Anyone else dislike Rose?


She's such a cow! So full of herself.

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I love Jean Marsh's irreverence. She makes some off-colour comments but so does Simon Williams. And the commentaries all the better for them IMO. Rose, though, yeah - the character develops into a good-hearted one but she does questionable things like stealing Daisy's war job. That just makes her more human though, rather than, say, Saint Anna in DA.

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Yes, St. Anna in DA is a bit hard to take sometimes. But occasionally she shows such disdain for someone, like the new ladies maid Baxter. After Baxter got her and Mr. Bates in the soup. Baxter only told the truth, but Anna can be unforgiving when it comes to her hubby!

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I liked her, though Hudson and Mrs Bridges were my favourites.

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I liked her, though Hudson and Mrs Bridges were my favourites.


Oh, my god! They're my faves, too. We should totally get together and have some fangirling fun!

It is the mark of an educated mind to be able to entertain a thought without accepting it- Aristotle

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Rose was one of my favourites.

Mrs Voorhees is watching you!

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I didn't like her, either....she was a sanctimonious busybody who identified more with the family than with the other servants. Also, Jean Marsh is one of those people who always appears to be "acting", and she also seemed too old for the part. Then on the other hand, she was far less irritating than Pauline Collins and Lesley-Anne Down were.

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I mostly liked Rose. It's interesting that she had the first and last line of the series.

But I find Jean Marsh somewhat charmless. She did a few appearances on the Tonight Show with Johnny Carson (apparently he liked her as a guest) and I thought her a bore. I remember one episode where she described herself as very smart and well read. It was cringeworthy.

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I didn't like her much at all. It seemed to me that Rose was never happy in service but lacked the courage to try anything different.

But the worst thing was when she got the windfall from the Australian sheep farmer and Hudson advised her to put it in the bank. But she got greedy and went to James and asked him about investments. Then when both she and James lost their money Rose went crying to Richard's wife about it and Richard ripped into James over it. And that was the straw that broke James back, and it was Rose's doing.




The Players of The Game are the scum of the earth.

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IIRC, there is no scene where Hudson advises her about what to do with her money.

It wasn't exactly Rose's fault. James came back from America with sunny optimism about making money. As Richard said, did James advise Rose about risk? Or did he make it all sound easy?

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IIRC there is a scene where Hudson gives his conservative opinion about investing money in Rose's presence.

Well if James thought there was risk he would have done something to salvage his own situation wouldn't he? Like James Rose gambled and like him she lost. She should have shut up and taken it on the chin instead of whining to Richard's wife in the hope that she could have her (undeserved) windfall (undeservedly) returned to her at Richard's expense.

Now James might have topped himself anyway even if Rose had put her money in the bank and not lost it. He was financially ruined after all and with a tendency to mental fragility on top of that, but what Rose did was contemptible in my book.




The Players of The Game are the scum of the earth.

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You're tough :)

It's unrealistic that Rose would have said nothing. A lady has a fairly intimate relationship with her maid. They are around each other every day. There is no way Rose could conceal her feelings. Eventually it would come out.

Her undeserved windfall? It's never stated that Gregory had a will, only that their letters were found. No money could be legally turned over on the basis of that in the absence of marriage. The letter Rose got informing her of her "windfall" (a poor term when inheriting something from a loved one) was from lawyers so one must assume Gregory left a will, going off to war that would have been the prudent thing to do. Inheritance from a long lost relative? Windfall. From a loved one? Calling it undeserved is a bit harsh.

What was Rose thinking of in wanting to invest? She never quit her job and apparently didn't spend very much of the money. It was her security blanket. She got caught up in James's talk about America and making money. She trusted her "betters" that they knew what they were doing.

Was it greed? I have a hard time saying it was. Rose never struck me as greedy. I certainly don't blame her for James's suicide.

I'll take another look over the next couple of days if I can see anything Hudson stated about what to do with the $$.

Edited to add: Rose said (I think to Mrs Bridges) that she only wanted to invest a little but James convinced her to invest it all. I think this is evidence that she only wanted to increase her nest egg, rather than greed.

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You're tough :)

I'm a grump.

It's unrealistic that Rose would have said nothing.

Unrealistic that a servant would learn how to keep her mouth shut around her mistress, really...?

A lady has a fairly intimate relationship with her maid.

I don't know that Virginia had a particularly close relationship with any of the servants, and Rose wasn't her Lady's maid was she? I think Rose was just one of the House maids. Now if we were talking about Lady Mary Crawley and her Lady's maid Anna from 'Downton Abbey' that is different. They had a close relationship due to shared traumatic experiences and were also of a similar age.

Her undeserved windfall?

Windfall - a large amount of money that is won or received unexpectedly.

What else would you call it? And what did she do to deserve it? She chickened out on the sheep farmer. They may have been briefly engaged but the relationship was never a physical one. It was kind of a business proposition more than anything. Why on earth he would have left her anything is beyond me.

What was Rose thinking of in wanting to invest? She never quit her job and apparently didn't spend very much of the money. It was her security blanket. She got caught up in James's talk about America and making money. She trusted her "betters" that they knew what they were doing.

