MovieChat Forums > Biutiful (2011) Discussion > Does Ige really return?

Does Ige really return?

posted 13 years ago by droida38
82 replies | jump to latest

Does the woman that take care of the children really return? I think not.

When Uxbal leaves the bathroom she's hanging on the ceiling, which usually means that the person is dead?

[–] med77_99 13 years ago

Spoilers !!!

I believe she does return, it seems she felt guilty once she got to the train station and felt sorry for Uxbal and his kids and returned.
as for she hanging on the ceiling, he didn't see her, he saw a vision of hemself hanging on the ceiling at the end, because he was about to die.

[–] SteveGreen 13 years ago

I agree: it definitely wasn't her on the ceiling. Not sure it was Uxbal, however; one of the Chinese, perhaps?

[–] 13 years ago

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[–] Michael Fargo 13 years ago

SPOILERS

I believe the fellow on the ceiling in Uxbal's apartment is the murdered gay Chinese fellow, indicating one of those individuals he must "apologize" to. However, of course, the fellow sitting next to the deathbed with his daughter, is Badem.

[–] salapaandrei-921-656440 12 years ago

on the ceiling was Uxbal, not the gay Chinese fellow.

[–] bjoggi_g 13 years ago

This is true, i just saw it on dvd and i pushed pause in the end and saw it was himself in the ceiling.

[–] snimpy 13 years ago

I'm not sure about the person in the ceiling at the end. I didn't see who it was as I wrote in the other thread about the face in the ceiling. I prefer to think that Ige did return (and didn't run off with the money or die) because it felt unbearably cruel on his poor kids. Father dead, mother in an asylum and nanny runs away with all the money -just too cruel and hopeless an ending.

[–] nutsberryfarm 13 years ago

yes. who was that person? if she didn't die i don't think she does.

Golf clap? Golf clap.

[–] crystal_cvngtn 13 years ago

I went to a q and a with Mr. Bardem where he himself said that, yes, she does come back. He said you have to have that hope in the end and that part of the journey is that you (the audience) want the kids to end up with her so badly which is amazing considering she is a relative stranger. He said this more eloquently than I am but the short of it is that...

YES, she does come back.

[–] HappyCozy 13 years ago

That sounds like Javier trying to give the moviegoers a little hope.

I don't think Ige returns. The crooked cops says, specifically refering to her husband, "don't underestimate another man's hunger"(sic). This is after telling Uxbal the story of the tigers that killed his friend. I don't think the film is trying to make judgements about Ige, it just tries to show people's desperation--The Chinese's, the African's, Uxbal's, Mamambra's, etc.

[–] mavrogreek 13 years ago

Ige returns. The director said it himself tonight at the Arclight Q and A following the screening. He said he didn't mean for it to come off ambiguous and to have her not return would have been much too hopeless and nihilistic.

[–] Paulbatesmotel 13 years ago

I was there too! Loved the insight he gave, such a smart man.. loved the movie.

[–] mavrogreek 13 years ago

Completely agree. Loved the owl metaphor.

[–] zarathustra_777 13 years ago

What's the owl metaphor?

[–] macktan894 13 years ago

Perhaps that was in his head, but I'm not sure the movie gives us that that certainty. I was glad to hear her answer when he called her name from the bathroom, but when he sees her on the ceiling, I thought otherwise. And yes, her not returning makes this an incredibly dismal film.

[–] nutsberryfarm 13 years ago

dismal? wow. that's harsh.

Golf clap? Golf clap.

[–] macktan894 13 years ago

Sorry. I should have written it this way -- if Ige didn't return to look after the kids, then this would have been a completely dismal film. But when I saw her on the ceiling, which I interpreted as her death or departure as seen through Uxbal's eyes, then I thought that he imagined her voice answering him, that he was already in the zone of death and delusion.

Depressing films can be well done--in many ways, this film is captivating. But it is also very heartbreaking and that's hard to take.

[–] mmobini 13 years ago

It wasn't Ige who was on the ceiling. It was Uxbal himself.

