this and Chaos Walking are the biggest bombs of the year, but at least this got decent reviews
shareBombed with $4.8 million. https://variety.com/2021/film/news/box-office-halloween-kills-debut-matt-damon-ben-affleck-last-duel-bombs-1235091240/
The running time of 2 hours 32 minutes hurts the box office, since there are fewer viewings available.
Too bad. I'm interested in Ridley Scott's works as usual, but I'll probably catch it on bluray.
shareChaos Walking was a terrible movie.
shareIt's a shame but it was probably always the case having the same release date as Halloween Kills.
Even more of a shame because I thought Halloween Kills was terrible whereas The Last Duel is fantastic.
I love historical dramas that are grounded and gritty, so this is absolutely on my must-see list, but this film was marketed as a modern day retelling of a real-life event through the lens of #MeToo and oh boy did that (rightfully) rub a lot of people the wrong way.
I think a film like this should have simply been marketed as a character driven mystery-thriller. A "Did he?" or "Didn't he?" affair with the trust of the wife being up for question, her life being on the line, and her husband willing to fight and lose everything for their honor. The marketing and media didn't need to dabble into the whole ridiculous #MeToo nonsense to garner interest, but the media is the enemy of the people these days so I shouldn't have expected anything less.
I went to see it last night and I have to say that, by the time the movie was over, I found the whole thing to be an intensely frustrating experience. Here's why:
It's an extremely well-made film. In fact, I feel like I can easily say it's the best film of the year. I don't even know that it's close, honestly. I have no problem saying that, objectively speaking, it's a better movie than Dune for instance.
Ridley was on his A-game here. The cast was on their A-game. Everyone behind the camera did an EXCELLENT job of bringing 14th century France to life. The film is always interesting in one or way or another and never boring, despite being 2 1/2 hours.
However, the excellence of the movie is also what makes it so frustrating. Everyone was saying that this was Ridley's #MeToo movie and that's what it is. You could tell that's kind of what you're going to get from the trailers, but I was hoping it wouldn't end up being as INTENSELY #MeToo as it ends up being. The film is structured in a way that the story is told from three different perspectives and by the time you get to the duel, you know the truth of the matter and the truth doesn't make either man look good. It's clear that both the guys are assholes and the woman is the hero for having to endure the menfolk's bullshit.
I really, really wish that instead of telling THIS story, Ridley had the same cast, the same crew, the same budget, and the same everything else, but a different script that is set during the same era. Because Ridley made a damn good film here. The climactic duel itself is thrilling and brutal. I just wish we got a different medieval tale to lead up into that great ending.
This is precisely what I was afraid of. Essentially it's a well-made SJW film. It's one that ropes people into its story, characters, and settings yet beats them over the head with Progressive messaging.
It's frustrating because I know that if I see a film like this I will both love and hate it, and some part of me feels it's best not to see a film like this to avoid having my blood vessels turned into a conduit of boiling liquid.
This is a bit spoiler-ish so don't look at it if you want to know nothing else about the movie but. . .
I could handle a basic message of "don't rape women." I mean, I agree that men should not go around fucking women against their will. But where the movie fails, at least in terms of my own personal enjoyment, is that it doesn't give us even one male character to root for by the end. You would think that it would be Damon's character, but the problem there is that it makes it clear that he actually doesn't care much about his wife, and when he finds out that she was raped he is only worried about his own honor and not her pain or shame. So he doesn't really fight the duel for her; he fights it for him. If they had instead made his character genuinely valiant and a good husband I would've been much more satisfied with the movie.
I didn't realize this at first, but apparently the screenplay was written by Damon and Affleck. And of course Ridley directs. This seems to me like a very strange trio for a #MeToo movie. But to be fair, it is based on true events. How close to the real story the film stays I do not know.
I still feel a little bad for Ridley that it has failed so miserably at the box office because he DID make a good movie. And I still think you should see it. Just set your expectations accordingly going in.
As to your objection: What if that's actually the way it was back in that time? Wouldn't it be better to portray actual attitudes and actions rather than cheese it up with a fan-friendly fiction?
In as much as a film cares to portray the truth, I'd rather watch truth than fiction when real life events are portrayed.
Not to dismiss your point -- it would have been more enjoyable, perhaps, but I still found something worth rooting for in the end. The truth.
I understand what you're saying, but at the end of the day I didn't go to watch a documentary. This isn't to say that dedication to the true historical details is not important, but frankly, since it is NOT a documentary I don't think it's THAT important. Give me the crowd-pleaser instead of the movie that's going to make me walk out feeling depressed and in a bad mood.
