in where I can't exactly remember, Dickie and Freddie were listening to jazz, Dickie told Tom they (Dickie and Freddie, that is) were going somewhere later but didn't exactly invite Tom, mostly sent him on his way under the name "sightseeing".
Was that simply because Dickie was kind of getting sick of Tom at that point or did it have another meaning?
>> there. i said it. <<
I think that was pretty much it. He was starting to get bored of Tom and he had another friend that could replace him.
shareI think Feddie had an immediate dislike/mistrust of Tom and I think he had an influence on Dickie's change in attitude. I'm thinking the first thing Freddie judged him on was the corduroy jacket....thinking "oh no way a Princeton guy would wear that jacket.". It's what Dickie had been willing to help him change until Freddie came along. Also, Dickie later questioned Tom about Princeton when they were in San Remo.
Reallly, I had a different take. I know in Purple Moon, Freddie disliked Tom instantly but, in this version he was cordial at first. By the time Freddie came along, Dickie had already began to tire of Tom and the first snarky remark from Freddie was at breakfast, the morning after Dickie caught Tom dancing in his clothes. I got the impression, Dickie had spoken unfavorably of Tom, which led Freddie to become suspicious of him. Of course Tom's weird behavior fueled it.
shareFreddie disliked Tom at the first sight.
shareFreddie was never really cordial to Tom. When he first meets him he gives him a very quick hello and then saunters off with Dickie.
shareThat's the way I saw it. On the train to Rome Dickey was making plans with Tom, such as buying him a new jacket. I think those plans were genuine, why else would he have brought Tom along? While in the record store Freddie must have made some comment to Dickie like "Who is this guy? Why are you hanging out with him?" That would have made Dickie have second thoughts about Tom. It also proves what Marge said, Dickie will lavish his attention on you until someone better comes along, then he forgets you. That's exactly what happened with Tom.
shareI think Feddie had an immediate dislike/mistrust of Tom and I think he had an influence on Dickie's change in attitude. I'm thinking the first thing Freddie judged him on was the corduroy jacket....thinking "oh no way a Princeton guy would where that jacket.". It's what Dickie had been willing to help him change until Freddie came along. Also, Dickie later questioned Tom about Princeton when they were in San Remo.
Yes, Dickie was getting tired of `the leach ` . Furthermore, he was obviously very different from the bond and interests that Dickie and Freddy shared and was showing. He began to ruin the enjoyment of the two guys by sticking out. Around Freddy, more than everyone else, he was an outsider who didn't belong. Marge overlooked it because she felt sorry for him, Meredith lived in her fantasy world and Peter knew and loved him because of it.
sharewell said
shareI agree with everyone's post. I'll elaborate and go on to say the clincher was when he told Dickie to not be late for the train (and Freddie and him made fun of Tom, and the subsequent scene when Dickie walks in on Tom dancing homosexually in his clothes).
I think Freddie definitely helped shape Dickies perspective on Tom.
Seeing Tom dancing to his own odd music also got Dickie thinking that Tom didn't really like Jazz at all and saw that Tom went to a lot trouble with his ruse by "accidentally" dropping all those Jazz records.
Yep definitely. I also believe that Dickie figured out the ruse of "accidentially" dropping the jazz records as soon as he saw Tom dancing to classical music or whatever the hell that was.
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S you in your A's, don't wear a C, and J all over your B's.
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the song was "May I" by Bing Crosby. It possibly still counts as "jazz", and would be in that section in the few music stores that are still left, however, it wouldn't be Dickie's kind of jazz. It's definitely more on the "easy listening" side - actually, in the 40s/50s it would possibly just be considered a pop song.
shareTom looking bored and annoyed when Dickie and Freddie were listening to (presumably new) jazz records earlier may have been the first sign, but yeah, this would have clinched it!
share[deleted]
I agree with you. I knew it was weird when he was prancing around in dickies clothing and slippers. Do you know what kind of slippers those were I have been trying to find a pair like that just havnt had any luck, very nice slippers!
shareThose weren't slippers, they were highly polished black tuxedo dress shoes. Recall Tom was wearing Dickie's tux, bow tie and shirt, white boxers and the tux dress shoes, prancing around with the Fred Astaire top hat, and Dickie busts him and comments 'you're wearing my shoes too?'...
shareThose weren't slippers, they were highly polished black tuxedo dress shoes.Of course they were! Even TOM managed to educate himself about such matters. Gosh what plebes people are now. Or rubes. Plebes and rubes. Slippers, indeed. share
Tom dancing homosexuallyGdub: I keep running into this issue with posters on this board... How does a person dance "homosexually", especially by oneself? share
Dickie liked attention from both men and women, but he was truly repelled when he realised that Tom was actually gay and was living with him. When Freddie arrived, Dickie retreated into the coarse male heterosexual world that Freddie epitomised. He would not have wanted Freddie to class him in the same way as Tom, through his association with Tom.
shareDickie liked attention from both men and women, but he was truly repelled when he realised that Tom was actually gay and was living with him.