It was a clear shot of him on the ceiling. a sign that he is about to die.

[–] Mehki_Girl 13 years ago

Yes it is him, but the face almost looked CGI...it looked like him but not exactly like him...sort of the way his face changes when he's sitting by the side of the bed (the dead him) like he grows a little younger looking or less careworn. It sees him and take one hand off the ceiling and almost waves at him...the director claims he didn't want that scene to be ambiguous, but initially it does look like Ige.

[–] salapaandrei-921-656440 12 years ago

It was Uxbal on the ceiling .

[–] lulupalooza 12 years ago

It's him on the ceiling. Press pause and you will see that it's clearly him in his blue shirt - indicating a premonition of his impending death (sees himself walking pass the mirror too).

Ige DOES return. This was confirmed by the director. He should've filmed it to be more clear...like having her physically say 'goodnight' outside the bathroom door or show her taking her child to the bedroom.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rbhrz1-4hN4

[–] lilyvegas 13 years ago

Just got back from seeing this and needed to take a xanax (am having issues with death), and I think she came back. Thank the Lord for that. Have to have some hope.

And yes, Uxbal saw himself on the ceiling.

Question for you, what were those things he kept seeing on the ceiling, like butterflies, or something, and who did they represent, or do I know this answer, but am afraid to admit who they represented?

Whenever you look up, there I shall be -- and whenever I look up there will be you.

[–] 13 years ago

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[–] calle_sundberg 13 years ago

haha i think u got some issues if u need to take a xanax when something stirrs up your emotions : ) Just i thought, i only watched it once but i got the impression that the things (which i thought were coachroaches) seemed to be growing, thus i made the interpretation that they represented his growing cancer. But i might be completely off.

[–] puradrea 13 years ago

Yes she did return. Just finished seeing the film, and clearly saw that it was Bardem on the ceiling. He knew he was about to go. Also noticed that his mouth wasn't moving when he was talking to Ana after giving her the ring...the camera panned and we saw him sitting in the chair watching himself (now dead) and his daughter...

Devastatingly sad film...life, in all of it's manifestations, is truly biutiful...

[–] puradrea 13 years ago

[–] 13 years ago

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[–] stevesw9 13 years ago

>The director said he didn't mean for it to come off ambiguous

Maybe he should direct his films better.
Ige did leave with the money - no doubt about it.
A masterpiece - with bullshine bookends that make me want to avoid this director for ever.

[–] Rkasperek768 13 years ago

I for one will seek out anything this director puts forth. For ever. Simply brilliant.

[–] antneon 13 years ago

The director is arguably the best out there right now. All of his movies are excellent. I do think he failed with Ige. Her fleeing was too devestating, and I cannot help that she is gone. He just took morphine so it would be easy to hallucinate her return. The director says she came back and, somehow, that makes me feel better. I wish he made that more clear in the movie. It seemed like the obvious happened when I watched it.

[–] meerko 13 years ago

maybe he should have tried harder to make it less ambiguous then lol. I really thought it was Lili saying "i'm back" because the look on Uxbal's face totally changed as if he realized it wasn't really Ige's voice or presence. And I also believe the spirit in the ceiling was the gay lover that got killed.

[–] 13 years ago

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[–] stevesw9 13 years ago

Ige left with the money - no doubt about it.
That is the movie. A masterpiece.
PS
With bullshine bookends that make me want to avoid this director for ever.

[–] djliquidz 13 years ago

It was Uxbal on the ceiling, I will take a screenshot of the scene and upload it if needed.

With hearing her voice, plus seeing her doubting her decision at the station and the director stating that she returned... like someone else stated earlier, I don't see why the question is still up for debate. I will agree that if the director did not want it to be ambiguous, a 3 seconds shot of her could have make it simpler.

But yes, ultimately we did not see her come back or be in the apartment. Anyone could use that to keep arguing that she did not come back. If your heart or mind is telling you that she left with the money(even with the good points brought in favor of her being back), I think it means we think and saw the movie differently.

