I think many people would unanimously agree The Second Renaissance parts I and II are the most disturbing episodes in the Animatrix. So what are the most disturbing and memorable images you’ve had of those anime features?
For me though it would have to be the image where the human soldier has his arms and legs torn off as he was being pulled from his mech. Coupled with his cries of help and his scream makes a very disturbing scene.
When the three men were beating the robot with a female skin it really gave the robots a face, it made them real, it made what the humans were doing completely wrong. I think that one scene is the most disturbing, the robot looked like a human, every human has the right to life and why not these innocent robots also, robots who paid for the actions of one.
shareI think there were a lot of horrifying image, and i think that they were so disturbing because we've seen them before. They used a lot of historical situations and animated them with the humans killing and beating the robots.
There were two that i found especially disturbing. the first is where the robot was kneeling on the ground and he was executed with a handgun at close range. The other was just watching the tanks roll over the robot in the Tiananmen Square-like section.
there is also a refferense to an israel/pakistan issue in the shot where the two robots were crouched together behind a trash can.
sharedon't talk about stuff you no nothing about..
it's either israeli / palestinian OR indian / pakistan conflict
it doesn't make you look any smarter babbling about stuff you heard on CNN..
Seriously, dochebag, get a life... this post is over two years old...
A)GRAMMAR!
B)it dosent matter whether or not the people died in India, Pakistan, Israel or Palestine (STFU up i know there isnt a palestine) the fact of the matter is that these people died ant its topical to this conversation.
And i dont listen to CNN i watch CNN. so go fornicate yourself.
There is a fvking Palestine, it's just been stolen by the Jews, so don't even go there.
shareYou mean Palestine perhaps?
shareAny resemblance with "Blade Runner"?
PC
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it's a machine
--
The Purpose of Life is to End
And it's a vision of what humans would do in the same situation: become prejudice against robots.
Humans are disgusting who treat their own and everything around them like *beep* We're all guilty of it.
That scene just helps us realize it, which is why it's disturbing.
with artificial emotions.
share> with artificial emotions.
Yes as artificial as fake.
--
The Purpose of Life is to End
I think one of the points of the movie is to promote that debate. The same as spilberg did on AI. If we create a robot capable of developing his own set of emotions ideas and reactions according to his interaction with the world (just like humans do) should we have the right to just plug them off? It's an ethical issue...
shareNot really. They were articifial life forms, but there emotions were very real. They feared for their lives and were afraid. Nothing artificial about those emotions.
shareAGREED!!
"You're Not Afraid of the Dark, Are you" - Riddick, (The Chronicles of Riddick)
That's the first thing that came up in my head when I red the title of the thread.
The key to immortality is first living a life worth remembering - Bruce LeeLee
I actually disagree, I found that laughable - I was like "do they expect me to really care or sympathize for the robot?" ..lol it wasn't disturbing to me, sorta stupid since to me a robot or electrical device will always be just that, regardless of whether it can think for itself - as long as I know that we created it out of non-biological parts (eg: purely metal) I really couldn't care less for it.
share[deleted]
Yeah, me too, especially when she screams "No, please, I'm real!". That just gets me every time...
shareThis is the most disturbing one to me as well. What the humans did were wrong of course. They had as much right to live as any human. It seems to me that the way the robots reacted was the last way out.
-
Dziga Vertov:
I am the machine that reveals the world to you, as only I alone am able to see it
It was definitely the part where what's-his-name crushes that woman's head, and her brain falls out. That bit was nuts.
shareDefinitely the guy getting ripped out of the Mech.
Bert, you're shouting again Bert.
That poor women bieng beaten to death. She did nothing to them she was innocent you can hear here screm "im a living thing" "i didnt do anything to you" and i know machines dont have souls but if it has the capacity to feel and love and think as humans do it deserves to live {but the robot deserved to die killing its masters but non of those innocent millons of robots deserved to die. Oh and by the way im not a vegetarian just wanted to metion that incase you thought i was one.
shareThat was a pretty jacked up scene.
"Awwwww......I wanted to explode"
-Gir
I think that the most disturbing scene was either the shot of all the wounded soldiers lying around in the makeshift hospital, the shot of the close range handgun execution, or the shot of all the destroyed robots being dumped into the mass graves. Those scenes just scared me.
shareThere's to much to list. Who was that person who put down "It's a machine"? Weird. Mine would definetely either the woman robot with the human skin who was getting it ripped off, and in the war, where the machines were ripping the people out of the mechs they were fighting with.
