather is out there primarily to make a film based on her current studies and get an A in the process. She had absolutely no idea that they would encounter the messed up situation they find themselves in and hence was not prepared or had adequate "controls in place".

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it is just sexism a lot of men and woman hate strong woman for some sick twisted reason related to their own insecurity

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Yeah, you definitely have more than just serious spelling issues.

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Just re watched it for the first time in years. Yep her voice is still highly annoying. And I'm a 36 year old female. So it's not sexist.

Her character is highly irritating.

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[deleted]

I see what you're saying. everyone keeps saying that "no one cares about her gender, it's her attitude, voice, actions, i would hate her either way", but I don't think it's that simple. I really do think that people subconsciously have less patience for aggressive, stubborn or controlling women than men who act like that. As the leader who lead her team to ruin (beyond her control), she might naturally not be the favorite. But I think it's possible that people would have minded her a lot less, been more patient with the character or just had more sympathy or appreciation for an argumentative male character with confidence and hubris who eventually admits his mistakes. It's a lot like how a male character is widely seen as a pussy for the same vulnerabilities you see in female leads. I don't think anyone means to, likability and gender is really subconscious.

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It's just a movie, alright? It's not a casus for a discussion about how men apparently can't deal when a woman is in charge.

They are fictional characters and not real people, so why don't you shut this 'sexism' topic down please and stop ruining this amazing, cult-classic movie for everybody. It's not real life, okay?

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GillesD:

It's just a movie, alright? It's not a casus for a discussion about how men apparently can't deal when a woman is in charge.

They are fictional characters and not real people, so why don't you shut this 'sexism' topic down please and stop ruining this amazing, cult-classic movie for everybody. It's not real life, okay?
I know they are fictional characters and it's not real, but the reactions that I'm referring to are real and can be indicative of underlying sentiments, beliefs, attitudes, etc. I'm sorry you can't see that this is something worthy of discussion.

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Unfortunately, your argument hinges on the fact that you, personally, don't think Heather was to blame. This in turn hinges on the idea that they were being messed with by supernatural forces.

Both of these are completely subjective. We don't know what Heather knew, and we have no real idea of how experienced a hiker or navigator she was. She could have known exactly where she was going and been genuinely confused when the terrain didn't match the map; or she could have been completely clueless about the route, and lying through her teeth the whole time. You can interpret it either way, since the film offers no real proof of one or the other (Heather's tearful, snot-nosed "confession" notwithstanding). Similarly, the film never actually confirms that the witch is screwing around with time and space, or even suggests it - that's just a fan theory that's sprung up in the years since it was released, with no solid evidence to support it. It would certainly explain a lot but, again, it's open to interpretation. So while you may not think Heather was at fault (and that's a perfectly valid opinion) other people might interpret events differently and believe that she was.

I'm not saying there aren't people out there who might dislike Heather for sexist reasons. And I know there are people who dislike her because they find her annoying or abrasive (she is, a bit, but so are the two men). But depending on how people view the events of the film, there's no reason to assume those are the only reasons to dislike her.

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In Curse of the blair witch they did hint at it somewhat though when they said the tapes were found beneath the foundation of the house and all the layers of dirt and leaves had not been disturbed in anyway or something like that but since its not in the actual movie I don't really think that should count for much. The townspeople said the house was burned down during the beginning of the movie so them coming across it at the end does sort of hint at it whether you want to take it that way or not, unless the witch is just making it appear to them but I don't know why that would be necessary either so who knows.

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MrRazorz:

Unfortunately, your argument hinges on the fact that you, personally, don't think Heather was to blame. This in turn hinges on the idea that they were being messed with by supernatural forces.

