MovieChat Forums > JokerĀ (2019) Discussion > Is This Joker an Incel, Or Could He Sedu...

Is This Joker an Incel, Or Could He Seduce a Woman?


The movie doesn't give us a clear answer to this question

The media in the build-up to release insisted that Joker was an incel icon, but the character himself is not necessarily an incel. Some versions of him have him banging Harley Quinn and in others he is maybe asexual

This portrayal did not depict him as sexually-frustrated. His delusions of being with Zazie Beats is shown to be more related to loneliness and longing for human connection than desire for sex

Also, incels usually lust after white, blonde women with no kids. Joker's attraction to Zazie shows a more sophisticated palate than found among the typical incel

Plus it is quite possible that he did make her laugh that one time in the elevator, so he might have some "game" that he could cultivate if he were able to improve his mental health

And lastly, his balletic dancing is charged with sensual intensity. I find it hard to believe that a man with such moves would be repulsive to the female race

reply

I don't consider him an incel. I think he could potentially have a relationship.

reply

Same. I think the sequel should introduce Harley Quinn as some kind of hospital intern. A young, naive girl who becomes infatuated w/ the legendary folk hero of the Gotham Riots and he manipulates her into helping him escape. Then they go on a Bonnie and Clyde-style crime spree

This way it sticks with similar serious themes as the first one. This time it's psychological manipulation and exploitation and co-dependent toxic behavior. Plus we stick with the gritty crime drama aspect, but now we can borrow from movies like Badlands and Natural Born Killers and other romantic crime movies rather than Scorsese movies

reply

He was most likely a virgin. He lived with Mom and dreamed of a loving father.

They did show him masturbating lying on his bed. It was background and out of focus, just before the phone rings. Most didn't notice.

reply

Yeah, I didn't notice that. Good catch

reply

I noticed it on the 3rd viewing. I've seen this 4 times now.

reply

Damn, you must've really loved the movie. I loved it too, but I'm too cheap to pay for multiple viewings. But it is definitely a special enough movie to warrant that many repeat viewings

reply

One I snuck into the other was a free viewing at my casino.

reply

Why do perceived sexualities, or personalities need to be pigeon-holed?

reply

I propose L, G, B, T, Joker, X, Y Z.... and straight.

reply

Also, incels usually lust after white, blonde women with no kids. Joker's attraction to Zazie shows a more sophisticated palate than found among the typical incel

WTF?????

An 'incel' es just a guy that can't get laid. It has no relation with politics (unless you use it as a political insult, but that's another story...). There will be people who can't get laid and like blondes, other will like brunettes, other will like blacks, and other will like Asians, and other will like all of them provided they have nice tits... just like the rest of males.

(Facepalm)

reply

I'm not talking about politics. I'm talking about incels liking blonde women without kids. I have actually visited incel forums because I find these people fascinating. So I'm not just making this up

reply

Sure, you visited incel forums because you find them "fascinating" lol. I also watch porn for scientific purposes. Not to waste my time on armchair psychology, we both know why you went there.

But anyways, to get on the subject, don't you think incels on some fringe forum aren't the best representative of incels in general? Because there's these a very small group of freaks who actually coined the term and call themselves incels, while on the other hand, there's a lot of guys who could technically be called incels, they never had sex and probably have the impulse to just like most men, but they have nothing to do with incels as a community. Not that I've seen the statistics, but I'd guess that percentage of virgin of males age 18-25 is like what...10%? That seams like a fair guess to me and that's a large number of individuals. Now, how many users does that forum you visited have? I'd imagine less than 0,1% of young males ever visit such forums.

Honestly, your claim that they only go after blondes sounds like you've visited 4chan or something where users are just openly racist, not even incels. As for women with no kids...well very few men want women with kids in general.

reply

I didn't say they ONLY go for blondes. I say they PREFER blondes without kids. And nope, it wasn't 4chan, it was a place called love-shy

And I went there after seeing a Youtube documentary about incels and they talk about that forum. So no, you don't know why I went there Mr. Psychologist

And yeah, most men don't visit such forums, obviously. But it's a general statement that holds roughly true that incels are particularly fascinated with white blonde girls with no kids. Just like you could say "most movie buffs love The Godfather" based on visiting a forum like this and probably be right most of the time



reply

So I went to check out loveshy and on the front page it says total members: 6449, members online: 9 and members online over past 24 hours: 245. A fringe herbalist/ alternativist forum from my small conservative country of few millions has more users than that lol

reply

Your brain has been hijacked by memes and now you percieve the world through this limited incel vs non-incel prism.

First of all, Arthur was on heavy medication. Not sure what drugs specifically, but a lot of such meds kill your desire for sex. Joker is a brilliant character who rivaled Batman. But Arthur Fleck was a mentally ill man on meds whose life consisted of him playing a clown for living and taking care of his sick mother in free time. Yeah, someone like that probably won't be slaying pussy, but it has literally nothing to do with...well anything.

reply

You're making assumptions about the character based on pure conjecture. Like another poster indicated above, he is shown masturbating in the movie. There is no indication that he has no sex drive. I've taken psych meds in the past and know tons of other people who have taken them and still have a desire for sex. Sure, in some cases they can affect your sex drive, but in many cases they do not. Or they decrease it, but not by much

Lots of people with mental illnesses or who take meds still have sex lives. And I assume so do professional clowns (lul)

Don't know what you are basing this assumption that I'm inspired by memes. My question was inspired by the thought pieces in the media about how the Joker was going to inspire incels to commit acts of violence

reply

I must have missed that part in the movie. But masturbation can be a form of venting, you need a stronger libido to actually go for a woman. You're right though, I'm just guessing here. The point I want to make is that it's very limiting to think in terms of incel vs sex-haver. And Joker is the finest example. Yes, he probably has some sex drive and you could force him in that category of an incel. But what does Joker really have to do with this imfamous group that are incels? That's why when looking at Joker I prefer to forget about such made-up categories that prevent us fron seeing things as they really are. That poor Arthur is a complex character with his own set of problems entirely unrelated to those of some spoiled college kid whose biggest trouble in life is not having sex.

reply

he could only seduce as equally messed up character as him (Harley). I know the whole movie is about him being "so weird and anti social". But one of the biggest queues is when he goes and watches the comedy show. he laughs(its not his condition this time) when no one else is at all the wrong places. what he takes from the jokes is all the wrong things.

hes jut so messed up

reply

Anybody can get laid they just need to lower their standards.

reply

Whilst simultaneously the other person also does so.

reply