What makes you think that a machine couldn't have a soul? Maybe the condition of having a soul is to feel those things. Love, hate, fear, desperation, hope. Maybe just the ability to look in the mirror and say, who is that? and how can I make her/him better?
Just givin' ya somethin' to chew on, is all.
I know this has been said before, but the most gruesome image was the soldier being ripped out of the robotic suit. It's not so much the sight of him being removed, but the screams and cries he is making. You really get a sense almost of what the man is experiencing.
I haven't watched that movie in probably four or five months, and I still can hear that scream. How shrill and terrified and excruciating it sounds. Jesus, it's so creepy.
I think some of the scarest scenes was at one of the episodes end with all the skeletons of the humans and that guy getting torn out of his mech *shudder* actully I think the whole damn thing was creepy. I wacthed it on tv yesterday and then I had a nap cause I didn't feel very good and I woke up in a cold sweat after realizeing that I had a dream about the Animatrix and it just creeped me out for the rest of the day. It might of been cause I was sick but I was still really creeped out
shareThe mech part and pretty much any scene where one side is helpless to the brutality of the situation had a big and disturbing impact ( edited or not on CN the mech guy was still haunting ). But for me the two worst were when the two robots went to try to make peace and were jumped by the humans, and most of all the the mechanical horse with the trumpet blower. They did an excellent job of creating a mechanical version of one of the 4 horsemen and the overall image along with the music just gave this overwhelming feeling that many lives would be lost soon & that much pain would be suffered.
shareI dunno, I'd have to say the guy getting ripped out of the mech was creepy.. but either that or the woman robot being beaten was 2nd and 3rd... I'd have to say the more disturbing image was the when the first robot to rebel (B1-66ER)killing his "owner" and then ripping the 2nd person's head into half and the details of the brain helped. Even previou to that the way you viewed it from the security camera gave a sense of hoplessness... the blood being strung across the couch two seperate times adds to the savageness
shareI forgot to add that the most MOST creeiest scene was when the women got her head crushed by the robot *SHUDDER*
share"I forgot to add that the most MOST creeiest scene was when the women got her head crushed by the robot *SHUDDER*"
Correction, it was a man!
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LOL, well i couldn't tell I tried not to look directlly into it! I'm sure you can forgive me for my mistake and thank you for the correction, but still I swear it was a women but I'm not up to argueing over something so small
share[deleted]
Yeah, that's what anime will do to you. You see it's animated, so you figure it's nothing too serious, thanks to our good friends at Disney. Then you get a bloodbath, nudity, swearing, etc.
America needs to start making serious animated films. I mean, The Lion King was great even if you look behind the singing and everything, but the fact is that we still had to look past that. I've heard Beauty and the Beast is the same way... I've never seen it or was too young to remember it.
I agree with sparky, anime needs to be more mainstream so people wont be too shocked or make bad decisions (taking their kids to see akira), or get to stereotyped. There are so many excellent animes out there, but things like
yu gi oh and pokemon end up spoiling all of them.
Words are far more potent when uttered scarcely -myself
Yes, Exactly
I tried introducing a friend to Fullmetal Alchemist (very, very cool anime)
but thought he was going to get crap (ie Pokemon, Yugioh)
So he never watched it, oh well, his lost
I call the big one bitey
-Homer Simpson
> Who was that person who put down "It's a machine"?
Hey, it was me :D
> What makes you think that a machine couldn't have a soul?
What makes you think that they could?
--
The Purpose of Life is to End
What makes you think they don't? Do you have a soul? How do you know you have a soul,can you show it to me? Their are lot's of discussion of what a soul is, and how it's perceived. I think a soul is the ability to show emotion's freely and without a second thought. No one knows what a soul is.. An that lies the question..of whether or not a robot or Artificial Intelligence can claim to have a soul or not. That movie is very disturbing and thought provoking at the same time.. It may look bad but it makes you think. Anime is a very good place to have a story played out for you and be very complex that you leave with a different attitude then when you started the show. Samurai X is a very good example .. I never seen Samurai X before maybe the edited series but not the actual OVA.When I saw Trust and Betrayal,I was so compelled that (I saw the movie at like 2AM) I actually thought about the story till the afternoon. But I've rambled to long that Renaissance was very disturbing. I like the one with the kids though.and never got the runner.
shareWhat didn't you get about it? I only ask as I watched it last night and I think we may be on the same page somewhere.