My view is based on Dickie's very hostile reaction when Tom suggested joining him in the bath.
share"My view is based on Dickie's very hostile reaction when Tom suggested joining him in the bath."
Very hostile? He just told him no, as any straight guy would if some fag wanted to get in the bath with him.
It wasn't a casual friendly 'no'; far from it. Dickie gave Tom a look of pure hate, when he realised how Tom had deceived him. Gay come-ons would have been nothing new to Dickie, but he would not have invited Tom to move in with him had he known Tom's agenda.
shareWell, we'll have to agree to disagree. I didn't see it as a look of pure hate but more as a look of "are you being serious?"
shareNo,he gave him an ambigous look,it is Jude Law after all,goodlooking guy with feminine features. It was just a friendly no...he didn´t even register,being so self-obsessed. You think he would stand there nude and slap Tom with the towel if he was repulsed and disgusted?
On the boat,when peeping Tom tries to lecture him,he says"That evening when we played chess for instance,it was obvious!" Dickie is just baffled"What evening??" and just looks confused. Connecting a dot. Dickie was perceptive,smart,putting the pieces together but too in love with himself and proud over having found Tom out as a Jazz and Princeton-fraud. Too narcississtic to see the real danger.
And no,he hadn´t tired of Tom yet,it was when he came home and saw psycho-queer dancing in his clothes...that was the thing that set the rejection in motion. Dickie is polite in the musicstore,being a bit embarrassed of blowing Tom off. He just wanted to spend some time with his old buddy Freddie...why anyone would is beyond me. And watch the scene again.Freddie laughs but Dickie is straightfaced and doesn´t insult Tom. Says he even can borrow his Jacket,saying"Come on!" He hadn´t tired yet,too bad for him....
My opinion has always been that Dickie is a quintessential snob. He knows that Tom is not and was never a part of his social crowd. Tom doesn't have any money to buy clothes, he can't ski, he has no taste, no natural charisma or charm. Tom is boring and low-class and it shows to someone who surrounds himself with a higher social class of people - past and present. When Dickie found Tom dancing in his clothes to music that would never be on his radar, his growing suspicions were validated.
I think SausagePourVous is right about the bathroom scene:
"No,he gave him an ambigous look,it is Jude Law after all,goodlooking guy with feminine features. It was just a friendly no...he didn´t even register,being so self-obsessed. You think he would stand there nude and slap Tom with the towel if he was repulsed and disgusted?
On the boat,when peeping Tom tries to lecture him,he says"That evening when we played chess for instance,it was obvious!" Dickie is just baffled"What evening??" and just looks confused. Connecting a dot. Dickie was perceptive,smart,putting the pieces together but too in love with himself and proud over having found Tom out as a Jazz and Princeton-fraud. Too narcississtic to see the real danger."
Superb take on the scene, SausagePourVous. Wherever you are.
shareI agree with this. Also, Freddie seemed to immediately recognize that Tom didn't 'belong', something Dickie was starting to doubt himself.
I'll take Punctuality
Actually Dickie knew it all along and was playing with Tom. When Freddie arrived, Dickie was tired of the game - or even earlier - and just kicked Tom out. He didn't need him anymore, he had fun with Freddie now. Different reasons but nevertheless...
Will Graham: I don't find you that interesting.
Hannibal Lecter: You will.
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Actually Dickie knew it all along and was playing with Tom.
I'm not sure about this. There are two episodes which make Dickie begin to question Tom. First, when Dickie catches Tom dressed up in his clothes, and then the bath tub scene. The purpose of these scenes seems to be to show that Dickie is increasingly doubtful of Tom's authenticity and sexuality.
Watch the look of distrust and anger Dickie immediately gives Tom at 32:45 when Tom suggests getting into the bath with Dickie. Homosexual come-ons are an old story for someone as magnetic and good-looking as Dickie. But he is utterly repelled, and angry at having been deceived so thoroughly by Tom.
http://www.alluc.com/l/The-Talented-Mr-Ripley/p2e7166
I don't think he liked it but it was no reason for him to throw Tom out obviously or he would have done it. He did it when Freddie arrived.
In my eyes there are two aspects:
1. there's some sort of dependence for lack of a better word. It's almost like Dickie is ashamed Freddie knows he spent time with Tom.
