Global Warming is a myth - The 11th Hour (2007) Discussion

Think this argument has already been won and people want action

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/sci/tech/7748247.stm

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[–] Aarya 15 years ago

This argument was won in the 1970s as well, when "people" wanted to avoid the NEW ICE AGE that scientists were warning us about then. General consensus amongst people doesn't mean anything, this is a scientific issue and science should be the only voice in the matter, not a failed presidential candidate or a Hollywood actor. But, then again, you obviously haven't seen the video I attached. What are you so afraid of?

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[–] Victorgoat 15 years ago

Yes I have seen most films or videos available on climate change. An issue that has interested me for over thirty years now. Guess you don't remember the hot, hot summer of 1976 when there were severe droughts in many parts of the world. That is when the issue first caught my attention and I don't remember anyone thinking it was part of an ice age then. Have kept records and followed developments very closely since then as have worked most of my life with a close relationship with the land. Know there are scientist who can prove just about anything if the incentive is right but choose to trust my own experiences in this matter so am convinced the argument is proved in many ways but the climate is always changing I know although the rate of increase over the past few years has been extreme from the research that I have done into the matter. Have made many changes in my life recently to adapt to what seems to be coming so unless the world can get its act together and really tackle the problem that is all one can do I guess. Did appreciate this film though and hope for some people it was a wake up call.

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[–] Alectreveiyan006 14 years ago

Did you even watch this movie???

Global Warming was already proven as factual by 1300 scientists from 71 different nations during U.N. World Summit on Ecological Systems in 2005.

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[–] hamvalue 9 years ago

Aarya, you're being nit picky. Who cares whose voice the warning comes through? The subject is the same. Jesus.

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[–] geeya 15 years ago

You are an idiot. Global Warming is just a name for climate change. It is not a myth. The climate is changing drastically. If you believe that it is not, you are ignorant.

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[–] acidburbn 15 years ago

excuse me for barging into this thread, but you sir are an idiot for that remark.

Global Warming is NOT just a name for climate changes. It is a THEORY that exhaust fumes and carbon dioxide in the atmosphere trap solar radiation within the earth's atmosphere.
According to this very theory this would ARTIFICIALLY cause an increase in the global temperature.

And I agree with the OP that some follow this theory to religious extremes.

But for all the 'facts' that are presented, the same kind of logic could be applied to the theory that the sun burns brighter and hotter, the older it gets.

It could mean that the magnetic poles of the earth are on the verge of switching places/charges. The magnetic field they create right now is a big factor in blocking out harmfull radiation and heat from the earth's surface.
If the poles are reversing, they would first have to build down to the zero-point, before they reverse.
Less magnetism, less protection, more radiation gets through...more heat on earth.

And trust me, you don't want to go sunbathing when those magnetic levels actually DO hit the zero-point ;)

Fine, that's out of my system.
Now I'm actually going to watch this film and see if it makes any sense...

beware...I may be back ;)

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[–] el-phantasmogoro 15 years ago

Quote: It could mean that the magnetic poles of the earth are on the verge of switching places/charges.

This... is a joke. Right?

You don't seriously believe this right? If so please show me some evidence that wasn't scrawled on a cardboard box in faeces by a homeless man named Jesus while talking to a sock puppet.

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[–] presenting-joe 15 years ago

It could happen, you can find out about the science behind it on the NASA site or BBC news( if you're like me and more comfortable with diagrams and color codes) or try some science journals if you're clever. If you require a bib when eating; are female; need drama in your life or are a combination of the 3 you can try the 2 links below which are amusing examples of sensationalism.

http://www.greatdreams.com/poleshift.htm
http://www.survive2012.com/geryl1.php

There is a pole shift due within the sun in 2012 according to Nasa. That could be spectacular. Maybe the Mayans were onto something, even if they were living shorter years :)

too slow chicken marengo, too slow for THIS cat

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[–] 15 years ago

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[–] Myth-and-Mayhem 14 years ago

The magnetic poles are constantly moving positions, even as we speak, they've always moved. They're not stationary..

"Hustling jalapeno dips to the apple seeds. Go on... Dismissed. Dismissed!"

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[–] gollumsmeagolrocks 8 years ago

Okay, I know that sounds ridiculous but that's actually a natural scientific process. It is known as a Magentic Reversal of Polarity. I mean, it's highly unlikely that the poles are switching right now, this is definitely climate change. After all, the poles takes millions of years to reverse.

