A flaw nobody seems to mention. - Rogue One (2016) Discussion

[–] Bobby_Robinson 7 years ago

You never mentioned any of this when we saw it together at the multiplex the other week, Colin.

I'll just bet that you were keeping it to yourself so that you could surprise me another video, you sneaky Pete. 

FANTASTIC!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

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[–] savoy1984 7 years ago

My names Dave and I saw it last year, on myself!

To be fair when somebody posts a video link it's usually something dodgy but I feel like I've got a good point to make that's why I made a video.

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[–] jrsjr81 7 years ago

Savoy1984 I seen your video and was barely able to make out what you were saying but something that I did pick up from what was coming out of your mouth was Galen Erso is a Rebel, which by the way is not entirely true, and that he built the Death Star, which by the way he did NOT all he did was design the satellite dish laser beam weapon on it. He was able to put a flaw into the Death Star though but there's nothing wrong with that. It doesn't change a thing. Now that we have Rogue One I now know the enormity of the sacrifice of the Rebels obtaining the Death Star plans and it gives A New Hope more heft and enjoyment.

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[–] savoy1984 7 years ago

What about the Death Star in Return of the Jedi do we have to assume that it's also thing left in there on purpose, what about the StarKiller base in The Force Awakens was that also planned before hand, I wouldn't have thought so, but maybe we will find out it was.

It's not a deal breaker for sure, I still love Star Wars and even flat out like 99% of the special edition updates/prequels but to say it doesn't changed anything is not the case in my opinion anyway.

All the other prequels were analysed to within an inch of their life's for anything that may have affected parts IV V and VI, yet Rogue One comes along a prequel that "changes" a pretty big plot point and nobody seems to care, I never will understand humans to coin phrase.

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[–] Bobby_Robinson 7 years ago

I don't think it's something that anyone's really bothered about, Col. in fact I would venture to say that it's only you who considers this to be a flaw and the rest of us consider it to be a strength.

ALLONZEEEEEEEE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

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[–] savoy1984 7 years ago

It's all subjective for sure but it doesn't fit in with the other films either.

In Episode 1 the droid ship was destroyed with tenacity and a bit of luck.
In Star Wars a weakness was found and the Death Star was destroyed.
In Jedi a weakness was found and the Death Star was blown up.
In Part 7 the Star Killer base a weakness was found and it got destroyed.

In Rogue One a "problem" was left in there by one of the goodies and essentially was gifted to them on a silver plate.

It's changed how Star Wars works on a fundamental level for better or worse, is it a deal breaker, nah loved Rogue One but it's a massive tonal shift no matter how you cut it.

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[–] Bobby_Robinson 7 years ago

Yes well I disagree with you (as does everybody else).

ALLONZEEEEEEEE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

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[–] ErgonomicSpliff 7 years ago

In Jedi a weakness was found and the Death Star was blown up.

No. The station was unfinished. The RA knew all they had to do was to get the shield down so that their snub fighters could fly into the superstructure and destry the reactor, which they already knew would kill the station.

There is absolutely no problem with there being a pre-designed flaw in the original Death Star, left there by a Rebel sympathizer. It changes nothing about ANH because no one who knew about the specifics of the flaw survived to tell anyone in the RA about it. The RA science people in Yavin were able to analyze the plans and find the weakness easily enough, which was their whole goal in obtaining them in the first place.

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[–] Sunny_Nelson 7 years ago

Yes, but of course that means actually listening and paying attention to what was said in the movie. Can't have that now, can we?

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[–] savoy1984 7 years ago

But it was still a "weakness" in the Death Star in Jedi that took it down, and was only made possible because the rebel alliance figured it out because they were clever it wasn't like it was there because somebody undid a couple of screws on purpose.

Also like you said about the shield generator on Endor how lame would it have been if somebody let 'em in the back door and just turned a switch, just seems incredibly boring for a space opera film.

It's like if I wanted to blow up this laptop I'm typing on by pouring a glass of water into it, I only know that because I know about electric and water don't mix, I didn't have somebody build in a fault in the laptop so it's "explodes" when that happens.

