During the restaurant scene with Conrad and Karen, she tells him twice in a short space of time that she has to go to a meeting because she's in the drama club at school and they're doing "A Thousand Clowns."
I never really noticed Karen's look of confusion after Conrad tells her she already told him about the play. Good acting by Dinah Manoff. Clearly, Karen WASN'T "all right," as Dr. Berger tells Conrad later.
I always saw Karen as a parallel to Beth. Both are emotionally fragile, yet live in a world of denial by busying themselves with social activities (parties and tennis for Beth; drama club and school secretary for Karen). Both get uncomfortable when Conrad talks about the hospital and other uncomfortable memories. Both refuse to go to therapy. Karen said that she stopped going to a psychiatrist because she thought she could help herself. Their scenes with Conrad are back to back, and both Beth and Karen remark about how Conrad's hair is growing out. I think this further shows that these two characters like things to appear normal on the surface, and want to brush all signs of emotion or fraility under the rug.
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toh devres tseb hsid a si msacras
Well said, Redart27!
I think it also shows how Karen was in fog. She was playing the part of a normal girl doing social activities, acting all busy, but deep down I'm sure she wasn't aware of what she was doing or saying. The fact that she forgets she told Conrad about the play proves her mind is elsewhere. She most definitely was not alright.
The only ones who really want to talk about Conrad's issues are Calvin and Jeannine...and Berger of course.
-Di
'always saw Karen as a parallel to Beth.'
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Why is Beth like Karen, because it draws another "undiscovered" piece of analysis to the already over-analyzed film? Ever consider that both the writer and director have no idea what viewers are pulling out of their hat?
Their scenes with Conrad are back to back, and both Beth and Karen remark about how Conrad's hair is growing out. I think this further shows that these two characters like things to appear normal on the surface, and want to brush all signs of emotion or fraility under the rug.share
I don't agree. Karen is not a parallel to Beth. She represents what Conrad would have become if his father had cared more for seeming normality than for his child. Conrad's father in his bewildered, fumbling way came through for his son.
shareI just took it as she was really rushed and distracted and just forgot that she had already mentioned the play. She hardly touches her Coke, too. The conversation was a little more telling as Con that she didn't need any post-admit help after he disclosed seeing Dr. Burger.
I spent about a week and a half in a partial Outpatient program and you really do get a sense that the outside world doesn't exist. Then you go back in to society and it's like "Ah! I want to go back!" Some just adjust better than others.
I really disagree with this, I dont think Beth is in denial at all, I think she realizes her state but doesnt see a way of gettin help. At the restaurant at some point when talking about how they need to let go of it and ''help themselves'' be better, she ends it with ''at least thats what my father says'' and quickly changes the subject. She seems to be repeating what she hears at home, from her parents.
shareUpvote for Redart27!
shareVery insightful!
shareI always saw Karen as a parallel to Beth. Both are emotionally fragile, yet live in a world of denial by busying themselves with social activities (parties and tennis for Beth; drama club and school secretary for Karen). Both get uncomfortable when Conrad talks about the hospital and other uncomfortable memories. Both refuse to go to therapy
"A Thousand Clowns" is a metaphor that describes the part Karen is playing for Conrad, her parents, and everyone else to make them think she's okay.
Karen repeats herself, I believe, because she's not in touch with herself. She's almost totally unaware of her own self. She's faking her way, and I think that it shows that Karen is in denial and still in some serious trouble.
shareIt was all pretend with her. I don't know if I like that Conrad hooked up with her again, it doesn't feel like it was right for him and he needed to move on from his experience in the hospital. He didn't really need the presence of another deeply troubled individual in his life. They were both awkward with each other anyway. That said though, her suicide was the catalyst for Conrad having an epiphany about his own feelings of "guilt" about Buck which led to his revelation about his mother not loving him.
Exorcist: Christ's power compels you. Cast out, unclean spirit.
Destinata:💩
By doing "normal" things, Karen was trying to show the world that she was normal. It was a script, and by repeating herself she was showing us that she was having trouble with her lines. She didn't want to talk about anything "real". Her "lets have the best Christmas ever!" line was completely ridiculous, considering both of their obviously fragile mental states, but it was great copy for the "I'm okay, you're okay" dialogue she was trying to sell.
Even Conrad believed her, which made her death so shocking for him. Karen was trying to "pull herself up by her own bootstraps", which is impossible.
Oh what a falling off was there.
Karen forgot her line. Not the actress. The character. She is putting up the facade that she is happy and all right, and has created a script to go along with it.
shareProbably she is not in the drama club and not even at school. She tells it to prove herself that there is meaningful content in her life. Conrad tends to turn his desperation to the outside. Karen tends to overplay it with showing everybody how happy she is. That is why Conrad is so much drawn to her.
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