MovieChat Forums > Kontroll (2003) Discussion > Identity of pusher? - BIG SPOILERS!!

Identity of pusher? - BIG SPOILERS!!


I've seen many reviews of this where they class the battle between Bulcsu and the pusher as a straight fight but there are two theories I'd like to discuss about who or what the pusher is:

1: Bulcsu is the pusher, in a Fight Club style the railing battle is the equivalent of the gunshot to the cheek at the end of FC, a symbolic 'killing' of another personality. He and the pusher each dress alike, there's the scene where he closes his eyes and lets the pusher pass, and his dream where he goes in the small tunnel and sees the pusher (his character had not seen the pusher or his appearance previous to this) all point to this.

2: I'd described the mood of the film to my brother who saw it with me as being like Pi meets Twin Peaks (got the owl), and perhaps the pusher, like Bob in TP, is a malevolent force representing violence and aggression. There's the quote about spending enough time around aggressive people that you become aggressive yourself (adds to theory 1), and the appearance of the pusher running towards the scene where Laci slits the guys throat.

Any thoughts?

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All of the arguments about who the pusher is (Bulscu, C., Worker...) are valid, because possibly the identity of the pusher could be more than just death, or fear, or evil. Perhaps he is a common thread through all of these people, and that's why each person could exhibit characteristics of the pusher, or conversely, why the pusher could exhibit characteristics of each of them. His identity might be less about death, fear or evil, and more about the fact that these emotions/characteristics can and perhaps do exist in all people... maybe in all of us there's a little destruction that runs in the little labyrinth (metro system) that is our brain.

Besides, things with definitive answers are boring.

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In all honesty ... I don't have a clue what this movie is about. All the theories sound compelling and, given I'm unfamiliar with the culture of Hungarian cinema and know nothing about the director, I likely won't ever know what Kontroll means -- whether it recounts the salvation of a fallen angel, or if it serves as a metaphor for the class divisions of post-communist Hungary, etc. They all sound like good theories -- they're as entertaining as the movie itself and as deep as the movie seems to be.

One possible idea I was kicking around: The whole thing is a mind trip exploration of self actualization a la Kafka's Metamorphosis or Hesse's Demian. The subway system is a metaphor for B's unconscious or subconscious mind -- each character represents different, and often at odds, impulses within B's mind. B may be a very conflicted, possibly demented, character, and the plot represents his strive for stability or sanity. The pusher, in this case, isn't necessarily a bad man -- he takes out B's mental trash -- the weaker or less desirable or whatever aspects of B's inner mind. He's cleaning house. Of course, he poses a threat to B's core personality -- the pusher could very well "trash" B's core. Kinda like that Cusack film "Identity."

By the end, however, B gains "control" over the pusher -- or, at least, overcomes him to such a degree that B is able to achieve a higher, more stable conscious -- a feminine consciousness, perhaps? Is that what "saves" him? Will he stay "saved"? Maybe. Maybe not. Keep in mind that B wasn't ALWAYS underground. A relapse, of course, could be possible -- even if the stairs only go up. And the pusher won't ever die -- he's as much a part of B as your immune system is a part of you. He didn't get splattered, did he?

Who knows? The subway official who greets the viewer on my edition of the disc maintains that the entire movie is symbolic. What it's symbolic of ... I have no idea.

Still, here's another theory. And this might be REALLY out there, but ...




... Kontroll is a movie about a madman who runs around the Hungarian subway system, tossing people in front of trains.

_Richard

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I'm inserting my reply here to back up richcapo's position. On the day I saw the movie I immediately had the same thing in mind. In fact, while I can understand all the talk about 'concretely which actor might have played the pusher', or even about 'what symbolism we could explain into the movie'. But it just seems totally clear to me that every person here represented something in one person's mind. It's not that Bulcsú and the pusher are one. It's that everyone here is one. We see inside a mind in crisis - that explains the setting which is all too obviously down below. It's the subconscious.
The title is like a magician's move to divert the audience's attention from discovering the secret to a trick. 'Kontroll' in Hungary made everyone think of those funny ticket controllers whom everyone loves to hate in Budapest. In fact it is what it is. This is a fight for 'Kontroll'. That of a personality.

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... Kontroll is a movie about a madman who runs around the Hungarian subway system, tossing people in front of trains.

I loved your post.

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Thanks, Ellen. Check out my profile if you'd like to read more of them.

Be well.

_Richard

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What did the director want to say with the scene at the end of the movie when Bulcsú is running from the train and the pusher is running behind him? Bulcsú got away but the pusher didn't make it and died.

