MovieChat Forums > Becket (1964) Discussion > Another great Christian movie.

Another great Christian movie.


While we are all so ardently waiting for Becket, assuming some of you have an interest in the shared Christian element, I recommend: 'Peter and Paul' (1981), now available on DVD from amazon.com. If you've read the book of Acts (in the bible) you know this is a good retelling of it, and how Paul, an educated Jewish rabbi, converted to Christianity and spread the Good News of Jesus Christ to the world, and formed the theology of most of the New Testament. The movie is 3hrs 14 min, on one DVD.

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What on earth has that got to do with Becket? I think you are just using this forum as an advertisement for your brand of Christianity. Don't get me wrong. I am a Christian and go to church on occasion. But this kind of thing really annoys me.

This would be like telling someone to watch a James Bond movie because they like "My Fair Lady" since they both have an English element.

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thanks for the recomendation, moovyfellow
what're some others?
Christian element, please

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Religion is often about power. In that respect this is a christian movie.

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"Becket" was a great movie with a Christian theme. There are so few great christian movies. Or should we say "Paulist". A psychotic (maybe from when he hit his head in the fall) misognist, educated, but non-rabbi fanatic, first for the Jews then for Jesus.

I'd recommend "The Da Vinci Code" as another great movie with a christian theme, but Opie and copmpany basically ruined it.

...MK

Unattended children will be given an espresso and a free puppy.

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St. Paul was a holy man who did much to spread the Holy Gospel. Please do not insult him with these false accusations.

The Da Vinci Code presents a distorted view of Christianity, and is completely unfounded in the facts.

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Some of MY favorite Christian themed movies are:

The Nun's Story
Miracle Of Our Lady At Fatima
The Song Of Bernadette
Ben Hur

and more closely identifiable with Becket,
A Man For All Seasons.

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"A Man for All Seasons" and "The Song of Bernadette", definitely...but Becket has two defects-not that it is not a great film!-but there are two major errors. Thomas Becket was not a Saxon-that has been stated-and nor was he before his selection as Archbishop of Canterbury a libertine. Remember, he was already a deacon, and was promised to celibacy and vowed to chastity, and he was not an "evil liver". The worst that can be said of him is that before his elevation (or, to put it another way, before the burden was dropped on him) he was too worldly, too career-minded. Henry II and Thomas Becket were the two greatest English wits of their age, I think, and I don't doubt that this was the source of their friendship. But I will say this...the film was faithful to the truth in its conclusion that Henry never sanctioned his friend's death. I'm sure he would have preferred that the Archbishop retire to a peaceful monastery so that the two of them could exchange frequent letters and occasional visits.

In the screenplay Henry's mother makes an only slightly veiled reference to a homosexual relationship...interesting that in "The Lion in Winter", Henry, in conversation with his French mistress, telling her she's the only person he's ever loved, also addresses this...I think it goes something like, "...Thomas Becket?...No, not that way...not what you think...." Well, if not that way--and it was not--then what way? I think friendship like erotic love has its passion too, I think Henry realized that in forcing the mitre on his friend of friends he had thrown him into God's arms, where he, Henry, was not yet willing to follow him. He had given over his friend to a higher love and a higher loyalty.

A tie-in with "A Man for All Seasons": After Henry VIII had sent More, Fisher and a good many others to Heaven, he destroyed the shrine of St Thomas Becket in the great Christchurch Cathedral at Canterbury. With the "great ruby of France", given by one French king to honor Becket's tomb, Henry adorned--as one writer has put it--"his sacrilegious hand". Becket's earthly remains were thrown on the dungheap.

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VERY intersting.
Many thanks.

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From my study of the Becket-Henry II situation, I have concluded that Henry thought that his buddy, Thomas, would make a great Archbishop of Canterbury, (which was arguably the second most important position in the realm,) since he was indeed a buddy and would "go along" and support what Henry wanted. As it turned out, once he became Archbishop, Becket insisted that the power of the Church was to be above that of the King, and refused to do as the King wanted. He always insisted that he put the authority of the King above everything "save for the Church." These were times in which the Church, which crowned the King, and the royal families, often battled over such power issues. Becket actually went to Rome to get help from the Pope and had to flee to France from England to escape the wrath of Henry. When he returned home, he was murdered. So far as I have been able to figure it, the question of Henry's guilt or innocence is still debatable, but Becket did excommunicate him, and Henry did accept blame and do penance for the act of murder. It's a timeless story and a great film.

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Where did you read that Henry VIII had the remains of St. Thomas Becket desecrated?

