What were Dorian's evil deeds?


I just saw the movie version on public television without commercial interruption and the use of color spliced into the black-and-white film was most effective.

But I am at a loss, never having read Oscar Wilde's book, because my only exposure with the character was, in all places, "The League of Extraordinary Gentleman."

I understand -- at least I think I do -- that the vain Gray was easily influenced with the decadent philosophy of living life to the fullest and giving in to urges.

His path to his own self-destruction in the film was when he corrupted the morals of a young woman he idealized for her purity, chasity (by having sex?)

When he rebuffed her cruelly for not living up to his expectations, he spurned her by letter, paid her off and she committed suicide and he feels guilty.

And so it seems, from what little I can gather from the movie, he embarks on a life of depravity and sin, since his action directly, indirectly caused her death.

But what were the acts, evil deeds he committed in the subsequent years of ageless life? In the movie, it seems like they were only alluded to but not specified.

Maybe they are explained in Wilde's book but if you can help me out with the movie version, I'd appreciate it.

Although this was my only viewing of the Oscar-winning film, I don't get Gray's connection with the scientist he blackmails into disposing the artist's body.

I also don't get his connection with the guy in the seedy pub who draws a caricature of Gray on the table in chalk -- what's their history?

Again, if anyone can fill me in why he was, as was mentioned in the movie, the object of such speculation about his misdeeds, besides looking young, do so.

Thanks.

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I haven't seen the movie, but Oscar Wilde wrote:

"Each man sees his own sin in Dorian Gray. What Dorian Gray's sins are no one knows. He who finds them has brought them."

In other words, it's left entirely to the reader's interpretation of how Dorian sinned.

...or do you think I'm too dumb to know what a 'eugoogoly' is?

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Thanks to Hitsujiko and Omari for (very) politely explaining the concept of intrigue as created by an author. Oscar Wilde doesn't spell out what Dorian's horrible crimes were, much as Hitchcock didn't often let you see the horrible acts perpetrated by his villains, they both knew that any individual can imagine far worse things than they could portray. Each person is going to have their own version of what Dorian's sins were, and given his chosen haunts, the idea that he might have dirt on others in order to blackmail them to do his bidding doesn't seem unlikely.

I love this film: the cast, the art direction, the bold use of Technicolor, Oscar Wilde's words -- everything. Anyone who finds it too slow and "talky" needs to plug in their Ipod and let the adults watch. George Sanders is one of my personal favorites, and this snide, devilish turn is him at his most delectable.

I would love to see a contemporary version of this film that lives up to the original. Since about 20 years pass (enough time for Gladys to grow up), it would be cool to see it set from the 60s to the 80s.

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Exactly. The point is not about Dorian's sins (on which many people wrongly focuses), the point is about the evil soul/mind corruption twists Dorian lives and finally swallows himself, perfectly consciously (and that's terrible enough!) but unavoidable... The terrible risks about going against his own pure and good attitude and choose "the wrong path" of oneself perversion, 'till the tragic end when with eyes wide open you look back and realize all of a sudden how bad you've fallen.

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Another way of looking at it is that the main character's misdeeds are a metaphor for the errors and failures of all men. We all affect people as we go through life, some positively, others negatively. It is part of life. The final shot of the film sums it up.

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You're right..the film makes no sense and seems to have been put together from bits and pieces of a much longer film.

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Other then seducing and abandoning Sybil. Listening to that idiot George Sanders, being so vain he actually kills Basil because he saw the real picture. I don't see where he was such a terrible sinner.

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It is subtly implied by Wilde that Alan (the scientist) had a homosexual affair with Dorian in the story. Wilde uses the word, "intimacy" twice to describe their relationship. Perhaps this was too much to spell out in 1945.

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>> I haven't seen the movie, but Oscar Wilde wrote:

"Each man sees his own sin in Dorian Gray. What Dorian Gray's sins are no one knows. He who finds them has brought them."

In other words, it's left entirely to the reader's interpretation of how Dorian sinned. <<

I can assume the book at least made more of a mention of what he did, somehow.

I have thought this myself many years ago when I first saw it. I figured I missed something. . . but what the hell DID he do to end up with a painting that hideous?? Serial rape, murder, and pedophilia? A homosexual affair certain could not do it, not even in the minds of the worst homophobes.

I am watching it right now on PBS in NYC. And I keep waiting for some horrible acts to be at least ALLUDED to in conversation by someone. But no.

