MovieChat Forums > Enough (2002) Discussion > She wouldn't have gotten away with it

She wouldn't have gotten away with it


(First of all, let me preface this post by saying that yes, I do understand this is a fiction movie. I actually quite enjoyed it. But I felt like pointing out how it's nearly impossible that she would get away with killing her husband.)

1. Mitch is talking on the phone with his current girlfriend about going to San Francisco because his daughter is there and his wife has gone missing. I'm sure the girlfriend would add in her two cents about how suspicious it is that Slim showed up at the house and then he ended up dead.

2. When the police go through Mitch's house afterwards, I think they would find it odd that knives were in the refrigerator drawers and that guns were in odd places. That would be a huge red flag.

3. Just look at Slim's clothing. It's loose-fitting and athletic, like she was preparing for a fight. One could argue that she wore those clothes in case he attacked her, but she also had lotion (or whatever that stuff is) on her skin. This also suggests that she was preparing for a fight. Perhaps the police wouldn't notice at first, but after noticing other things, I think they would take into account her appearance.

4. She cut the phone line. Why would she do that unless she wanted all calls to be prevented, including in the event she herself needed to call 911? I'm pretty sure the police would notice the snipped line.

5. The autopsy would show that punches were made by hands with sharp rings or similar objects. That suggests that someone WANTED to hurt him and badly.

6. Someone would find the bag she threw in the river. It has to happen some time. That's a very interesting set of tools, so if she wasn't caught in the beginning, the police would probably wonder why someone threw this bag in the river, why and how they were used, and what crimes/incidences could have been made using those tools.

7. The fingerprints on the letter are probably not substantial enough to suggest he really took a good look at them. There would be none of his fingerprints on the back of the letters, so the police would know he didn't handle the paper from an envelope. They would only be on the front, probably not very many prints at all, and probably smudged because he fiddled around with the paper instead of firmly holding it.

Besides, is there any additional evidence of any letters? He had to have written to her, wouldn't he? Those are definitely letters that you keep. The police would notice a lack of phone calls, too.

8. If the cell phone call that Mitch made was put through at all, it would record that he called 911 and that it was cut off. Couple that with the tools in the bag, I think the police would get the idea.

9. If Slim suffered "intense physical abuse," as she wrote in her letter, why would she got to Mitch's house, unaccompanied? If she were going to meet Mitch face to face, wouldn't she more likely go to a crowded place and probably bring someone for protection? Even if she did have evidence of self-defense training, it's a little odd to go to a dangerous man's house by yourself when you know he's likely to try to beat the crap out of you.

(I don't take into account the amount of injuries she had because she probably had quite a few. He hit her a couple times, threw her against the wall, choked her, hit her with a lamp, etc. I don't think his and her injuries would necessarily show murder, just all the other stuff I just listed..)

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You give the police/legal system more credit than they deserve. The guy's dead; there's nothing left but paperwork, and they're not interested in that. Slim could always say that had she gone to murder him, she would not have stuck around. Also, she didn't cut the phone line; she unplugged it. As for the police finding the gym bag, I'd bed that that bag just landed on top of a few others that still hadn't been found. Why would they go looking for a bag that they don't even know about? Yes, the bruises would be hard to explain...those rings left some bad bruises, I'm sure. That was a bit of a stretch. But not enough for them to start a murder investigation.
Also, the cop that talked to her looked like he was ready to put the whole thing to bed. He just told her, "I guess you're one of the lucky ones." I can see ol' Mitch just being processed through the coroner's office, quick and dirty.
Cops don't go through any more trouble than they absolutely have to. She'd have had to answer some questions, shed a few tears, smile pretty, then gotten away with it. And more power to her for it.


"Level head? I think mine's level, and yours is the one things would roll off of."

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I'm not saying they would initially investigate it. However, I do think her clothing may tip them off to something. If not, whatever. But someone would find a clue here or there, such as the knives in the fridge or the snipped phone line. (It was not simply unplugged. She snipped it with huge pliers.)