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From the Catholic Encyclopedia, but this has been documented everywhere and, sorry to say it's all too true:

Within three years of his death the archbishop had been canonized as a martyr. Though far from a faultless character, Thomas Becket, when his time of testing came, had the courage to lay down his life to defend the ancient rights of the Church against an aggressive state. The discovery of his hairshirt and other evidences of austerity, and the many miracles which were reported at his tomb, increased the veneration in which he was held. The shrine of the "holy blessed martyr," as Chaucer called him, soon became famous, and the old Roman road running from London to Canterbury known as "Pilgrim's Way." His tomb was magnificently adorned with gold, silver, and jewels, only to be despoiled by Henry VIII; the fate of his relics is uncertain. They may have been destroyed as a part of Henry's policy to subordinate the English Church to the civil authority. Mementoes of this saint are preserved at the cathedral of Sens. The feast of St. Thomas of Canterbury is now kept throughout the Roman Catholic Church, and in England he is regarded as the protector of the secular clergy.


'in England he is regarded as the protector of the secular clergy.'

I find this amusing, but feel certain that Becket would find it appalling.

I've read some very interesting ideas and posts here. While I agree with that Henry II was right, to the modern, humanist mind, Becket feared for the King's soul as well as agitating for ecclesiastical courts in England at the time. I thought another bone of contention was Becket's power to excommunicate the nobleman who murdered the priest -- that certainly was with his purvue, irrespective of what the King thought. It would appear that many of these issues were settled in the ensuing centuries, until the matter of Papal Primacy reared its head during the reign of Henry VIII. Had Charles V not been the Holy Roman Emperor AND nephew of Catherine of Aragon, the dispensation to the first dispensation may very well have been granted - although I maintain, an English Reformation was in the offing and would have happened, inevitably.

The parallels between Becket and Thomas More are fascinating -- though More was never Archbishop of Canterbury and Becket, according to the film, realized he had to 'render under God' and, indeed could not serve two masters.

In America, when we argue over church and state, we should think about these matters and understand why the Founding Fathers advocated so strenuosly for no established religion. But they were visionaries and students of history both.

I'll leave it there.

If you don't stand for something, you will fall for anything.

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As a non-Christian... allow me to enlighten you... other faiths have, and admire, people with conviction, morals, and principles. Attributes which far too often, are claimed by certain types of Christians, as exclusively belonging to them.
Also, allow me to point out.... the story and battle in Becket is a distinctly medieval one. In retrospect, Henry was entirely correct, and Becket was wrong. If a priest or any minister (I'm not excluding the Protestant TV Evangelists)breaks the law, and then demands the right to be put on trial only in a special court, administered and conducted exclusively by his/her church... I certainly hope we'd be on the side of Henry II also.

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eddyskiva, you'd be on the side against seperation of church and state.

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Good succint point TheBenchwarmers!
This is one of the 3 movies I plan to see
in the next 3 movies.


"To thine ownself be true."

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Break a secular law: be tried in a secular court.
Break a religious law: go to confession.
Render unto Caesar.

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yes, eddyskiva is correct... I'm alittle afraid of some of these responses I see from so called 'free' people... we here in the United States of America have, and value, a separation of church and state. Are we loosing that? Anyway back to a great movie.

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Well I most certainly would not have been on the side of Henry II. He appointed Becket Archbishop of Canterbury because he thought he would be able to control him, then when Becket took the position seriously and refused to dance to Henry's tune, Henry trumped up false charges against him and wanted to put him on trial! Would Becket have got a fair trial? Somehow I doubt it!



The King's Good Servant but God's first

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Here, Here.

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"In retrospect, Henry was entirely correct, and Becket was wrong."

No.

"If a priest or any minister (I'm not excluding the Protestant TV Evangelists)breaks the law, and then demands the right to be put on trial only in a special court, administered and conducted exclusively by his/her church... **I certainly hope we'd be on the side of Henry II also."**

No. Different times...
In modern democracies the 'King' is answerable to the people (checks and balances).Becket wasn't necessarily 'wrong' in insisting there be two 'court systems'. In this film for example, Henry proved how easily he could manipulate the Church when he pressed (false) charges against Becket for embezzlement etc.
"Absolute power corrupts...." etc. The American Revolution addressed these issues paving the way for the idea of keeping a separation between church and state (the 'Establishment'/Free exercise clauses, not 'Separation' clause grrrrr).Beckets contention was understandable in that time and place.

"the story and battle in Becket is a distinctly medieval one."

Wrong. 'Been there,done that' myself during the course of my own life. Its a universal and eternal story. Quick...check to see if you've gotta soul !
It may have slipped away at some point while you weren't lookin'...being the slippery devils they are :-) Seriously, did you mean that ???? OK, maybe you were referring to the 'church/state story only. In that sense, yes, I do agree.
But you didn't make that clear. Not that I'm 'Mr. Clarity' here...not by a long shot.

"...allow me to enlighten you... other faiths have, and admire, people with conviction, morals, and principles."

You don't say !! Wow, please enlighten me more ! I'm all ears...
I must get out more.

*See "Constitutions of Clarendon".

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Every Christian should watch "Prayers For Bobby" and hopefully learn something:
http://www.prayersforbobby.com

Bimbo Boy
http://bimboboy.com
http://twitter.com/bimboboy

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go away

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