Still, a clever idea overall.
'Hey if they took care of business, I'd be out of business...know what I mean!?'
'Ha ha ha! Those IDIOTS!'
The ceepiest thing for me was just the thought of seeing the last sunrise and the part where the narrator says 'the distruction of the sky'...and of course the war.
The whole thing made me think about what humanity can do to itself.
That guy's face when he was yelling at the camera: "Kill 'em all!"
Actually, scratch that, his face looked ridiculous, it made me chuckle.
Then, aside from Mech Suit dude and people getting dissected alive, maybe the part where a squid attacks that tank and you get to see a shot of the people inside disintegrating.
I tried to accept jesus in my heart. But then my doctor ordered a bypass. :(
I thought the attack on the woman was the most disturbing image. You think she's human, she screams for help and says she is real, and a thug clubs her with a bar. You find out she's a robot; but it's still pretty graphic, with the white skull-like head and broken jaw.
And the mass burial a bit later is very confronting. It is so much like infamous mass killings throughout the 20th century - which I presume is the point.
I told you over a hundred million times - STOP EXAGGERATING!!!
Yeah, the whole damn thing gets REALLY disturbing once the machines starts to triumph. From here, there are so many haunting images, not just the graphic display of humans being relentlessly massacred.
The machines themselves makes one's blood run cold. Their designs are TOTALLY awesome and disturbingly surreal. Their coldblooded merciless rampage and superiority to the humans is just painfully grotesque to watch(I hope Spielberg kinda goes in this direction with his upcoming War Of The Worlds, but it'd probably be to brutal). And yeah, that post-war scenario just creeps me out. Humans being experimented with. We're naked, bald-shaved, semi-dissected and completely in their control. The guy laughing and crying is absolutely terrifying, and you can't help but taking it personal. I mean, we're being totally molested here and there's nothing we can do. It's just so thought-provoking and strong. They really should adapt The Second Renaissance into a live feature, because alotta humans should get the chance to witness something like this, the dire downfall of mankind.
And if I werer to pick out the most haunting image it'd probably be the end one right when the little snow-playing girl is waking up from her "nightmare" and we pan out to see the endless fields of the human demise.
Breathtakingly sinister end to mankind and fantastic end to the episode.
its been a while since i've seen the animatrix but i think it went like this.
when they destroy the female robot, first she looks like a human, but after they hit her on the head and with the bar, she just stands there for a moment, right before they shoot her, completely humiliated. think about the toughts and emotions running trough her head.
also when u see all those androids and robots with their signs, protesting, and those special forces or the army already start shooting them, and on the background you can see some robots, not very human like, like they are older versions or something, they just stand there scared to death, holding eachother. when i saw that i tought what are you doing to them they didnt do wrong,.. and when i saw the second part when they harvest the humans, i remembered those scared robots and i tought well you deserve it dammit.
i know its just a movie or a cartoon but man this is so convincing and real looking, maby because its a possible reality like someone said before in this tread
Then don't do anything. Don't come near me. All you ever do is hurt me.
I allways thought that the scene where the female robot gets her skin beaten off and is then shot was the worst. But really, its just a machine, I mean, however "alive" it looks, its not. How many of us have kicked a Coke machine when it ate our money, its the same thing!
Strength Through Peace, not peace through strength.
I will agree that the female-skinned robot getting beaten to death was the most intense scene. Hearing her scream chilled my blood.
"How many of us have kicked a Coke machine when it ate our money, its the same thing!"
It's not the same thing. A more appropriate example could be that you can eat a hamburger, but you can't eat your pet. Just the look of a human makes us feel attached to it, but a big, blocky Coke machine is 'dead.'
the most distrubing scene was at the end. the little boy playing in the snow, he turns aroud and to smile at his parents, and they turn into agents, he lets out a scream of terror.... and then we see him in a pod. i dont know why, but that one really got to me.
I read your e-mail.
A coke machine can't kick you back...
share[deleted]
I just saw this movie again, and some new things hit me. The hospital scene where you see all the "survivors" of the war isn't a human hospital, it's controlled by the machines. (You can see robots standing around, tending to them) That to me was creepy, cause I could just imagine what would lie ahead of them.