I don't think the police would go searching for the bag in the ocean. I'm saying it could be found some day and that could tip off in the future if nothing did in the present.

I understand this is fiction. I just think that if this were reality, she wouldn't get away with it. "You were one of the lucky ones" maybe, but she just didn't cover her tracks very well.

I'm just pointing out that there's a list of tip offs. Would each one tip off? No, probably not. However, I think at least one of them would.

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My daughter was raped at knifepoint by a guy who lived 3 houses down from her, in a very small town. He got away with it. And that's reality. The police don't care or are too stupid to connect the dots. I firmly believe that any successes the police have are from pure luck or fate just dropping the perp in their hands. We learned that the hard way.
You are right, btw, about the phone line being cut. I thought she'd unplugged it, but I saw somewhere else on the board that Slim had cut it, so I must have been having a senior moment. LOL Sorry...my bad.
I think that IRL the police might have known that something was "off" but that they would not have gone to the trouble to investigate. It wouldn't have brought Mitch back, and it would've put a battered mother in jail. They'd have let that one sail.

"Level head? I think mine's level, and yours is the one things would roll off of."

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Hmm, perhaps you're right.

I do understand what you're saying about the police. I have to wonder if the police wouldn't call in a detective to investigate because something seems fishy. They wouldn't have to do much work after simply calling someone in.

I'm very sorry to hear about what happened with your daughter. I wish you both all the best.

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Thank you...I know I sound bitter; I guess that's because I am. I can't tell you the heartache our family's been through. I wish your friend would take a trip down here. He/she's GOT to be better than what we have.
What a world, huh?

"Level head? I think mine's level, and yours is the one things would roll off of."

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[deleted]

Hey Whipper, so sorry about the evil put upon your family... My dad beat my mother when I was a child, till her face was swollen to the size of a pumpkin...
I have always been protective of women because of this, when watching L.A. Confidential I related to Russell Crowe 100% Only "Weak" men beat, rape, abuse
women, I wish I could be a "Me on the Wall" in each of those situations...
Randy Sadberry@facebook Love...

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Thank you, randy; I'm sorry to hear about what you and your mom went through when you were young. I can't even imagine seeing my dad hit my mom. They're in their 70's, and still leave little love notes to each other around the house. I had a very "Ozzie & Harriet" type of childhood, which is probably why things like this really get to me.
Good for you for being that sort of man. We're all very careful to teach my daughter's two boys to be caring, gentle men. So far, so good. *S*
To the forensics guy who posted earlier, I'm sorry to see a professional who has the same opinion of the police that I do. It just means that our sad little town is not the only one that is cursed with a bunch of idiots with guns and the authority to use them on whomover they wish. So sad.

"What's that? Bag o' tricks?" Glory
"No. Bag o' knives." Willow

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Hey Whippitchick, don`t forget > Leave it to Beaver & Andy Griffith, tee-hee
I bet you loved > Little House on the Prairie & Highway to Heaven? Keep a close watch on the daughter especially, sadly 18, 21, 30, 40,etc... they are always vulnerable to evil weaklings... Randy

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LOL We must be the same age! Yes, I did love all those happy shows. *G*
Happy to say that my daughter came through the ordeal better than I did. She's now happily remarried and does not dwell on what happened. She says that if she does, he wins, and she won't give him that. Good for her; I'm very proud of her. But when someone hurts your child, I don't know if you (as a parent) ever really forget that. So I'm still working on it. And yep, he's still walking around free. *sigh*

"What's that? Bag o' tricks?" Glory
"No. Bag o' knives." Willow

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Whippet, I am glad she is "seemingly" dealing well, never know what nightmares she "may" have? hopefully none! The main reason!!! we need to have a vengeful God after we die, otherwise rapists, murderers, Hitler`s, etc.. get the same as the rest of us, just a death, one death no matter how much human harm they caused while here on earth... Just send me the gas money and he "won`t be" walking around free > lol???
Just kidding, but geez! I wish life were always fair, but no such luck... Randy

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always_keep_fighting, if he won't get punished in this life, he will after he'll be dead.

