MovieChat Forums > Le violon rouge (1999) Discussion > I think many of you missed the point of ...

I think many of you missed the point of the film *spoilers


At the risk of starting a small, tactical, flame war, I think most of the posters have missed the point of the movie entirely. But to start on a positive note, I would like to say this movie is a masterpiece, an instant classic. Nearly flawless, its minute shortcomings will only be mentioned later.

The point of the movie, which the redeemed anti-hero Morritz discovers through his character-arc near end the end, is people and relationships are what we should value most highly. Objects, no matter how beautiful, should not be so coveted, as this can lead to great trouble, as exemplified by the "curse of the Red Violin." Morritz isn't stealing the Red Violin at the end of the movie!

Card 1 - The Moon - You will live a long life, full and rich, there is travel ahead, a long journey.
Card 2 - Hanged Man - A curse hangs over you madam. Danger to those who come under your "thrall", and there will be many. Sickness and death.
Card 3 - The Devil - Then I see a time of lust and energy. You have a Lazarus soul. A man comes into your life, a handsome man.
Card 4 - Justice - There will be a trial, a great trial, before a powerful magistrate and you will be guilty. Beware the heat of the fire.
Card 5 - Death, upside down - Could be good news.

The owners, or possessors of the violin in order...

Nicolo Bussotti - Even though tragedy befalls him, he is not a victim of the curse, as he does not covet the violin. Even though he considers it perfect, he wants to give it to his son. And it is very clear he loves his wife and desperately wants a child. Also the curse follows the "humors", or the blood used to coat the violin. Since we know the Red Violin was the last he ever produced, it is likely he died shortly after making it, probably of a broken heart.

Trader - He probably came into possession of the violin during the estate sale after Bussotti died. No wealthy merchant or royalty had commissioned the piece, it was to be a gift to his son, so even though it was of the finest quality, it might have been taken by an apprentice in lieu of back wages or sold at auction. Perhaps Bussotti owed the merchant money and this was to be his payment? He does not covet it, so it passes through his hands to the monks.

The Monastery - The monks buy it, but do not covet it, lending it as a reward to the star violinist in their orchestra of orphans, hey thats a good name for a band. We see it pass from boy to boy, until Kaspar Weiss. Although he had a bad heart and is a small child worthy of sympathy and empathy. He covets the violin, even sleeping with it. The mere thought of losing it actually causes him to have a fatal heart attack.

Georges Poussin - He never possessed the violin and does not fall under its spell. There is much debate on this forum about who robbed the grave. It was the Gypsies and not Poussin. I base my conclusion on the following: Poussin is clearly interested in the violin, but not to sell. He rebukes his wife for suggesting its sale and only mentions the sale of the violin to Prince Mansfeld as a "possibility" to be discussed after the boy has played for him, which is his real goal. Of course that thought causes the poor boy's death. If Poussin had taken it from the grave, he would have either kept it, or sold it to the Prince for a princely sum, as they say, not to "scum" Gypsies. Had Poussin fallen under its "thrall" the story would have followed him to his demise. In wonderful acting, Poussin does "perk-up" upon its mention by the Monks, but seems resigned to their conclusion that it should go with the boy to be played in heaven. *sniff

The Gypsies - Known throughout Europe as beggars, thieves and con-artists, hence the term "gyped", they came across the fresh grave and robbed it, looking for anything of value, but finding only the violin. We hear the Gypsy music being played while we are looking at the re-opened grave, before we cut to the Gypsies. None of the Gypsies covet the violin. We see it being passed down through the generations, always being played in the celebratory setting of a family gathering. No real harm befalls them.

Frederick Pope - He covets the violin from the instant he hears it, following the sound across a meadow to the source. The famed Pope copy results from this meeting. He mentions "some arrangement" can be reached when he finds the Gypsies trespassing on his land. I believe the arrangement was a trade in which Pope would commission a copy of the finest quality to be exchanged for his use and ownership of the Red Violin. While it was being manufactured, the Gypsies could live on his land. Pope has fallen under the "spell" of the violin. During his concert he pants and grunts as if he is making love to the violin. He even kisses it when he is finished. During the sex scenes, is he making love to the woman, or the violin? Notice when Victoria points the gun at his chest, he hold the violin out and away, most people would hide behind anything to deflect a bullet. His obsession costs him the woman he loves and he commits suicide.

