MovieChat Forums > September Dawn (2007) Discussion > In defense of my religion!!

In defense of my religion!!


First off I will say that I posted on here a few years ago that I would see this movie and give it a fair shake. I thought it was wrong of people of my faith to come on here and judge a movie they had not even seen. I watched it and it was completely inaccurate and none of it was true. There is a documentary filmmaker that has done an excellent film on the Mountain Meadows Massacre. Chris Cain who directed this film stole things from this guys documentary and when it was found out the guy wanted to sue Cain in court. Because Cain had more money and backing the suit was thrown out. The filmmaker named Brian Patrick came out against the film and said it was inaccurate and did not portray the LDS Church fairly. I have been a member of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints for 30 years and it should be also noted that I am a history major. I have researched Mountain Meadows thoroughly and I can say with firm conviction that the Church was in no way responsible. The Prophet Brigham Young made the statement and told the brethern that when the immigrants arrived to "Leave Them Alone." You can find this statement in the Utah state archives and there is plenty of documentation on the quote. There were angry disenfranchised people that disobeyed the Prophet's counsel and took the law into their own hands. The documentary I referred to above is called "Burying the Past" Chris Cain and his son Dean Cain made this horrible movie which is as Roger Ebert quoted in his review "A Mormon Hit job." A new book has also been released that refutes Dan Bagley and Sally Denton who have written books on Mountain Meadows and they want to blame Brigham Young and the Church for the whole thing. The book has been written by three historical scholars and is well documented and footnoted extremely well. The movie September Dawn paints my religion and past leaders in a bad light and none of it is true. The way that our ceremonies in the Temple are portrayed is horrible and very offensive. Showing Dean Cain who plays Joseph Smith as a vindictive and vengeful person is also offensive and wrong. The movies is a huge let down and doesn't make you feel good at all. Many critics have denounced the film as one that obviously paints the LDS church in a bad light. The new book that will be the definitive study on this subject is called Massacre at Mountain Meadows. The Mormons in their early history were driven out because of not only their religious beliefs but because they were anti-slavery and they were friendly with the Indians. Young boys were murdered, women raped and houses burned all because of what the beliefs of the early saints were. From all I've read and believe me I've read both sides the evidence against Brigham Young and the Church is circumstantial and has never been proven. The people who committed this massacre were angry members of the Church that wanted revenge after Joseph Smith and his brother Hyrum were murdered. They went against what Brigham Young said and took the law into their own hands. I am a firm believer in my faith and am not brainwashed. Problem is I can't prove to anybody who would respond to this that I'm not. I have researched and read a lot of the early history of my Church. I firmly believe in my faith. I am also Christian and believe that Jesus Christ is the Son of God and that he died and was resurrected. I believe God speaks to man daily and that the Bible is not all there is. I believe the Bible to be the word of God but I also believe in the Book of Mormon and that it was written by Holy Prophets who were called of God also. I believe that Joseph Smith was called as a Prophet of God and that he did see God the Father and his son Jesus Christ.

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I have just seen this movie and have to agree that it does take liberties with the facts. However, it's hard to defend the church actions around the incident when the church made no effort to arrest and prosecute those involved, nor to affect any redress of the families of the victims.

I can’t conceive of how anyone could defend the lack of action from Mormon leaders after this incident. Were church leaders so cold hearted that they felt no need to acknowledge what their followers had done? Did they feel no pity for the families and friends of the victims?

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Brigham Young was a pig, a whore, and not only KNEW about the massacre but ORDERED IT and you damned well know it, but being a Mormon and a coward, you don't admit what you know in your heart! Joseph Smith was a con artist of the lowest caliber, like Joel Osteen, Joyce Meyer, and countless other charlatans who sucker fools like you so that they can attain blood-wealth just like churches like yours have been doing for centuries. May God eternally DAMN the Mormon church and forever curse whores like Brigham Young and Joseph Smith!

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Brigham Young was a pig, a whore, and not only KNEW about the massacre but ORDERED IT and you damned well know it, but being a Mormon and a coward, you don't admit what you know in your heart! Joseph Smith was a con artist of the lowest caliber, like Joel Osteen, Joyce Meyer, and countless other charlatans who sucker fools like you so that they can attain blood-wealth just like churches like yours have been doing for centuries. May God eternally DAMN the Mormon church and forever curse whores like Brigham Young and Joseph Smith!
Where is your evidence that Brigham Young not only knew about the massacre, but ordered it? I think the first part of your allegation is likely true, but not the second part. But I have no evidence to cite either way.

I think if you believe that Joseph Smith was a con artist you would have to also believe that his caliber was not very low as he created a movement that has lasted close to 200 years and has millions of followers. However, I do not think his motivation was seeking wealth and you also would be hard put to prove that.

I also have a higher opinion of Joel Osteen than you do.

Oh Lord, you gave them eyes but they cannot see...

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Had Joseph Smith followed the warnings of the Church leaders when he first went to them with his wacked out story of having been visited by God, when in fact, they knew from their knowledge of the Scriptures it could only be demons (most probably from loco weed or bad liquor), your post would not be here, nor the Mormons. And the Mountain Meadows Massacre wouldn't have taken place.

Under our clothes, we are all naked!

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[deleted]

I do not think his (Joseph Smith's) motivation was seeking wealth..."


Make that "wealth and power and sex" and you'd be closer to the whole story, IMAO.

"I don't deduce, I observe."

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Make that "wealth and power and sex" and you'd be closer to the whole story, IMAO.
I think a stronger case could be made for the power and sex angle than wealth, especially something along the lines of wishing to obtain influence. But I think a case can be made that Joseph had a weakness for the ladies.

Oh Lord, you gave them eyes but they cannot see...

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