bocabonita_amh:
"For instance, the freedom to walk around a store and not be followed or suspected of stealing, freedom from unnecessary police harassment, freedom from being charged higher interest rates and finance charges on an auto loan, freedom from being undermined at your job even though you are more articulate, competent, and hardworking than your white co-workers and subordinates etc. I have experienced all of this and many of my Latino friends have experienced this as well (These are just a few examples, and thankfully they are becoming less common) but I do not condone racism from any group.There are just some things in America that people of color face that whites do not and vice versa"
Granted, these such things exist and most likely will exist while diversity and things 'we don't understand and therefore dislike' continue to be. Your points are no doubt valid, and in that I think perhaps you misunderstood what I was illustrating. I'm not arguing that racism from whites/blacks/latinos/etc. doesn't exist or that some races aren't treated differently or better in certain circumstances (and you can't say any one race is _always_ treated better, we have too much diversity in America to argue that consistently), simply that being white isn't any guarantee of success by any stretch of the imagination. That is what I would define "white privilege" to be. That any notion of "white privilege" as something preventing achievement, for any race, is really just a self imposed crutch, and while preconceptions based on race are something that likely shouldn't exist, they do. As I said in my previous post, racial prejudices can either be something annoying and unfair, or a reason to not even try in the first place. Certainly, there have been non-whites undermined at their job even though they are more articulate, work harder and so forth. On the same note, however, how many whites that are better educated and higher qualified have been passed over during the hiring process because of affirmative action? Let me clarify the above statement: I disagree with _any form_ of affirmative action. I think it's a racist policy at it's very core and an extremely dangerous precedent to set. If you can tell someone who they _can_ hire based on racial qualities, you can tell someone who they _can't_ hire based on racial qualities. Isn't the whole point to get past that petty nonsense? Besides that, how do we ever expect to eliminate prejudice when you have programs saying someone of this color should be hired and someone of that color shouldn't? Anyway, I digress.
I agree that police harassment is certainly a problem, certainly unfairly targeted toward non-whites, as I have plenty of non-white friends who can attest to such. At the same time, black/latino/etc. officers have treated whites differently as well, although I'll agree, not nearly as consistently as the other way around. There again, I never said there aren't problems from all races, preconceptions and prejudices are born from lack of understanding and ignorance... if you figure out a way to fix those little issues, by all means, let me know. These minor and, in some cases, major discriminations are by no means just non-whites job to bear. I know a white man that works under two black women who is constantly picked on and discriminated against because he's white. There are plenty of black/latino/etc. bosses that show favoritism towards their own race when hiring or in giving promotions. I've on many occasions experienced discrimination for no other reason than I'm white. As a recent example, I was attempting to change the pension check that my grandfather, who is quite senile and can't manage his own business anymore, receives from being mailed to him to a direct deposit into his account. I called the pension department and spoke to a black man, who on each successive call demanded more and more ridiculous paperwork. Each time I'd call, feeling sure I had met every _possible_ requirement, he'd dream something new up that "just had to be done". Finally, after several weeks of needless delay, and when he requested I send the trust account paperwork for "our lawyers to review and decide if it's properly worded", I realized he would continue adding requirements as long as I continued trying to get it done. I called and managed to get a supervisor (who I'm pretty sure was white, either way, someone who doesn't hate a person simply because they _are_ white) and discovered that a simple form was all I needed to fill out and fax back. It could have been done in one day. Annoying, but certainly not the end of the world. This sort of racism exists in _all races_. I've experienced numerous such cases of petty/annoying discrimination based on nothing more than a general hatred of someone that is white. Is it unfair? Sure. Does it prevent my functioning in our society? No. The truth of the matter is, very little major discrimination exists anymore. If you have the slightest bit of tangible evidence you were paid less or charged more, not hired or fired based on your race or religion you can throw a rock in any direction and find an organization that'll help you pursue your claim (in most cases, free of charge).
So, what is "white privilege" then, if not economic? If being white doesn't guarantee you a spot at the head of the line, how can it be called "white privilege" at all? These discriminations exist in all races and all walks of life, some endure more, some less, but no one is completely immune. If it's not preventing success, achievement or a better life, what is it? It's annoyance, it's unfairness. It's something we might wish didn't exist, but it does, because we live in the real world. Only in some idealistic, perfect world utopia would we be free of such things. More than likely there isn't a single human on earth that hasn't experienced discrimination of some sort based on their religion, race or class. That's just it in this country, we're so terribly sensitive. I think we've forgotten what _real_ hatred and racism is. You know life has gotten a little too easy in a country when being "offended" is the worst possible thing that can happen. I think many people look for and find racism where there isn't even any to begin with. In many cases the perception of racism is actually worse than the racism itself, and the preconception of everything being racist stops someone from trying far more than any real, tangible racism does. Sometimes people don't like other people and it doesn't have a *beep* thing to do with their skin color.
That's certainly not to imply that all racism/discrimination is imagined, or that we should just accept that racism is a part of life and just pretend it doesn't exist... not at all. However, as you said, it's becoming less common all the time. So, even if you don't define white privilege as an economic issue, it's hard to argue there is any institutionalized or widespread generalized discrimination anymore. Really, we're dealing with individual racism and ignorance, and I think it's quite unfair to just generalize and say "white privilege". There is just too much diversity of opinion to say any one race is, or has any real "privilege". You could put 10 whites in a room and likely get 10 completely different people and opinions, as with most any race. That's another charming pastime in this country, we love collecting and using our labels. If we can slap a label on something we avoid having to honestly and openly discuss it. It's so much easier to just say "white privilege" or "racism" and not have to give any further explanation or discussion (I'm not implying you did that, as you actually explained your definition of the term rather than "you're just wrong!" without any basis or explanation). The issue stays at a stalemate.
Whites are so mortified of even the hint they might be called a "racist", and these labels end up having to suffice for real, open debate. Many whites simply say what is "accepted" by politically correct society at large and then harbor their true opinions in private... whether they're racist in nature or not. People of color, non-whites, whatever happens to be the new politically correct label, in many cases, know full well that whites are afraid of confronting these issues and take advantage of it. So both groups, whether intentionally or not, end up hiding behind these labels and terms rather than actually confronting the real problems. That, to my mind, is more of an issue than the actual racism itself. Irrespective of who is right or wrong, if people don't openly and _honestly_ discuss their opinions and find reasonable compromises instead of just saying what's accepted by PC society, it's pointless to even discuss it. When double standards abound, on both sides, it's pointless to discuss it. When you're practically expected to be ashamed of being white, and when even the hint that you're, heaven forbid, _proud_ of your race/culture/history as a white is almost tantamount to admitting you're a Nazi... gee, doesn't that create animosity in and of itself? Until all races can admit equally their own culpability in the situation, of which we all have our own fair share, instead of just throwing around or hiding behind labels and baseless opinion passed off as fact, nothing will ever change. We as a society need to attempt the elimination of that small bit of racism left which is truly a problem and/or dangerous, recognize what's simply trivial ignorance or annoyance, and get on with our bigger problems.
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