Lucifer or Satan?


So I just noticed that whenever I want to re-watch Peter Stormare playing as Satan/Lucifer, the youtube videos calls Peter Stormare Lucifer instead of Satan.

So here is an example
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7rVFse1LLQs

Notice the description calls Peter Stormare as Lucifer instead of Satan or whatever

Now If you read through the credits list and look for once again Peter Stormare
http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0360486/fullcredits?ref_=tt_cl_sm#cast

Peter Stormare - Satan

Now I guess some people may just say "Oh it doesn't matter because both names work, etc" But to me, I love the name Lucifer more than Satan. Does anyone else prefer the name Lucifer or Satan? Just hearing the word Lucifer really gives me a good goosebumps!

Anyways, looking forward to some answers or debate about this topic or anything related to the Peter Stormare

cheers!

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Lucifer is nicer than Satan lol.
I don't know, Gabriel called him by many other names too. He himself says that he missed the old names.

So I guess he is actually both names, and many others.

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lol thanks for the response. Yeah I also agree with you on the Lucifer is nicer than Satan part as well lol

What's interesting is that when I did a little bit more research on the matter via wikipedia

Satan
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Satan

"This article is about the concept of Satan. For the concept of "devil", see Devil. For other uses, see Satan (disambiguation)."

Lucifer
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lucifer

"This article is about the religious figure. For other uses, see Lucifer (disambiguation)."

I wonder why the Lucifer part didn't mention "For the concept of "Devil", see Devil. For other uses, See Satan"

Since both names technically mean the same thing I guess? Also, what other names did Gabriel say? Just curious since I am hard of hearing and it can be challenging for me to hear certain words/names/etc during movies. thanks!

cheers! :)

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someone in another thread said that they were supposed to be two different entities, not the same one. But I don't know. I thought they were the same.

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Do you happen to know whom that person was or perhaps a permalink from that thread? If not then no worries, I bet whomever that person was will hopefully see the title of this thread and possibly provide his/her 2 cents on the Lucifer / Satan thing.

And you are not alone because when I first saw this movie 8 years ago in theaters and heard the name Lucifer. After the movie ended, I decided to ask my friend who went with me to see the movie about Lucifer. I basically said "So Lucifer is pretty much Satan, right?" and he said "yep that's pretty much it" and that was about it LOL

but fast forward 8 years later, I finally got a chance to watch Constantine for the 2nd time this past weekend and I just wanted to learn more about the difference between Lucifer and Satan.

This is why I created this thread because I am hoping more members will see this thread and hopefully provide some details/information or their "2 cents" on the matter between Lucifer and Satan :)

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I know that this is from a while ago, and you've probably already done your own research on this, but I believe the distinction between the three Satan, Lucifer and Devil is that A) Satan is most likely a title bestowed upon an evil entity that opposes God in the Abrahamic religion; therefore, there could have been multiple Satans, but no specific entity is said to be Satan. B) Lucifer is a fallen angel that opposed God who then in turn created Hell for Lucifer to be contained, not for him to rule, so it can be assumed that Lucifer became the Satan when he was opposing God, but could have lost the title allowing it to be taken up by another entity during his imprisonment. C) The Devil (or a devil) is a term for a multi-religion entity that is the personification of evil. Satan would be a devil or The Devil in the Abrahamic religions, but there are also Devils in other religions. However, in the Abrahamic religions The Devil is shown to be a different entity than Lucifer as he appears in Heaven to speak with God, while Lucifer is confined to Hell, so it can be assumed that this Devil is also (the) Satan, and not Lucifer. Please take this with a grain of salt, as I am no theology expert, and much of this can be open for interpretation.

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In the original Jewish mythology as laid out in the Torah / Bible, Satan is simply an angel. The story of Job even names him as one of the sons of god. There is also a fallen angel in Judaism, but his name is Azazel, not Satan. The Old Testamentarian Satan was never intended to be anything but a loyal servant of the Judaic god Yahweh.

The name Ha-Satan means as much as accuser or prosecutor in Hebrew, and Satan's role was just that. He is the prosecutor of mankind, while Yahweh is mankind's ultimate judge. Satan points out human failings to Yahweh and occasionally tests the faith of individual people, as he does in the Job story. It is important to note that the Judaic god Yahweh created Satan specifically for this purpose. He is not an adversary of Yahweh.

The Judaism-derived Christian mythology later conflated several different entities into one superpowered antagonist of their trinity god. Christians equated Satan with the snake in Genesis, an animal that was never meant to be anything other than a talking snake. The snake is simply a plot device and only acts malevolently because the authors of the Jewish creation myth didn't think very highly of snakes.

Other characters that were thrown in with Satan include the devil aka the father of lies first mentioned by the gospel authors, who were strongly influenced by Greek mythology and also invented the Christian hell based on the Greek Hades. Further mixed in with Satan are several characters from the book of revelations, such as the dragon / serpent and the beast. And then there is a passage in Isaiah, which brings us to the term Lucifer.