The final reclamation of himself at the end seems odd, also. After all these horrid sins SUICIDE can save himself? Or was it really a suicide?

Maybe those who read the book can answer. . .

Was this movie heavily edited and truncated (as was "The Magnificent Ambersons") after it was finished? Were key parts left out, and a narration added to compensate for Hatfield's weak acting?

But of course perhaps we are to interpret into the painting what we assume would be horrid. (?)

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I just watched the same airing on Channel 13 here in NYC and I think you guys are missing the point. Dorian's sins are not spelled out but alluded to because that was the way it was in polite culture up until the 1960's. Innuendo and entendres were used to get the point across and since the film was set in Victorian England it's not hard to realize that things like drug use, homosexuality, fraud, etc which barely raises an eyebrow by more mature people nowadays were frowned upon by genteel society at that time and in the movies also when the Hayes Code was in effect.

I saw Dorian more as Satan on Earth because he whispered in those people's ears to see if he could corrupt them just as Lord Wotton and Dorian's wish for eternal youth corrupted him by abusing Sybil Vane's trust and love the way he did. Less is more at times and such an approach suited this movie in my opinion because to have everything spelled out would have ruined the mystery of it all for me. How did Dorian get his wish? How did he kill himself when he stabbed the portrait? What did he actually do in the years between Sybil's death and his own? Sometimes an open ending is just as satisfying as one that ties up all loose threads.

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I guess I watched the same airing as the previous 2 posters. I'll admit to not being a fan of Wilde's. I found the film quite dated and way too subtle for today's tastes. My friend and I could not figure out what Dorian had done that was so terrible and it was not at all clear to us that maybe we weren't supposed to know.

The worst part however were the nightmares I had after seeing Hurd Hatfields creepy mannequin face - yikes.

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There were hinted sins of commission: perhaps 'going with' a prostitute at the ale house, also participation in or knowledge of homosexual affairs which led to the blackmail. For sins of omission he has two suicides on his hands; a further sin of commission (one murder)and the accidental death of the brother. There's also the question of 'the spirit world' via the cat. Not a dude you'd feel safe hanging around with, me thinks! At least there were no vampires.

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omari, I believe you've got it exactly.

"Thank you for a wonderful evening."

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One must keep in mind that this film was made in the mid-1940s, when every script had to be approved by the Hays Office, and that it was made, incredibly, at M-G-M, whose glossy films usually emphasized the happier aspects of life. Still, they got by with quite a lot, expecially the undertones about Dorian Gray's sexual exploits. Today, of course, half of the film would take place in bed, just to make sure the audience gets the point. Censorship actually caused many film-makers to be clever, something we can assume from films like this that the folks at the Hays office weren't particularly!

Those of you who think you know everything should politely defer to those of us who actually do!

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"...half of the film would take place in bed...", ha ha, you got that right. I watch very few films made after 1980 anymore (except for the occasional Woody Allen film).

"Thank you for a wonderful evening."

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The obvious sin is that he kills Basil. I suppose that is a sin.

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[deleted]

"You must be psychic,just watched the 2009 re-make and it does indeed drive his sexual exploits home...with a sledgehammer."

Ugh--just saw this last week. Talk about miscast and obvious. :P

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The final reclamation of himself at the end seems odd, also.

As indeed, it should.

Dorian's attempt at redemption was, for once, to not break his new girl's heart... but this noble act made no difference to the portrait. In fact, it was more hideous than ever. So in frustration and anger, he attempted to destroy the last vestiges of his "conscience" - the portrait.

It wasn't to redeem himself, if I remember correctly. The noble "redemption" aspect, as portrayed in the film, may have been to satisfy Will Hays (because the Production Code said that people always had to be seen to pay for their crimes).


I need a man, not a boy!
"Grown Up World"
http://www.axella.com

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[deleted]



I absolutely agree with you. "...what the hell DID he do to end up with a painting that hideous??". Dorian Gray's evilness, whatever it may be, simply does not come-off in the film. Hurd Hatfield is eerie ("...his mannequin face") but he is to a-sexual for the role. Maybe there's a hint to what you are saying in the movie itself. Whan Baisl sees the painting he exclaims: "If this is what you've done with your life, it's far worse than anything that's beeing said about you". Yes, a rapist, serial killer, pedophilia...?

But the film has the right mood and the balck and white cinematography is first rate.

