MovieChat Forums > I Am Michael (2017) Discussion > If straight people can turn gay, why can...

If straight people can turn gay, why can't the opposite be true too?


There are so many examples of people who for many years were straight that identified as gay later in life, why is the converse SO hard to believe?

Since this is an entertainment website, examples like Maria Bello and Meredith Baxter come to mind...

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No one is straight and then becomes gay. Gay people think they are straight and live straight life-styles because that's what society dictates. It is scary to act on feelings for the same sex so people repress them out of fear of retaliation from their family, friends, and community. It is when they finally accept who they truly are and eschew what close-minded people think they should do that they "come out" and identify as what they truly are.

It's not something you can turn on and off.

So no, a gay man would not just suddenly turn straight. Not vice versa.

Someone can be bisexual, but that's also something you are born with.

There is no choice in sexuality. Only the choice to act on it.

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Although the causes are not known, sexual fluidity is a widely accepted concept. A person's sexual orientation is not fixed; it is fluid and can change for reasons unknown.

There is no scientific evidence that anyone is born gay, straight, or bisexual. In fact, the scientific evidence says that sexual orientation is not 100% biological or genetic.

I wrote a short essay (500 words) called "What Causes Sexual Orientation: Nature and Nurture." If you would like to read it, I am open to any feedback:

https://christopherjohnlindsay.wordpress.com/2016/12/16/sexual-orientation-nature-nurture/



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Although the causes are not known, sexual fluidity is a widely accepted concept. A person's sexual orientation is not fixed; it is fluid and can change for reasons unknown.

There is no scientific evidence that anyone is born gay, straight, or bisexual. In fact, the scientific evidence says that sexual orientation is not 100% biological or genetic.

I wrote a short essay (500 words) called "What Causes Sexual Orientation: Nature and Nurture." If you would like to read it, I am open to any feedback:

https://christopherjohnlindsay.wordpress.com/2016/12/16/sexual-orientation-nature-nurture/


That essay seemed to be written as if you began with your conclusion and then searched for stats that appeared to support it. First of all, I think you're incorrectly interpreting the stats you did include. One of the main papers you referenced concluded the abstract with the following:

"Although wide confidence intervals suggest cautious interpretation, the results are consistent with moderate, primarily genetic, familial effects, and moderate to large effects of the nonshared environment (social and biological) on same-sex sexual behavior."

Have you read the entire paper, or just the online summaries? I'd ask the same with the rest of your citations, because we laymen can't always interpret raw data and statistics into practical explanations, especially one so complex as this. And we certainly can't base those conclusions solely on research paper summaries we find online, after choosing a hypothesis and then searching for stats to support it.

Since your education is practically the same as mine (we both have undergraduate degrees), I'm okay with saying that I myself would be wary about trying to interpret research data like that without consulting either the authors themselves or a scientist in a related field. This applies to your other sources as well.

The whole genetic issue of gays has not been solved yet, so I'd urge caution in casually telling people "there is no scientific evidence that anyone is born gay, straight, or bisexual." I'm not going to collect the info here and now, but the claim of "no scientific evidence" is complete BS, and I imagine you know that. You admit in the next sentence that "sexual orientation is not 100% biological or genetic," but you fail to mention that the research suggesting the former is rapidly outpacing the latter.

It's still too early for any conclusions to be made, either way. The salient point is that we do know, through research, that "nurture" (environment) isn't solely responsible for a person's sexuality. The reason why that's so important is because is discounts the notion that sexuality can only be influenced outside the womb...

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Thank you for your thoughtful feedback.

The abstract portion you quoted is an example of political correctness within the scientific community. The study found that heritability was the lesser factor in sexual orientation. But it is very difficult for a scientist to "come out" and declare the obvious.

In my view, the single best explanation for sexual orientation is Daryl Bem's peer reviewed paper. http://dbem.ws/Exotic%20Becomes%20Erotic.pdf

It hasn't been widely accepted because there is a politically incorrect ramification.

Since no scientific study has found that anyone is born gay, it logically follows that sexual orientation can only be an indirect causal factor. The direct cause is nurture because nurture happens after birth. But no scientist can declare that, or they would be subject to severe censure.

Political correctness rules, even in the scientific community.

The most difficult thing to speak is the truth.

http://christopherjohnlindsay.wordpress.com/

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I don't know about that, man... The fringe science community says the same thing about academia, in order to justify its refusal to submit its own research for peer review. They say the system is rigged and no one will dare to step outside the boundaries of established science for fear of reprisal.

They say this, but they never offer any evidence of corruption or ineptitude stemming from fear of reprisal. I think it's also an argument from incredulity, to some extent. When we don't get the answers we want from scientists, it's very easy to just say they're being politically correct, or they aren't being earnest because they're afraid of losing their jobs.

It's much more difficult to demonstrate that these things actually happen, though.

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Tbh, to me what he says sounds way more accurate. Even though I don't know any gay person who randomly change his sexual orientation, I don't see why it wouldn't be possible.

We always learn and change (at least I hope for you). Our way of thinking changes as we age. So I don't see why it wouldn't be out of any possibility that even a sexual orientation is not fixed.

