MovieChat Forums > Hell's Angels (1930) Discussion > How come this isn't a classic?

How come this isn't a classic?


I haven't seen it, but The Aviator makes it sound like one of the greatest films ever made. Why does it only have 467 votes?

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probably because the people who saw this film in it's heyday don't use the internet, and are more than likely dead.

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Interesting angle. But if that was the case, then why is the Wizard of Oz or Gone with the Wind still popular? This movie is not afforded what I call the "American nostalgic machine" for whatever the reason. I mean why the hell was Hell's Angels never shown on TV?

But here is another angle:

Given the budget at 4 million and the realism of the aerial scenes, the movie is a technical masterpiece. The cinematography and the special effects are very impressive for 1930. The coloring of the dinner scene and in other effects frames are also impressive for the time.

Even the story is quite engaging but cliche.

Sadly, the biggest reason that this movie is not a classic is that most of the acting in this movie is just not "classic" worthy.

Alot of the movie has a "slient" feel to it and it seems the actors are still getting used to being heard. Even Miss Harlow (who happens to be a fave of my Dad, and is very, very sexy) seems to struggle to find the right "tone" of Helen. I couldn't help but snicker at the scene when Roy or Monty discovers her with the Air Corp Captain and she screams at him in a half-drunken tirade.

Perhaps the sound technology just wasn't great then. Perhaps its my ears.

But overall I feel instead of thinking this movie a classic - think of it more as a pioneering movie - way ahead of its time in the "blockbuster" sense.

Just like the man who made it, come to think of it. =)

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Hell's Angels was shown on TV for years in its only known existing format -- all black & white; in the usual TV rating of 4 stars for excellent, Hell's Angels was rated either 1 1/2 or 2 stars or below-average to average. When John Wayne's personal copy of the film with its one two-strip Technicolor(r) scene and the tinted sequences hit the small screen [AMC?]after his death, the rating went up to 3 to 3 1/2 stars or just a hair under excellent.

A little color should not really make that much difference, but it does. Jean Renoir's The River (1951)is a "classic" in its original Technicolor (r) version but almost a dog in the black & white version shown on TV before color was the norm.

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wasnt cliche back then and your right the sound was probably the biggest problem. if you watched the aviator you wouldve know that they had already completed the film silently but then before it was going to premiere "talkies" were invented so Hughes scrapped all the acting and reshoot with sound. and that was after he scrapped the project to reshoot all the aerial scenes because they looked like toy planes and they needed clouds lol




is Santa so jolly because he knows where all the bad girls live?

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Can, say, someone well-versed in 19th century theater and literature weigh in on whether it was cliche at the time or not?

The Cockroach Honor Award
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Reviews in 1920 were universal in acclaim for the flying scenes but the mundane plot and maudlin characterizations were also noted. Harlow, Lyon and Hall received mixed reviews for their acting. The New York Times was especially critical about Harlow's performance saying, "his film is absorbing and exciting. But while she is the center of attraction, the picture is a most mediocre piece of work."

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You won't find a lot of these movies at your local video store. Sadly, the classics sections are rather slim. The local library is where I get most of my movies.

http://www.imdb.com/mymovies/list?l=13212785

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[deleted]

Same here.

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Because it's complete rubbish.

The acting and storyline are preposterous.

The spoken sequences have clearly been spliced into a silent movie.

The colour ball scene is completely out of sync with the rest of the black & white movie.

The flying secenes are the only redeeeming feature of the entire film

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So....you've described just about every 1930 vintage movie. 1930 audiences didn't have a problem with it. To them--it was all new and exciting. With possibly the exception of "All Quiet On The Western Front"...what 1930 movie still holds up to today's standards? And even in that gem of a movie--modern audiences will still laugh at some of the acting.
Pierce

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[deleted]

Lets just say--personal experience. The acting in "The General" may have topped "Hell's Angels"(in your opinion),but, remember, by 1930 most people would rather see the worst talkie over the best silent movie. And yes--I have a stack of movie magazines from the era with plenty of reviews.
Pierce

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Your comment is 8 yrs old-I suspect you watched a bootleg copy.
Look for it on TCM and you'll have a different movie.
This movie would be considerd what the kids say-O.G. " original" the first of its kind

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Hi MDavout!

