Extremely Homophobic



Martin Balsam's character is just so over the top fairy. Not to mention the word "Fag" used throughout this movie, and even the word deviant as well to describe the gay character (Martin Balsam). Frank Pierson obliviously was feeling very homophobic when he wrote this offensive screenplay. There is even another gay character who is an interior designener (like Balsam's character) who lives in the building. Dyan Cannon describes him as a "Fag Designer". This character is even more over the top fairy. Watching this movie yesterday, I felt a lot of homophobia and hatred in the Frank Pierson dialogue.

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I hate the phrase "homophobic," which just makes people defensive, but the portrayal of the gay character was severely condescending and at odds with a film that tried tried to portray itself as forward-thinking. Hard to imagine anyone defending that character, but there are plenty in this thread.

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Why not "defend" his character? He was a funny guy in a comedic movie - and kinda smart, too. Find it hard to believe anyone involved with the movie had any "phobias" concerning him or gays in general.



"facts are stupid things" - Ronald Reagan

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What I found unrealistic were the two men (detectives? lawyers?) who came before the judge to request a search warrant for the antique dealer's store while using this language in their request: "The fag who owns the joint is importing fake antiques..."

First, I can't believe two persons involved in law enforcement would show such a lack of respect for the court by using slang terms. I can't see them saying the word "joint" -- let alone the word "fag" -- when making a petition before a judge. Second, I can't believe the judge tolerated their colourful words without giving them a lecture, like, "Gentlemen, you are not in a locker room; you are in my court. And in my court, we speak proper English."

I'm not saying that such language wasn't used, nor am I commenting on the attitudes of the time. What I am saying is that even in 1971, people kept their street slang out of the courtroom and used more formal diction in that arena.

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I think the OP is maybe a little bit upset that there wasn't some kind of subliminal gay "subtext" in this picture that nobody but him and other gays that are "in the know" would be able to notice.

Instead we get an obviously gay character, portrayed as gay and intended to be seen as gay, it's right there in the open and everybody knows he is gay.

In the face of a gay character portrayed in a neutral and somewhat sympathetic manner, the gay lobby complains about a "stereotypical" portrayal of homosexuality.

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You do have a point there, Jade. I can only assume they thought it was funny to have the cops use such language in a courtroom. Which it may or may not be.



"facts are stupid things" - Ronald Reagan

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OP, you're ridiculous. The film is on TCM right now.

Actually Balsam's portrayal of an older gay man isn't over the top, there are plenty people walking around today who act just like him.

And the movie is now over 40yrs old, this was around the time(late 60s/early 70s) where gays were discussed for the first time in films. It had to start somewhere.

When you view old films, you have to remember when they were filmed.

As others have said, I'm so tired of everything today being so PC.

I know this is an old thread, but grow up.

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[deleted]

Just because you think some over-the-top flaming fairy is humorous doesn't mean you hate fairies.

Anyone who's spent any time in the gay community knows that this affectation DOES happen, and is funny even to many gays.

Get a grip. Buy a clue.

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It was typical of the times. You also get racism in movies from the twenties. If you don't like to be exposed to negative stereotypes from the past, don't watch old movies. There's no time machine to fix the past.

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I'm gonna guess many of the comments in this thread were made by people under 40 yrs old:

"However, it's the more staunch adherents to the status quo (i.e., the doorman and the authories) who refer to Balsam as a "fag" and a "deviant."

This movie was made in what - 1971 or so ? This was before a group of gay psychiatrists successfully challenged the DSM classification of homosexuals as 'deviant'. At the time this movie was made, that cop was using the correct term.

Secondly:

"I can't believe two persons involved in law enforcement would show such a lack of respect for the court by using slang terms. I can't see them saying the word "joint" -- let alone the word "fag" -- when making a petition before a judge. Second, I can't believe the judge tolerated their colourful words without giving them a lecture, like, "Gentlemen, you are not in a locker room;
you are in my court. And in my court, we speak proper English."
And:
"I'm not saying that such language wasn't used, nor am I commenting on the attitudes of the time. What I am saying is that ven in 1971, people kept their street slang out of the courtroom and used more formal diction in that arena."