Maybe they could've at least given us a scene with some human warmth to it at the very end after the duel is over, but nope, the ending just drives the final nail in.
I would like to read the book now to see how close the film stays to true events.
Genius comment, right on the money.
The story is exactly told as what people believed then.
The events and behaviour reflect that, and the movie is a comment on that.
Damon being an asshole is realistic and effective to that point. Had they made him more "valiant" that would be lost.
I also was rooting for truth and justice. These people were dealing with them with their medieval limitations, but that is what this was about.
This is my top movie of 2021.
4 sure both men were bad guys in this. i expected matt to bleed out from his thigh wound shortly after victory. leaving the woman with $, land, and happiness
i wasnt too far off
Really appreciate your reasonable and enlightening comments on this movie. You gave a rational justification for your impressions about what was good and bad which helps me decide whether to invest my time. You were not rude or dismissive in explaining what disappointed you and you were willing to accept that others might disagree. I see where someone below takes shots suggesting you should not comment on your disagreement with the “political” messaging in this movie. I roll my eyes at the anesthetized inconsistency of someone expressing an opinion about how you should not express an opinion.
shareThanks for the post.
And yes, I agree, I suspect that person loves to read posts on here with political and social messaging they agree with. They only want to keep politics out of movie discussions when it's something they don't find palatable.
Truthfully, I wanted to love this movie and would still give it a qualified recommendation. I really do wish Ridley had made some different creative decisions but it is what it is.
I'm of the opinion that a well-made movie can and should piss you off. It evokes emotion, for better or worse, and that's a sign of a riveting film. Very much embodies that love/hate feeling.
shareI have no problems with a film pissing me off, but it should do it for the right reasons.
Like Elite Squad 2, for instance. That film absolutely did piss me off, but not because it was a bad film in anyway (I gave it a 10/10) but because of how realistic the political corruption was depicted. That sort of stuff happens in real life ALL the time, and it pissed me off because there was a slice of indisputable reality attached to it.
The same thing could be said for films like El Salvador, Welcome to Sarajevo, and Spottiswoode's Under Fire.
I don't mind having a well-made movie piss me off, but I also don't like when a well-made movie undermines its own potential to push a socio-political message, usually done to subvert expectations or push an ideological message at the expense of the character(s), plot, or story's integrity... or worse yet, preach to the audience in some fourth-wall breaking way.
I am glad this movie was made exactly the way it was. I get tired of people like yourself whining anytime a movie is made that does not cater to your political ideology gets made. If a movie was extremely right wing you would not say a word. Things like this do happen to women. Mad Max Fury Road is a feminist film but it is still a cinematic great. People like yourself though will complain about those things simply because it does not fit your political ideology. End of Watch is a right wing film and I lean a different way, but in the end it was a good film the end. A film does not have to cater to my political ideology in order to be considered a good film.
shareYou probably feel that way because basically everything coming out of Hollywood is Leftist propaganda. To get anything from there that could be called "right-wing" is rare enough that I could see why you wouldn't be bothered.
You would probably be bothered though if basically every film was pushing some conservative viewpoint.
I don't support an extreme leftist viewpoint. The difference is I don't lose it at the slightest hint of a political ideology. You did the same thing for Shape of Water. Yuck it's promoting beastiality! Okay by that logic then Star Trek is promoting Kirk sleeping with aliens... It's a movie relax.
Now if the movie is badly made ie the new Ghostbusters I will call it out as a bad film. People like you though would mark down a film like mad max Fury road just because it's feminist. Something can be feminist or left without being hamfisted. Same goes for leaning right. End of Watch is good, god's not dead is right wing propaganda trash. Just like how the 2016 Ghostbusters is left wing trash. See but people that rate something higher or lower just because of the ideology are ignorant. Judge how it's crafted if it's hamfisted and use logical reasoning. Not wah it's not playing for my team wah!
I even like hacksaw ridge which has Christian undertones. I like Ben Hur, the ten commandments etc because they are well made films. People like yourself even hate Black Panther why? Oh because it got rated high and it was an sjw film! I get it Black Panther got rated high but what leftist ideology was pushed? An all black cast?
You've made some interesting assumptions here.
Might you point me to any posts I made where I said I hated Black Panther?
It was an assumption but your posts about always hating left wing ideology leads me to this assumption. A typical right winger hates Black Panther.
shareI liked Black Panther and think it's better than a lot of the other Marvel films. I did not think it was the Second Coming of Jesus Christ, as many made it out to be, but it was a solid superhero movie.