~NW~

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[–] bianodias 15 years ago

I don´t know Ma`am
But I tell you this, I tell you this

When I was 8-9 I could spend the whole day from sunrise to sunset out in the sun without sunblock or anything. I would be burnt bad, having trouble sleeping, but here I am!

Now, I can´t even spend an hour

This is no story, folk

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[–] gringott 15 years ago

Since we in the west have dumped our religon we need something new to believe in because that is human nature. I got it, let us go with Climate Change (because we all know that the climate has changed in our lifetime, no matter how old or young you are), blame it on Mankind (because we all know in our hearts that this development and good life we are living cannot possibly be good so it must be bad), and destroy our economies and also only teach politically correct subjects in the indoctrnation schools - excuse me, universities, and if anyone speaks out they are facists and racists etc. That will be your new religon. And if you are a white herto male, kill yourself now because everything is your fault!

What a great world you will have once you get rid of all the smart people and destroy all the civilization that was created. We can all be like the Amish except without Christ and white herto men. YEAH!!!!

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[–] deathtoallbutmetal 15 years ago

I personally couldn't care less if global warming is real or not.

I just want us to stop pi$$ing away all of our resources and screwing generations down the road.

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[–] Brommabo 11 years ago

I just want us to stop pi$$ing away all of our resources and screwing generations down the road.

Yes. It's not like if global warming is a myth (which I by the way see as wishful thinking) we can just keep on living like we do and everything will be fine.

Anticipating the end of the world is humanity's oldest pastime

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[–] wwright5078 15 years ago

Celebrities are used for the simple reason that Americans don't follow scientists. The American masses don't spend money to watch scientist speak every weekend like they do actors. Until that changes, celebrities will be used to gain attention to subjects and issues. Also, it's not like the film only consisted of DiCaprio talking about facts or issues for a couple of hours, he just narrated the film.

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[–] saturnjwl 10 years ago

I agree with you.

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[–] user-18049 15 years ago

"The Great Global Warming Swindle" which you reference was universally slammed by everyone with a Science GCSE or higher.

Sorry for bursting your bubble there, but...

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[–] Lmiranda2220 15 years ago

Unfortunately, an actor and vice president are the only one's out there telling people to get educated. Whether its a myth or not, it doesn't hurt to know what's going on and to be informative. You can't deny that celebrities have more influence than the Average Joe... they're really just giving the information they've been told by experts.

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[–] feachlomana 15 years ago

"I don´t feel an actor or an ex vice-president are the people who should be teaching us about a subject they are in no way experts in..."

"...I´ll let experts, climatologists and such, to show their evidence, and I would welcome any scientific debate..."

You seem a bit confused. Are you saying you would believe the experts? The experts have already spoken.

I think you'll find that expert climate scientists have published a wealth of evidence over recent years proving beyond doubt that man's activities are bringing about a change in the climate. So much evidence, in fact, that there is no longer "scientific debate" among them about this.

If you are at all bothered by the notion that mankind is acting to bring about it's own extinction, maybe you should take some time out to actually look at some of the evidence, rather than some dubious and long since discredited TV show.

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[–] emmamaria 15 years ago

What an IDIOT!

All that this post shows is what an ignorant, privliged, First World (I am assuming, but I doubt that you are not American) moron you are.

Global warming is a myth.... a religion???

If you are trying to make some sort of 'Political Ecology' argument, I will give you credit for that. I definately think that a certain form of knowledge or "dominant discourse" around Global Warming is mythologised or taken up as religion...

However, saying that Global Warming is a myth is pretty much like saying that HIV/AIDS is a myth. The consequences are potentially just as negligent.

I don't have much time to watch your movie, but I saw about 5 minutes and I wanted to scream!

You most obviously do not live in a country where the effects of global warming are so obvious and SO disasterous. I am South African and it affects our society profoundly. Cities that were never affected by malaria are now suffering hugely because of radically shifting rain and temperature changes. Xenophobic violence has flared in the wake of a growing number of refugees connected to countries that have civil wars over resources. Certain areas are flooding where they never used to and other areas are experiencing extreme droughts.

Religion is based on faith for something you cannot see or feel. Believe me, much of the world can see and feel Global warming all too well, don't advertise how isolated you really are.

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[–] 15 years ago

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[–] emmamaria 15 years ago

It is so frikking obvious that you are completely ignorant of how power works in the world.