2. he wasn't fooled by Tom, not for a long time anyways. He knew Tom lied but he liked the idea to play with him. And just like spoilt kids do, threw away his toy when something better came along ---> Freddie.
Will Graham: I don't find you that interesting.
Hannibal Lecter: You will.
****
Good points, not only is Dickie spoiled rotten but he's very charismatic and therefore his ego is off the charts. He makes everyone around him feel better about themselves in his presence, and that's a very powerful hand.
I don't read a whole lot into Dickie's reaction to things. He toys with people, and Tom was a interesting diversion for a short time, but he was growing boring, and as soon as Tom became clingy, it was over.
As I said earlier, I think it s debatable point as to exactly when Dickie grew weary of Tom. Dickie may have doubted Tom's authenticity from the beginning, as he bet Marge that he never went to Princeton at all, but why would that stop him from having some fun? It seemed that Dickie was titillated at Tom's impression of his father AND the idea that his dad would send an errand boy to Italy to fetch him, and that bought Tom a short respite.
I'll take Punctuality
I think we agree.
Will Graham: I don't find you that interesting.
Hannibal Lecter: You will.
****
Watch the look of distrust and anger Dickie immediately gives Tom at 32:45 when Tom suggests getting into the bath with Dickie.
It's almost like Dickie is ashamed Freddie knows he spent time with Tom.
I don't think there is any evidence Dickie and Freddy are homophobes. Freddy can tell Tom is a phony and he has nothing in common with the rest of the crowd. Dickie seems more and more off put that Tom is so clingy and obsessed with him. Neither makes any comment or implication they don't like gays. It's unclear if they know Peter is gay or if they don't care. There's no support for any homophobia.
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Consider the daffodil. And while you're doing that I'll be over here looking through your stuff.
No, there is nothing to suggest that either Dickie or Freddie were homophobic. I believe they would have known Peter was gay and had no problem with it.
(My take on it) - Dickie was definitely shocked and repelled when Tom asked to join him in the bath, and horrified that he hadn't realised earlier that Tom's interest was basically sexual predation. He had been duped and sucked in by Tom, to the point of having him live with him. Further, when Freddie arrived, Dickie felt mortified that Freddie would have realised it immediately. From that point on, he wanted to be free of Tom.
"I am always happy to engage in POLITE discourse."
De gustibus non est disputandum.
Yep, everything changed when Freddie arrived.
The bathtub scene - Dickie wasn't horrified at all. He wasn't even angry. Tom asks if he can get in the tub, long pause. When Dickie says "no" there is almost a hint of a smile on his face. If he was homophobic he would have left the washroom, or at the very least cover himself with a towel, not stay in there to catch Tom staring at his naked reflection. Then he swats Tom playfully with the towel, and still has not left the room or covered up.
Next scene they are on their way to Rome (to meet Freddie)and they're having a good time, Dickie even offers to buy Tom a new jacket, tells him he loves how responsible he is and his dad should hire him as an accountant. Nothing has changed between them yet.
I'm not saying that Dickie is gay, but I do agree with the comments that he just loved attention
Listen! Do you smell something?
Excellent observations, and I love your tagline.
share[deleted]
Amongst all this, you've also got to wonder what Dickie was doing with a Bing Crosby record? Unless it was Marj's, or Tom had just purchased it in Rome
share"I think his eventual dismissal of Tom was more class-based and didn't have much to do with suspicions of homosexuality."
Agreed - although they're not shown hanging out together in the movie, Dickie's supposedly very good friends with Peter (Marj mentions this on the boat when Tom's feeling rejected, just before he does his peeping)
I think Freddie really didn't like Tom from the moment he met him - the corduroy jacket thing was a big give-away.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GAIJ3Rh5Qxs
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Could Dickie have stolen a boat? With plans to not have his name associated with it in case he ended up killing Tom or did the cop say it was stolen for reasons of getting Tom to imply or incriminate himself?
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I wouldn't say he was getting sick of him at this point. At this point it's a matter of Freddie's personality winning over Tom's. Freddie is an extroverted character who shares more common ground with Dickie. They have similar tastes. They appear more passionate about jazz and women, and care little about acting how they please. Tom is more introverted and bookish. The scene perfectly illustrates their clash in personalities; one wants to go partying, the other wants to go sightseeing and shopping. Freddie is the more appealing of the two to Dickie, and of course they are old friends catching up. Given all this Tom is naturally left in the background somewhat.
Later that day is the definitive moment Dickie starts to become sick of having Tom around, when he sees him dancing in his clothes and is visibly annoyed by it.