All the best to you!

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the fact is most of the evidence you point out is circumstantial at best. hardly enough evidence to support pre-meditation and any investigation and court proceeding would end with her sob story in front of a jury and Xrays from her countless injures would be proof of physical abuse not to mention anyone who testified on her behalf in the end she would get off scott free

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I just watched this for the first time and thought i'd chime in.

1. She could just say he lied to the girlfriend like he lied to her. He is dead and can't dispute it but his fingerprints on the letters would prove he knew she was in town.

2. I would have to assume that Slim put things back after it was done while she was cleaning herself and the scene. If she's throwing her bag in the river with a hole in it so it'll sink it's likely she did a little interior cleaning as well.

3. Illogical point. She's dressed for a casual sitdown, there's nothing here for the cops to pursue. Her gloves and boots are in the river. She's dressed like a normal person when the cops arrive.

4. THIS is the only point needing to be made and it would be what did her in. There's no way for her to explain it and if she tried to claim that HE cut his own phone line it would be a huge red flag because he turned off the alarm. Why would he turn off the alarm and then cut the phone line?

5. With all the damage in the house those injuries could have been caused by anything. Probably wouldn't even be brought up but if it was it would be dismissed rather easily as injuries suffered during the fight.

6. It would probably take a long time to recover that bag and they wouldn't drag the bottom without cause which they don't have. She put a hole in it so it would sink and it's not like it's that shallow around the base of a house so chances of anyone finding it are pretty slim. Not impossible but she could just come back later and retrieve it.

7. One fingerprint is all they'd need. The fact that they're in the house and have any DNA of his on them would be enough. They would need to prove that he DIDN'T actually read them and that wouldn't be possible.

8. She could say that SHE grabbed his phone and tried to call 911. In 2002 it wasn't as great as it is today. She could say she tried but didn't get service and back then it would have been enough.

9. She could just say she wanted to give him one more chance. Makes him look like a monster and her a nice woman at the same time. Easily explained.

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Pretty good points.

I'll still disagree that the fingerprints don't mean much. I know someone in forensic science. Fingerprints and how they're put on evidence does pull weight. The fact that the fingerprints were smudged and there were none of the back of the letters does mean something.

I also can't see how the police would simply shrug off her going to his house by herself. That just seems pretty odd to me when she was running away from him due to fear this whole time. It might be easily explained, but I think someone would raise an eyebrow to that explanation.

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Well, think about all the women in abusive relationships that stay, and do nothing about it. And I'm talking not just movies. Even herself, the guy said earlier in the movie that she had chances to go to the police and didn't. Of course to us, it doesn't make sense because we knows she's on the run from him the whole time, but the cops don't know that do they?

-You thinking what I'm thinking partner?
-Aim for the bushes.

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I understand what you're saying. However, I was talking about meeting him again after disappearing for so long. She understood she was in danger at some point. So why then would she go back and put herself right in danger again, especially after he'd tried to kill her. A lot do stay, but she didn't.

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[deleted]

I hate to break this to any of you, but abused women make illogical decisions all the time. They stay with men who abuse them and they go back to men who have abused them. The men apologize and the women think "this time it will be different". And sometimes it is for awhile. But it never lasts. And many of these women die. It's very common.

The police would not know that Slim didn't fit this pattern.

To each their own...opinion

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[deleted]

I can't believe nobody's brought this up. Look, I just took a class in criminal law, and here is one thing I learned that seems to easily explain this (see if this is familiar):

If you go someone with the intention of killing that person, even if you planned it all out on how you were going to kill them. If you STOP, if you decide you're NOT going to go through with it, and then THEY attempt to kill you and you fight back, killing them in the process, then the self defense is shifted into your favor.