...the film never actually confirms that the witch is screwing around with time and space, or even suggests it - that's just a fan theory that's sprung up in the years since it was released, with no solid evidence to support it.
I completely disagree. There may not be rock solid evidence proving the witch was screwing with reality, but it's highly, highly suggested that she was when, after walking south for the entire day, they ended up back at the exact same spot. It's possible that she was so completely incompetent that she couldn't read a compass, or that she was so irresponsible/thoughtless/lackadaisical that she just didn't bother to check it all that much (or something?...not sure how else you explain this) despite the fact that she was incredibly desperate and motivated to get out of the situation at that point, but that really does strain belief to the breaking point. Also, how do you explain their finding Parr's house when it had burned down years before?
I'm not saying there aren't people out there who might dislike Heather for sexist reasons. And I know there are people who dislike her because they find her annoying or abrasive (she is, a bit, but so are the two men). But depending on how people view the events of the film, there's no reason to assume those are the only reasons to dislike her.
I never said that sexism is the only reason why people would have a problem with Heather. I only bring this up as a means to try to understand/explain what I perceive as an outsize amount of dislike for her. If there were just a few people here and there that expressed this, I wouldn't have thought twice. It's just the overwhelming amount of it that makes me think something deeper is at play.

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There may not be rock solid evidence proving the witch was screwing with reality, but it's highly, highly suggested that she was when, after walking south for the entire day, they ended up back at the exact same spot.
No, it's just been interpreted that way. The film itself doesn't offer any explanations, or even suggest one. It just presents the situation that they're hopelessly lost and going around in circles. Then someone came along and went "Hey, I bet the witch is messing with them!"


It's possible that she was so completely incompetent that she couldn't read a compass, or that she was so irresponsible/thoughtless/lackadaisical that she just didn't bother to check it all that much
...or the compass was broken, or the terrain got so rough and the woods so thick they had to detour or backtrack and got turned around, or Heather just wasn't the outdoorsman she thought she was.

Also, how do you explain their finding Parr's house when it had burned down years before?
Easy. That wasn't Parr's house.

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It wasn't Parr's house? It just happened to be an old house in those woods with a bunch of childrens' hand prints all over the walls, eh? And Mike just happened to feel like standing in the corner of the basement after running down there in a panic and ignoring Heather's cries because, what? He found something really interesting stuck in the wall over there? And Heather instantaneously drops her camera and goes completely silent because she just naturally passed out or something?

Really, your insistence that these supernatural things weren't even suggested is ridiculous to the point that I suspect you're trolling.

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To clarify:

Yes, there was (probably) something supernatural going on. They were being stalked by a witch, or ghost, or some other evil entity that harassed them, kidnapped one of them and used him to lure the other two to their doom. The same entity messed with Russell Parr in the 1940s, leading him to kidnap and murder children, and Mike and Heather's final moments were basically a re-enactment of Parr's method of killing (which he may have inherited from the witch).

However, there's no indication anywhere that their being lost in the woods was due to magical interference. Again, that was an idea that fans came up with afterwards. It's a cool idea, I admit, but there's just not enough evidence for it to be taken as canon, or used as the basis for an argument. Going by the clues that were actually presented in the film, they got as lost as they did because Heather was overconfident about her navigating skills, and Mike had a hissy fit and threw the map away.

As for the house they ended up in: it could have been Parr's house, but it didn't have to be. When I watched the film in '99, it never occurred to me that it was Parr's house. I made the connection between Mike standing in the corner and the way Parr used to kill kids, but that could have happened anywhere.

But on the other hand, it's worth noting that Parr's house being burned down is never mentioned in the movie. It's from the promotional material. So while we could consider it canon, it's not really a plot point in the actual story being told. Take that as you will.

Really, your insistence that these supernatural things weren't even suggested is ridiculous to the point that I suspect you're trolling.
No, I'm just disagreeing with you. There's more than one interpretation of the film, and just because I don't accept yours doesn't mean I'm "trolling". I'm not even dismissing your interpretation - like I said, it's a cool idea, and one of the better fan theories. I'm just saying it's not well-supported enough to be assumed as fact, or used as the basis of an argument about Heather's character.

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Thanks for the clarification. I thought you were arguing that there was nothing supernatural at all being suggested in the movie. I guess we'll just have to agree to disagree about whether or not the movie suggests that reality was being messed with in order to keep them from escaping the woods. To me it's heavily suggested and not just a fan theory (that was my immediate thought the moment they arrived back at that same log), but you're right in that there's no proof. It would be interesting to take a poll and see how many of the people who have a negative opinion of Heather believe in the warped reality theory, thereby potentially absolving her of that responsibility.

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I'm with the original post...I always felt that the anger and dislike toward Heather was sexist. She was clearly the leader of the three and kind of in charge of the guys. She was aggressive, assertive and smart. For those reasons, she was disliked. Had she been in charge of a group of women no one would have disliked her.