Well, maybe that the evil side of Bulcsú was the pusher and that it died/left him when it got hit by the train (leaving only the good side of Bulcsú left). Wich in turn allowed Bulcsú to leave everything behind him and go up to the real world...

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One of the earlier posters said that it was a worker who did maintainance on the tracks, and we see him during one scene (after Bulscu has dinner with the train driver), using a saw. Both men stop and glance at each other for a second. Whether or not this film is about good and evil, I think it's also about redemption (for Bulscu, obviously).

"Death, you are my bitch lover!"

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[deleted]

I'm The Pusher.

Great movie.Still need to buy.Ashame we got shafted on it in R1.

Why is the rum always gone?Oh... that's why.

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Pusher is Bulcsu, you can see that Bulcsu's clothes have a hood. In the beginning of the film when Bulcsu's co-workers are in the work meeting, a reference is made that they are on probation from prison, so my guess is that Bulcsu also has been in prison; which is why his ex-boss thought he had been travelling abroad. The reason why he pushes people in front of the train is because he probably suffers from build up frustration from his job and he is also eager to leave the underground but somehow finds himself trapped. All by all I thought the film had a heavy Dostoyevsky influence, especially the nihilsm found in notes from the underground and crime and punishment. Some people have mentioned that teh pusher is Bulcsu's fear and demon, that seems quite right to me; it is something that possesses him (possession as an element suburban decay), you can see that the pusher does not really exist because he always just vanishes; at the end for instance when Bulcsu gets pushed into those shelves and those pipes and stuff fall down etc, when he gets up again you can see that there was no one else there; so at the end he is just running away from himself and when he dies at the end, the bear girl becomes and angel who leads him out of the underground. As for a possible meaning of the 'pushing', perhaps because Bulcsu is afraid of his own destiny and wants to hide from the world (he can't leave the underground because he cannot face the world and his destiny) he pushes people unto their destiny. I also like the Kafka like distinction between the workers and the suits, all by7 all a great film.


SVN


Check out my work: http://www.amazon.com/gp/search/002-9286149-5088812?search-alias=aps&keywords=steven%20van%20neste

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wow..........OMG

I just watched this movie,
and when I had finished it, I was kind of disappointed, but.....
this topic RULES...so many VERY interesting interpretations

Thumbs up to everyone here!

especially the part with the daughter = angel, uncle= angel in his "prime-time"
knocked me away...I'm NOT gonna sell this DVD anymore...!

I hate "I-rarely give away 10/10-Users"

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There is no reference to prison... "Probation" was a reference to being on probation at work.

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You can see the bottom half of the pusher's face when he walks toward Bulscu. Look at it in stop motion.

It is actor Gyozo Szabo,
http://www.port.hu/picture/instance_2/11202_2.jpg
not the character Bulscu


I'm pretty sure that whoever said it was the same character as the mechanic grinding the rail seen immediately before Bulscu mees Bela is correct. The mechanic's face is harder to see since he only turns a little towards Bulscu. But everything else about the scene fits that idea.

I wish the storyline included the capture of the pusher. A nice ending would be for Bulscu to run from the pusher on the rails. The pusher chases him down the rails while a train approaches from behinf. Buslcu makes it out but pusher is shown being totally obliterated by the train!

Very good entertaining film.

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[deleted]

Great discussion. The pusher just seemed like a metaphysical symbol of 'death' to me -- the classic silhouette of the hood -- so it never occurred to me to wonder if it was also a real character in the movie, even though apparently (from the discussion above) the pusher was played by the same actor who played the 'mechanic.' The other reason I didn’t think it was intended to be a real character is that I don’t think I recall anyone seeing the death character except Bulcsu (but I could be wrong about that).

Also, did anyone else notice what seemed to be Christ references? When Bulcsu is tied and beaten up by Gonzo and his team, and is then cut down by Bela the old driver, one of Bulcsu's hands has been really badly cut on the palm. When I saw it again, that resonated with Bulcsu's comment to his old co-worker that he had to leave his old job because he couldn't stand having to match his own perfection anymore (or words to that effect). And then Bulcsu wins the race with Death, and ascends from the underworld with an angel. (Of course, this is a particularly human and imperfect Christ...) There was also the intro comment before the movie from the real-life subway supervisor, who said the director wanted to make a symbolic movie about good and evil.

But all the symbolism aside (most of which was delicately enough handled that I didn't notice until the very end anyway, or even a day later in retrospect), the movie worked tremendously well on many levels, as thriller and character study and “guy” story and dark comedy -- all extremely human and in this world, not just symbols -- which is how I'd define a great movie.

