The Borg names are so stupid - Star Trek: The Next Generation (1987) Discussion

[–] Geek_XX 8 years ago

Remember it's a hive collective.

Each hive is designated a number out of how many in that hive.

It may be stupid but it's how their society works.

Why do we have names? It's unexplained since there are over 1 million Johns and Susans and Daves and Kathys etc.

How can we identify each of those Johns and Kathys? Some even have the same last name.

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[–] Nakitaakita-1 8 years ago

So in Hugh's hive there are 6 of them?
I thought that the entire collective was connected.
Even the other ships were connected.
Like Picard knowing all about Wolf 356.
Or knowing about how to shut down the Borg ship and make them ALL go to sleep.
Not just a few of them.

we need more diversity in sports. Where are the short, fat Asians!

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[–] Geek_XX 8 years ago

Technically yes.

I'm not 100% sure how they determine there's 6 in one group and say 9 in another.

I believe it's like a family. They unite in each section of the cube.

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[–] WyldeGoose 8 years ago

It didn't bother me because I see it as a literary gimmick. They could've just as easily had Hugh or Seven say something like 75876889344 as their name, but saying "3 of 5," or "7 of 9," sounds simpler.

Consider how more trivial it sounds to be 3 of 5. He's but one of a group, some nameless group of drones either permanently or temporarily assigned as needed. Hugh may have been 1 of 10 the week prior to the episode. And he could've been 7 of 9 just before that.

That he's a cog in a greater machine is the point, and it doesn't really have to be explained too much (in fact, the problem with the Borg is they've been explained too much).

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[–] Nexus71 8 years ago

Wouldn't the Borg be more efficient using binary codes for identification?Something like Borg 100100111101 talking to Borg 1010001110101. 

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[–] WyldeGoose 8 years ago

They probably already do, to one another. But, TV and film are visual/audio mediums, and there has to be something of an emotional connection to the audience. The best way to convey that kind of information is in a pithy way, to the point.

Sometimes, the less you say and the more you show conveys more information than raw exposition can ever do. In The Empire Strikes Back, for instance, there's a simple scene of expository dialogue where Admiral Piett walks into Vader's chamber room, to tell Vader that they've lost the Millennium Falcon as it went into an asteroid field, but before that he sees the back of Vader without his helmet on. The helmet comes down, and Vader swivels to face him. Then he makes his report. This scene is used to convey additional information to the audience about Vader, and about Piett, that Vader is something that may have once been human, kept alive by machines, and is exposing some of his physical vulnerability. Yet Piett is still terrified of Vader, and you can see it in the actor's expressions. Whether you realize it or not, you're being fed information about the characters in the scene.

To have Borg drones refer to themselves verbally in binary codes probably would've been a bit too much information for the audience to digest; they'd have got the point, but it wouldn't be the same as saying something like 7 of 9. The audience, if they already know about the Borg from previous episodes, already know there are thousands, millions of drones, and to hear one say she's 7 of 9 indicates that they are mere cogs, interchangeable as needed for the Collective. That they are unimportant enough not to have real names. Having a specific code to represent one drone could convey that they are important enough to have a more specific name. If they have something more specific, it's not known to the ordinary, non-Borg people, and thus not known to the audience. That helps to convey the sense of anonymity among the Borg, that you lose your real identity when you become a drone. I think this was done rather well in light of Picard's assimilation as Locutus. With Locutus having a name, they needed to show how drones are designated, so that Locutus was more important to the Collective.

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[–] foebane72 8 years ago

Wouldn't the Borg be more efficient using binary codes for identification?Something like Borg 100100111101 talking to Borg 1010001110101.

Spending a little time on Windows Programmer's Calculator, I see that:

Borg 2365 would be talking to Borg 5237 (Decimal - more efficient than Binary, don'tcha think??)

Or even better:

Borg 93D would be talking to Borg 1475 (Hexadecimal - more efficient than Decimal, wouldn't you say?)

In fact, converting Naki's example of 75876889344 (in Decimal) would give the following:

11AA9D7300 in Hexadecimal
1000110101010100111010111001100000000 in Binary (OUCH!)

Just in case you're not sure, Decimal is Base 10, Binary is Base 2, and Hexadecimal is Base 16, and all of the above are identical in numerical value, even though less and less symbols are used to represent the values as the Bases increase. Hell, there might even be a Base 26 possible, using every letter of the alphabet to represent numbers!

I'm sure the Borg would have some even more efficient method in use. I'm just showing how inflexible Binary and Decimal would be for representing such huge numbers as Naki did.

