MovieChat Forums > Cilla (2014) Discussion > NOW, I Can Learn About Her

NOW, I Can Learn About Her


I guess she must have been a bigger deal in the UK, than I thought.

We, [Americans], had such little exposure of her back in the 60's, I am looking forward to this.

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no, she wasn't a big deal in the UK either. There were far better female singers in the UK around that time. If you have never heard of any try Dusty Springfield and a bit later Petula Clark.

don't expect to learn the facts of what happened from this series. It's a biopic and not that accurate.

she became popular in the UK later in life by hosting TV programs such as Blind Date.

I'm not saying don't watch it. It's not bad :)

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I agree with your comments, althogh Petula Clark was before any of them (rather than a lot later). And one can't forget Sandie Shaw! All of them fine British singers with individual qualities.

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sorry, yes you are quite right. Petula Clark was French and German stuff in the 50s ! I was only thinking of Downtown onwards. sorry :)

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I grew up in the USA in the 60's and I beg to differ. I recall Cilla being a pretty big thing. When the British Invasion hit over here she was huge.

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She was more successful as a celebrity .That didn't make her a better singer.

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I think that Ed Sullivan didn't take to Cilla on his TV show in America. He misinterpreted her attempt at humour I believe. Whether that may have been the reason why Cilla didn't ever really take off in America we can't be sure. Her records sold well in the UK in the 1960s. She had two records at the top of the charts in 1964.

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I had to laugh at the part where Cilla is appearing on Ed Sullivan show and introduced her as being from "Wales in England". Did he really say that?

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Re Cilla on the Ed Sullivan show. I can remember Cilla being interviewed a few years ago about when she appeared on the Ed Sullivan show. I think I can vaguely remember that Ed Sullivan did actually say that Cilla was from Wales in England. But what I think I can more clearly remember is the feathery trim that Cilla wore on his show. She tried to make fun of it and send herself up a bit. But I believe Cilla said that Ed Sullivan didn't seem to like it when she spit away some of the feathers that got in her mouth. Although she did for comic effect, Ed Sullivan seemed to take exception to this bit of humour.

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Oh gosh what bias there is against Cilla. To that silly poster who stated that she wasn't that big of a deal in the UK and singers such as Dusty or Petula were far better is talking nonsense. It was not her later career as a television presenter on shows such as Blind Date and Surprise Surprise in the 80s, 90s and 2000s that made her a big star, as a matter of fact they followed because of her hugely successful singing career in the 60s and 70s. Cilla was the UKs most popular female recording artist in the 60s, and she even had her own smash hit weekly TV show titled 'Cilla' on air between 1968 and 1976. She had two consecutive No.1 singles at a time when to do so required an artist sold over 100,000 copies a day, and had a further 11 Top 10 hits and 19 Top 40 hits. Finally, and most importantly, Miss Black was officially the biggest selling British female singer of the entire 1960s, and at the time was the biggest selling British female singer ever.
If that makes her unimportant then goodness knows what people class as important.
She has led an extremely interesting life, from humble beginnings in poverty stricken Liverpool to nationally famous singer and then massively popular personality, and this ITV drama is doing her great justice thus far.

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And no doubt why there has been a series about Cilla and not Pet Clark, nor Dusty ! (or Sandie Shaw / Lulu )
Always liked Cilla on her variety shows, went to quite a few at Shepherds Bush TV Theatre and TV Centre in the 70's :-)

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I was born in 1955, and when I was 10 or so Cilla was extremely popular here in the UK (together with Lulu and Sandie Shaw). Petula Clark was much older (my Dad loved her!).

Dusty Springfield had the superior voice and she is the one I listen to nowadays, but Cilla's popularity in the mid-sixties cannot be downplayed.




Life isn't about waiting for the storm to pass, it's about learning to dance in the rain.

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I remember Cilla from her BBC tv days but she became a popular tv star especially in the 1980s and the singing increasingly took a back seat but at least she had a longer career than if she had just stuck to a music.

Its that man again!!

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I think the bias may actually be yours.

She had one very successful year with two very good songs. However, your comment about the relative merits of Dusty and Petula is rather like suggesting how wonderful Ken Dodd was because he outsold the Beatles in 1965. Do you know he was the third biggest seller of records in the 60s ?

as an example did you know that despite singing a single Alfie the film producers decided to have Millicent Martin on the UK film release and Cher for the US release ? Her musical career had hit something of the doldrums by 1967 which she blamed on Brian Epstein ! Funny when you consider how well he was doing with other artists.

So her move to TV was an attempt (successful) to revitalise her career that was not doing so well. So Surprise Surprise and Blind Date were her salvation.

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Just to show that it isn't only my 'bias' this is the write up on her box set Completely Cilla...

'Cilla Black wasn’t a natural singer when the Beatles’ manager, Brian Epstein, discovered her, and while she learned the ropes well enough and developed into a strong ballad singer, she was never a serious threat to Dusty Springfield in the talent department. But the pop world isn’t really about pure talent as much as it is a matter of timing, luck, having the right look, and maybe most of all, good material and good production. Black had all of those things going for her in the early ’60s, and since her producer throughout the decade was none other than George Martin, her signature body of work between 1963 and 1973, the period covered by this lavish box set (released in advance of Black’s 50th anniversary as a performer in 2013), holds up pretty well all these years later. Not bad for a onetime hatcheck girl at the Cavern Club — out of all Epstein’s Liverpool acts, which also included Gerry & the Pacemakers and Billy J. Kramer & the Dakotas, she trailed only the Beatles in total record sales.'