In Isaiah 14, the author muses about the rise and fall of (presumably) a Babylonian king. He writes "How you are fallen from heaven, o day star ... you said in your heart, 'I will ascend to heaven ...' but you are brought down to Sheol, to the far reaches of the pit."
When the word "day star" in this passage was translated to Latin, it became "Lucifer" (literally "lightbringer"), the Latin name for the day star / morning star / planet Venus.

Now, it is important to understand that Sheol is not the same as the Hades-inspired Christian hell. Sheol is simply the realm of the dead, a place of peace and tranquility (akin to Hel in Norse mythology) rather than a place of punishment. Ancient Judaism had no heaven or hell. After death, both good and evil souls spent eternity in Sheol. There were even schools of Judaism that didn't believe in an afterlife at all.

In other words, it is clear that Isaiah was talking about a mortal person, a king who thought himself a god but eventually died and ended up in Sheol like everyone else. Yet Christian scholars used this passage to concoct a story about Satan as an usurper who was banned from heaven and thrown into their Hades-inspired fiery hell. And since this passage speaks of the day star, the term Lucifer became one of the many bynames of the Christian devil. I hope this clears up a few things :)

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Wow! There are so many holes in what you wrote! You're criticizing Christian scholars yet you say the book of "revelations"? Kids in Sunday school know it's "Revelation". Also using the word "Yahweh"? You might want to read up on that. It's not even a word. It's derived from YHVH which doesn't even have a pronunciation. The Hebrews were totally reverent in actually using God's name (which is WAY too complex to really even say), so much as they often referred to Him as Hashem which means "the name". People who use "Yahweh", "Yeshua", etc., are generally pretentious windbags who want to come across as being "in the know". Oh, your story about the serpent is the most ridiculous thing I've read in a LONG time. Sorry.

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The comics (source material) make it very clear that there is a "trinity of evil" consisting of Satan, Lucifer and Belzebub (I think). They have different shades of evil and there is one comic book "story arc" that has them plot all three together to get Constantine. He plays them all.

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Gabriel used the names/titles "Son of Perdition", "Little Horn", and "Most Unclean".

"Looks like Somebody doesn't have your back anymore."

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[deleted]

I looked into it a long while ago, and I'm not sure if I got the correct answer or if I misunderstood it but here's what I got.

Lucifer, Satan, Bealzebub, are all the same entity. In a part of the bible it talks about possession and a young boy being possessed by an entity known as Legion, that refers to itself as we. Saying something like "We are legion for we are many."

Now if I'm to take that the way I read it I get the impression that the Devil goes by many names or is even a multitude of beings with different drives. The other possibility is that the young boy possessed was possessed by many demons, who collectively called themselves Legion.

"Sometimes its the people who no one imagines anything of who do the things that no one can imagine"

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Yes. The devil is a spirit being and has many names.

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Lucifer and Satan are the same individual it matters not which one you call it.

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ah yes the fallen angel thing, after reading about that part via wiki that is very true. Plus, the fact that Lucifer was wearing that snappy white suite kind of reminds me of the word "light" that you just mentioned via light bringer.

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[deleted]

Lucifer does mean "bringer of light," and he was the angel of light, also called the Peacock Angel. He was beautiful - the most beloved angel by God. That's why he became proud and hence "fell."

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In the DC universe (well, from what I read from the Vertigo imprint comics) Lucifer rebelled because he didn't want to be a part of God's creation/plan. This goes on to the point where he abandons Hell because ruling there was basically a part of God's plan for him.

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http://www.imdb.com/list/bYs2wu8iWNY/

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In the DC universe (well, from what I read from the Vertigo imprint comics) Lucifer rebelled because he didn't want to be a part of God's creation/plan.


Oddly enough, I recently justt got done re-reading Mike Carey's Lucifer series (and judging by your avatar I'm guessing you're a Sandman fan).

Yes, Lucifer (aka Samael) does resign his post for the reason you stated. In the series he also has the chance to take God's place and become the new God, but refuses because he sees the role of God as being a prison.

It's an extremely creative and well told series that gave me an entirely different outlook on the Lucifer/Satan character of mythology to the point that I really don't like the traditional interpretation of him. Carey's version is smarter and his attitude and thought process just make more sense given the character's backstory.

He's not a good guy, but he's not pure evil that wants to destroy the world or collect souls. If helping you will play into his agenda then he'll help you, and if it doesn't he won't. He doesn't lie and he keeps his promises and repays his debts. Of course he's manipulative as hell (pun intended), but in an interesting way. I just find the whole red skin/horns/hooves version to be boring and nonsensical now.

Don't try to cash in love, that check will always bounce.

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Yeah, I'm a sandman fan. I too read the Lucifer series a while back, was interested by the the spinoff. It's not really all Carey's or Gaiman's idea of lucifer, I heard it's more John Milton's (the blind poet) idea of him from Paradise Lost. It's weird that it ended in 75 issues. The sandman series consists of 75 issues too and this other vertigo comic (Fables) should have ended on the 75 issue (you'll understand if you ever read it).

It's annoying though, if this film were considered canon in the DC universe then this will clash with this version of the morningstar. He's displayed as pretty much a creep. And if all angels are as androgynous as Gabriel here then that will also clash, not just with Lucifer but with Michael in the comics.

