MovieChat Forums > The Messengers (2015) Discussion > Another Religiously-Themed Show?

Another Religiously-Themed Show?


From the look of the promo, it seems to be a religiously-based programme. What a pity. It was great the 2014 "God-themed" shows have gone by the board, so I hope this one does too. SMH

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I'm not religious at all, but what's wrong with supernatural religiously-inspired stories? They're usually pretty cool. We have The Messengers, Constantine deals with it a lot, Damien (based on The Omen) is coming up soon, Preacher is coming, Supernatural deals with religious themes all the time, we have The Leftovers which touches on it, etc. If you have a problem with it, don't watch them. Some people happen to love and enjoy the crap out of em, I don't see what difference it makes to you?

--

"Betty's voice brought darkness to the land." - Amanda Tanen

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I don't watch any of those because such shows are just a regurgitation of themes regarding some sort of higher power, deity, or intellectual design. I instinctively roll my eyes when such movies or shows are advertised, and definitely, I do not watch them.

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Than you do not know what you are missing

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However you take the time to come on to IMDB message boards and comment about shows you haven't even seen, with some nonsense about "instinctively" turning away from them... LOL! Instinctively? Maybe because of some "learned" disdain for anything spiritual, maybe, but instinctively, I think not... From your comment it sounds like you don't really like anything on television, since everything from Game of Thrones to Critical and Vera to Vikings are just rehashed versions of shows that have come before... What DO you like? Or do you just instinctively hate everything you've never seen?

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Do you maintain that disdain for shows in the same vein but aren't christain? Greek mythology, norse mythology, druid & fae mythology, etc.

As long as it isn't proselytizing, what's the big deal? If I were a christian extremist, I'd be pissed about these shows - who wants their sincerely held beliefs and traditions to be exploited for the purposes of secular entertainment?

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I find it strange that people think they need to believe in order to watch. On the same line of thought you used, do they believe in Odin or Thor? Or maybe Superman. If not, does that mean they won't watch any shows about them?

I'm not religious but can watch a show about biblical superpowers just like I can watch Gandolf casting spells.

No Sitcoms! No Sports! No Reality!

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Totally agree with you, this crap is such a yawn. Like anyone with any common sense remotely believes in "the devil" and all that nonsense. I love horror films, sci-fi, heck I love every genre, but when I'm supposed to believe that some Abrahamic religion is "reality" I just roll my eyes and look for something with some imagination.

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I love every genre, but when I'm supposed to believe that some Abrahamic religion is "reality" I just roll my eyes and look for something with some imagination.


Huh? Do you even know what you just wrote.

You clearly are struggling within yourself and have not fully recovered from your upbringing.

If you did, you would understand the fiction and ride with it, not feeling like there's some hidden agenda out there to get you back into the Christian circle.

You're another one who is on an IMDB board for show you don't watch.


WHY IS THAT? WHY ARE YOU ON AN IMDB BOARD REGARDING A SHOW YOU WOULD NEVER WATCH?

Don't mean to shout, but I just don't get it.

What possesses you to go to an IMDB board to spout your opinion of what you think is crap that nobody really cares about?
(pun not intended but it works!)

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I am an Atheist and I don't think I've ever really believed. I've had debates with friends family and strangers and honestly religious thinking bothers the s*&t out of me.

but entertainment is entertainment. If an artist is good, if a song or tv show or movie is GOOD, and ENTERTAINING,if it's handled right religious themes can be some of the best. It's supernatural sci fi - similar to aliens and zombies, just ghosts or angels instead.

Priest was a great movie, The Omen, The Prophecy, many more I can't think of. Just because the subject matter is religious in nature doesn't mean it will be a bad watch. The fact that it's on CW on the other hand ;)

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Absolutely right. If you are truly an atheist you can enjoy these stories as fictional entertainment and not have to be militant with the idea of there is no supernatural.

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I think "good" is exactly the point. Of course in that vein good in itself is subjective. Just because you like it doesn't make it good, and just because you don't like it doesn't make it bad, right? For me, the mark is: do I care about the characters, do they hold my interest, do I care about what happens to them? Sadly my answer to every one of those questions as the season winds down remains, No. Does that mean the show is bad? No, of course not and I don't judge the people who enjoy the show. I know there are people out there who felt a great love for the show and are heartbroken that it's now over. For me it's not surprising but that's a whole other subject.