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Yes, I was aware of the huge success Ken Dodd had with 'Tears', but unlike Cilla he had one massive success; Cilla had two massive hits and 19 other hits, some reaching No. 2 and No. 3 in the charts. Post-1967, she still went onto have a successful recording career, of course releasing such hits as 'Step Inside Love' and 'Something Tells Me'. Even by 1980 she was still in the charts, such as with her album of that year 'Especially for You' being certified silver.

In regards to Alfie, yes Martin did sing it on the credits (because she was also the star of the film and also a singer), and Cher did release it in the US because Cilla was unknown there, but neither had the success Black had with it. It became her definitive song, and it was the public who went out and bought her version more so than any other.

Don't get me wrong, I adore Dusty Springfield and her talent, but talent wise I would never say either her or Black were better or worse, they were just so different it would be impossible to say. But in regards to success during the 60s, Cilla was factually superior. And in regards to the description from the Completely Cilla box set, I am aware of it and have always found it very insulting; it seems to me as though he who wrote it felt the need to give their personal opinion.

I am not being biased, but it bothers me when people for some reason try to underplay her talent and success.

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well you are clearly something of a fan :)

My point about Ken Dodd was to show how strange the 60s were. In fact, in the 60s he sold more records than she did and had several top ten hits. Post 67 is described as her purple period by various writers as her music career was in the doldrums.

In verified number of records sold she isn't even in the running in the tables only coming 409 in 'Best female vocalist' and the highest sales by a female singer is Madonna https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_best-selling_music_artists with 165 million verified sales. Aretha Franklin is bottom of the female tables with 24 million verified sales. Cilla Black doesnt appear on the tables at all.

So I guess we will have to agree to differ as your memory is of something I don't agree with.

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Don't want to be too argumentative here (), but you made two statements in your post of 21 September that I would take issue with:

no, she wasn't a big deal in the UK either

and
she became popular in the UK later in life by hosting TV programs such as Blind Date.

Cilla was a big deal here. I lived through it. She was never off the TV or radio. And she didn't need to wait until later in life to host a popular TV programme. She had her own BBC series at the age of 24.

I know popularity doesn't always equate with quality or talent - far from it -, but to say Cilla wasn't a big deal is patently untrue.









If there aren't any skeletons in a man's closet, there's probably a Bertha in his attic.

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After being the only female act in Brian Epstein's stable (you'll have heard of one or two of his other acts), The Queen of Scottie Road was the first female singer with her own Saturday night TV show and went on to feature, simultaneously, as host of the two most popular live Saturday night TV shows of her time, Blind Date (which EVEN I watched) and Surprise Surprise.

She was at the top of the profession for 30 years AND made the most graceful exit from it in history. She was a genius at knowing what she was good at, stuck to it and her UK fame eclipsed all the other UK 60's female artists.

She tried the States once but all her big UK hits were covers of Dionne Warwick and Nina Simone tracks and weren't released in the US, partly so that two versions of the same song wouldn't compete against each other at the same time in the same chart.

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"BUT DID YER AVVITTOFF?!"

Marlon, Claudia and Dimby the cats 1989-2005, 2007 and 2010.

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well supergran I note that you may not 'want to be too argumentative here' and then go on to give your own subjective opinions as if they were fact.

You may have 'lived through it' as did we all. However, that makes your own personal views as valid as my own as personal views.

I won't reiterate my own substantiated opinions which has been documented above.

Yes, she had a TV series early in her life and then she had her grey period without any real success. This is documented as a fact which is written about in various biographies on her career. She blames her manager for this failure. However, this manager was very successful with other stars without any grey periods.

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I'd imagine that when the OP made the innocuous comment "I guess she must have been a bigger deal in the UK, than I thought", he didn't expect an evaluation of her vocal prowess or an account of the peaks and troughs of her career. 

I'll shut up now and keep my unsubstantiated opinions to myself.




If there aren't any skeletons in a man's closet, there's probably a Bertha in his attic.

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If you're talking about Brian Epstein, yes, she did express disappointment that her singing career couldn't be sustained at 1965-66 levels but before dying in 1967, Epstein cushioned the blow by getting her a start in TV from which she never looked back.

For US reference, her TV audiences regularly topped 18 million.

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You tell 'im, la - I'm obviously being much too subjective. 

As a scouser (although far too young, of course!), what did you think of the 60s' Liverpool depiction, alfa? Though just a soft southerner, I enjoyed it very much.





If there aren't any skeletons in a man's closet, there's probably a Bertha in his attic.

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Lulu blew her away as far as voice and looks went. Cilla Black was lucky she was from Liverpool. In the right place at the right time.

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Apart from 'Shout', a Cilla-style American cover, and 'Boom Bang a Bang', name a couple of other memorable Lulu songs. Merely her Glasgow shadow.

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Apart from 'Shout', a Cilla-style American cover, and 'Boom Bang a Bang', name a couple of other memorable Lulu songs

Relight My Fire 

Are we looking for the Pointless answer?

I am ANYTHING but a pugnacious upstart

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No need. You found one. Bottom of page 2 search results before you can find a version with just her on it.

Cilla YMW = +- 800,000 views. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ttTZL8YPXls
Lulu RMF = +- 300 views https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0IPq_8HOib4

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Yes but Lulu's a babe.

Marlon, Claudia and Dimby the cats 1989-2005, 2007 and 2010.

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