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http://www.imdb.com/list/bYs2wu8iWNY/

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I was reading this thread just waiting for someone to mention Paradise Lost! Thaaaank you! I'm an English major, so it was my first thought!

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Lucifer and Samael Real NOT the same. One is a high celestial that is a soldier of God, able to walk the 2 world's of heaven and hell,defeating evil.
Lucifer is that evil that he walks the two world's to defeat

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Exactly.

I prefer the name Lucifer because it is a name directly from the bible (like Gabriel and Balthazar) though honestly I have never read it.

It begs the question though, is he Satan as painted by some to be completely different than a fallen angel (in most lore, didn't read the comic book either) who created hell and demons which is the origins of Lucifer? Not sure, but it really wasn't relevant to the story.

I do prefer Lucifer though if you are talking about what has a better ring to it.

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He never fell,....man simply has not met up to the highest potentials of God-dom,needing something or someone to blame.

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Yes, Lucifer is the "bringer of light" which is why he is conflated with the Greek God Prometheus who was the "bringer of fire".

Lucifer was also nicknamed the Morning Star. He got the names Satan (adversary) and Devil (satyr-goat demon) after he "fell".

The term "scapegoat" comes from the idea of Judeo-Christians blaming all their problems and the evils of the world on the Greeks and their gods, turning them into Biblical devils and demons.

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This is not where we get the term scapegoat. Israelite Priest in the wilderness were instructed to sacrifice one animal (believe a lamb) for the sins of the people, lay hands on a goat, and then let it go out into the wilderness. This symbolized the sins of the people being transfered to the goat and being taken away from the camp
. It HAD to be alive and HAD to leave the camp.

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Satan is a verb, not a proper name. It basically translates to "The Accuser" or "The Adversary." Lucifer is a specific angel who was banished from heaven by God for refusing to bow to man.

Prof. Farnsworth: Oh. A lesson in not changing history from Mr. I'm-My-Own-Grandpa!

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No-it was not that he refused to bow to man.....it was because man was give a soul, a divine connection with all, an equal to the highest of celestials,....though many of you don't act like I, nor even care.

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No-it was not that he refused to bow to man.....it was because man was give a soul, a divine connection with all, an equal to the highest of celestials,.


Yes, it was. He refused to bow to man, and in fact he wanted to BE God.

Your reasoning doesn't even make sense. Why would humanity being given souls cause Lucifer to fall?

Prof. Farnsworth: Oh. A lesson in not changing history from Mr. I'm-My-Own-Grandpa!

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Why has no one brought up Bealzebub?



You don't know sh!t, Jon Snow!

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Lord of the flies! I don't know. I guess it wasn't relevant. They are all stuck on Lucifer and Satan really!

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Overall it was pride. He never asked for forgiveness. This is just my interpretation. You shouldn't shoot down someone else's thoughts. None of us were there. It could be all of the above.

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When someone else presents incorrect information, yes, they should be shot down. The simple idea that man was given a soul is not what CAUSED the fall. It was what caused him to rebel, but it is not what caused the fall.

The new home of Welcome to Planet Bob: http://kingofbob.blogspot.ca/

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You are correct except for what you said about Lucifer wanting to be God,no where in the bible does it say he wanted to be God. Im not sure what the comics said about him but as far as the bible goes it never said that..... Lucifer refused to bow down to man because he seen man as inferior and unworthy.... and for all the other people, Lucifer(the morning star,bringer of light etc) was his name before he fell from grace..

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Yes, it does, actually.

http://biblia.com/bible/esv/Isa%2014.12-15

Specifically: I will ascend above the heights of the clouds;

I will make myself like the Most High.

"The Most High" is God. So it's clearly saying Lucifer wants to be equal to God.

Maybe try reading the Bible some time before you go around correcting people with wrong information. Maybe don't base your information on Supernatural.

The new home of Welcome to Planet Bob: http://kingofbob.blogspot.ca/

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I know it says "Satan" in the credits, but in the film, Constantine calls him "Lu", so I guess either works.



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I smell dark magic! It's a bit like burnt popcorn.

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[deleted]

"I know it says "Satan" in the credits, but in the film, Constantine calls him "Lu", so I guess either works."

Yes, this... exactly.
Not sure why the credits would refer to the character as Satan, but forgetting all the religious explanations and history - in the context of the film, Constantine calls him 'Lou' (or 'Lu')... obviously short for 'Lucifer'

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I think it's because Lucifer is the name of the angel, and Satan is the name of Lucifer's fallen self. Stormare portrayed him in Satan form rather than as one of God's messengers.

If you can read this then you are trying too hard.

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From the fourth century, Lucifer is sometimes used in Christian theology to refer to Satan, as a result of identifying the fallen "son of the dawn" of Isaiah 14:12 with the "accuser" of other passages in the Old Testament.[citation needed]


So he's kind of both.

Courtesy of wikipedia:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Satan

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Wow! I can't believe this thread was created in 2014 and the amount of replies I've read is pretty great. So many great debates between several imdb members and alot of the posts were extremely interesting to read as well. Thanks to all the users that have provided in depth information about Satan and Lucifer.

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