I know that it has been 8 years since your post, but I have to agree with you. To be honest, overall, I didn’t really care much for Hell’s Angels and I saw it only a couple months ago. Having seen The Aviator, I thought that it would be interesting to see the movie that was so acclaimed in The Aviator. Really, I didn’t get the hype. The acting and dialogue were atrocious, the story was bland, and the accents were so dreadful.

It is a shame that no time was taken to work on the accents for the English characters at least, given how ridiculous it was to hear “bloody” thrown in by one of the brothers, who was obviously played by an American. I almost found that part hysterical, if you ask me. If you are going to do accents, foreign accents in particular, you have to DO THEM RIGHT. If they knew that they were going to have problems with the accents to begin with, they should have just rewritten the script and made them American expatriates or something.

The film at times was a chore to sit through and some parts could have been edited and cut down to a more satisfactory running time. The movie, I feel, didn't need to be that long. Less is more, I think. I could have really cared less for any of the characters, really.

Jean Harlow wasn’t really that attractive. I swear there were better looking women back in that era than Jean Harlow whose face to me, reminds me of a clown.

After watching this movie, it is a good thing Hughes stuck with aviation and didn't make too many pictures to begin with.

Cast Away...It's like Forrest Gump, but on an island. - Bridesmaids

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After hearing about this film for years I finally saw it the other day. I was not impressed about the movie as a whole. If I were to view it out of historical context I would say that it is forgettable. Wings is a better WWI aviation movie. However, since I have seen more than a few films of the late 20s and early 30s, I can say that I am very impressed with Hell's Angels in a number of ways.

Hughes appeared to ignore the mores of the time by including a great deal of sexuality and profanity. While this doesn't sound like a reason to like a movie it is. It was realistic in its portrayal of how people speak and the things they do as adults. I have no doubt that many high-minded people found this film to be scandalous and a threat to the country's moral standing. This film is noteworthy only for the fact that it went where others were afraid or unable to go.

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It really is a kick ass movie. I watched after The Aviator just to see if the air battles were that amazing. They were. What this most reminded me of in spectical is Michael Bay. There is a scene where a pilot kamikazis a zeplin. The burning zeplin falls from the sky filling the whole screen as our two heros dive for their lives. Bloody amazing. The scene in the zeplin where the crew jump ti their deaths so the zeplin can loose weight and climb is really harrowing. And when they drop bombs you know it isnt a special effect. You know that they have just dropped a bloody huge bomb. Pretty amazing stuff. I was far more impressed after that film than I thought I would be

You watched it, you cant un-watch it! - Futurama

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Me and my boyfriend would love to watch it but I see that Turner Classic's Movie isn't going to show it anytime in the future. Wonder where we can get it at?

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u can get it on dvd.

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The scene in the zeplin where the crew jump ti their deaths so the zeplin can loose weight and climb is really harrowing.


I was hoping that Karl would have given them the wrong coordinants to the London target, but nothing was said about it. Too bad he got dropped though. He was a nice guy before the war.

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It's been a few years since I last saw Hell's Angels, but as I recall, Karl DOES give them instructions to drop the bombs from the observation car, and they fall harmlessly in the Thames River. Am I wrong?

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You're not wrong; that's exactly what happened. Nobody had even realized what he had done at the time he was dropped from the zeppelin. I just watched the movie and I'm quite impressed, it exceeded my expectations.

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Someone pointed out that the film reminded them of Michael Bay's work. They seemed to think this was a good thing.
I also agreed that Hell's Angels is perhaps the Bad Boys II of 1930. It has it all, terrible acting, chauvinism, infantile humor, massive explosions, scantily clad women, paper thin characterizations, large machines that go "Bang!". Sure it is technically ingenious, but that does not make a good film. It makes you laugh and blush in the way that only true trash can. So if you wish to claim that is a technical achievement or a half-decent mindless action film, by all means do so. But you are wrong if you think this is great cinema.
Also, there are far better and better known talkies from this period, not to mention silent films. Hell's Angels is pretty damn obscure, or at least was until The Aviator, and found itself in this situation because it is nothing more than flashy big-budget garbidge. People should never forget that there have always been bad films. I do not believe that the standard for cinema has dropped significantly , only that time has separated the wheat from the chaff and left us with all the true classics.
Unfortunately, time missed one.