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[deleted]

One thing I don't think anyone has mentioned is that when Muki asks Bulcsu if he is the pusher, Bulcsu doesn't respond. He pushes Muki down and walks away. It's almost as if he isn't sure, or maybe he does know in some part of him that he is, or could be, the one who is pushing people in front of the trains.

I'm not really sure what I think about who the pusher is etc, but this is a very interesting discussion.

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The pusher, IMO, is the maintenace guy. Look no further than Bulcsu's dream: the bear-suited woman takes him down to that alternate tunnel entrance, and it's there that Bulcsu sees the hooded man cowering in the cave.

Later on in the movie, where is the maintenance guy working? At the alternate tunnel entrance...

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Just watched this for the first time and was very impressed - I'm also very impressed by this thread, one of the best I've seen on IMDB, I think, with some very interesting theories that have certainly made me think again.

I tend towards the split personality theory I think.

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* Just watched this for the first time and was very impressed - I'm also very impressed by this thread, one of the best I've seen on IMDB, I think, with some very interesting theories that have certainly made me think again.

I tend towards the split personality theory I think.* QUOTE

Lol, you watched it on Channel 4 on Friday as well?!

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i just saw this about 5 minutes ago, and i can everyone right here and now, that woman was drunk, very drunk.

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There was no pusher. The whole story was a hallucination in the mind of the drunk woman before she committed suicide.

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OK... so even if the Pusher was the same man as the mechanic... maybe the mechanic was just imagined by Bulcsu in that one scene. No one else ever acknowledged his presence.
I think the Pusher is the same as Bulcsu, myself; he is the darker side of him.
But get this... what if Bulcsu actually died himself at the ending "railing"? He is symbolically lead up the esculators into the bright white lights being led by the chick (who was dressed as an angel). There seems to be a basic "good vs. evil" theme throughout this film as Bulcsu battles his inner demons.
Another example would be when the girl is eating with her father, who she refers to as "an angel". The next shot he actually has an aurora over his head (bright lighting technique). He also tries to guide Bulscu in the right direction, and also symbolically is "driving" him (on the train) towards salvation.

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in my opinion the 2 theories mentioned at the top are correct.

- note - the look on bulscu's face when the camera zooms in on him on the monitor (when being interrogated) is not one of shock/fear, but one of aggression/hatred. this is just a small piece of a big puzzle that leads me to believe bulscu is another tyler durden.

Raoul Duke: "Oh, god, did you eat all this acid?"

Dr. Gonzo: "That's Right! ... Music!"

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Just watched in on TMC then rewatched it on TMC west. I agree with the pusher being Bulscu. I have heard the mechanic theory a few times but what would be the point? He is barely even a character in the movie. However, I have a bit of a different theory. Does anybody think it could all be a dream? Kind of like Muholland Drive. A lot of the things that happen in the movie are not logical and therefore similar to what happens in dreams. For instance, why on earth would Sofia ride the metro in a bear suit? At first I thought that maybe her job required her to dress in a bear suit, perhaps working for childrens birthday parties but then she discusses losing her job with her father and she turns up in the bear suit after that discussion. Sofia in the bear suit could represent safety and security to Bulscu.

I also believe in the theory of Bulscu's good side battling his evil side but I am wondering if this is taking place in his dream/nightmare. The dream he had when he saw the hooded man in the tunnel could be a dream within a dream I suppose but I think Sofia (in the bear suit once again) was making him take a look at himself.

BTW, I read that the director/writer is making a movie with Kate Beckinsale.

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I personally wished the director had given us a few clues as to who the pusher was so there wouldn't be endless debate on it without anyone ever knowing the true answer!

Does anyone (who has the DVD) know if he does reveal the pushers identity on it?

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I know, I was a little surprised when I saw it the first time. I'm going to get the DVD soon so I"ll let you know. BTW, it airs on TMC tomorrow (11/26).

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oh my god, dudes, it's so obvious. the killer is that dude that sits in the main meeting room after the meeting at the beginning of the film. c'mon! you know, the guy that's sitting alone and he's spaced out, and the boss dude tells him to get moving. he was totally the killer. screw that fight club crap, and forget symbolism, it's that random dude. end of story.

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The DEFINITIVE explanation..

I have been a fan of World Cinema since I was little.. when I would regularly watch Hong Kong, Indian, Pakistani and Italian movies.. (as well as your run of the mill English movies)..

