the chicken rape scene



Um, was it really necessary to hurt/kill those poor chickens? Couldn't they have shot it in a way that the point of its perversity still comes across but they don't actually maiming the animals?
I'm not a PETA freak or whatever, and I know they're just chickens, but I don't think it's necessary to kill animals haphazardly like that and cause them harm just for the sake of a movie, and a stupid one at that. I found this to be the part of the movie that was in the poorest taste, which is saying a lot since this movie is "an exercise in poor taste" according to IMDB.
This scene was just really uncalled for and kind of made me like John Waters less for having done it.


"Milk's one of nature's... non-temperature hang on-ers."

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I don't condone this scene, but its fair to say that in real life chickens do suffer much more in the world of mass produced meat. And Waters did state that those chickens were all put on a bbq and eaten by the cast and crew afterwards.

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Just because they ate them doesnt mean they can be crushed and tortured the way they were until death.

It ain't easy being cheesy

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I never said i condoned the scene. But i have seen slaughter house docs before and its shocking how badly chickens are treated. And believe me!... Its much, much worse. This particular doc was an attempt to make people go veggie and it was stated that chickens are the most abused animals on earth. Seriously, if you saw this, you'd soon see that the scene in Pink Flamingos was nothing by comparison.

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Is that video the one with Alec Baldwin talking? Iv seen that, they are treated way worse in that video, but I still dont understand why people would kill animals that way for a really stupid movie like Pink Flamingos

My DVD collection
http://www.imdb.com/mymovies/list?l=11782867

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I am with cheesymac on this one. Yes, the treatment of chickens in farms/slaughterhouses etc is atrocious. We all know this. But that is a big, virtually unstoppable machine. It doesn't justify the treatment of these particular chickens for something that is, essentially, a waste of everyone's time. They could have been more humane about it, is all I'm saying. That scene made me sick.

"Milk's one of nature's... non-temperature hang on-ers."

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Well yes. Despite everything thats been said; the scene wasn't called for. It doesn't make the movie any better or add anything other than shock-value.

It has been stated that about 8 or 9 chickens were killed altogether in that scene.

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OMG! Aww, poor things! :(

"Milk's one of nature's... non-temperature hang on-ers."

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or add anything other than shock-value

I'm not saying killing animals onscreen is acceptable, but the whole point of most of this film's scenes was their shock value.

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Yeah, I cannot watch that scene. I cannot stand to see helpless animals tortured.

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[deleted]

Do you also wait under apple trees and wait for the fruit to fall in order to eat? There are many places you must not be able to look.

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Callmechia,

Does it not strike you as slightly hypocritical that you accept, however begrudgingly, the mistreatment of animals during food production, but are disgusted when you see that same treatment on film? perhaps that is the point john water's is making.

Does it not matter that these actions are performed by humans everyday - you just don't want to know about them?

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o coulter, your point is moot.

I do NOT accept the mistreatment of animals during food production. But the fact remains that this happens and will continue to happen. I do admit the inherent "hypocrisy" of that statement, but again, those chickens, at least, gave their lives to be eaten. I guarantee that these chickens were not eaten, no matter what Waters says. Do you think Divine knew how to pluck and cook a chicken? No. Those poor things went straight into the garbage.

I think you're right that Waters' "point", if there is one, is that this stuff happens whether we are aware of it or not. Chicken-rape and animal torture does occur. This cannot be helped, however sick and perverse it may be.

What I AM condemning, as I stated in my original post, is the FILMING of this to SHOW people that it occurs. Waters could've easily just used fake chickens, or fake blood. My issue is that this scene could have been done without cruelty.
The ACTUAL torture/killing of the chickens just to illustrate the point is unnecessary. To do so is just CONTRIBUTING to the problem (more innocent animals killed), not solving it. All Waters has really done by showing this scene is disgust a lot of people and possibly turn some people (who may be predisposed to such behaviour anyway) on to the practice.

"Milk's one of nature's... non-temperature hang on-ers."

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"those [slaughterhouse] chickens, at least, gave their lives to be eaten"

I don't care where your from - chickens are definitely no martyrs. However noble a creature they may be, I don't think they "gave" anything. Assuming slaughterhouse chickens had been asked if they could give "their lives to be eaten", and assuming they could respond, I suspect their stoic plumage might flutter ever so slightly. Otherwise we might have to start erecting memorials for all the veteran slaughterhouse chickens who valiantly "gave their lives".


"[food production] is a big, virtually unstoppable machine. It doesn't justify the treatment of these particular chickens for something that is, essentially, a waste of everyone's time."

Assumption 1) Food production is beyond reproach and cannot be stopped because of its integration in our lumbering society (I agree with you on this). John Water's isn't, and can be (i disagree with your double standards on this - why excuse one and condemn the other?).
Assumption 2) The ends justify the means. Because churning battery hens through slaughterhouses is for eating, which is, presumably, a biological necessity - it serves a purpose and is ultimately justified. Wheras, churning chickens through depraved sexual acts for purpose scatological humor, is not - it is "a waste of everyone's time".

"I guarantee that these chickens were not eaten"

What difference does it make if they were eaten or not? I thought we were talking about man's callous mistreatment of animals.

"Waters could've easily just used fake chickens, or fake blood. My issue is that this scene could have been done without cruelty."