Only females will understand this deeply intuitive feeling of sexism. Men simply don't and can't feel it, thus they won't agree with the claim. Plain and simple.

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Heather seemed alright until it became apparent to her and her team that all was not right within the woods, and by that time all three were showing the less appealing aspects of their personalities.

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Men can see it when it exists which in this case it didn't, you're just being a crybaby wanna be feminist idiot like most "nasty women" these days. Women in this day and age disgust me with their man hate BS when only a sub section of guys are misogynists and the rest are just people with a strong moral compass and won't let some woman boss them around and dictate what they say or do. Enjoy your cats and life long loneliness with that BS attitude.

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silverponygirl:

Only females will understand this deeply intuitive feeling of sexism. Men simply don't and can't feel it, thus they won't agree with the claim. Plain and simple.
Well, I'm a male and I'm the one who started this thread!

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I have to agree with you jevicci, there is definitely an underlying hint of sexism in the harsh judgement of Heather by many that they don't even consciously realise. I strongly believe that a male with exactly the same traits as her would not cop half as much flack as she has.

There's a lot of talk about her annoying voice, personality etc. I didn't find her annoying and there was nothing aggravating about her voice or behaviour for the most part (her wanting to film Josh when he was crying was probably the only moment when I thought she crossed the line). She did have a propensity to use sarcasm a lot, but so did the guys, and she came across to me as a very confident, reasonably intelligent young woman who finds herself in a completely unexpected, messed up situation. She was there to complete a film project as part of her study and that was her primary goal from the outset. Never in her wildest dreams did she imagine what they were walking into. That's the beauty of this film.


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Exactly. I felt the exact same way as you regarding her belief in the Blair Witch, but Geosci did raise a good point when pointing out the following scene.

Josh: So what's up, I mean what's your take on the Blair Witch at this point?

Heather: I don't know.

Josh: Do you think she exists?

Heather: I don't know.
One could argue that her being open to the possibility that the Blair Witch was real makes her responsible to some degree for what happened. I don't know. Personally, I have a hard time with this for the reasons I explained earlier. But I honestly think that's irrelevant because that's not the one of the problems people have with her that I'm addressing here. I think the vast majority of people (like myself) don't hold her responsible for leading them into a situation of supernatural danger because they (again, like myself) don't believe in the supernatural.

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*Spoilers*

I like Heather, and I like Mike and Josh as well. I don't think that everybody who hates a female character is sexist, though. I know that's not what you said so I'm sorry if it sounded like it. I'm a female and I was accused of being a sexist once on the Pirates of the Caribbean message boards because I didn't like the character of Elizabeth Swann, and found her very selfish. I do really like Keira Knightley, though. She's one of my favorite actresses, actually.

Back to the Blair Witch Project, though. Heather seemed like a warm, genuine person, and she took responsibility for what happened because it was her project. It wasn't her fault, though, because she didn't know that the Witch was real. She was a professional hiker, and probably studied the area closely. It was the Witch that prevented them from leaving, so no, I don't blame Heather at all.

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You're talking straight out of your ass.

If you're wondering why Mike and Josh dislike and blame her, it's pretty obvious. It was her project and she was in charge. Who else are they gonna blame when they got lost? A supernatural being??? Eventually Mike assured her it was NOT her fault.

I don't think there's one viewer who "blames" Heather for what happened. As for disliking her, she does have an annoying, haughty and confrontational way of speaking (like when she whined about her shoes getting wet) and her screams were also irritating. I say this as a woman, it has nothing to do with sexism and not liking a woman to be in charge of men.

And by the way, she DID lie about knowing where they were going. It was very clear that at some point she had no clue either.

Now sit down.

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If you're wondering why Mike and Josh dislike and blame her, it's pretty obvious.

I'm not wondering why Mike and Josh dislike and blame her. This post is about viewers of the film disliking her.

I don't think there's one viewer who "blames" Heather for what happened.

I guess you didn't read this thread because someone here claims she's responsible for what happened, but as I said in response to that, I don't believe this is the main problem people have with her. It's more what you yourself have expressed when you say "she does have an annoying, haughty and confrontational way of speaking". That's really interesting that you say that as a woman yourself. Honestly, I don't know what you're talking about. I didn't get that vibe from her at all. So she whined a tiny bit about her shoes getting wet. Big deal. Mike had a hissy fit and threw the map away, an infinitely more egregious act, yet he doesn't get even a tiny fraction of the hatred and vitriol that Heather gets.