Top 4: The Royal Tenenbaums, In The Mood For Love, Lawrence of Arabia, The Third Man
Last Seen: Hell's Angels 4/10

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I should have said "The good bits that Michael Bay can do". I meant the spectical of the big shots. I just wasnt expecting it, although to be fair I havent watched a lot of old movies.

But I standby the fact that there are some very powerful scenes in that movie. The Zeplin scene is really intense. They drop the observor to his death, after he had shown compassion, and the mass suicide is amazing! A very downbeat ending too.

Yes the acting is a bit typically "silent movie", but I really enjoyed the film.

You watched it, you cant un-watch it! - Futurama

http://teamwak.blogspot.com/

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[deleted]

Thought it was an excellent movie. The acting and script were typical of the time period (stage like, rather than what we are used to in modern movies), but the movie was sexually racey and technically advanced for the era.

Howard Hughes clearly was a perfectionist. The sets were outstanding. The effects would have been good for a movie made twenty years later. The ammo depot scene, the zeppelin, the aircraft, even the dual sequence was well done.

The interaction between Helen and the brothers was tension filled and worked well. Helen is desirable and dangerous. Roy is admirable and pitiful. Monte is lovable and loathable. Karl is the only character who exudes innocence, and his heroism and fall is lonely. The interaction between the characters works well, particularly the unspoken interaction of Monte and Helen.

Great flick. I usually don't like oldies, but this one, I do.

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I just watched the movie and it was amazing! A classic!

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Hell's Angels IS a classic, though a minor one from its era.

It is notable for two things:

-Introducing Jean Harlow
-The incredible aerial stunts which many consider among the best ever filmed.

The acting was terrible & the script was ho-hum which is why this will never be considered a classic in the same vein as other 30's classics such as Gone With the Wind or Grand Hotel. Hell's Angels came at a time when Hollywood was just starting to cope with the new sound medium. I take this film for what it is: Two hours of escapist entertainment. I know it must've been thrilling to have seen this film on the big screen when it premiered in 1930. I had the privilege of seeing it in 1999 on the big scren for the first time and I was impressed with the film as a spectacle. I'm also a big Jean Harlow fan, so having her in this (in two strip Technicolor for a brief period at that!) was just icing on the cake.

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[deleted]

I have to agree on this, while i have not see The Aviator (Leonardo = yawn)this film, which was really "made" much earlier than it's release date, straddles the silent and sound worlds. (There are several other films like this, the one I'm thinking of is The Canary Murder Case with Bill Powell.)

The whole silent/sound process is different, right down to the speed and quality of the film stock. Notice how in the sound sections the movements are smoother than the obvious jerky movements in the silent scenes? Thats just one example of the difference between sound-on-film photography and silent.

I watched it last night on a HD screen and was quite impressed, not with the bits and pieces overall.

But having seen "Wings" "All Quiet on the Western Front" and "The Big Parade" I can say that there is a clear arc in the evolution of not just the film making, but also what the audience expects. Is Harlow any more or less hammy than Renee Adoree or Clara Bow? Are the special effects any greater/lesser then in Wings ?(the first film to win Best Picture btw)Would Sheerer or Garbo or Crawford have handled the situation any differently? I have to think not.

Also, WW1 was fodder for film for only so long, and I would have to say that Angels is roughly the apogee in this arc. Its the big budget, big bang, big boobs blockbuster, after it, not much else? I mean who can compete with a crashing zeppelin in 2 strip Technicolor?

Classic? thats too small an envelope to mail this one in. Maybe not, but as a WWI genre film, it would be in my top 5

As an aside, i have to admit I got a giggle out of the Pre-Code naughtiness. Harlow's rack is practically in your lap most of the time, and it's clear she's "getting her needs met" by any number of men, up to and including her lover's brother. And its very VERY clear they slept together, something that would not be made that obvious for another 50ish years.

In the end, I would sum it up as saying the Hughes really tested the limits of the medium and for a moment in time, this was the standard. Then came....

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~~~~~As an aside, i have to admit I got a giggle out of the Pre-Code naughtiness. Harlow's rack is practically in your lap most of the time, and it's clear she's "getting her needs met" by any number of men, up to and including her lover's brother. And its very VERY clear they slept together, something that would not be made that obvious for another 50ish years.