The Chinese Servant - How does the servant come to possess the violin? When he sells it later in China, it has the bullet mark, so it can't have been repaired in England. The copy had already been ordered when the damage was inflicted. The Gypsy girl leaves Pope and the Red Violin, the day of the shooting, still expecting to receive the copy at a later date. Upon his suicide, Victoria controls his estate. She hates the violin, she shot the violin. It's most likely she gave it to servant, just wanting to forever get it out of her sight and mind. Had he "taken" it, that would have shown greed, but nothing bad happens to him, which is the pattern of the film for those who covet the violin.

Chinese Store Owner - We don't know how much time has past when the servant comes to sell the violin. He is wearing a suit and has a suitcase. Has he just arrived from England? He looks older. I think he had the violin for several years, without realizing its value and coveting it, and now wants to sell it to finance a trip. Perhaps this trip is to visit family? The merchants main interest in the violin are the rubies in the scroll. He removes and sells them probably recouping most or all of his investment. The violin then hangs in his shop for many more years, as illustrated by his advanced age when he re-sells it. It has been repaired during this time, the "horse-glue, hack-job" referred to later. You can see the repaired neck when he hands it to Xiang's mother.

Xiang Pei - She covets the violin and it leads to trouble in her life. The Red Violin is the perfect symbol of the greed and avarice millions of communist Chinese were denouncing, or being forced to denounce, at the time. Rather than leave it be or destroy it, Xiang feels drawn to play it one last time, which leads to her son telling her husband, who turns her over to the cultural police. We don't learn her ultimate fate, but it being in her possession certainly leads to problems. I don't think she was killed immediately but perhaps she was sent away to a re-education camp.

Chou Yuan - He comes to covet not only the Red Violin but dozens of other fine musical instruments which become the basis for the auction we see in the movie. None of the coveting of the violin is truly evil, nor is Yuan's. We find him dead of old age, having died in the attic amongst his "treasure-trove" of antique western musical instruments. The tragedy is that he probably never was able to play any of them again, for fear someone would overhear. And he probably spent every remaining day of his life in fear of being discovered and punished.

Charles Morritz - He has been under the spell of the violin for years. Morritz begins by formulating the plan to acquire the Pope copy for comparison purposes, but when he hears the red violin being played he decides he must have it, and the copy provides the way to execute such a plan.
How much would Morritz make, and more importantly what is he risking? Guesstimates - There were 72 items in the auction, starting with a cello with a reserve of $10,000. The reserve on the Bussotti, was $250,000 and it sold for $2,400,000. So lets assume that most items went for 10 times their reserve, and the items increased in value, but only the last two items sold for fortunes. I estimate the other 70 items to have sold for $14,000,000, approximately $200,000 apiece, plus the Strad and the Bussotti, at $1,950,000 and $2,400,000, for a grand total of $18,300,000. If the auction house takes a fee of 10%, Duvals grossed approximately $1,830,000 for holding this auction. If Morritz's fee was 10% of their fee, he made $183,000 for his three weeks worth of work. If it was 5%, which would be 1/2 of 1% of the total value of the auctioned items, he made $96,000. Stradivarius copies routinely sell for $20,000 or more and the fictional Bussotti is considered to be in that league. The one and only copy of the famed "Pope Red Violin" would have to command at least $30,000, but probably more in the range of $50,000. If he were using the copy only for comparison purposes he probably could have "rented" it and billed it to Duvals. But we know he buys it because of the line, "and more of your money," from Evan Williams the restorer and accomplice.

If he can afford to buy the famous Pope copy, he obviously makes a very comfortable living, but it is probably not enough to outbid others in an open auction. So what is he risking when he decides to steal the Bussotti? At the very least he risks his professional reputation, but in addition there would likely be prison and fines. In short he is risking it all to posses the Red Violin.

We know he has done extensive research into Bussotti and the violin, as his hotel room clearly illustrates. This research could have easily lead him to know the generalities of the violin's history, but not the fortunetelling we the audience know. It is during the Ruselsky private viewing session, which also seems to be hotly debated, that Morritz decides to steal the Red Violin.