Everything in Star Wars repeats, it just puts that doubt in my mind and takes the edge of the rebel alliance being these cunning clever characters and the empire being these bad asses. It's just doesn't fit in with the war motif that Star Wars is built around.

To me it's the equivalent of somebody escaping from a prisoner of war camp because a guard left the keys in the lock, or the some daring wartime mission worked because the baddies were in on the thing the whole time.

Don't get me wrong I love Rogue War and Star Wars still, just doesn't fit right, it's a cool idea, but not a cool Star Wars idea.

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[–] ErgonomicSpliff 7 years ago

But it was still a "weakness" in the Death Star in Jedi that took it down, and was only made possible because the rebel alliance figured it out because they were clever it wasn't like it was there because somebody undid a couple of screws on purpose.

I'm sorry. You seem to not want to accept the fact that nothing about how the RA found the weakness in the original Death Star was changed by the events of R1. The weakness in the second Death Star was that it was unfinished and protected by a shield. The only thing that had to be cleverly figured out was how to get the shield down.

No one who knew about Galen Erso's pre-engineered flaw survived the events of R1. The RA still had to find the weakness by analyzing the plans. They weren't given some kind of intergalactic primer to find it. There were no "keys in the lock" as you stated. Finding out that the weakness was not just a simple mistake (how could it ever have been, anyway?) does nothing to change the fact that it had to be discovered post-mortem.

And even then, it still took a Force-user to accurately hit the exhaust port to start the chain reaction that Erso set up. This is really a non-issue.

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[–] savoy1984 7 years ago

The thing is with Star Wars and its as pretentious as all heck, but it's based around myths, real life wars and other films, all mixed up like a stew or soup. Probably because Lucas oversaw everything beforehand they felt at the very least tonally the same thing, and for all of Rogue One's greatness it rings hollow in lots of places. I never will understand how people still to this day can rip apart something like Episode 1 and praise up something like Rogue One.

I'm a Star Wars fanboy pretty much one of the first videos I ever rented was Caravan of Courage, one the first films I saw at the cinema was Return of the Jedi and providing I'm not in some terrible accident (touch wood) I'll be going to see Episode VIII, but I'll be dammed if I can't predict how Star Wars fans (just in general) think.

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[–] Bobby_Robinson 7 years ago

You just need a good hard shagging, Col. 

ALLONZEEEEEEEE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

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[–] ErgonomicSpliff 7 years ago

It's like if I wanted to blow up this laptop I'm typing on by pouring a glass of water into it, I only know that because I know about electric and water don't mix, I didn't have somebody build in a fault in the laptop so it's "explodes" when that happens.

Forgot to address this analogy.

This isn't a good analogy. The RA didn't "have somebody build in a fault," in order to destroy the Death Star. The fault was engineered years and years in advance, unbeknownst to the RA. They found the fault without any prior knowledge that there was one. They certainly hoped that they'd find something they could use to their advantage. The fact that they actually found it doesn't impugn their abilities to locate the fault that they knew nothing about, but hoped was there for them to exploit.

Equating your knowledge of the hazards of mixing water and electricity to the RA locating a flaw that they didn't know was there, makes zero sense.

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[–] MaximRecoil (4044) 4 years ago

"The fault was engineered years and years in advance, unbeknownst to the RA. They found the fault without any prior knowledge that there was one."

You don't know what you're talking about. Jyn Erso told them everything she knew about the fault (which was everything her father told her about the fault in the hologram message) at a Rebel Alliance meeting.

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[–] Urogy (176) 5 years ago

WRONG!!!!!! In Return of the Jedi, Mon Mantha says at the RA meeting that "many bothams died giving us this critical information"..….... It's right after Luke sees yoda on degobah and he is reunited w/Leia + Han in deep space at the RA meeting.......

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[–] FFNogoodnik (770) 4 years ago

It has been a while since I watch Return of the Jedi but was the information from the Bothans about the flaw in the Death star or about the fact that 1) it existed 2) where it existed 3) the codes used to get on to the planet 4) the location of the base on the planet

I think the information was about all of those other things.

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[–] crc32 (2584) 4 years ago

Yea but the droid ship was the weakness that was found. In an age when computers were decentrealized Lucas stilkl made a movie where a central computer controlled every little individual droid on the surfaceof a planet which required loads of bandwidth from the command ship to each individual droid.