Plus, his statment is more in the form of a hypothesis while you seem like you state "facts". So for me, he gets the point because of that. Nothing annoys me more than when people start to sound arrogant and talk like if their OPINION/THEORY/BELIEF (or any form of position that can't be proven with science yet so unless you're ahead of every scientists, well....) are the ultimate truth.

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You're ignoring science and wildly overstating and blatantly misinterpreting the whole "sexual fluidity" business and taking old quotes out of context just to support your theory. To suggest that a person's sexual orientation is not fixed is both irresponsible, completely off-base, and even homophobic. "Sexual fluidity" may refer to bisexuality (still a bi person's orientation is fixed) or it may suggest that some -- very few -- but some people may become a bit bisexual or seek alternative sex partners for some reason in later life, but even then one has to take into account people becoming more conservative and closeted as they age. Again, "sexual fluidity" is one of the most mis-understood and overstated (and over-rated) concepts of all.

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There is no fixed sexuality. God is not up there going 'okay straight, gay, straight, straight, straight, straight, straight, straight, oh you can like both why not, straight, straight, straight, hmmm you can have a strange attraction to animals'

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Don't you think that Michael is Bisexual who had a strong preference and chose to be with a guy until something happened to him and he came across a gir and fell in love with her? Look at Ann Heche, there are other examples like Angeline Jolie and Lady gaga, these are women who admitted to like men and women, but chose one over the other. The best Example is Anne because she used to date Ellen and no is married to a man. So Gay people might identify themselves as gay because they have no attraction or didn't meet their "soul mate" of the opposite sex. They can then deny that they are gay and call themselves straight because this is what they are now, possibly even out of shame or denial or maybe because they really do love their opposite sex partner. It is possible and it does happen. It's all about who you are attracted more.

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That's just garbage. There is no proof, anywhere, that we are born with an inherent attraction to one or both sexes.

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https://www.newscientist.com/article/2155810-what-do-the-new-gay-genes-tell-us-about-sexual-orientation/

There’s some proof for you, there’s a whole lot more as well. Knowledge is power.

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It's not that hard to believe, IMO, it's just that there's a lot more skepticism and suspicion of someone who identified as gay then turning around and identifying as straight because self-closeting/repressing is a far more common phenomenon than realizing you're straight later in life. Because to a lot of people, bowing to familial/religious/societal pressure seems a heck of a lot easier a thing to do (depending on where you live in the world and how you were raised and who your friends and support structure are) than having the balls to be yourself and live however the fvck you feel like.

So, the thinking of many people will go, "Sure Michael could be straight, but what's usually the case when former gay guys turn straight?" And then they'll assume one of two things if they don't buy it -- that he was gay to begin with and is now completely repressing and/or conforming and/or lying, or that he was bi all along and just never figured that out and maybe finds "straight" a safer and more comfortable umbrella to live under.

But since no one on this planet is telepathic as far as I'm aware, none of us can read his thoughts and know the truth. Hopefully this film is an interesting, well-written and -acted, and I hope for A LOT of people out there, a thought-provoking watch. Hopefully critics from both sides don't sh!t all over it (unless it's badly made, in which case, too bad), because there appear to be a few conversations worth having that this movie could provoke.

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I agree with the OP, short, concise, and true. Turning to God can produce a powerful result as in this case. God made us "man and woman" and even went so far to differentiate in body chemistry and function. It's not that hard to believe, and like any sin, which I have many, can be repented and forgiven by a Loving God.

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You're a homophobic jerk. You need to get past your self-hatred.

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And a religious retard as well... Considering he's not trolling.

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Straight people don't "turn gay" nor do gay people turn straight. In tje past, and to some extent now, some gay people feel stigmatized and afraid to live as openly homosexual. In an attempt to fit in, they may try to pretend to be straight, even get married and have children. The strain of pretending may eventually cause them to begin living as they should have all along, therefore it appears that they have suddenly become gay.
There are also people who have fluid sexuality and are equally comfortable with a partner of their own or the opposite sex. Sexuality is varied.

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Probably because a lot of people "identifying as straight" are just either repressed by their surroundings or self doubts, or just waiting for someone to surprise them.

Whereas people identifying as gay, are more likely to later in life come to identify as bisexual or pansexual if they meet someone who makes them redefine their sexuality, than to just "change their mind" and narrow their definition further.


For every lie I unlearn I learn something new - Ani Difranco

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why can't ashes turn back into wood? Shows you that even gays know that they are degraded

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Why don't you try it out? Straight people don't turn gay, it's gay people who live the life of straight people that turn gay.

Don't get hurt kid. I'm not your daddy, I'll beat you senseless.

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I asked god this question and now iam licking hairy ass all day long. I do not recommnd straight people to ask god about sexuality, u will get trolled!

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Here's this pastor who was helping to push an anti-gay marriage law in his state, only to be outed for kicking it with a male prostitute whom he was banging and smoking meth with on the downlow--I remember when this was all over the news a decade ago:


https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ted_Haggard

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