So here's what we saw happen in the movie:

1) Slim about to kill the guy
2) Slim stops and calls Ginny, saying she isn't going to go through with it
3) In the process, Mitch is going after her, fully aware by now that she isn't going to kill him.
4) He hits her with a deadly, blunt object, Ginny calls the cops. At this point if Slim had died, the fact that Ginny was a witness that could say Slim called her and said she couldn't go through with it, so stopped, Mitch could have gone in for murder
5) Slim defends herself and kicks him off the edge, he dies.
6) She is free.

All because she had that one moment where she told someone she was not going to go through with it. See, we had a big discussion about that particular thing happening, so that's what I'm reminded of when I see that scene. She has grade A self defense

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It's not uncommon for abusers to cut phone lines, break cell phones and unplug phones while they are abusing their victim...happens all the time and police would think nothing of it especially if the violence had escalated to a piont where he was going to kill her...

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Those are very good points.

Slim is dressed in casual, yoga/jogging wear so it would be acceptable. For that lotion, she can claim she put on shimmering lotion, which was available at Bath and Body Works.

There's one thing I would like to add though. How does she explain her alibi on where she was the entire day? She was hiding out at Mitch's all night and day; can someone vouch for her?

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Oh, that's an interesting point.

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That's why she had Jupiter get her a body double.

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Actually she probably would have. Cops get a frantic phone call from a concerned friend saying she thinks he's beating her to death. They show up. Clearly they've fought. Chances are they're not going to look too closely at it. Especially if she brings forward witnesses to the abuse which she had, even if she didn't report it.

Two specific things though. I just watched it (insomnia rocks) and you are incorrect about the letters. He manhandles them pretty thoroughly while searching the drawer for the gun, so chances are good some fingerprints ended up on both sides of the letters. On the other hand you are completely correct about the cut telephone line. She was so careful to make everything else easily correctable or explainable, so why cut the fricking phone line when disconnecting it would have been just as effective? Sloppy scriptwriting if you ask me.


Visualize Whirled Peas

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I agree with the OP. I think if the cops really persued it they could charge her with murder. He is dead after all and he looked like his injuries were worse than Slim's. He looked like he had been beat up a lot. Like it wasn't with just one swift punch or push. And the girl who he told he was going to San Fransisco, the cut phone lines, the way she was dressed, (I too actually thought she looked like she was prepared for a work out) and the letters. To me, the letters look too placed there. Well, that's what I thought when I saw her put the letters in the drawer. And to me, the most damning evidence is her call to Jenny in the middle of the fight. If she was in fact defending herself why, when she gets hold of a phone, did she not call the police for help?

But the strongest evidence in favor of Slim would be the people that knew she was getting beat. Jenny, the lawyer, Mitches mother ( was it? ) that she showed her frirst black eye to, they could all testify that he was beating and it could look like self defense.

But I still think she'd get manslaughter or something. Mitch looked worn out, he looked like she took her time with him and I think evidence could prove she did a number on him and it might not have been self defense.



Jesus Christ is

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Why didn't the alarm go off when she broke into the house? Usually, when you set an alarm at night and are still in the house, the alarm will immediately go off when you open the door.

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The alarm wasn't on. You can see the panel inside on the wall- no light blinking. And the girl the next day...she just walks out without him turning off the alarm.

Minte vreodata regula de trei

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I think he didn't turn the alarm on because he was home and he had a guest. Then he wouldn't have to get up and turn it off if she left before he did. I'm sure with all his guns he figured he didn't need the alarm while he was home.

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I've read through what you and others have said and most of your original issues with the film have been discussed; one of them-#6-has fewer comments and since its an area I am familiar with, I thought I'd put my two cents in.

Let me premise with this..I am a certified UCSI and forensic scientist, among other things, and have had to do the whole "find the needle in the haystack" in retention ponds, the open ocean, under bridge passes and at docks. (if your anything like me, you look at the posting history of a commentor; most of my discussion revolve around my studied areas- I say this because there are a remarkable number of people who become experts in a variety of fields to lend validity to their opinion and I don't wish to be confused with that particular set)

Even in instances where the police KNOW something went into the water...and can point to the spot "it" went in...majority of the time, the object is NEVER found. An underwater search is harder than you think. Its one of the great mysteries of the water...nothing stays where it is supposed to. Bags like the one in the movie are thrown in all the time and they never, ever surface again. They drift, they get intangled and they get buried in silt and coated in shells and barnacles.

