MovieChat Forums > Finding Jesus: Faith. Fact. Forgery. (2015) Discussion > If Jesus exist...

If Jesus exist...

posted 9 years ago by csecrest2
20 replies | jump to latest

If Jesus really exist 2000 years ago then so did Confucius, Buddha and Muhammad. These four extraordinary sages who influenced world civilization more deeply than any other human beings in history. As just one measure of their importance, current rankings of the most influential people in history consistently put them at or near the top of the list. Four centuries after the rise of the scientific worldview, their influence in human affairs continues to be fundamental, underscoring issues ranging from questions of ethics and justice to religious and political conflicts to other issues that dominate today's headlines.

In the 21st century, much of humanity still looks to the lives, teachings, and actions of these four sages for guidance on how to live, for their conceptions of morality, and for understanding the most crucial human values.

Never merely historical figures, as models of human living they remain dynamically alive for countless millions of people around the world, exemplifying the moral and spiritual precepts our civilizations are built on. Taken together, their influence extends over most of the human population, from Asia to the Middle East and from Europe to the New World.

No understanding of human life, individual or collective, could be complete without factoring in the role and contribution of these history-shaping teachers.

[–] lulupalooza 9 years ago

True.

Even understanding the belief systems and myths that proceeded these four is extremely compelling. Interestingly, many of those leaders were much like these younger four and what they represent. So much so, that stories and teachings are very similar as to be suspected of helping shape the tenets of the four that followed (e.g. floods of Noah and Gilgamesh).

As the centuries and millennia go by, religious and spiritual ideologies will evolve and change while tending to restate similar themes of universal ethics and morals.

"Don't get chumpatized!" - The King of Kong: A Fistful of Quarters (2007)

[–] fp_ff_fp 9 years ago

It is true that these names have had historical significance but there's chances Jesus didn't exist or even if he did, he might've been some ordinary guy used as a rallying figure and then elevated to god status.

There's enough corroborating evidence for Buddha, Muhammad and some for Confucius.

But definitely, they had an impact.

You're forgetting others like the hindu gods, egyptian gods, roman gods etc. who also had significant impact in these civilizations, even more so than the 4 of your names put together.

Also, of note is that the scientific achievements and other achievements did take place irrelevant of these 4. I would say more on the arts/philosophy side these people have had some posthumous influence.

[–] leefoo-1 9 years ago

The only difference between all of these 'sages' is that Jesus died and came back (rose again). Those other three just died. In fact, that is what being 'born again' is all about. The Holy Spirit (part of the Trinity) lives inside of you when you ask Jesus to take over your life. It is the basis of the New Testament.

It is what makes people who never wanted to read the Bible want to read it the very next day when. It happened to me and all of my friends who asked Jesus into their heart as their Personal Savior.

Also, those other 3 have detailed plans on how to EARN your way into Heaven (or something similar). Jesus/God says that He is Holy and that ALL men are sinners and that NO man is good enough to get into Heaven.

And the only way to bridge that gap was for Jesus to become the ultimate sacrifice on the Cross. His Free Grace (something that can never be earned, no matter how good you are) is what the Resurrection is all about. It is why Paul, the Pharisee of Pharisees said, after HE was born again, that "All my good deeds are as filthy rags".

[–] cubsblue 9 years ago

Those three can still be found I n their graves. The tomb of Jesus is empty.

[–] daviddwatson127 9 years ago

Amen

[–] Moonglum9 (10709) 3 years ago

And people say there's no proof! Pshaw!

[–] AngstBoy42 9 years ago

Skipping the rest of the nonsense in your post, let me simply point out that there is perhaps no more wicked philosophy than that of "grace". Assuming for the sake of argument that "sin" exists (it doesn't) and that one needs to be saved (one doesn't), the idea that one can not be saved "no matter how good you are" - that one has to just hope to be one of the lucky "chosen" beneficiaries of said "grace" - is as evil and vile and *beep* a philosophy as has ever been hoisted on the human race.

There is no argument I could present to your thick skull to convince you why you should reject "grace", so I won't waste my time. It is self-evident to anyone with 2 or more brain cells that a blood-thirsty, hate-filled, vengeful, jealous, capricious "god" who is intent on destroying the majority of his creation to suit his fancy, and saving other segments of his creation "just because", is no god worthy of anyone's love or adoration. That "god" is nothing but a *beep* cosmic thug worthy of the dust heap of history.

Good day.

[–] crc-4 7 years ago

Skipping the rest of the nonsense in your post, let me simply point out that there is perhaps no more wicked philosophy than that of "grace". Assuming for the sake of argument that "sin" exists (it doesn't) and that one needs to be saved (one doesn't), the idea that one can not be saved "no matter how good you are" - that one has to just hope to be one of the lucky "chosen" beneficiaries of said "grace" - is as evil and vile and *beep* a philosophy as has ever been hoisted on the human race.

