Um...weren't the Egyptians black?

I already stated where I got that reference from: Cheik Anta Diop. You can read I assume, so read his research. It's available on Amazon.com should you not know where to turn. I'm not "deciding" to believe somemething because I want so "deperately" to believe the ancient Egyptians were black. It's not that serious. Why don't you read the ENTIRE thread, so you can jump on the bandwagon more effectively? Different theorists believe different things. Just because YOU haven't seen anyone disagree with your ideas, doesn't mean other people haven't contradicted them in some fashion.

Truth hurts, doesn't it?

i must say, this was an interesting read. i can't speak for everyone but it seemed like most the thoughtful post had at least something i either (a) agreed with or (b) had read numerous times before.

i do have one question, why are the ancient egyptians the only people who supposedly refer to the color of their land rather than themselves. wouldn't good soil be black pretty much everywhere on this planet. and if that is so, did people in the pre-Columbian who refer to themselves as 'people of the black earth'? or in ancient parts of europe? i don't know, just a question.

people are fooling themselves if they think just because they have scholarship that proves that ancient egyptians were NOT anywhere remotely related to sub-Saharan africa that it bereft of politics. even sciences that are not related to race or social agendas have politics involved. take a look at the whole global warming thing (as it's been written about in the U.S.).

egypt (or khemet if you wish) had been around a long time before cleopatra come on the scene. by that time egypt was in no way near its height, if fact it was in decline. i personally refer to the latter part of the egyptian empire as the greco-roman period. so, if she was macedonian, who cares? she wasn't even that hot.

in terms of sheba, if she was from the arabian peninsula, like yemen. people from somalia have always intermarried and ruled that area even in present times. true, this is anecdotal however, this is what people from that country told me.

also, you can't go by what people in parts of the world look like now as a barometer of what the people who occupied the land 10K yrs. ago. that, to me, doesn't even make sense. most people in the U.S. don't like the first occupants of this land for example.

i find it interesting that people who claim that ancient egyptians couldn't have been anything like sub-Saharan africans paint the afrocentrists as emotional as opposed to themselves, who i assume are totally basing everything on fact. don't fool yourselves, you've got skin in the game too. just as much as they have a reason to say egyptians are "black" you have an agenda to say they are anything but. and just as you probably will not convince them i doubt you would be convinced differently, even if they have scholarship to prove otherwise. that said, i hardly think that anyone can be considered a definitive source of egyptology. i think it all depends on who has the power to determine what's a legitimate source and what isn't. isn't that how power works anyway?

i also find it interesting that people think that egyptians wouldn't have had any contact with people in western africa. the sahara wasn't always as widespread as it is now and i'm pretty sure there was trade between egypt and the rest of africa. why wouldn't they intermarry and trade culture and politics with egypt and vice-versa.

to me the term 'North Africa' is a european colonial construct. egypt is totally in africa not partially.

that said, there are native africans who are white. the berbers.

in some ways, this debate reminds me of something i discovered recently regarding the medicis. when they brought over shows a few yrs. ago. it had pieces of art from the descendents of alessandro de medici, duke of florence and his descendents who were arts patrons. when those shows were here in the U.S. they didn't mention (or maybe even denied) that they were Black. even though paintings of them and the historical record made it clear that they were at least part "black" and if you've seen the pictures let me tell you, they weren't talking about the soil.

also, someone posted earlier, what is considered "black" or "negro" is a very much a construct based in 19th century pseudo science. back when phrenology and eugenics were considered legitimate science. according to the definitions of people here of egyptians, even african americans wouldn't be considered 'black'. there is a range in color and hair texture within the community which comes from a mixture of various ethnicities though most (obviously) sub-Saharan african, primarily (though not exclusively) from western africa. for example, sallie hemings is thought of as a "black" slave even though if you were to see her she would have been indistinguishable from a "white" person. allegedly, she was thomas jefferson's wife half-sister (her mother being half "black").

as much as i believe that the first dynasties were "black" in origin (it just seems logical given where humanity began) i also think it is a mistake to apply those 19th century terms to ancient people. i also don't think that roman, greeks or (especially) persians were exclusively from northwestern europe. purity of "race" is a myth. let it go.

also, regarding posts from people who claim to be from egypt (and the 'middle east'), they are as touched by colonialism and all the white supremecy inferiority complexes it brings as any other region. so like everyone on this board, myself included, i take what they say with a huge grain of salt.

lastly, the people who put the Lost references in. very funny... those are my favorite of this particular thread so far.