Why are you here if you haven't seen the movie yet?

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[–] RubyHypatia 8 years ago

Seven's full designation is Seven of Nine Tertiary Adjunct of Unimatrix 01.

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[–] Nexus71 8 years ago

Seven's full designation is Seven of Nine Tertiary Adjunct of Unimatrix 01.

Hence my reply that it would be more efficient for Borg to identify themselves with binary codes,and since we as a viewer don't know what the hell a Tertiary Adjunct of Unimatrix 01 is or does we don't really loose much information,unless you are Borg obsessed or actually watched the episodes that deal with the Unimatrix on VOY,and even that won't explain it fully(to my knowledge or I could be wrong).And how can someone designated 7 0f 9 be tertiary adjunct shouldn't she be designated Five of Nine or Six of Nine?

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[–] foebane72 8 years ago

Hence my reply that it would be more efficient for Borg to identify themselves with binary codes

Nexus, I've already explained why that is NOT the case. Go read my other posts here.

Why are you here if you haven't seen the movie yet?

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[–] Nexus71 8 years ago

Those post were both made a day ago and I wasn't replying to your post Foe,please check the date before you get yourself worked up for nothing mate.

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[–] foebane72 8 years ago

I'm not worked up, and I know your post was one day ago, but it still applies. 

Why are you here if you haven't seen the movie yet?

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[–] blakgard 8 years ago

Binary is an extremely inefficient means of counting anything. The only purpose it serves is when it comes to electrical pulses of on or off.

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[–] Nexus71 8 years ago

Well since they are highly integrated with the Collective which in effect is a giant computer to which every drone is connected one would assume the Borg would use binary codes to send and receive information to the Collective(going by the assumption computer science evolved in a similar fashion as here on Earth).And when we go by that assumption we must assume that each drone has his/hers own individual identification code when connecting with the Collective so why not use that same identification code as it's identity?Got this idea after watching the Binars a couple of weeks ago and they used binary code as identification,so I asked myself "Why didn't the Borg use a similar system since they seem so much like the Binars?"

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[–] foebane72 8 years ago

Well since they are highly integrated with the Collective which in effect is a giant computer to which every drone is connected one would assume the Borg would use binary codes to send and receive information to the Collective(going by the assumption computer science evolved in a similar fashion as here on Earth).And when we go by that assumption we must assume that each drone has his/hers own individual identification code when connecting with the Collective so why not use that same identification code as it's identity?Got this idea after watching the Binars a couple of weeks ago and they used binary code as identification,so I asked myself "Why didn't the Borg use a similar system since they seem so much like the Binars?"

Did you not eventually check out my post on different numbering bases, Nex?

In it, I stated that a number can be represented by ANY base you choose: Binary is Base 2, Decimal is Base 10, and the point is, whilst the higher the base may need more symbols to represent every unit (0,1 in Binary; 0,1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8,9 in Decimal), the crucial fact is there would be LESS units needed to represent that number (2,4,8,16,32 in Binary) or (10,100,1000,1000,10000) in Decimal. Hexadecimal is Base 16, which is represented as (0,1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8,9,A,B,C,D,E,F) which has been used in all Computer Science classes since, forever. And I know that "4D7F2A4" is far more memorable than "100110101111111001010100100" and communicates exactly the same information.

Why are you here if you haven't seen the movie yet?

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[–] caseyrook 8 years ago

Well, there's Crosis, Goval, Locutus, Hugh...

I think I prefer the numbers.

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[–] foebane72 8 years ago

Casey, aside from Locutus (probably given to Picard by the Borg Queen) those are names that those Borg gave themselves.

Why are you here if you haven't seen the movie yet?

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[–] memayse1701 8 years ago

I think 75876889344 is the Borg equivalent of SMITH.

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[–] dexx-26415 8 years ago

The Borg were really scary In their first few appearances; First Contact is a good movie but the Borg were more typical Hollywood zombies by then.

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[–] cjh8504 8 years ago

You nerds are really, REALLY over thinking this name thing. Jiminey Cricket!

RIP Gene Wilder. One of the funniest people of all time. RIP Matt Roberts. You were great.

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[–] RubyHypatia 8 years ago

I don't get into zombie movies or TV shows because dead people roaming around is just too beyond creepy for me. With the Borg, they only appear to be zombies, so the creepiness level well within my comfort zone.

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[–] bjlevine 8 years ago

Personally, I would have liked it better if they were all just 'Borg'. But then the concept of the Borg seemed to get worse with each new Borg episode.

Over 20,001 Tacos Returned...AS GARBAGE!