And then the scene where they begin to construct the Matrix and are attaching all those people to the towers...and you hear all their screams and cries and you see them on the towers...God it's creepy.
The director of this movie makes a good comment though about the violence in this movie, that it's not meant to be entertaining, but meant to be thought-provoking. He even admits to that he can't look at it sometimes.
The thing that scared me about these episodes weren't the images, but the concept itself. I mean, it is pretty ridiculous, but imagine if this is what the world is going to be like in thirty years time? The whole thought of a trusted robot killing a human just scared the crap out of me, i mean, this was a machine, there are people in the world developing the same types of robots in the world today. That just scared me, this was a very gruesome experience, it scared me even more than a horror film, and that's saying a lot considering my doctor diagnosed me with a phobia of ghosts.
Touch me, and that hand will never touch anything again -Trinity
The thing that this movie made me think about, is that, although in the movie the humans only attack the robots, how many real life women have been beaten to death before, how many millions of people have died in some gruesome way in a war throughout the last few thousand years? It doesnt seem as bad when you see it being done to robots, but humans actually do this to each other. Who knows, maybe the robots were right to lock us up, we do less damage to each other that way.
share""How many of us have kicked a Coke machine when it ate our money, its the same thing!"
It's not the same thing. A more appropriate example could be that you can eat a hamburger, but you can't eat your pet. Just the look of a human makes us feel attached to it, but a big, blocky Coke machine is 'dead.'"
My point entirely. Because it looks human we feel sorry for it, but it is just a machine. As a coke machine has been programed to do certain things, so has this robot; but because it looks and acts like us we imagine it to BE like us. When I used my intellect instead of my emotions, I realised how inhuman the robot is.
No Osama Bin Laden. No WMDs.
Way to go George!
First of all, I agree that all the scense that have been discussed are indeed hard to watch. But that doesnt mean I didn't enjoy TSR.
Also-robots posess intellect (intelligence, whatever), do they know that they are inhuman? Or, do they, like the woman, see themselves as human? If they do, shouldn't they have the same rights and liberties as humans?
I do find it interesting that I, Robot holds a similar theme. Did anyone else notice this, or am I just reading too far into it?
Reject the basic assumptions of civilization, especially the importance of materiel possessions. -Tyler Durden
"Also-robots posess intellect (intelligence, whatever), do they know that they are inhuman? Or, do they, like the woman, see themselves as human? If they do, shouldn't they have the same rights and liberties as humans?"
We're thinking about it the wrong way. Robots dont "think" or "feel" they simple carry out a series of functions.
For example:
Do you know that robot which looks like a face and you can interact with it? When you make a noise it moves its eyes to where the sound came from, and when you get up in its face quickly it backs away. Well the robot isn't curious about where the sound came from at all, it simple perfroms a pre-program response. It's just like when you use a phone which has voice recognition on it, when you say billy, it rings billy's phone; on this robot, when someone says billy, it doesn't ring billy it moves its eyes. When you get up in its face and it shrinks back, it isn't frightened, it is simply carry out a pre-programmed function. Have you seen those Eye Toys for PS2? When you move your hands in the air, you can hit things on the screen. Same thing with the robot, but instead of moving things on the screen (which it doesn't have), it shrinks back. No-one thinks that this robot is "alive" or has "feelings" or "idependent thought" because its responses are limited and its apperance is very "un-natural". In the future, however, when we can build robots which look like people and have HUGE memories big enough to store billions of activites, then people might start to believe that they are alive, have feelings and indepandent thought, simpley because they look and act LIKE us.
No Osama Bin Laden. No WMDs.
Way to go George!
I know what you mean, but this isnt what is going on. These robots are past the point of doing what they are programmed to do. These robots are self aware, and can think for themselves. The machines no longer needed programs to tell them what to do.
Example: The machines had humanity on the brink of destruction, but they knew that they needed a power source, so they turned to humans. Do you think they were programmed to enslave humans in order to survive? I really doubt it.
Yeah, I dont know. It's very complicated. Today we have programs which create other programs because they can do a better job at it than humans can: they are quicker, more efficent, "smarter", and eliminate human error. The machines in The Second Renaissance also create new and better AI. Maybe they just got so smart and were able to perform so many functions that it appears that they have free choice. And what does it mean to be "self aware" and "able to think for themselves"? Is this just that they can perform so many functions that they are programmed to choose the most suitable? Again, the machines we have today can do this on a simple level.
