MovieChat Forums > Ghost (1990) Discussion > Major Spoiler: little bit upset that....

Major Spoiler: little bit upset that....

posted 8 years ago by VanillaLimeCoke
12 replies | jump to latest

I'm a little bit upset that Carl died and then got dragged off by the evil hellish spirits.

I mean sure he was scum and wrong but he was just moving money along all along from the mob making some extra dough. He honestly didn't mean to have Sam killed.

When I first saw this movie I missed some bits and pieces. One major scene I missed out on was the scene where Carl went to Willie's apartment. I only came back where Sam was punching him relentlessly and at the time I thought he was someone else.

That made it more confusing why he needed certain codes so badly and what he was doing with a Rita Miller account and why Sam had Odae fake Rita Miller and then why Carl got mad when the account was closed and then he was threatening to kill Molly.

Then seeing the movie in whole and realizing that Carl was bad I was scared of him. I thought he even poisoned the Japanese Apple Pears he got for Molly.

But after awhile seeing the movie again and again in later years I could clearly see he never meant for Sam to die. He explodes at Willy for this. He even says later to ghost Sam that he didn't mean to have Sam killed.

It also bothers me in these types of movies that the police never come. Instead it all has to cum down to a violent grand finale (and I'm sorry for spelling come so offensively there but it's because the middle school and high school kids who picked on me like the violence way more than just a simple police ending). I mean even a somewhat violent pursue and then the police suddenly showing up would have sufficed.

And as for Carl I would have liked to see him arrested and then see Odae and/or Molly get a cheap bitch slap in as the cops hauled him off to jail or witness protection (since he was the brains of the mob the police could have used him). Another thing is that if he died instead of having the evil hellish spirit ghosts drag him off he should have just stayed as a ghost indefinitely until he fully redeemed himself.

[–] !!!deleted!!! (67334719) 8 years ago

The movie set it up that evil spirits aren't stuck and move on

[–] AutumnCider 8 years ago

I'm not so sure that he didn't mean to have Sam killed. Carl knew that Sam was perplexed by the extra money in the accounts, and that he was determined to figure out why it was there. Carl had also been asking about the codes earlier in the day, and had asked to take over for Sam. If the mugging had only ended up with Sam's wallet (with the MAC codes inside being stolen,) and suddenly the excess money was gone, he would have figured out why.

Friend or not, Sam was too honest to keep something like that a secret (otherwise Carl probably would have just offered him a cut of the money for his help and silence.)

Not to mention that Carl did try to torch the apartment with Molly (and whoever else lived in the building) inside. He also tried to kill Oda Mae. He held Molly at gunpoint, too. Not exactly heavenly behavior!

[–] VanillaLimeCoke 8 years ago

That's the whole problem.

Carl had gotten himself into something bad and that led to not heavenly behavior but it's at the same time I don't think he nearly deserved to go to Hell. The thing is I'm not sure if he would have really killed Molly or Ota Mae. If surely so he would have done it right away.

The money really wasn't Sam's either, so technically Sam having Odae Mae give the church $4,000,000 isn't 100% law abiding.

That's just where it gets all complicated.

Sam should have just somehow sent an anynomus tip to the police station (like type it up on the computer, print it out a bunch at Carl's office) after he learned movement but that might have been too tough.

Basically it's just that I wanted Carl to be put in witness protection and being forced to testify against all of his drug launders instead of just dying. With the ending we get the drug launders don't get their money but yet they're all still out there.

"Be excellent to each other...And....Party on!"

[–] snelling 8 years ago

I have seen this movie countless times and I even saw it in the theatre back in 1990 and now I agree that Carl didn't deserve to go to hell after reading all the above posts. But at the movies when the dark shadows took Carl away, the audience cheered and applauded. Maybe that is the reason the director went that route.

"'Extremely High Voltage.' Well, I don't need safety gloves, because I'm Homer Sim--" - Frank Grimes

[–] jsn_hylnd 8 years ago

I'd say it's Carl's seducing of Molly is what generated the cheers for the dark shadows scene. A lot of people miss the laundering details when first viewing the movie.

[–] Beeracuda 8 years ago

He most certainly deserved it. Sam trusted him as a co-worker, but more importantly as a friend. Carl's actions got Sam killed, and emotionally ruined Molly. If that was his only evil action, I might agree with you. However, he then asked Willy to "do away" with Oda Mae. Tried to move in romantically with Molly, further undermining his friendship with Sam. Tried once again to kill Oda Mae, then threatened to kill Molly. Had Oda Mae given him the $4,000,000, I don't believe for one minute that Carl would have let her and Molly live - the two witnesses who can definitely pin money laundering and murder on Carl. Even during the short period of time between his death and when the dark angels came for him, he showed no remorse, and missed a golden opportunity to apologize right to Sam's face. So yeah, Carl got exactly what he deserved.

As for the $4 million, he didn't exactly give it to the church. He donated it to them to be used to help the homeless, per the sign right behind the nuns. That's certainly a worthy cause for money that was acquired through drug sales and murder.

[–] kylopod 8 years ago

The thing is I'm not sure if he would have really killed Molly or Ota Mae.

He told Willie directly to find Oda Mae and kill her. And we know Willie ends up very nearly succeeding in following this order. Whether Carl would have physically carried out the act himself is less important than the fact that he willingly signed her death warrant--that is clearly attempted murder right there.

[–] marialucia1985 7 years ago

Lol despite Carl's actions, I actually found his demise quite unsettling and sad tbh.

I think his desperation with his money owing predicament and such, had made him do despicable things, that he wouldn't have normally done.

I don't believe he wanted Sam dead and was probably just as shocked and devastated to learn this.

At the end, you can even see Sam looking devastated at Carl's 'death'. And was almost trying to stop it.

Saying all this, he was a complete rotter for ordering Oda Mae's murder via Willie!

I don't believe he would've hurt Mollie tho. I think they were just threats to test Sam and wouldn't have followed through with it. Carl knew and felt something for Mollie but Oda Mae - he couldn't care less about.

Which is why, when he was attacking Oda Mae, he kept telling Mollie to stay out of it and not get in the way.

[–] nickscribe 7 years ago

You could argue that Carl is less directly responsible for Sam's death than Willie. Certainly Willie doesn't sweat it when Carl berates him for it - all in a day's work to him. Her even describes Sam's death as "a freebie".

But obviously Carl's actions have a knock-on effect and he clearly told Willie to kill Oda-Mae, a result of his desperation growing.... What if the drug dealers had got to him first? Would he still be dragged off to hell?

Also, what's to say that Hell is permanent? Maybe a soul can gain redemption after an indeterminate time? The less corrupted the soul, the more likely their chance of redemption.

All very deep I know...

[–] wqxyzcj 7 years ago

Maybe he was dragged to Purgatory. It is pretty much the same as Hell, only with the chance for redemption.

[–] LetsBeSerious 7 years ago

Instead it all has to cum down to a violent grand finale (and I'm sorry for spelling come so offensively there but it's because the middle school and high school kids who picked on me like the violence way more than just a simple police ending).

What does this even mean?

[–] Dub88 (53) 5 years ago

I have no idea but it has me laughing.