Ruselsky is a master violinist, a la Itzhak Perlman, and not just a collector. This film evidences this by, his private showing, where he is allowed to actually play the violins before the auction, Mme Leroux's comment that she has the recording of the piece he plays on the Strad, there is a Grammy on a shelf in his office, and also by the autograph seeker at the actual auction. He also has an orchestra waiting for him during this scene and he says "they can wait". Some people seemed confused by Morritz's line about the Strad needing to be "played by a master" to be fully appreciated, after Ruselsky said it was, "tight on the top, stronger over the break." This is ribbing between friends. Morritz knows Ruselsky well enough so this barb passes without causing any anger. Later at the auction, Ruselsky waves at him as he enters the room.

Morritz attempts to dissuade Ruselsky from even playing the Red Violin. But as he plays, Morritz falls completely under the musical spell as he hears it for the first time, and at the hands of a master, no less. Did Ruselsky know he was playing the famous "Red Violin", when he said "nothing special" afterward? Well he just criticized an authenticated Stradivarius, so my guess is he never fawns over an instrument he is considering buying at auction. His later outrage on the telephone, where he says, "I knew it as soon as I saw it, and I said it.", is simply a mis-remembering of the previous events after reading the paper and feeling that he was mis-lead. His keen eye did spot it, and he wanted to play it, but he certainly never said, "I want this violin." or "This is the famous red violin." This is part of the theme of the movie, people don't always recognize something of true value. Even though the audience knows it has the most perfect resonance's Evan Williams has ever recorded, the bidders don't know this.

The allure of owning the Red Violin is different for each of the main bidders.

Older Ming's attendance at the auction can only mean his mother survived. Would she have told young Ming, or her husband, what she did with the violin, after just having been sold-out? After Ming reached adulthood, Xiang probably told him that she had given it to her old music teacher Yuan. After Yuan's death, the details of the auction and the contents of his "treasure trove" would have become public knowledge. Lot 72, the violin up for auction at the end of the movie, is the real Red Violin. It has been switched back only moments before by Morritz. There are other reasons why Ming stops bidding. First, he is blind as a bat, wearing thick glasses and would not be able to "spot" the original from the copy from 30 feet away. He has to ask his assistant if the violin is even in view and is looking at the picture in the catalog when he says, "It's not at all how I remember it, perhaps if I heard it again." This is revealing. He wants the violin because it represents a re-capturing of his youth. He wants to re-establish the relationship he had with his mother before he sold her out to the communists. Of course it doesn't look the same, your mother isn't playing it for you before you learned how ugly the world can be.

Nicolas Olsberg - This guy is a great character. He is worried to death about missing the auction, yet still takes the time to ask for a receipt from the cab driver, assuredly for reimbursement by the Pope Foundation. From his comments about Pope we know he is the type of person to be obsessive and we can only wonder what fate he would have had with the violin coming under his care, if not truly under his ownership.

Modern Monks - It was only after the death of Frederick Pope and his commissioning of a copy to be made of his prized Red Bussotti, that the order becomes aware that the red violin they owned for over 100 years, over a century ago, and which was robbed from their prodigies grave, was the famous red Bussotti owned by Pope. But obviously at some point they became aware of the history of the violin and were prepared to bid on it, probably with the backing of the Vatican. They drop out rather early.

Ruselsky - If you subscribe to the reincarnation theories put forth in other threads, Morritz does not represent the reincarnated husband the fortunetelling servant woman Cesca tells Anna Bussotti to go to in the last flashback, its Ruselsky. We don't know for certain, but Ruselsky isn't wearing a wedding ring and never mentions children. The woman sitting next to him at the auction is probably his personal assistant. In his office we see only one picture and it looks like him. He has many violins, statues, books and awards, but no pictures of family. He has spent his life in pursuit of musical excellence. Music is his true love. Perhaps him winning the auction is the wife returning to the husband? The movie is ending, the prophecy is complete with the upside-down death, a possible good sign. Perhaps Ruselsky will cherish the violin but not covet it as he obviously has many other fine specimens, and the curse will be lifted?

continued...

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this is the best thread I have ever seen on IMDB...
no name calling or anything.. just civil discussion..
wow!

great movie...an 8 from me...

and I am not sure if Morritz ended up with the original or the copy...
right now I lean to the copy.

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I agree that this is a most enjoyable thread but I vote for the "theft" being of the real Red Violin to give to Morritz's child.