And by the way, she DID lie about knowing where they were going.

While that is possible, there's no way to say that with any certainty. I go into this in detail above if you're interested.

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"I guess you didn't read this thread because someone here claims she's responsible for what happened"

You need to read your own thread again, because nobody "blamed" her. Like I said, only Mike and Josh blamed her, which is understandable.

"That's really interesting that you say that as a woman yourself"

And why is that interesting? I merely mentioned that fact to point out that my opinion has nothing to do with her sex. You're saying it should???

"Mike had a hissy fit and threw the map away, an infinitely more egregious act, yet he doesn't get even a tiny fraction of the hatred and vitriol that Heather gets."

People already explained this to you, Heather was in charge and responsible for most of the decisions. Sure, Mike threw away the map, but he wasn't as annoying as Heather.

"I go into this in detail above if you're interested."

Yeah, and that was just you grasping at straws. Just like you deciding for other people why they dislike a character you like. You can't say for certainty it's because of sexism, so why even bring it up? You're forcing people to defend themselves against a totally random accusation just because they have a different opinion than you.

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You need to read your own thread again, because nobody "blamed" her.

I'm referring to Geosci's post near the top of the thread. They were saying that much of the dislike of Heather is due to her being responsible for what happened. That's not blaming her?

And why is that interesting? I merely mentioned that fact to point out that my opinion has nothing to do with her sex. You're saying it should???

Nope. Everyone's entitled to their opinions. I just find it interesting is all.

People already explained this to you, Heather was in charge and responsible for most of the decisions. Sure, Mike threw away the map, but he wasn't as annoying as Heather.

This goes back to the issue of people blaming her. How can you say people are justified in disliking her because she was in charge and for the decisions she made, but no one's blaming her? "Sure, Mike did, by far, the most dangerous, irresponsible, and reckless thing in the movie, but Heather was still more annoying." OK, that's your opinion and you're entitled to it. It just doesn't make any sense to me.

Yeah, and that was just you grasping at straws. Just like you deciding for other people why they dislike a character you like. You can't say for certainty it's because of sexism, so why even bring it up? You're forcing people to defend themselves against a totally random accusation just because they have a different opinion than you.

How did I decide anything for anyone? I'm just speculating. I don't think it's random at all. It seems very relevant and even likely to me. Why bring it up? Because this is a discussion board and that's what it's for. People are free to disagree and bring up counterpoints. Do you always browbeat people for bringing up things that you disagree with?

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"That's not blaming her?"

Nope, that's just saying that as the leader of the team she receives the brunt of the criticism. She did do most of the decisionmaking which was not always the wisest. The BLAME lies with the witch, of course.

"I just find it interesting is all."

I don't see how the sex of any poster here is interesting unless you enjoy being prejudiced.

"Because this is a discussion board and that's what it's for."

You want to invite people to a discussion by making preconceived assumptions about them? Why not simply ask why they react differently to Heather?

"Do you always browbeat people for bringing up things that you disagree with?"

No, that seems to be your speciality...

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...as the leader of the team she receives the brunt of the criticism. She did do most of the decisionmaking which was not always the wisest.

So what are you criticizing her for? What decisions did she make that were "not the wisest"?

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Like I and others have already pointed out, she acted like she knew where they were going. She admits this herself, so there's no reason for you to deny it.

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And that goes back to my original post explaining that she could very well have had every reason to believe she did know where they were going when she was making that claim. You can't say for sure that she was lying about that (even though you emphatically did so).

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Yes, I can be sure, she says it herself (admitting it's her "fault", because she "insisted" they weren't lost). You only choose to believe otherwise because of your ridiculous assertion that everybody blames her because of sexism.

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It's obvious you're not really paying attention to what I'm saying and since I have no desire to go around in circles repeating things or correcting you on matters that I've explicitly laid about above, I think we're done here.

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Lol, people don't agree with you, so they just don't get it?

I know perfectly well what you're saying, and it's something the movie never even suggests and only exists in your head because it supports your argument that Heather did nothing wrong and people are just sexist for thinking otherwise.

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