I don't particularly care for this film, I like many people on this board think it's a vile, racist piece of propoganda. Having said that, this film gave birth (pun intended) to modern cinema! How can this film not be in the top 250 and something like the Kill Bill films are?
Last film I saw:
Shaun of the Dead 10/10
I agree with you about kill bill sucking but this movie is nothing but racist garbage.
"Get busy living or Get busy dying "
I have to admire someone who is so intelligent that s/he can sum up the complexities of this controversial and seminal movie in one sentence. I also admire the skill with which that sentence is rendered. Notice, for example, that the sentence technically means that Kill Bill is racist garbage. This is clearly a insightful comment on the link between the violence in Kill Bill and racism. Also the fact that the author did not construct a technically correct sentence is only a commentary on his or her disdain for the movie in question. It is my deep but irrational hope that all other posters here can rise to this stellar height of intellectual honesty, skill and courage. Kudos!
shareSounds like arrogance.
Anyways I've watched parts of this film and am amazed by the technical aspects and the fact that the film is an epic. However, as I was watching it, I definitely noticed that the racism was prevalent that it really took away from the film and made it hard to even appreciate it.
D.W. Griffith was an influential filmmaker, that wasn't racist, he just found a story to make a film with. The author of the novel The Klansmen(man?), that Birth of a Nation is based on, is a racist disillusioned man.
I say just watch the technical pieces of this film, don't sit through the whole thing not because of its length, but because its racism is gratuitous and takes away from the film marvels of the film. It's one of the only times I'd recommend jumping around or skipping scenes in a film.
I am shocked, totally SHOCKED that this movie is not in the Top 250. 11.5% of voters give it a score of 1? It is only the #19 film of the 1910-1919 period? Sickening! My faith and respect in IMDB and its patrons is continually diminished.
(UCHoodman, this isn't directed at you specifically)
If you can't separate the message from the film, and if you can't recognize that innumerable technical and logistical marvels this film achieved, then I can't understand how you consider yourself a serious film buff. If you ask any respected film critic or scholar they will almost ALWAYS list this among the 100 best films ever made.
I guess people are so self-conscious in this PC age that they will automatically condemn a masterpiece of cinema (most likely without having seen it) purely because its views do not align with their own. Grow up.
PC is killing a lot of films these days. thank you josh ff8(final fantasy 8? There are some wonderful things that happen directing wise in this film, so I agree that every film buff should at least check out some scenes of this.
shareIs there some rule that people are supposed to rate a film only on technical aspects? I thought people were free to rate a movie based on whether they thought it was good or bad. Why do people expect so much from imdb?
shareAnd "Fight Club" sure is politically correct...
Top 250 are favourite movies, not most important ones.
what isn't PC about fight club? it's marxist revolutionary nhilistic movie that promotes individualist collectivism, that the entire point of PC because PC is a creation of the centre for marxist studies a.k.a. the frankfurt school. It's intentionally created to bring about egalitarian genocidal revolutions within "Western" nation under the guise of betterment. Fight club is a movie to appeal to the lowest emotions of the revolutionary anti-materialist marxist egalitarian. They make a commune based on agrarianism and destroy and reform the identity of the people they recruit. it's PC propaganda 101, this is specfically targeted at young angst ridden white males, the message is "let it all burn" "who cares about society?" "smash it all!"
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This is gibberish. First off, the PC movement is not even related to marxism or revolution, and is essentially the working opposite of nihilism; pouring meaning and history into words.
Second off, Fight Club is pretty clearly of the opinion that the society formed in the movie is unworkable and deluded... they are a bunch of shiftless nobodies following a madman; following a philosophy even the crazy person rejects in the end.
Third, "let it all burn", "smash it all", and "who cares about society?" are all statements fundamentally opposed to the kind of nanny state liberal philosophies that spawned the PC movement.
Fight Club is not Marxist in the slightest and it sure as hell isn't PC. Fight Club is predominantly about minimalism after nihilism, where as Marxism is about taking what is yours as workers, Minimalism is just about taking what you need and constantly rejecting consumerism and society at large.
shareThere's a fairly readable essay on the fascism of Gladiator and Fight Club floating about.
The Nazis were all for agrarianism too, whoopdee doo.
At the same time Fight Club questions our values and consumerism, it appeals to them with a forked tongue.
fight club is one of the best films ever made (and fincher's masterpiece) - so yes, it DESERVES to be in the top 250.
deal with it
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I think this film deserves to be in the top 250 because it is a landmark film. But the top 250 is moot because it isn't based on the quality of a movie, but by how popular it is. That's why Dark Knight was #1 when it first came out.
And people, remember that BoaN was made in 1915...people had a different sense of race, etc. as we do today.
You just ain't zany enough to rock with Shady
http://www.youtube.com/user/UofLCardFan08
I believe that not only is the film one of the most influential films of all time, but that it does convey an important message. You all seem to think that it holds a racist message. Based on what? Huckleberry Finn is a supposedly racist book, and people condemn it simply because it uses racial epithets one too many times, completely ignorant of the fact that it is an influential book.
You all also seem to be forgetting that Griffith did not consider this film to be racist (based on the notion that he directed "Intolerance: Love's Struggle Through the Ages" shortly after this.
And to all of you who says the film has boring imagery (like someone said about the still of a cat attacking a dog), you are all missing the imagery it conveys. Cats and dogs hate each other for what reason? Innate views that have no merit.
You all should respect people's right to make a film. A film is not meant to be seen as propaganda, because technically any movie can convey messages that some feel attempt to coerce others to the film's point. If nothing else, watch the movie based on the technical aspects of the film, and how it influences films today.
To put it simply, lots of people are too sensitive about things in the past. Everyone realizes how vile this film is, everyone knows it's propoganda. Because of this, however, they do not respect the film's importance (single most important American film ever) or its quality at that time.
Why do people feel like they have to hide from this film or underestimate its importance? It is racist, but it was made almost 100 years ago. You'd think the "controversy" would slow down and this film could be seen as it is without people feeling like they have to make some sort of statement against it.
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In simple terms: One of the greatest movies ever made. 10/10
"I told you to keep away from that radio. If that battery is dead it'll have company." Cody Jarrett
How is this movie not in the top 250
I see that most people in this thread tend to forget that people from other countries also vote in the ratings of movies. For us, this movie does not have such a high cultural significance as it does for americans, and we perceive it like a racist propaganda film that did more evil than good in history (this film led to the reborn of the KKK and they used this film as a recruitment tool until the 70's).
Sure, it does have some technical merits, but it is a lie that it was the first film that influenced the rest. Georges Melies was already playing with camera angles, editing techniques, SFX, and other optical tricks and camera shots that truly revolutionized cinema.
The reason why Birth of a Nation is not on the top 250 is quite simple: Because it doesn't deserve to be there.
Fact is that it is a very overrated movie which was successful because back then most americans were as racist as the people depicted in the film, so it made a cultural impact (and sadly, even today, almost 100 years later many people still adhere to that ideology, after all the KKK continues to exist). For people in the rest of the world, not so much.
Ironically D.W. Griffith has another movie which is highly underrated and far superior to Birth of a Nation: Intolerance, which was actually made when Griffih was bothered of being accused as a racist due to his most famous film.
Was he truly a racist? Personally I believe he was more racist than he admitted, I find it hard to believe that he wasn't aware that he was making a very racist movie that was glorifying a hate group.
Christianity's GREATEST ally and BEST friend throughout history is Satan
Hear, hear!
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