In response to some of the other comments you made...I don't mind religious themes in shows. There are numerous shows drawing from Christian themes that I enjoy. This one felt a little too heavy handed for my liking. I don't think it was intentional but it felt like the show had an agenda...and I get that from shows that stress the Christian message a little too hard. Supernatural lost me for the same reason around season 5. I'm not an atheist and I know it's the rules of the world the story is set it but...it makes me itchy for some reason.

Finally....if you like "The Omen" you should go find yourself a copy of "Good Omens" by Neil Gaiman and Terry Pratchett...I think you will find it quite amusing. :D

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i would love to see your rating public so i could shut ur mouth =)

http://trakt.tv/users/pedro

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Oh, I get it! You just watch the regurgitation of unoriginal themes like The Voice, American Idol. Or just the shallow, low brow, crude, unrefined, coarse, crass, tasteless and unintelligent regurgitation of red-neck themes like Duck Dynasty, Honey-Booboo? Or simply just the regurgitation of unsophistication of The Real Housewives and Kardashians? Or is it just the regurgitation of themes like SEX, VIOLENCE, CRUDENESS, CRUELTY, murder solved after 40 minutes, swearing every after second sentence.

Or is it just the regurgitation of themes found all over Hollywood that is boorish, uncouth, smutty, gross, vulgar, rude or uncouth? I am sure you don't roll your eyes but you keep them wide open!

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So you're just a close-minded bigot.

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But yet you watched this enough to come to the boards.

Or do you make it a habit to go on forums for shows you dislike or believe you would dislike even without viewing. Strange hobby you have there.

Gee, I think I'll go on a IMDB forum on some series I would never watch based on the premise and spout my distaste to advertise my superiority of never watching those types of shows.

That is so unique because such spouting is only done on every frickin series out there on IMDB.



Speaking of regurgitation ...

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The problem is, these shows are usually uninspired, regurgitated and unoriginal crap. Simply regurgitating old stories and themes is a waste. Especially themes and stories based on two to three thousand year old fairy tales whose ideas weren't all that good in the first place. These shows only take away money and time slots that could be dedicated to something original and worthwhile.

How many of these shows do you need anyway? I get people enjoy them, and by all means, I would never deny them that enjoyment but there's enough of them as it is.

My other issue is that they tend to reinforce childish ideas of good vs Evil (as a supernatural or innate force) and other ignorant and silly religious philosophy.

But as I said, enjoy away, I'd just wish the money and time expended on such shows were also expended on other more worthy shows that usually end up axed or not even seen to fruition due to the lack of understanding from the general TV watching public and execs.



Life's too short to make others shorter

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Your criticism applies to 90% of all shows out there. Things like moral ambiguity and evil as myopic righteousness are the rare exception in prime-time. I don't think a show based loosely on christian mythology is any more or less likely to be simplistic and pedestrian than any other prime-time show.

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I don't get the OP's problem. Constantine, Sleepy Hollow, Left Behind and other shows are essentially based on Christian mythology. As long as they don't get 'preachy', circa. Touch By An Angel, they're fine with me.

Television is big enough for all of us.

Happiness must be earned.

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The Messengers got quite preachy in ep. 2, though, and on top of that created an atheist caricature (the blond astronomer).

Fanboy : a person who does not think while watching.

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I think GoT is the most explicitly anti black & white in the matter of good vs evil show of all time. Not ever writer is George Martin though.

Fanboy : a person who does not think while watching.

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Oh, I get it! You just watch the "worthy" shows that are an "inspired and original" regurgitation of unoriginal themes like The Voice, American Idol. Or just the shallow, low brow, crude, unrefined, coarse, crass, tasteless and unintelligent regurgitation of red-neck themes like Duck Dynasty, Honey-Booboo? Or simply just the regurgitation of unsophistication of The Real Housewives and Kardashians? Or is it just the regurgitation of themes like SEX, VIOLENCE, CRUDENESS, CRUELTY, murder solved after 40 minutes, swearing every after second sentence.

Or is it just the regurgitation of stories and themes found all over Hollywood that is licentious, lascivious, depraved, boorish, uncouth, smutty, gross, vulgar, rude or uncouth?

Or is it just the overall dissoluteness, indulgence, lust and carousal of Bacchanalian fornication of Hollywood TV shows that is worth your time?

Anyone who shuns anything including religion, religious themes or the possibility of good vs. evil without keeping an open and vast mind is the ONE who lacks understanding and intelligence.

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sometimes people are just.. idiots =)
they see movies with robots that turn into cars, they see superheroes both in movies and shows, they see horror movies, they see shows with deamons, they see all kind of entertainment of stuff they know it´s not true or dont belive in. But a Good or angels themed show/movie?! "oh! wait a minute! God doesn't exist! stop doing this kind of shows! stop shoving god down our throat!" etc etc...

http://trakt.tv/users/pedro

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The Leftovers does not have you believe into anything to follow the show.