In the end, I would sum it up as saying the Hughes really tested the limits of the medium and for a moment in time, this was the standard. Then came....~~~~~

Pre-censorship films certainly look like films for grown-ups don't they?

~~~~~Classic? thats too small an envelope to mail this one in. Maybe not, but as a WWI genre film, it would be in my top 5.~~~~~

I think this puts it rather well.

Marlon, Claudia and Dimby the cats 1989-2005, 2007 and 2010.

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because Howard Hughes pulled it from circulation soon after release and for several dozen years it was locked away, a typical hughes move, he never felt anything was good enough, like his spruce gooses one flight., but thats the biggest reason it's not considered a classic, not enough continual viewing over the years. it is a very well made movie, the cross over from silent to talkies is very obvious yes, but the mood of the movie is amazing for it's time, much like Metropolis or faust ( both silent) that draw you in past the by todays standards hokey acting and poor effects, with tthere artistic moods, the Zepplin coming out of the clouds, the tension building realistic ariel combat sequences, you get a genuine feeling of the tension and gloom of war. I got it through netflix, I was not disapointed and it is a classic to me, and maybe will become one as more see it.

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MAy hAVe SPOileRS.

Just saw it from Netflix.
I never realized it wasn't a classic. What makes a movie a classic? The number of votes? The age? I would call it a classic.
This movie started out as being a typical hokie movie. You can tell that Howard put most of his effort into the aerial sceens, the rest looks like it was directed by Ed Wood.
One of many questionable scenarios.
I was wondering why the brothers didn't want to get a few hours sleep before their big mission, and why the officers didn't insist on their sleeping. I guess it was common for pilots to go 24 hrs. without sleep, get drunk and fly a huge plane in the dark that you never saw before, while trying to read maps etc.
I do think it is a very worthwhile movie to see, for the historic content and cinematography. The sound is surprizingly clear for such a film, and it is cleaned up nicely. Someone watching with me wondered if it was really the original movie, it looked so good.

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I got to see for the first time off a projector like the kind they used to have at high schools. I was learning to fly and our flying club, of whom I was by far the youngest, screened it one evening after everyone had landed. Obviously it was available as a small frame black and white print. It was a great setting for the company of pilots, but we were watching a small portable roll-up screen. I've seen it on TV since, and the story line is so artificial and the acting so superficial that it is almost unwatchable. The flying scenes are of course fun to watch. (Kind of like "Titannic")

What makes a film a classic? In one sense you can pass an overall definition: "Something that people will always want to watch". This probably refers to an engaging story line, well acted, either timeless or so well focused in its own world that it draws the spectator in.

So "Hell's Angels" is a niche classic. It appeals because of its link with Howard Hughes and the story of its making. It appeals because of its great flying sequences which are one of a kind. I think for most people it does NOT appeal on its story line, which I think would always have been kind of hokey.

Remember that scene in Citizen Caine where the opera ends with the horrible performance by the wife of our main guy, in an opera house he had built for her? The audience is silent until Caine stands and single handedly starts the applause. And drags everyone along. I picture opening night of "Hells Angels" the same way.

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Good to see it has many more votes now than it did in 2005.

It is over 1600 votes now, which is something.
It was a very good movie.


http://www.imdb.com/mymovies/list?l=30520828

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rado above "hated the ending" and that might be part of the problem for classic status - the ending is very uncompromising indeed. Roy loves his brother, he has seen him make the effort against character of going on the dangerous mission, but when it comes to it he is a coward and a wrong un - so Roy has to shoot his own brother. Roy is himself executed moments later. Roy has done the right thing by the men going over the top later in the day, but at great cost.

The aerial battle scenes are rightly praised - they are truly spectacular. The bombs are clearly real bombs and no doubt the great war did look like that. When we see a truck blown 20 feet into the air it brings to life the devastating destruction.

The Zeppelin section is remarkable in many ways. At one moment it looks like a dreamscape, at another like a liner on the ocean. We are reminded how new and strange and terrible aerial warfare was.

When I first saw this I fell asleep after about 20 minutes and then didn't want to finish it for a long time. I knew it got better, what I didn't know until watching it through tonight is just how much better.

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1. It wasn't very good, just flashy

2. You have no idea how many people in the entertainment industry blacklisted HH, that has very lasting repercussions.

3. Made by no particular studio so no one to rake in the royalties from showing it. If it had that RKO tower or the little plane dragging the Universal logo around to start it off, it could be a turd and be on TNT 5 nights a week.

4. HH wasn't Jewish. (i kid)

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