Regarding Mad Max, I didn't like it, but not because it had feminist overtones. It was because it was boring.
You might be surprised that I was once a vocal champion of female-led action films. I had a lot of fun, for instance, with Kill Bill and Underworld. But by now the shit has just gotten ridiculous on a number of different levels. One can only watch a 90-pound woman kick the shit out of a 200-lb man while making girl power quips so many times before it becomes nauseating.
I did not think it was great either, but as you said I thought it was one of the better Marvel films. Thing is people get mad that it got overpraised so they over compensate by saying it is one of the worst films ever. They also say it is a left wing film. I simply ask what is so leftwing about it?
Mad Max Fury Road boring? Wow! That would be the last thing I would call it. Overall it is considered great by both critics and the mass majority of people.
Just like how there is a saturation of superhero movies after The Avengers came out.
There were actually some interesting elements of Black Panther that conservatives could cling to. For instance, if you recall Wakanda was serious about its borders. They recognized that they had to protect their sovereign territory and be diligent about knowing who is coming into the country.
There also weren't a lot of "evil white man" tropes in the film.
Furthermore, the cast was good, there were some good action scenes, and there was also some effective humor, so overall I thought Black Panther was pretty good and probably a Top 10 Marvel film.
I thought Mad Max was boring because it was basically just a lot of stuff happening on the screen with little in the way of an interesting story to underpin the action and visuals. Also, I didn't think any of the characters were likable and I didn't care about any of them. I am happy for George Miller, returning to the franchise after so many years and having such a big success, but I didn't much enjoy it.
How come no one mentions how the villains of Captain Phillips were ethnic while having a white male hero? Notice not one word comes from you about that? Why is that? If it were the other way around you would come unglued.
shareYou're obviously correct that the villain in Captain Phillips was black, but you have to say it with the caveat that they bent over backwards to absolutely make him as sympathetic as possible.
When you get down to it, the problem isn't really having white villains or black villains or villains of any other color. The problem is the obvious social engineering that Hollywood engages in to push certain viewpoints and influence society.
See but that argument doesn't work either. Javier Bardem was the villain for No Country For Old Men. He was not sympathetic at all. Yet not one peep from the conservatives. My goodness I bet people these days would have a fit about Blade if it were released today. The villain was white in that and the hero is black.
Hollywood does engage in that stuff but so does the right. I know that if the right was the majority in Hollywood there would tons of pandering political undertones for right wing films. Don't deny it.
Oh, I don't deny that if conservatives ran Hollywood that we would get a lot of movies with conservative themes. Executing one's agenda is simply the consequence of holding power. Obviously I would like it a lot better if that were the case than having to deal with the opposite.
But speaking of denial, you can't deny that certain kinds of movies that we once got we just don't really see much of anymore. For instance, films where a white person comes into a community of color and in some way helps elevate that community are now called "problematic" because of the "white savior" trope. Even if the film is based on real people and events, you're just asking for a liberal backlash if you make a movie like that now.
Correct but in the end certain trends do get a bit tiresome. Right now the superhero thing is a bit tiring since there is so many of them. Movies go through trends and that is okay.
shareIf you issue with the film is that it has #Metoo, then the problem is you. There is nothing wrong with #Metoo.
Yeah, the two guys are assholes. That happens, and it was very true back then. That’s how many men view and treated women during that time.
If there was nothing wrong with #MeToo then the movement wouldn't have been stamped out when it got out of hand, looking for boogeymen under every bed and around every corner.
shareIt didn’t rightfully rub people the wrong way. Those that have an issue with #Metoo have to look at themselves and work on their mindset.
shareIt's hit the cinemas in the UK the same weekend as Venom, two other blockbusters (Bond, Shang-Chi) still running and Dune opening the following weekend. It sounds interesting but personally I don't want to watch such a dark sounding film at the moment so was going to give it a miss anyway.
shareWhen will Hollywood learn. If you try and sell a film by saying it's all about "toxic masculinity", no one is going to bother to go and watch that shit. Shame. It could have been good if it hadn't been infected with this nonsense.
Get woke, go broke.
Indeed.
What's fucked up is that it's an extremely well-made movie. I saw it last night and this was immediately apparent to me. But it's a straight-up #MeToo movie. I would have loved to have seen this director, with this cast, and this production crew tell a story set during the same time and place, but have it not be some #MeToo shit.
Do you think it could be saved with a director's cut or is the shittyness too ingrained to be edited out?
share