Cedric Hardwicke is the narrator (I thought it was Sanders himself). Albert Lewin is one of those wonderful director who were "discovered" in France during the golden years of the Cahiers du Cinema (Ulmer, Tourneur, Michael Leisen, Sam Fuller, etc.) He made at least 2 masterpiedes: "The Moon and Sixpence" (I really hope this film never becomes a lost film) and "Pandora and the Flying Dutchman" (one of the very few films that can be called "surrealistic".)

George Sanders is perfect for the part. 40, 50, 70 years ago Hollywood (in the broadest sense of the term) had the perfect actor for any immaginable part. Selznick's David Copperfiled and Gone With the Wind are perfectly casted films, as was the 1961 version of Quo Vaid? (and the 1956 John Huston's version of Moby Dick -inspite of the controversy around the casting of Gregory Peck as Captain Ahab). Tony Richardson's Tome Jones is another example of a film with a perfect cast.

I love Angela Lansbury.

Perhaps a better remake COULD HAVE BEEN made in the 70's, had it been directed by Luchino Visconti, with Dirk Bogarde as Basil, Peter O"Toole as Lord Henry and the young man from "Death in Venice" in the title role. For the 1945 version, there was talk of offering the lead to Greta Garbo, but by that time she was too old for the part.

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Hatfield's acting (in the role of a weak man) was hardly weak. He did a very good job.

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The Sybil Vane thing wasn't like it was in the book.

In the book, she was a gifted Shakespearean actress, performing in a cheap venue. Gray spurned her because on the night he brought his friends to see her perform, she performed badly (she'd lost her "edge" due to her love for Dorian).

Also, at the end of the film when Dorian went to the vaudeville theatre and is seen by Sybil's brother, it was an opium den in the book. I guess that hanging out in opium dens would've been considered one of his sins.


I need a man, not a boy!
"Grown Up World"
http://www.axella.com

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I thought that the opium dens were the root of the problem, because he could not remember his deeds of the night before?


‘I had rather hear my dog bark at a crow than a man swear he loves me.’ :P

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Thank you axellaj. I'm halfway through the book now, and I thought I was tripping reading some of above comments. Glad at least 2 of us have read the same story!
I didn't think Dorian and Sybil got anymore intimate than kissing; and he had written a letter to try to make up with her, but was too late. She'd already killed herself.

Love is never having to say you're sober.

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For some reason I always pictured a donkey in the back room of the tavern?

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Watching it now on TCM.

Some of his sins are implied in the flowerly language of Wilde's era:
"women who for his sake had set convention at defiance would grow pale" -- this implies he became quite the seducer of women at his own social level, promising them love and then abandoning them as he had Sybil Vale. Both in the Victorian era and in the 1940s, this constituted sin.

Others are merely hinted at, as when the men in the social clubs whisper behind his back and look on him with scorn, leaving the viewer to imagine the very worst of Dorian. Visiting the seedy haunts of Whitechapel (at the time of the story, a warren of brothels and drug dens) was shorthand for debauchery of the lowest kind, there were places where wealthy, entitled "gentlemen" went to indulge in all manner of vices away from their polished, immaculate drawing rooms and the stuffy conventions of the privileged upper classes.

His mid-film conversation with painter friend Basil alludes to many more, but obliquely so that while we're not quite sure if Dorian's explanations are true or not, his callousness about the destruction of those around him is.

Deaths he is clearly responsible for: Sybil Vane's suicide, Basil's murder.

Blackmailing Alan Campbell into helping him dispose of Basil's body - another 'sin'. We don't know what hold Dorian has over Alan, but Dorian's knowledge of a possible "scandal" might be first-hand involving relations with Alan. His suicide can be laid at Dorian's door as well.

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[deleted]

Most of it is referred to in a subtle fashion, but you can't really miss:

1.) Stringing Sybil along, then destroying her to the point where she gives up all hope in life and commits suicide.

2.) Running around, carousing with Henry, and their implied homosexual relationship. Not that being gay is evil, but it was a scandalous thing for Dorian's time and place (19th century London high society).

3.) Smoking opium and, it is implied, doing other drugs for the sheer pleasure of the senses. He is quite indulgent with alcohol too.

4.) Killing Basil.

5.) Taking advantage of a young Gladys for his own pleasure.

This was quite a bit to put up on the screen in 1945. The film actually was banned from many places due to the implied homoeroticism alone. And even if we don't see all of his misdeeds, there is no questioning that he is doing them, and everyone is talking about them. We, as the audience, know it too, and see the painting reflect the poor lifestyle choices he is making.

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