"The UN says so, therefore it MUST be 'true'? RIGHT... the rest of us intelligent, critical, thinking people will hold comment for the moment.

"If this carbon dioxide certainly did affect climate change, thereby affirming the theory of global warming, the United States would MOST CERTAINLY feel the effects tenfold over South Africa."

PLEASE explain to me how you came about this piece of crap conclusion? You must be stupider than you sound because this makes NO SENSE WHAT SO EVER!

Do you think that carbon dioxide floats over the country that emits it most like a cartoon cloud... idiot! There is this think called dispersal... think about it for two seconds and you might realise how derogatory you are being.

And please oh please explain to me how a first world country would be more hard up than a third-world country by the effects of global warming OR climate change.

You need to get out of that precious little cocoon of yours and think about more than your trite 'controversial' THEORY of a global conspiracy.

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[–] 15 years ago

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[–] emmamaria 15 years ago

Ok, so I understood the UN thing wrong... you think you would react somewhat positively to this, but your immaturity obviously comes through.

Thankk sweet Lord I am a sociologist and not a scientist! I will not make any attempt to claim any kind of 'scientific knowledge' (something you seem absolutely unable to grasp is actually a construct formed under constraints of power and discursive violence) about carbon DIOXIDE or carbon monoxide... but would I not be correct in thinking that:

1) the destruction of the ozone layer and global warming are not the same phenomena and,

2) that if the earth heats up then we are all screwed, not just poor old US where apparently (as Hollywood would love to have us believe) the only effects of any kind of disasters are felt.

I maintain that you live in a iron-clad mental cocoon, and the fact that you are well travelled to boot and are obviously unable to grasp any kind of discrepancies between 'first' and 'third' world countries does more to discredit you than anything else.

Are you really so absolutely ignorant, crass or stupid enough not to actually read what you are telling me critically?

Can you not recognise that a First world country has SO MUCH MORE capacity to deal with global crisis than a Third world country?

Think about it for two seconds and I hope you will start to feel a bit stupid. Do you know what the conflict in Darfur is all about? Now think about how horrific that war is.... and then think about how the US is handling the 'war' in Iraq. Which civilians do you think are suffering more? Where do you think that all those refugees are going? I can make a very safe claim by generalising that the majority of those refugees are not ending up in the US...

But hey, that suits you all much better, doesn't it? So easy to ignore when it does not affect your every day life in the way that it does ours.

You so very very very obviously are a 'scientist' that it is sad to see how unable you are to recognise that "science" is never isolated from the very human influences of power, social impacts, economic constraints/imposition, cultural influence, and so forth.

We are human-beings and everything is mediated by ordering and hierarchy. It is just so clear where you have placed yourself in terms of that hierarchy and who you trample on to make your 'point' known.

The BEAUTY of this movie, "The Inconvenient Truth" and the like are that they make these issues global and FINALLY begin to hold someone accountable. You seem to reject the fact that this (whether you call it global warming, climate change, environmental degradation becomes a VERY arbitrary distinction) is a global issue that affects the WHOLE WORLD is very alarming.

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[–] 15 years ago

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[–] emmamaria 15 years ago

No, I am not confused, I just have the ability to see the links you so obviously are unable to.

You obviously have no clue that South Africa has been having a spate of very serious xenophobic attacks. So yes, the refugees from Darfur, Nigeria, the Congo, and numerous other waring African nations very often end up in South Africa and threaten our very young democracy. So it does affect our lives very tangibly.

For me, the most relevant points of Global Warming have very little to do with the 'scientific' facts surrounding it. The arguments of Global Warming I find relevant are:

1) human beings are causing far more rapid than usual climate change through conventionalised means of production and consumption, and

2) this affects all of the world, disproportinately so.

Do you really think that the conflict in Darfur has nothing to do with oil (a natural resourse needed to maintain the conventionalised form of production that is screwing up the world), the lack of water in the area or the interests of the other parties in the resourses of the area?

Yes, whether you call it global warming or not becomes a significantly arbitrary distinction if that is the catalyst for change in the way the world operates in a highly commodified manner.

I find you argument about politicians installing Global Warming as a theory to make money HILARIOUS! Have you watched An Inconvenient Truth OR The 11th Hour (to name a few)?