Let me clarify - I agree that it is cruel and he should have used fake chickens and blood. But it is no more cruel than the acts man constantly inflicts upon other animals, and on one another everyday. He makes his point BECAUSE he chose to use actual chickens - to our very core we feel that cruelty can be justified in certain instances. Our instant reaction is to disprove of what we see - these unconscious actions reveals much about our values. Particularly our double standards. It's a bit of a Patrick Bateman/American Psycho manifesto - this scene could not exist without society to provide the context. He embodies this sickness and produced the scene - he does not try to justify it.

Waters "not solving it"

The problem CAN'T be solved, remember? Food production is beyond reproach and cannot be stopped because of its integration in our lumbering society.

"All Waters has really done by showing this scene is... possibly turn some people (who may be predisposed to such behaviour anyway) on to the practice."

Films should have a sound morality to avoid leading wayward (or even previous uncorrupted) souls astray.

If it wasn't for cinema, we wouldn't have columbine. We wouldn't have the torture of inmates at prisons in [insert country here]. We wouldn't Josef Fritzl. We wouldn't have hitler or stalin. We wouldn't have Jack the Ripper. Oh... wait. Thats right.

I could almost put everything else you have said down to difference of opinion, but this is a very naive statement. Essentially good people can be corrupted upon viewing things of disgust? If this was the case, I think everyone would be done for upon walking down any drinking district on a friday night and witnessing the debauchery.

"I do admit the inherent "hypocrisy" of [my statement] statement"

perhaps you should reconsider.


[note: I am a carnivore. I particularly like pork (one the most poorly treated animals). All criticism of meat production is for the purpose of pointing out hypocrisy and double standards - including my own. THANK YOU]

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I guarantee that these chickens were not eaten, no matter what Waters says. Do you think Divine knew how to pluck and cook a chicken? No. Those poor things went straight into the garbage.

I love these kinds of assumptions which are based on nothing and are made simply because something frustrated/shocked you.

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To those idiots who are arguing that "the chickens were going to die anyway" or "they are treated no better in slaughterhouses" etc. etc. -- let's put it in perfect perspective for you: if someone decided to get a HUMAN prisoner on death row for a film and decide to viciously kill him on camera for some stupid, horrible effing film -- would you think THAT was ok since he was "going to die anyway"??

Give me an effing break. It is NOT ever OK to harm (let alone KILL) animals in the name of "entertainment"!

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Well John did get them from a store that sold freshly killed chickens so they were going to die anyway. As he said himself "They got to me in a movie, they got *beep* and after the shoot the cast ate the chicken". I'm gonna admit that the scene itself disturbed the hell out of me and I do tend to fast forward through it, but it was no worse than what chickens go through in slaughterhouses. A chicken in a slaughterhouse is just as dead as the chicken in that scene, the difference is we still remember the chicken in that scene.

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Don't reply to me if your wanting an answer from someone else, i'm not someone else

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Just to correct some of the facts: Divine didn't pluck the chickens. Waters stated that Danny Mills(Crackers) cooked them and the cast ate them. Cookie Mueller said in her memoirs that the cast ate them as well. There's even a scene where we see Crackers put it on a BBQ.

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IIRC John Waters has claimed that the cast and crew cooked and ate the chicken afterwards

"Unless Alpert's covered in bacon grease, I don't think Hugo can track anything."

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Do you really think that Waters used this shock value film to make us think about the finer points of animal cruelty in the world or do you think he put it in to make the film more notorious?! Like films such as Cannibal Holocaust which drag people in with it's blurb about killing real animals. Face it, he used this scene to get his film banned, just peurile filth, as it suggests!

If you want to put some moral slant on it, well, you can't! This should NOT have been allowed, FULL STOP. There is a reason it's banned nowadays!

I wouldn't even accept PETA making a shock film to teach us all about the slaughter process of animals - the ones they manage to film themselves are point enough!

Water is a complete joke for doing this in his film, I was actually about to get hold of a copy and watch this and now I'd rather spit in his face.

WASTE.OF.TIME

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I don't care when chickens die.

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i agree with John Waters here,

"Well, l eat chicken and l know the chicken didn't land on my plate from a heart attack. We bought the chicken from a farmer who advertised freshly killed chicken."

...hypocricy of the society surfaces...

he's damn right. why dont people have a problem with killings of chickens when it's for their meal? is it a "moral cause"? for the chicken, death is death. either for being eaten by the people, or for a movie. i bet they dont realize the reason.

leaving the hypocricy thing aside, i disagree with Waters at one thing: i would never kill a chicken for a movie neither.

i think it's a crime to kill so i dont even kill bugs or mosquitos in my house. i dont think their lives are less important just because they are bugs and mosquitos. they have their own existance, and i respect that.

people who dont eat meat and eggs, who kill no kind of animal are honest when they criticize John Waters. because they have a point.

but others, they are just hypocrites.







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i agree, this was torture and should be criminalized today if repeated.

in a way this shows the state of america in early 70s,
there was crime and violence rising fast in those post vietnam war times, assassinations, corruption, shocking sharon tate's murder, widespread drugs, serial killers, it shows how people descent into madness back then and how this was normal back then - so much anger and aggression

only this year i found out the term "new york in 70s" - google images show it all,
and read about the crime rising in america every since jfk was murdered

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