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[–] bdtyler13 7 years ago

Star Wars isn't real. Of course there will be some discontinuities.

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[–] savoy1984 7 years ago

I like 99% of everything that's ever happened in Star Wars this just doesn't work for me I'm astounded more people just love this idea to be honest. Also it's not real but it's got a strong basis on real world events...also like that's ever stopped anybody.

;)

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[–] Sunny_Nelson 7 years ago

Who said anything about loving this idea? Pointing out exactly what is said and what happens and what is explained within the film itself is not "loving," it's just basic comprehension.

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[–] savoy1984 7 years ago

I've heard by numerous sources that Rogue One is the best Star Wars film since Empire Strikes Back, imagine if the AT AT's had been programmed to fall over how lame that would have been.

Like I've said before I really enjoyed Rogue One but's it's dangerous close to fan fiction, Episode 1 might have it's faults but in comparison it may as well be Shakespeare, I've got to be one of the most easily pleased film fans/star wars fans on the planet but it's just a shoehorned writing exercise so a character can have some invested interested in something that happened in that universe.

So somebody knew somebody who built in the reason why the Death Star had a weakness, makes Luke landing in Yoda's back yard a lot more plausible now. :)

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[–] Jeorj Euler 7 years ago

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=83uzLFHQ97w&t=1s

We actually discuss this "flaw" quite often. I can understand how the element of sabotage detracts from the theme of Imperial arrogance, but as another replier pointed out, the betrayal illustrates how the Empire was slowly coming apart.

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[–] Skullomania 7 years ago

A true Star Wars fan would've done the countdown at the start as...

V...IV...III...II...I

Casual 

John Hancock

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[–] savoy1984 7 years ago

I did say "red5 4 3 2 1" but it's a good point, may have been cool, thanks for watching. 

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[–] ahsnedden 7 years ago

What??? The guy in the video says "the Death Star was made by one of the good guys. Part of the rebel alliance"

What movie did he see?? Galen Erso was not a member of the rebel alliance. Not at all. Not in any way. He's seen in a flashback scene, loving life as a high ranking Imperial officer in his beautiful pad on Corsucant.

Later on he had a change of heart and tried to escape life as an Imperial officer. He took his family to Lah'mu to hide and live as a farmer. He was tracked down by Krennic and forced into what amounts to slave labor to complete the Death Star. He lied, he played a long and SECRETLY designed a deadly flaw that could be exploited.

This guy, although he seems like a NICE fella, is way off base with his criticism.

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[–] savoy1984 7 years ago

But that's like if you were say teacher, or some other profession that's considered quite law abiding, then becoming a bank robber and when the police catch you say well I used to be a teacher.

Somebody who works building the death star to have some kind of issue that makes it blow up sure seems like a rebel to me, and in those flash back scenes wasn't he like frowning and stuff he wasn't like really enjoying it, (could be wrong on that).

Darth Vader had a change of heart but you wouldn't say he wasn't one of the bad guys, also secretly doing something makes him even more of a rebel doesn't it?

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[–] Hazekiah 7 years ago

Galen WAS effectively a rebel.

He left the Empire to to pursue a life of peace, yet also was close enough friends with Saw Gerrera (while HE was still part of the official Rebel Alliance, btw) that he left his daughter to be protected, raised, and trained by her...while he HIMSELF dedicated his life to sabotaging the Empire's super-weapon so he could get word to Saw and the Rebels to destroy it and kill hundreds of thousands if not MILLIONS of the Empire's Finest.

Just like K-2SO said to said to Bodhi after seeing him gun down some Storm Troopers:

"Well, you're a Rebel now."

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[–] Otter (24464) 4 years ago

Some of you dont seem to be familiar with the concept of "double agent". Or "mole".

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[–] tanyalawrence (352) 4 years ago

It changes nothing. A flaw was built into the Death Star which the Rebel Alliance used to destroy it. The films work well together.

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[–] ultravioletx (10212) 4 years ago

It's about what you'd expect from a nobody Youtuber who doesn't even wash his hair before making a video.

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