Subscribing to Global Warming threatens conventionalised forms of production, that is why politicians are the ones rejecting it and why these movies are needed in the first place! HOW IN THE WORLD do you suggest politicians are making money from Global Warming????? PLEASE explain it to me? Did you know that Organic agricultural production is cheaper in the long run? Just an example... but why would governments vest themselves in less expensive forms of production if they were in it for the money? The 11th Hour's whole point is that sustainable forms of production are more cost effective in the long term!

Me thinks I am not the one who is more than a little contradicting themselves!

If you could give me actual references (in peer reviewed articles) as to the 'proof' you site against Global Warming I would really like to see it. In the meantime, I suggest you do some research of your own concerning "political ecology" any maybe you will get an idea of where I am coming from.

The problem I have with your stand point in that you have no appreciation for the possibility of change you are limiting with your argument. If Global Warming is the theory that instigates change in the way that the world works then why the hell not? Who cares if it is 'science' or not? Religion is not science but it surely has very material effects on the world?

You say that you disagree with the way the US is doing things but then you reject the very theory that has done the MOST towards debunking that form of action in a very long time! Are you really this unable to see the bigger picture?

Don't limit me because you are narrow-minded and then call me 'confused' or 'off the topic'. This is just lazyness on your part.

Oh, but wait, I am speaking to somebody who actually subscribes to an unmediated, 'pure' form of 'history'... do read some Foucault, Bourdieu, Althusser and so forth and educate yourself!

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[–] 15 years ago

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[–] emmamaria 15 years ago

Well, I know Nietzsche quite well and you are obviously not thinking through what he is saying enough and really more obviously in denial that he would despouse your ideas as well as mine. And if you actually think in some kind of depth about Nietzsche (beyond finding a quote on the net) you would also know that nothing is ever "completely off the topic".

Wow, I am so super impressed that you went to some website and downloaded all these cute little quotes... I asked you for a peer reviewed journal. It's not rocket science, just want one actual academic reference... you do know where to find peer reviewed journals, don't you?

The entire point was for you to wave your huge ego in everyone's faces and you seem to be managing quite well, thanks for the amusement. Further established by the fact that you are little-minded enough to think that I am trying to 'bad-mouth' you... what, are we in pre-school?

"How about the revenue from An Inconvenient Truth to start? How about Federal Taxes? How about charities? Scare tactics! This is all about money and subjugation, and you've fallen victim. Political parties engineer new ways to produce income and revenue, and Gore has done just that."

All I can say is that you must be on crack if you think that any of the things you have mentioned come anywhere CLOSE in ANY KIND OF WAY to meeting the BILLIONS upon BILLIONS of Dollars/Pounds/Euros made from the mining and burning of fossil fuel, or maintaining the kind of consumer lifestyle that much of the world subscribes to today.

Yes, I know what Global Warming is... I know that you are saying it is a theory and in theory I have quite a bit of experience... you are the one that has taken it out of the scientific realm and placed it into a theoretical perspective that you are SO unable to grapple with.

"I reject the theory of global warming because it is simply false." And then you use that Nietzsche quote later... do you know what the theories surrounding negation are? Do you really expect me to take you seriously when you are making these highly ameturish examples?

If you can't think broader than a topic you most obviously posted just to show off, then I suggest you go back to the play-pen.

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[–] 15 years ago

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[–] emmamaria 15 years ago

"If you could give me actual references (in peer reviewed articles) as to the 'proof' you site against Global Warming I would really like to see it."

This is from an earlier post that I sent you, silly little man.

I have no issue with Nietzsche, you are just using him incorrectly.

You have ignored so many of my arguments that it makes me laugh hilariously every time you reply.

You are not capable of arguing, you are not capable of saying anything beyond a few quotes from OTHER people which you think that I won't notice have been COMPLETELY removed from their original contexts.

You have done nothing to convince me and you are clearly incapable of recognising how connected so many different issues are. I gave you CLEAR links between climate issues, Darfur and South Africa and you seem to be too stoic to join the dots.

And if I read all of your replies to other people on this post it becomes SUPER apparent that you are just blowing a lot of how air around. Everyone asks you for somekind of proof/references/etc and all you can come up with are a few measley quotes and a movie that now somehow must be the 'truth'.

Point being: you are not relevant to the rest of the world.

"I'm afraid I cannot continue to supply answer after answer to such a small mind."

I am afraid that I cannot continue to not get any answers and pretent like you are saying anything worth while.

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