A show showing angels in that classic fashion needs you to believe that they are anything but sappy fairy tale nonsense. That might work for outrageously silly content like Constantine, which is based in fantasyland right from the beginning, but it immediatly breaks a show which starts as scifi. I can see how people who hoped for a well-written scifi show (something which got very rare these days) are put off by that.

Also adapting the whole christian part lets things become even more sour: Pure fantasy just asks for imagination, but when throwing the bible into the mix, it quickly gets to the blurry border to propaganda, which tends to trigger people's gag reflexes.

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I watched it for entertainment value and to be honest I rather enjoyed it, however, I do see your point, the Christian angle was so heavy handed and it was condescending, like when Koa (is it?) said she was a Buddhist 'God has a plan for you too'? I mean...wtf? I think I would have slapped her.

I can see why people are annoyed and switched off, the religiosity was really doing my head in, even though I love the whole Angel mythology and usually enjoy it. The Angel on Sleepy Hallow suckede also. *smh*


If you love Satan and are 100% proud of it copy this and make your signature!

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You pretty much summed up what bothered me about The Messengers. The heavy handedness was what lost me...especially with Koa and her being a Buddhist...it's heavy handed with the religious themes. Other shows draw on the themes without hitting you over the head with them...when it's done the way The Messengers did it starts to feel like they have an agenda which is what makes me itchy. If they fit the rules of the world around those themes without throwing them in your face then it becomes the mythology of the world of the show but with shows like this one it just feels condescending as you said.

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It only feels like it's an agenda if you're over sensitive or not comfortable with what you believe or don't believe.

When you become fully comfortable with what you believe or don't believe you will find stuff like this to not even phase you, not any more than if it was a story based on Greek or Roman Mythology.


It's all fiction. It's all playtime and entertainment.

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Hail Satan!!! :) :D

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Forgot Sleepy Hollow too T_T

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I don't mind religious themes in shows but for me this show was a little too heavy handed about it. There is a fine line between presenting it as the mythology of the show and the world it is set in and preaching to the audience...and for me this show felt preachy. Even when a Buddhist character is presented it is not a moment for a dialogue about different beliefs but rather, "sorry you had to find out that your entire system of belief is wrong".

I actually love Constantine and Sleepy Hollow. Hell, even Buffy had threads of Christianity running through it...I think for me what it is, is that when it starts feeling like the show has an underlying agenda, even if it isn't intentional, then the show loses me.

I don't judge people who like these kinds of shows...it just missed the mark with me. If I felt a connection with the characters it might have been different. I'm an emotional watcher, so it's my emotional connections that keep me watching even when the acting is bad or the story is kind of...whatever...but in this case I don't have an emotional connection with a single character and that's where the show lost me. *shrug*

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I think this is better than both Sleepy Hollow and Constantine. To me has more mystery and suspense as well as better acting ... at least better than Constantine.

Sleepy Hollow has gotten old and sometimes silly. Constantine is annoying because of Constantine. I really don't like that character nor the actor.

Even when a Buddhist character is presented it is not a moment for a dialogue about different beliefs but rather, "sorry you had to find out that your entire system of belief is wrong".


That is not at all what I took from the dialog between Joshua and the Asian woman when she asked him about being dead. I seen a far broader view of the godhead rather than she was wrong and Joshua was right.

The show does not promote reincarnation but it doesn't dismiss it either.

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We are all allowed our opinions, yes? :) I have long been a fan of Constantine. I liked the movie, and I like the show more because it is closer to the depiction of the character as he appears in the comics. I was glad to see Constantine appear much more like how I encountered him in the first of the Sandman comics. Of course I am an emotional watcher, so those connections make it easier for me to like a show, even if others think its bad.

For me, the Messengers has an interesting take on Revelations and the end of the world but it just failed to hold me. I ended up not caring about the characters and as an emotional watcher I *must* care about the characters, or at least one of them, or I quickly lose interest. I have to feel a connection to the story or the show or there is nothing that draws me back and convinces me to watch that show over others that might also interest me. *shrug*


I wasn't talking about the interaction with Koa and Joshua but between Koa and Rose the first time she is told she is one of them. When she commented that she was Buddhist it felt like Rose patted her on the head and said "that's okay...we'll fix that in time." It just grated on me. I like that they tried to integrate other systems of belief, we have an athiest and a Buddhist, but it felt like there was a goal to convert them. Of course that might just be my own sensitivity.