There came a point, I don't remember exactly when (mid 60's/70s ?),when the top brass in the NYPD became concerned with how police officers came off in televised news interviews due to the often used crude/rude or simplistic language and/or cop slang used and understood amongst cops only.
The NYPD as well as other big city police agencies came up with policies which were meant to standardize the way police spoke to the press when being interviewed and in general more proffesional sounding while on duty. When you hear cops being interviewed at crime scenes using terms like 'The perpetrator' entered the building at approx 3pm at which time the subject was' ...blah blah blah and 'subsequently apprehended' ...blah blah 'the perpetrator then did in fact expire from his wounds due to profuse bleeding' ...blah blah blah" its largely due to these new policies. It was a laugh riot at the time because the use of these terms was not only new to most cops but to the viewing public also. What was most funny was how uncomfortable the cop being interviewed sounded when using these terms. NYPD cops often had a jaded, bland,monotone 'matter of fact' manner of speaking which gave comics, sit/com writers and humorists of all kinds a new subject to joke about.
These days we're used to hearing these terms but when they were new to us all, but back then it was hysterical !! Cops got just as much a laugh out of this, if not more, then the public. The cop who appered on last nights 'evening news' had to take having his balls busted for some time after. And back in the 60's when perps might call a cop, to his face, right there in the court room, 'PIG', Nazi, Storm Trooper or carrying on about 'The Man', police brutality etc etc., judges often over looked a cops lapse in good manners and/or lack of use of polite language. Letting the 'f' word (fag) slip out would be nothing back in those days and a lot of judges wouldn't get their panties in a wad over it. So its possible that the writer was making fun of something that was topical at that time in history - just like the stereotypical gay antique dealer, mob guys etc. This was the way people talked back then.
The only language that rang false to me was the mob guy calling 'the blacks' 'spooks' as 'Mully' was the term most of these Italians used to call 'da blacks' ('moulignon').
BTW, I wrote the above while trying to watch the follow up movie 'The Taking of Pelham 1,2,3' on TCM - hope it made some kind of sense. And speaking of language ...

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[deleted]

So a gay person acts over-the-top gay. Does this ever happen in real life? Yes. So someone calls him a fag. When someone acts over-the-top gay, do others often notice this and refer to them as fags? Yes.

I think what you want is some macho obviously-hetero character in a movie, but make him gay so it will really "make the audience think." All that would do is just confuse everyone, which is why it doesn't usually happen that way.

Many gays act like flaming queens in real life. One gay character in a movie acts like a flaming queen. Why does every person who belongs to some type of "group" need to completely be identified by that group so it consumes their lives and they complain about every portrayal of any member of that group as offensive?

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BTW if the poster [the kangaroo kid] who was upset by the word fag is reading he would most definitely have been called a fag and treated as a fag had he been at the average Public School in the UK. I'll bet so many may have came over from the US to enjoy that particular diversion only to find they were used as non sexual slaves. Many Brits of ALL sexes take great pleasure in having multiple oral experiences with fags each and every day.

Unfortunately many are trying to give this up and this might be detrimental to our efforts of recruiting outside wealthy students.

It seems to me that today so many USA 'fags' are so really up their own posteriors [they wish?] that sometimes having an active partner is really a non essential accessory [appendage].

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How were they supposed to portray him? He was out an out flaming queer, and he was not portrayed that bad. He was Anderson's good friend, did not *beep* up on robbery, and was non-violant. Mob guy sent to go on robbery was one they all made fun of when they got together, if you notice, all the guys-Black guys, Christopher Walken character--al get along, and bond, thug sent to be killed is one they all go agaisnt as soon as he joins group for first meeting. Fag was not portrayed bad, for queer.

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Well,I got the impression that while in jail, he and Duke had a thing. The man was constantly touching him and practically groping him when Duke got to the shop--something that Duke didn't seem repulsed by--perhaps he was Dukes cell-wife while in prison. There's your homosexual subtext.

And Pearl, you must not know any cops or people in law enforcement. It wasn't very PC back in the 70's nor is it now within those confines.

Swing away, Merrill....Merrill, swing away...

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As a gay man myself, I realize this is how gay people were depicted in films of the 70's. I do not take offense as happily things have evolved since then. That being said, Foster 1234 is a complete asswipe and a real piece of trash.

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