[–] Pequod88 13 years ago

"...seeing her doubting her decision at the station..."

Absolutely. Watching her face as she looked around the station assured me she was coming back. She did the right thing, as Uxbal intuitively knew she would. She also did the smart thing, as there was no future for her returning to her homeland, which her husband had made very clear. While we did not see her return, it did not strike me as ambiguous. I believe the actress nailed the scene, so that we don't have to see her enter the apartment to know that she never got on that train. I suspect that subsequent viewings will confirm this for most.

[–] noveltylibrary 13 years ago

how the heck did he not mean for it to come off as ambiguous??

[–] chambleejrod5 13 years ago

He didn't plan for the scene where Ige returns, to come out the way it did. It was just a small mistake on his part. He has stated that Ige DOES return though. If people want to believe it's ambiguous though, fine by me. Technically though, Ige does indeed return. Also, it is 100% fact that Uxbal is the one on the ceiling. It's pretty ridiculous that people were mistaking Javier for a Chinese man and/or a black woman. Some people probably just didn't get a good look during that quick shot.

[–] karateka96-1 13 years ago

HappyCozy, I think you are spot-on. I don't think she returns. If that is she hovering at the ceiling, it is a mirage...a dream...what Uxbal hopes for in his dying images.

As you say, it is people's desperation that is the sad theme of this film. It is a harsh reality, one that is almost never shown in US movies.

Biutiful was haunting and memorable.

[–] filmfancy 13 years ago

That sounds like Javier trying to give the moviegoers a little hope.

I don't think Ige returns. The crooked cops says, specifically refering to her husband, "don't underestimate another man's hunger"(sic). This is after telling Uxbal the story of the tigers that killed his friend. I don't think the film is trying to make judgements about Ige, it just tries to show people's desperation--The Chinese's, the African's, Uxbal's, Mamambra's, etc.

I agree. Ige seems to have a moment of hesitation at the airport, but I don't think she returns to Uxbal's house. The dirty cop's relating of the tiger story was in the film for a reason--it foreshadows what later happens with Ige taking Uxbal's money and leaving him.

"And all the pieces matter"

[–] paynefree 12 years ago

BIUTIFUL - Uxbar on Ceiling by paynefree,
http://www.flickr.com/photos/46821668@N00/6661740139/

Screen capture of DVD, I hope this helps the debate, All we see is our own truth, that must not be belittled. I only publish this to clarify between personal experience and film's original scene. I also thought when I watched the DVD that this could be the gay lover or Ige. When I froze DVD on my standard definition 32" television I was no wiser! Though I could see it might be Uxbar I was not at all sure...

[–] MTulliver 12 years ago

*face/palm*

The director said she returned. Therefore, she returned!

How many times do people have to say this before people believe it!

[–] AllyWheels 11 years ago

It's not up to the director to decide how the viewer interprets the end scenes.

[–] stillbwell 13 years ago

The fact that this isn't clear is just one of many examples of how a poorly-written screenplay can ruin a film.

[–] calle_sundberg 13 years ago

in what sense did this ruin the movie for u?

[–] noveltylibrary 13 years ago

i don't usually mind if things are left open, but i don't get how a director mistakes something like that.

[–] rdeschene 11 years ago

The fact that this isn't clear is just one of many examples of how a poorly-written screenplay can ruin a film.

It wasn't poorly written, just not clearly shot. If taken literally (the way the script was written), then it's clear that Ige does return. It's only the fact that we see a shadow passing by the door, with her voice saying that she's back, that makes us wonder.

And thank you to the poster who posted the screenshot of Uxbal on the ceiling. I too did not see that clearly, due mainly to the murkiness of the scene as it was shot.

[–] 11 years ago

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[–] Eumenides_0 13 years ago

This didn't seem ambiguous to me. We don't see her, but we listen to her voice behind the door.

This world is a comedy to those that think, a tragedy to those that feel.