The likelyhood of the bag ever being found, by a cop or fishermen in the future is highly unlikely. The police have no reason to search for the bag in the first place. So it would have to be found by accident. And yes, that does happen. If it were to be located at some time in the future by some anonymous person- it wouldn't make it to the police; they would toss it away. If you happen to get the one in a million person who finds the items suspicous and they do turn it in, where's the connection to Slim? It will be turned over to some faceless patrolman who will in all likelyhood, dismiss the thing intirely. What is there to connect this bag of stuff to a self defense killing that wasn't even on the water where the bag was found.

I think that particular point is reaching a bit to much. And while it has been pointed out by others, I'd like to say...the police are lazy- they don't go one step farther than is absolutely necessary. Add to this that the average IQ of a cop is 75-85...I don't see her getting caught.

Sorry this was so long...I've never been very good at economy of phrasing.
Minte vreodata regula de trei

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Perhaps you didn't hear the last line of the police officer: "You're one of the lucky ones"

He has killed before, and she "was lucky" to get away. So when they see a dead serial killer, TRUST ME, they do less detective work.

His girlfriend didn't know Slim showed up at his house, and if she heard he was a serial killer, I doubt she would witness against Slim, the abused wife.

And for obvious reasons, the letters he would've written to her, would not be in his possession. That's the thing about letters. You tend to send them to whoever they're meant for. If you mean she would've kept them, well she could just say she threw them out. At max, it'd be suspicious, but it's not evidence.

Everything you describe is at best suspicious circumstances, and it cannot be proven that she did it. And the bag will sink to the bottom of the lake. EVEN if found in 10 years (though it probably wouldn't), it wouldn't lead back to her, and even if they could find her fingerprints on it, it wouldn't be enough for a conviction. Again, odds are no one would look deeply into the murder of a serial killer.

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Perhaps you didn't hear the last line of the police officer: "You're one of the lucky ones"

He has killed before, and she "was lucky" to get away. So when they see a dead serial killer, TRUST ME, they do less detective work.

His girlfriend didn't know Slim showed up at his house, and if she heard he was a serial killer, I doubt she would witness against Slim, the abused wife.

I had always figured the cop meant that she was one of the lucky ones in the sense that she lived, that Mitch didn't beat her to death.
Cops likely see lots of abused and even dead spouses of abusers.



"I'd say this cloud is Cumulo Nimbus."
"Didn't he discover America?"
"Penfold, shush."

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Well, cops don't see that many people actually getting killed by a beating from their spouse.

Mitch's mom, when seeing her black eye, immediatly asks "What did you say to him?" without being told Mitch did it. Mitch really have a problem with his temper, obviously, which is why I interpret it as him having killed before. The other "lucky ones" I assume are the women he cheats with outside his marriage.

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Cops see a lot of women killed by their spouses. The statistics are shockingly high. It seems a lot of these killings are not during the marriage itself, but after the women leave and the men find them.
Despicable, what is wrong with them?



"I'd say this cloud is Cumulo Nimbus."
"Didn't he discover America?"
"Penfold, shush."

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I never said people aren't being killed. I'm saying that the individual cop doesn't see that many wife's being killed by their husbands.

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He has killed before, and she "was lucky" to get away. So when they see a dead serial killer, TRUST ME, they do less detective work.


He wasn't a serial killer. The cop meant that she was a lucky woman because other women in this situation usually end up dead.

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Well, it's open for interepretation. Could be one, could be the other.

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Cops see a lot of women killed by their spouses. The statistics are shockingly high. It seems a lot of these killings are not during the marriage itself, but after the women leave and the men find them.
Despicable, what is wrong with them?


If you talk to cops, you'll find than most abuse/murder on young children are made by their mom.
Disgusting. What's wrong with them ?