You don't believe in sin but you believe belief in sin is evil. Stated more precisily you believe the notions of sin and salvation are the worst evil this world has ever seen more evil then the extermination of 4 million jews, more evil then the rape of nanking more evil. Danm I can think of a lot of things that are evil but oh no nothing tops the story of salvation for you.

Nimrod.

[–] hccman2000 9 years ago

If you really want the facts, then read the book by Lee Strobel, who incidentally, was a atheist at the time. I ask you to read this book from front to back before making any judgement or anything. You will see the evidence within that book and know fact from fiction.

The Case for Christ: A Journalist's Personal Investigation of the Evidence for Jesus
by Lee Strobel.

Here is a link and you can buy this book for under $3 online or you can go to Barnes and Noble, which is going to cost more more than likely.

https://play.google.com/store/books/details?id=ydVw3pbYZbgC&source=productsearch&utm_source=HA_Desktop_US&utm_medium=SEM&utm_campaign=PLA&pcampaignid=MKTAD0930BO1&gclid=CjwKEAiAjsunBRCy3LSlz_PJqCgSJACJY7yKemo9HeiaBPYkDG4Xsmq3Pm_QrQSCTE9LysNvWPCcdRoCTcrw_wcB&gclsrc=aw.ds

Yeah well, you know, that is just like your opinion man.

[–] Poisoned_Dragon1964 9 years ago

If you really want the facts, then read the book by Lee Strobel, who incidentally, was a atheist at the time. I ask you to read this book from front to back before making any judgement or anything. You will see the evidence within that book and know fact from fiction.

That book and its claims have been amply answered, for anyone who really wants to know the facts.
http://debunkingchristianity.blogspot.com/2010/05/case-for-case-agains t-case-for-christ.html

http://www.amazon.com/The-Case-Against-For-Christ/dp/1578840058

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[–] scwalker-1 9 years ago

Before the world was, I AM

He's alive today and every knee shall bow and tongue confess he is Lord

IMDB wise guys, atheists, everybody

[–] david-ashton-755-718241 9 years ago

I wish all the message boards had thoughtful and intelligent discussions like this thread...

[–] megafauna005 9 years ago

Jesus didn't exist so no need to worry about it!

Jesus NEVER existed! He is Judeo Christian MYTH!

[–] Joshwilson55 9 years ago

Yeah thats not true it is historical fact that he existed!!

[–] megafauna005 9 years ago

Not a chance! There is not a SINGLE eyewitness account or contemporary account of Jesus! "The bible says so" is NOT evidence!

Jesus NEVER existed! He is Judeo Christian MYTH!

[–] timmy9313 9 years ago

Well, the bible is full of eyewitness accounts.

[–] megafauna005 9 years ago

EVERY religion make extraordinary claims. If you simply believe the book about one particular religion then ALL religions and ALL stories of gods are true!

There are ZERO non Christian eyewitness accounts or even contemporary accounts of Jesus.

Jesus NEVER existed! He is Judeo Christian MYTH!

[–] Joshwilson55 9 years ago

There is several historians during the time roman and hebrew that wrote about the accounts of Jesus Christ and his Crucifixion. Not to mention that we can accurately date the time in which the New Testament was written and most where written with in 50 years of Jesus's death. Not to mention even prominent atheist scholars acknowledge that there is no doubt that he existed they just doubt his divinity. Stating that he didn't exist is not even close to accurate.

[–] megafauna005 9 years ago

Absolute NONSENSE Josh! There is not a SINGLE eyewitness or contemporary account that Jesus existed. All there are Christian sources which mean NOTHING! Horus was tied to tree, beaten, and resurrected so you believe that too? MANY gods from Hercules to Osiris to Mithras to Horus had resurrection, disciples, performed miracles, etc.

You realize even the earliest Christians NEVER saw an earthly Jesus? The non Christian sources of Josephus and Tacitus are a JOKE because both were born AFTER Jesus allegedly died so they NEVER saw an earthly Jesus! They were simply repeated STORIES they heard. They had ZERO evidence!

You are mistaking PROMOTION and PROPAGANDA for evidence! "The bible says so" is NOT evidence! LMAO!

Jesus NEVER existed! He is Judeo Christian MYTH!

[–] Poisoned_Dragon1964 9 years ago

If Jesus really existed 2000 years ago then so did Confucius, Buddha and Muhammad.

That does not follow. Each one must be considered on their relative merits.

Some may have existed while others did not. Or it may well be that none of them did. Their importance to various belief systems does not bear on the question.

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