[–] drivenbyseclusion 13 years ago

The problem with assuming that Ige does not return causes the viewer to question which other scenes in the film may also be imaginary. As a result from this -- we get a convoluted mess of a film that was otherwise suppose to have a pretty straight forward narrative.

If we do an analysis of the individual characters -- we will soon realize that Ige is perhaps the only one who is altruistic. Marambra's character for example cannot be trusted based on the information we know about her: she's cheated on Uxbal several times, she claims to have been healed of her bipolarity, and she has beat her son on more than one occasion; because of this, we can trust Marambra to repeat the same patterns. We can apply this to any of the characters and trust that they will repeat their behavioral tendencies based on their former actions.

There's an interesting scene between the cop and Uxbal at the diner where Zanc gives a profound insight into the human condition: "Don't underestimate another man's hunger".

Ige is perhaps the only character throughout the movie who is not self serving. Her first display of altruism is when she is sharing a dialogue with her soon to be deported husband. She wants nothing more than to go back with him, but eventually she succumbs to her husbands wishes to stay in Spain. Based on this altruistic behavior -- it is more than likely that the behavior will be repeated; it's not guaranteed, but I think it is perhaps logical to draw this inference vs. Ige breaking her behavioral pattern.

[–] calle_sundberg 13 years ago

Agreed, i also think this is one of the themes in this movie. To be trapped in a pattern.

[–] iavir 13 years ago

nope not electric, there is a scene when they lighten up.

I was always in doubt that she return, i been thinking that maybe she didn't return and that his mind play a trick on him to die in peace.

"It's only after we've lost everything that we're free to do anything."

[–] martytamu27 13 years ago

I thought this was kinda ambiguous as well...the way it shows her at the train station...maybe having second thoughts?
then he hears her come in..or was it an hallucinaiton? we never physiclaly see her or lights on.

btw..i think that is javier on the ceiling, he turned away quickly cause he knew the end was near.

i feel the director meant for her to come back, it would be too sad and hopeless if she did not. but a beautiful ending with his little girl

[–] Jbluemax 13 years ago

I do think Ige returns because someone answers when he asks Ige if she is home. Initially I thought that could have been an auditory hallucination. However, when he goes into the bedrom and lays down and talks to Ana, she never mentions that Ige is gone. The kids would have been stressed out if they had to find their way home alone. She was calm and normal in the scene. And plus we never saw Ige get on the train.

[–] 13 years ago

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[–] mornston-979-157828 13 years ago

It's still being debated because it is an ambiguous moment- nothing about it obvious. I was sure that was Ige on the ceiling- a very haunting image. As Uxbal saw his life slipping away he saw everything he knew just slipping away with him. It was a multi-layered montage of the moments between life and death in addition to being the climax of the film and resolving all the story lines. And as much as I LOVED this film, I do not think it was successful in doing that. But that was ok, he kept us all thinking and I consider that a good thing, and doesn't compromise anything about this oh-so-biutiful movie. (But can you believe if she DID leave?? I thought for sure she did, and this was just a portrayal of the lowest form of humanity, among a sea of really super- low lifes....)

[–] kenichiku 13 years ago

I think the PC resolution is that she does return however only through her shadow in the hallway I'm still skeptical that Ige didn't return. She's only reluctantly in Spain after her husband's urging before he was deported back to Senegal as the job situation is dire there but a dying man provided her an impetus & funding to go back to rejoin her husband.

Sorry my take is Uxbal in his delirium needed to know that she was there otherwise he dies unfulfilled thinking that his kids are alone.

[–] fmuto2000 13 years ago

When I watched the film I authomatically assumed Ige returned (we heard her in the hallway). However my friend thought that she did not because of the previous statement in the movie ("don't underestimate another man's hunger"). We see such raw reality that I would not wander if Ige left for Senegal. She might have had her interests same as everybody else. The characters are developing with mastery: not black and white but encompass selfishness, fear and desire to help fellow human beings together.
I feel so overwhelmed by this movie that whatever the ending does not really alter my impression: I fell as if a huge piece of marble fell on my chest but left me feeling inspired.