In reality, you've 3 much more 'chances' to be victim of a homicide if you're a man.

What kills women ?

Mainly cancer and heart disease (45%)

Chances of being killed by an accident: more or less 4%

Chances of being killed by your husband/boyfriend etc: less than 0.004 %

In practical terms:

On 1000 women:
- 450 will die oh heart disease and cancer
- 40 will be crushed in car accidents, electrocuted etc
- 4 will be killed by their companion.

Morality: Chances are, cigarettes and trans-fat are much more deadly than your psychotic ex boyfriend.

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He's not a serial killer. He's a wife beater.

The cop was referring to the fact that as a beaten wife, she is one of the lucky ones to have gotten away rather than end up dead at the hands of her husband.

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Well, you're assuming she called the police immediately and they showed up immediately.

She had time to ditch her stuff, she also had time to put everything back in the house the way it was; put all the kitchen knives back, put the guns back, etc.

I also don't think the police would bother to search the house. Cause of death is pretty obvious. It also looked like the police officer interviewing Slim gave her a wink as to not having to worry about any charges or investigation.

Wearing clothing and lotion can be easily explained and is no proof of premeditated murder.

The police would only notice the line if they were looking for it. And there is no way to determine when the line was cut or who did it.

The bruises on the body from the rings might now show up for several days. The cause of death was pretty obvious. Head trauma from falling backwards from a railing that failed. I doubt they would look beyond that for anything else.

I doubt the bag would be found. Even if it was, there is no way to connect it to Slim. If anyone found it I doubt they would even contact the police.

I doubt the police would even bother fingerprinting the letters. That was just some insurance.

Mitch's 911 call never went through. The screen said no service. She was blocking cell phone signals in the house. And again, the police had no reason to look at his cell phone. His cause of death is pretty obvious.

If it looks like a horse, walks like a horse and whinnies like a horse, you don't go looking for a zebra.

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But what would surely have made the cops suspicious is:
Mitch is beaten to a bloody pulp yet his wife barely has a scratch!

Yeah OK, she 'fought back'. Come on! What cop is gonna buy that scenario?

If she had merely struck him with a bat or pipe, maybe they'd buy that.


I'd say this cloud is Cumulo Nimbus.
Didn't he discover America?
Penfold, shush.

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You may have a point but I sure loved what she did to him!

"A real man would rather bow down to a strong woman than dominate a weak one"

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1. First, it seemed like a hookup, not a GF and that could be an issue but with the letters and with her testimony to prove it, it could easily just be explained that he didn't really tell the hookup all the real details about his personal life.

2. I'm assuming she put everything back in order.....since she unhooked everything and put it in the yellow bag and sunk it I'm assuming she put the house back in order, including putting that stuff back.

3. I think that is reaching. She is wearing bum clothes wouldn't mean anything. Lotion? First, if you've ever worn it, it doesn't last.....she sweat it off and they didn't do a physical exam on her. I think she was wearing a jacket or something when they got there anyway. That's reaching.

4. That is a valid point. If they found that she'd basically have to say, I don't know anything about that.

5. No, her hands were wrapped. They weren't exposed. They just had more weight behind them. I think you are reaching with this one.

6. No they wouldn't. That stuff sank in the bay. Maybe a random diver will find it several years later but the police aren't going into that bay/water. That makes no sense at all.

7. Possibly. If the investigation gets that intension.....it gets CSI type of scrutiny than you may be right. It is hard to tell if the police would suspect anything odd and go to all of the trouble to examine the house on that level. If it seems open and shut to them they may or may not do the type exams you are talking about.

8. Bag? No. We covered that in 6. The phone? Maybe, it may show the 911.....if they look. She can say she has no idea, maybe he started to call 911 when he hit her from behind and thought she needed a doctor and aborted it when she came to.

9. People don't have to explain that stuff. She can just say she did. That all there is to it. She wanted her daughter and running wasn't working so she had to finally face up to him.

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