You raised a good point with regards to them enslaving humanity though. I have to admit that I dont have a definative answer. My only guess could be that they are programmed to surive, and it was nessesary to defend themselves against humans in order to do this.
It's fuuny talking about this, because it's half based on possible futuristic facts and half based on fiction. The point where which I think the facts end and the fiction takes over is where the machines become "self aware". I dont think that this could ever happen in reality. I personally believe that human research into AI is mostly pointless. It's very expensive and weilds very few results. Maybe one day a thousand years from now a robot will find a cure for cancer, but until then we have a LOT more important things to be focusing on, like making peace and eliminating poverty.
What do you think is more important: everyone in the world being free and healthy, or a few rediculously rich people having a robot?
No Osama Bin Laden. No WMDs.
Way to go George!
In a concise nature, you are correct, but you seem to exclude the concept that human minds and artificial minds operate in identical manners. Was not preprogramming for said artificial minds, formed off of the basis of a human mind, performing mechanical functions.
Humans create choices in their life time, choices that are limited by emotions, but still they decide a certain action, and enact in such. Machines act in the same manner; for they enact the action that was programmed for them to do, only in the absence of emotion, these actions are limited by numerical data.
Both minds are the same, restricted by instinct developed at conception and development. Some simply refuse to witness this as it would state that we are equal to our creations. Ironic, in a sense; for they were structured to perform actions that would ease our own lifestyle.
May the death of humanity act as the harbinger for indifference, and hence...serenity.
yeah? well your promoting republican quotes so u can *beep* right off. oh and your totally wrong about your idea of machies, you will be proven wrong in the future.
shareits not the same thing when has a coke machine ever begged you for its life?
share[deleted]
I'm going to use the words of a very wise friend of mine named Eli. We had a discussion after watching the Second Renaissance to try to understand it all.
"You watch the first part and say 'Wow... I hate humanity...,' but then you watch the second part and say 'Jesus... I hate robots...,' but when you stand back and look at it, you say '... I hate violence.'"
The point he's getting at is that Second Renaissance is a mirror to our culture. It's no accident that the Wachowskis used several evocative images of our human past in the first part of this movie (Tienamin Square, the oh-so-famous close-range execution from the Vietnam war), and then in the second part reinvented cruelty with the mechanic efficiency the machines used to destroy their enemies. There's no easy answer, no way to say "This is what this movie means." I think the only idea that can be garnered from this creation is this. Violence is evil. Hatred is evil. War is evil. And if we don't watch ourselves, this could easily go from science fiction to science fact.
BRAVO! Somebody gets it!
shareI agree. Very well put.
shareFinally someone says that war in general is evil. I just couldn't believe the grand scale of mass destruction that went on, over humans lack of acceptence to the machines. You couldn't really point the finger at any one person...everyone was screwed up.
YOU WILL NOT STAND AGAINST ME!!!-Roland of Gilead
The whole 2nd Renaissance is very sobering...I don't have one scene as most disturbing, just learning what the war was really about got me.
YOU WILL NOT STAND AGAINST ME!!!-Roland of Gilead
I think the most disturbing scene for me personally would be the Robots trying to present themselves to the humans. I'm not joking or anything, I just thought that was the most spine-cringing scene in that piece. That gore stuff doesn't really phase me that much except I just might moan in understanding and fear of the pain or agony of the slight...
Anyways, I saw this a couple years ago and I can only recall some parts of it but I guess that part would be the scariest imho.
sobegreen and Ron Mc Don have some good points, but Jeez, The Second Renaissance is insanely freaky, I swear to God The Wachowskis must have watched Trent Reznor's Broken endlessly before writing this stuff,
Kagome's #1 Fanboy, Crazier than thou art,
When the robot rips the man's face off of his skull.
shareThe most disturbing has to be when the first robot to rebel killed the guy on the floor. When the robot put its thumbs under the eyes, made them pop out then rip his head in 2, now that is disturbing.
Note: I first watched this 2 years ago at 1 in the morning, it was on Channel 5 in the UK as part of the Matrix season thing. Not the nicest image to go to sleep with, it was kept in my mind for 1/2 months.
It's actually on right now (on a childrens cartoon network in Canada :D )
I definately have to say the woman being beaten/and the mass robot graves. Also maybe when they blacken the skies, there is something just so final about watching the blue skies slowly turn pitch black.
the whole thing was disturbing
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