When I heard that this movie was a Hungarian movie I was intrigued.. as I had never seen a Hungarian movie before in my life… so I thought id give it a chance seeing as it got a good review…

Well what can I say… This move was just EXCELLENT!!!!

A massive BIG UP to the director for REALLY putting Hungary movies on the world map!!

OK heres the Ninjas explanation of the whole thing..

Our friend Bulcsú is a real person who works in the Metro underground.. not in hell.. but the underground!

Next the dude suffers from a severe case of split personality! His alternative personality is the Pusher.. an deep down inside.. a part of Bulcsú knows it.

The other theory that it is the underground rail worker is probably the most strongest from all others.. reason being.. when Bulcsú stares at the underground worker when hes working on the track.. the worker stops and turns his head to one side, as if he knows that Bulcsú is looking at him.

NOW.. when Bulcsú wakes up from his beating and the disco is taking place, he spots the pusher an starts to follow him.. while hes following him.. the pusher stops and turns his head to one side.. again showing that he knows Bulcsú is behind looking at him.

But the one thing that proves all other theories besides the split personality explanation as wrong is this.. when Bulcsú is running through the tunnel at the end with the Pusher chasing him, an he jumps onto the platform an survives.. the train doesn’t screech to a halt or anything.. it just stops as normal.. meaning that there was no other guy.. it was just a figment of Bulcsú’s imagination, who just got killed.

HOWEVER….

Or it could be that it REALLY was the underground worker all along.. who had a secret trap door or tunnel which he jumped into and saved himself from becoming mincemeat.. thus meaning that he’s still ALIVE!!!!!!

Regards

Ninja Sinai

P.S. This has to be one of the BEST message board topics on imdb by far!! Overall a wicked movie.. HIGHLY RECOMMENDED!!

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I've got to go with the split personality myself; to me, it seems more logical. Especially when he is accused by his boss and called on it when the boss mentions the overhead camera. Obviously, Bulcsú is starting to panick and there is a hint of fear in his eyes even though, he keeps denying being the "pusher." Perhaps, he doesn't remember.

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oh my god, dudes, it's so obvious. the killer is that dude that sits in the main meeting room after the meeting at the beginning of the film. c'mon! you know, the guy that's sitting alone and he's spaced out, and the boss dude tells him to get moving

*rolls eyes* Uh no it's not obvious. That was the guy who wound up slitting the commuter's throat. He was the guy who cracked under pressure and then he was gone. There would be no point in making him the pusher. He was used to show what people might end up like if they work in the Metro too long.

Besides, like everyone said, the pusher was played by a different actor! sheesh.

What I want to know is, how did they not capture the Pusher on tape if they have all those surveillance cameras in the station. Right after Bootsie's killed, we see the PUsher physically walk by Bulcsu, BUT then on the tape, there is no trace of the Pusher walking by. That made me question if this was all in Bulcsu's head or not.

Still, a terrific film!

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excellent image not being caught in cctv gives us the answer

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Just because the guy didn't get caught on the Closed Circuit doesn't mean he wasn't there. The suit even says at one point that if you spent enough time down there, you'd figure out the cameras and how to avoid them. The Pusher obviously did this. Also, there is the scene when the mechanic is on the traintracks when Bulscu is going to visit Bela. That mechanic CLEARLY wasn't supposed to be there, and he had a buzzsaw... who uses a buzzsaw to work on traintracks? It's pretty clear that he's trying to sabotage the trains in that scene. Bulscu doesn't stop him though, because he has that latent desire to see the disaster. But yeah, Bulscu doesn't have the penchant for violence that some of his coworkers do. The entire story is about his fear of developing such a penchant.

Notice how his wounds never heal? The constant fights he gets into, the trials, the tribulations, they are all indicative of his need for repentance. It's sort of like he has a deathwish, but he also sees that as the only way to find a way out, by fighting and scraping through all the *beep*

Also, in case anyone was wondering, in traditional literary theory, the owl represents the concept of wisdom. The times you see the owl are a) at the beginning of the dream sequence, b) when he finds the dead-end wall at the end of the tunnel, and c) when he finally finds the exit with the girl (angel). So those represent the three instances of "knowing." In the dream he knows his penchant for violence - that he could become the Pusher, living like an animal in the subway system, outcast from society. When he finds the dead-end, he then knows his prison and that he must find some means of escape. And in the end, he finally finds the exit and redemption through the act of beating the Pusher and finding love.

Woo! I'm a dork.

My reflexes are five hundred times faster than Mike Tyson's!!