For the reason that that is why it was made in the first place and for when Morritz asks Evan Williams if he has children and he says 'no' and then asks, "What would you do with it?"....and Williams answers something like "take it apart...see how it works....blah, blah, blah".

Morritz knows that that is "wrong" and finally decides to get the violin to its proper home.....a worthy child.

That last sentence I wrote made me recall when Poussin kept suggesting that the violin Kasper has is too big and he should get a child's version (like young Mozart!) leaving me more convinced that the violin had to complete it's cycle back to a child.

It IS a 'child's' violin!

Anyway....that's my take and thanks for all the fish.

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Interesting discussion. I totally disagree with the assertion that Morriz returned the original and kept the copy. He did not have the original in order to return it--the person employing him was no dummy. For all his smiles and thank you's it was evident he knew Morriz was trying to hide his investigation and misrepresent the results, only admitting to it when pressed. From the point of confrontation on he had no access to the violins in the collection until the theft.

He had the Pope copy purchased discretely with his own funds, so the transaction did not show up on any reports handled by his client. They had no reason to suspect the original had been stolen. It's not clear the theft would have been discovered any time soon either, as (unlike Morriz's partner in crime) Ruselsky would NOT chance ruining the instrument by trying to take it apart, and the copy was an acknowledged quality instrument. Morriz was the only one to have EVER done the tests on the violin and if his accomplice didn't tell, nobody would know how vastly superior it was. In spite of his protestations, Ruselsky was not certain of the identity of the red violin after trying it out, and he did not make a detailed examination of it. There's no reason to believe he wouldn't be duped by the fake, it having been apparently authenticated only days before.

He would have admitted climbing the golden stairs & cutting St. Peter's throat with a bowling ball.

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I've seen this movie several times and love it. I've never even considered that Morritz was returning the original Red Violin and stealing the Pope copy at the end. Everything you've written makes sense and I do believe now that is exactly what happened. Great thread.

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The OP's posts are longer than the movie itself. This is an interesting little film chronicling the "life" of the Red Violin. The tragedy of Bussotti's wife is carried with the violin... Kaspar Weiss, Poussin, Pope, Xiang Pei, Chou Yuan, Ruselsky. These are people who all cared about the violin, and each had some bad thing happen to them. But then there's the monks, the gypsies, Pope's manservant and the pawnbroker... they remained detached from it, and nothing happened to them. One has to wonder what is going to befall Morritz.

Moral of the story: love for an object will destroy you. Did we need a series of novel-length posts to explain that?

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Wow! That was a fantastic summary, movielover35. It cleared up some questions I had. Thanks!

However, I disagree on one point. I believe that Morritz DID steal the real red violin. His guilty reaction when the auction guy called his name with his coat was just too much.


Schrodinger's cat walks into a bar, and / or doesn't.

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KUDOS movielover35, I feel you did an excellent analysis and I tend to agree with you. I've not yet fully read this thread (lack of time) so bear with me if these points had been already discussed:

# it's true in the scene we see Ruselsky playing the violin we hear the topical sound, and the frame is centered on Morritz hearing that sound : is that a possible evidence that the actual sound a Master like Ruselski is hearing is that of the copy instead. The switch has already been made (Morritz also says something in the sense he had just worked on the instrument, that is the violin was not on the exposition 'till a short time before). It seems odd a Violin Master is not recognizing the quality of the instrument.

# the Chinese Lady beside being a party leader was also married to one: interestingly he discovers (?) her mother was a musician in the thirties looking at the photos and see all the broken records besides the one still playing; after sometimes he's waiting for her he says 'she'll come back' and send the red guards to have some foods: they are not really chasing her.
I suppose she did come back explaining she felt ashamed by her Mother's love for the western music and wanted to get rid of all of it: I believe she was accepted back without much troubles. Leaving the teacher/collector she tells him something like 'I'm in the party and cannot hold to such things, but I love the people' besides threatening to break it up.

# I don't believe Pope made suicide after all and since his beloved violin had been badly damaged by a bullet, he ordered a pristine copy. Since the Gypsies were not really attached to the instrument maybe he let them camp on his premises in exchange for it. Or if he came to suicide in the end it may have happened sometime well after the shooting incident, so he left his estate to his lover and the damaged violin to his Chinese servant, as an almost worthless if not symbolic gift.

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