No. It was greed pure and simple. And Rose in her weaselly way even tried to put all of the onus on James by saying something like "If you think it's best" when she had clearly already decided to go for it. As in if it falls flat then it's your fault not mine because you said it was best. As I said, contemptible.







The Players of The Game are the scum of the earth.

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Rose.was her lady 's maid.

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Okay I've gone and looked at the episode concerned 'All the King's Horses' (second last episode season five). Here is what happened:


1. James returned from America. Edward put the idea into Rose's head by talking about how everyone was getting rich over there. As for James he wouldn't shut up about Wall Street and how it was a new age of prosperity for all.

2. Daisy asked Hudson about the Stock Exchange and he told her how it worked. But he cautioned that people could lose money as well as make it. Rose listened in and commented that you needed to have people advise you. Hudson said that people also advised on horse races. He went on to point out that speculating was another word for gambling. He finished by saying that the Stock Exchange was "not for the likes of us".

3. Rose had different ideas and deliberately sought out James. At first Rose said she would invest a little of her money. She mentioned Hudson's gambling comment. James said it was speculating and there was a world of difference. James asked her how much she wanted to invest and that it must be her decision. Rose said she would leave it up to him. So in the event James was all for it and invested the lot and Rose was swept along.

4. When James told Rose they had both been wiped out in the Stock Market crash Rose went down to the servants quarters and wailed to Mrs Bridges that she had lost her money and it was all James fault because she had only wanted to invest a little of her money but he invested the lot.

5. Hudson tried to calm Rose but she was in no mood. He forbade her to speak to Richard or Virginia about it but she stormed off and blabbed to Virginia (off camera). Virginia told Richard, Richard was aghast and sent Hudson to fetch James and then got stuck into him.

Also when Rose was wailing to Mrs Hudson she said "What would Gregory think of me? I was keeping the money for him!" But this is a nonsensical thing to say. Gregory was dead so how could she possibly be keeping the money for him? What she was really doing was putting a respectable face on her distress at having lost her money by making out as though she was upset for Gregory's sake and not her own.

And when Hudson tried to comfort her by kindly saying that they would always look after her she snarled at him "I want to look after myself, and now I can't!" This is what she was really upset about. She hated being in service and wanted to make enough money to fulfill her dream of being able to live independently one day.

Interestingly Gregory the sheep farmer had offered her a kind of independence but she had turned it down. Apparently the terms weren't favourable enough for her. Too much hard work perhaps. Not that I blame her, it would have been tough!

So I suppose in calling Rose contemptible I was going too far but I still think she comes out of it looking very badly. I understand why she did what she did but she acted out of greed and selfishness. As for James I suppose he wasn't much better than Rose when all is said and done so perhaps it was fitting that they brought about each others downfall. Although his downfall was much worse than hers. After all the only thing that happened to Rose was that she lost a windfall. Easy come, easy go. Otherwise for her everything was still the same. But James had really made a mess of it and dragging a servant in with him was the final nail in the coffin apparently.







The Players of The Game are the scum of the earth.

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BTW, yes Rose was promoted to lady's maid. It was when Virginia took back Edward and Daisy. Daisy became head houseparlourmaid with Lily under her.

You make a good case and reminds me that I think I had the same opinion as yours early on. Maybe over the years my position has softened.

Did you see the "sequel" a few years ago? I thought the 1st season was just ok, but I thought the 2nd season was good and was disappointed it was cancelled. But I thought that the idea of Rose owning a business was not in keeping with her character. There was never any indication that Rose had an entrepreneurial bent.

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Yes I watched the 2010 version. It looked nice and had a good cast but the story lines were forgettable. I do remember that Rose made an appearance but I can't recall the details. 'Downton Abbey' was a better effort but even it was weak as far as the story lines went compared to the original 'Upstairs, Downstairs'.



The Players of The Game are the scum of the earth.

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Tose was both very nice and unlucky to be influenced by James. Elizabeth would have been a lot worse off without her.

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The only thing dumber than getting investment advice from James would've been getting it from Lord Grantham - who thought Ponzi was really onto something.

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She could be dour, prim, and sanctimonious, that's for sure! (And whiney, as with the whole investment business.)

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When I first watched the series I always wavered on my opinion of Rose. I appreciate flaws in characters more now, so I guess I like her. I never thought much about her age but I think now that a younger actress might have been better for that role.

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Wasn’t Rose secretly in love with James? It was implied at times, but given her age I was never sure if it was romantic love or maternal love

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I think it was Thomas that Rose was attracted to not James. Basically because Thomas pursued her whereas James never did.

It was Elizabeth that Rose loved most of all I think. As in Rose's mind Elizabeth belonged to her and she belonged to Elizabeth because of their long and close servant/mistress relationship. Which I thought was always more strongly felt by Rose than Elizabeth whose emotions though intense at times were usually short lived and shallow.

And moreover I have always thought that Rose was at least as attracted to females as males. Rose and Sarah had a little fling I think while they shared the same bed. In Sarah's case it was calculated to make certain of Rose's loyalty but Rose was, at least to an extent, in love with Sarah it seemed to me.



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