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Hi,

I just saw it last night and I haven't had much time to "digest" it yet. Most of the time I'm very literal-minded. You know, sometimes a cigar is just a cigar. My initial reaction was that the lead and the slasher are two seperate entities.

Your theory is very plausible, though. One reason is that strange scene of the lead character climbing through that tunnel to the slasher's lair, at the behest of teddy bear girl. And the slasher's reaction (slasher's get scared, too ;) On the platform, right after Bootsie got it, B. closes his eyes as the slasher approaches. Not the smartest thing to do when a maniac approaches you, especially if you're unusually intelligent (as his former co-worker implies), though neither is racing a train! Also, the lack of slasher footage in the Bootsie video.

After all that, I still think they're two seperate entities. Balcsu does not have that extreem rage -- to say the least -- the slasher obviously has. If fact, Balcsu seems just the opposite. He seems more the philosophical type. Remember the reason he gave his former co-worker about not completing the project? That perfectionism-streak is a sign, to me, of someone intellectually inclined. Neurotic, probably, but that's a giant step from homicidal. Also, his choice of staying underground, literally, seems more of an escape (of his high expectations/perfectionism??), where as the slasher -- like the owl -- is a night predator, and underground it's always "night".

The "teddy bear" girl's attraction is another sign to me that he's not giving off that disturbed, murderous vibe. Women really are intuitive. They have to be. This woman is odder than most, so is prob even more intuitive. When that poor azzhole lost it & was holding a knife to that fat ass's throat, his co-workers asked B. to diffuse the situation. You'd ask someone strong, with an inner calm or wisdom to do that, not the office hothead. Their reactions to the slasher accusation spoke volumes, too. Again, if he gave off an inkling of that anger/unbalanced vibe -- and they see it everyday -- they wouldn't have been so surprised & saddened.

Lastly, it just seemed that he wanted to kick Bootsie's ass a bit. Killing him seemed WAY out of character, but if he were going to, you know he would've roughed him up first.

If the slasher is real it's because there are always monsters in the dark, especially in subterreanean lairs.

If the slasher's only symbolic, I don't think he necessarily represents Balcsu's dark side. He probably represents Man's dark side, and Balcsu is symbolic of the other side: troubled, but decent. The slasher has lost all hope, and has succumed to "the depths". Balcsu still has a little optimism left, and joins Teddy bear girl (now mothwoman??) on the escalator going UP.

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[deleted]

I doesn't matter who the pusher is though - the film is about Bulcsú and not a murder mystery about the pusher. You are missing the point completely here since the storyline bout Bulcsú and his journey through a difficult part of his life is well made and complete.

The disclaimer part at the beginning explains clearly that it is a highly symbolic film and in this way I think it has more in common with films like Donnie Darko and David Lynch films and shows like Twin Peaks than Fight Club (which has also been repeatedly suggested). In this way, I do not believe Bulcsú is the pusher but I accept that, like Sofie who is a positive symbolic character, whoever the pusher is, is also a seperate real characer (personally I don't think , the cripple is the most likely). This can be compaired direcrtly to Donnie Darko where the bunny rabbit guy (Frank) is a symbol and manevolent force but is also a real life character. The two are unconnected but the image is used as symbolicly.

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Yeah, I think 'punkylittlemonkey' is right. You are missing the point. The very fact that the ending/identity of the pusher was left open-ended is one of the best features of the film, in my opinion.
You could say they should have "Hollywood-ized" it and spoon-fed us with all the answers, but then it would just suck.
I liked the 'feel' of this movie, and the questions it raises.

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My 2 cents:

I don't believe that the director created a movie about a redeemed murderer, so I don't believe Bulscu is the pusher. Whether the pusher is an actual person or a representation of evil/death is not made clear either (thankfully). For all we know, the whole movie was a dream or it could have been a Bulscu's test of redemption to enter Heaven (i.e. Bulscu's already dead).

Either way, fantastic film and excellent thread here.

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I agree, although I can't speak for the director... but it's very possible that the pusher was a real person and that the movie still represents the symbolism of Bulcsú's redemption... I agree with the poster who said that Bulcsú does not show any of the characteristics of someone who is angry with the world that he would push random people onto the tracks and I don't think the movie was about Bulcsú being schizophrenic.

If we go with symbolism, then the pusher could represent death. Who else could have control over the lights? Why else would the pusher being running toward the knife incident. And maybe it's only a coincidence but the two times we see the pusher in the tunnels before the final chase scene (once in his dream and once as the worker on the rail), alternate tunnels were shown.

Of the death theory, some may say you cannot kill death... But noone ever said the pusher was actually dead. It's just that he was able to escape death...

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