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[–] memayse1701 8 years ago

Yes BJ, their story should have ended at THE BEST OF BOTH WORLDS

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[–] RubyHypatia 8 years ago

Yes BJ, their story should have ended at THE BEST OF BOTH WORLDS

No way, then we wouldn't have had FC.

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[–] cjh8504 8 years ago

I'm sure they don't care for the movies, Rube.

RIP Gene Wilder. One of the funniest people of all time. RIP Matt Roberts. You were great.

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[–] elaphe-1 8 years ago

Why was Picard Loqutus and not 9 of 10 or some other "combination?" It seems that he was special but all the members of the collective are supposed to be equal.

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[–] foebane72 8 years ago

Why was Picard Loqutus and not 9 of 10 or some other "combination?" It seems that he was special but all the members of the collective are supposed to be equal.

Maybe, since Picard was chosen by the Borg to speak to humanity, humanity would feel more comfortable with a more "traditional" name, rather than a Borg designation?

Why are you here if you haven't seen the movie yet?

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[–] Nakitaakita-1 8 years ago

They could have had Picard be 1 of 8657321779453217.😄

we need more diversity in sports. Where are the short, fat Asians!

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[–] Bubbathagut 8 years ago

I think this was done rather well in light of Picard's assimilation as Locutus. With Locutus having a name, they needed to show how drones are designated, so that Locutus was more important to the Collective.

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[–] cjh8504 8 years ago

Certainly. Couldn't have Picard as just 1 of 562.

RIP Gene Wilder. One of the funniest people of all time. RIP Matt Roberts. You were great.

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[–] bjlevine 8 years ago

FC was the best of TNG movies, but the concept of the Borg had drastically changed by then.

But in the series, once you're past BOBW, you get I Borg and Descent. Ick.

Over 20,001 Tacos Returned...AS GARBAGE!

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[–] foebane72 8 years ago

Oh, I HATE those two episodes, BJ!

Why are you here if you haven't seen the movie yet?

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[–] cind5 8 years ago

What's in a name? That which we call a rose by any other name would smell as sweet.
At least the Borg names are easy to remember, you should walk around with the tongue-twister I have for a last name. It's Italian.

Spenser with an "S", like the poet.

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[–] seldon913 8 years ago

The Enterprise should have used the virus from 'The Naked Now' on the Borg. Could you imagine a cube full of drunken Borg?



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[–] Nexus71 8 years ago

Borg on the rocks 

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[–] blakgard 8 years ago

It really wouldn't make any sense for them to refer to each other by the same name. Each would have a singular purpose to provide the collective and be named thusly.

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[–] cjh8504 8 years ago

Names are easy. Kevin Borg, Timmy Borg. Simple enough.

RIP Gene Wilder. One of the funniest people of all time. RIP Matt Roberts. You were great.

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[–] eyeguy72 8 years ago

I know I wouldn't have a choice, but If I were a Borg and could choose my designation, I'd pick the most badass Borg name ever. The obvious choice would be 1. But I think the queen would be one, right? Or is her designation just "queen"? IDK

Anyhow, if 1 was taken I'd go with something else cool like 13. Or 21. I've always liked that number. 100's good. Nice round, even number. Maybe 88? Something about the symmetry of the eights.

Number Six: Who are you?
Number Two: The new Number Two.
Number Six: Who is Number One?
Number Two: You are Number Six.
Number Six: I am not a number! I am a free man!
Number Two: [laughs]

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[–] Nakitaakita-1 8 years ago

Number Six: Who are you?
Number Two: The new Number Two.
Number Six: Who is Number One?
Number Two: You are Number Six
-------/
Number six: I'm what?
Number two: number one, number six.
Number six: who is number one?
Number two: number six.

we need more diversity in sports. Where are the short, fat Asians!

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[–] cjh8504 8 years ago

Do I smell an Abbott and Costello routine?

RIP Gene Wilder. One of the funniest people of all time. RIP Matt Roberts. You were great.

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[–] Nexus71 8 years ago

Why not THX-1138?

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[–] 8 years ago

[deleted]

[–] dpcole7 8 years ago

If they went the full extent, a Borg would be "7 of 42 of shuttle 69 of mothership 8675309 in sub-unit 42958973774" and on and on until the viewer fell asleep. A compromise had to be made somewhere. Borg processing power would make the whole designation go by as fast for them as "Hugh" does for us. :)

But the "I Borg" story is so poorly contrived from the get-go.

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[–] KobiyashiMauru 8 years ago

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zE-EMinj69o

Luke Skywalker, your Mom was hawt! Darth Vader

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