Also, just once, I would like to see the horsemen not be associated with evil...or at least be neutral. From my understanding of them, they were not evil any more than many of the ancient gods associated with death were embodiments of evil...but gods of death are also depicted as villains in many stories. I would have liked to see something different, a new take on it maybe...but that's just my opinion.

In the end, I don't want you to think I begrudge anyone their entertainment. The show didn't do anything for me and I got board. I didn't think it was that great but I have shows I watch myself that are little more than fluff when it comes down to it and other people think are stupid. I don't judge anyone who likes this show and I wouldn't look down on them. Just becuase I don't like it doesn't mean it's bad (of cousre just because other people like it doesn't mean it's good either...;) ) In the end I think it's subjective what is a good show or not. If you like it, great! Just don't ask me to watch it with you ;)

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It seems they have completely run out of ideas. Yet another half-baked idea using old themes with 'sexy people' (their words) Yawnnnnnnnnnnnnnn

Oh gravity, thou art a heartless bitch!

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Great insight! What DO you like?

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Probably a show inspired by SyFy's Dominion. Hope it is not a copycat.

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Don't worry, it could not be more different.

If anything it may be more similar to Constantine (the series).


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It's a cross between Constantine and Sleepy Hollow, with a little bit of Dig in it.

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Dominion sucked, it's nothing like that... At least you aren't hating it before you've ever seen it, like so many foolish others...LOL!

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I thought Dominion was better than this. A lot better.

Because it's not constantly peddling Christianity and good vs evil like this show seems to be.


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WHAT?

Are you saying you don't go on to the IMDB boards of a show you have no intention of ever watching?


Neither do I. What's wrong with us?

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And from the first episode, not even a halfway good one.

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As an atheist, I enjoy religious-based fiction, because to me it's all fiction anyway. 'The greatest story ever told' really is just that, a story. So why not play with that story and tweak it with a modern interpretation?

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'The greatest story ever told' really is just that, a story. So why not play with that story and tweak it with a modern interpretation?

I'm down with that, even though I'm not an atheist because, after decades of studying the history of Catholicism, I've come to the conclusion that
it's all fiction anyway
.

Although I'm not inclined toward most religious or supernatural shows because they are so poorly done, I actually liked this first episode & put it on my watch list. And as long as no zombies or vampires show up, I'll give it some time to develop.

The show, Touch, http://www.imdb.com/title/tt1821681/?ref_=nm_flmg_act_8, to me, was really fascinating, and, although they did not get into religious topics, they explored the phenomenon of synchronicity, dovetailed into mathematics, Einstein's theory of relativity and the time-space continuum, quantum theory, etc., I personally, would love to see those concepts combined with religious mysticism. Alas, I am not holding my breath... I thought that Touch was an absolutely brilliant show, even with Kiefer Sutherland's limited acting range. The fact that it was canceled after it's 2nd season was regrettable.


God made man because he loves stories. —Rabbi Nachman

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Touch was effectively cancelled after its first season. They ripped out all the cool stuff and turned it into a dull actioner for the second season. I watched it, naively hoping that some of that original genius would come back, but it never did.

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Yeah, that was a let down.

I think of that show now and the first thing that comes to mind is hearing Keifer screaming "Jake! JAKE! JAAAAAAKE!"

Every frickin episode "JAKE! "JAAAAKE!" and Keifer running down some street somewhere all sweaty. He's still hot though.

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[quote
The show, Touch, http://www.imdb.com/title/tt1821681/?ref_=nm_flmg_act_8, to me, was really fascinating, and, although they did not get into religious topics, they explored the phenomenon of synchronicity, dovetailed into mathematics, Einstein's theory of relativity and the time-space continuum, quantum theory, etc., I personally, would love to see those concepts combined with religious mysticism. Alas, I am not holding my breath... I thought that Touch was an absolutely brilliant show, even with Kiefer Sutherland's limited acting range. The fact that it was canceled after it's 2nd season was regrettable.
][/quote]

I cannot agree more. I'd love to see a series blend mysticism (from multiple religions) with science. Especially quantum physics, which I think shows us the world is a lot more "magical" and insane than we ever thought (in a scientific sense). Maybe one day.

--

"Betty's voice brought darkness to the land." - Amanda Tanen

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I'd love to see a series blend mysticism (from multiple religions) with science. Especially quantum physics, which I think shows us the world is a lot more "magical" and insane than we ever thought (in a scientific sense). Maybe one day.


We should become friends on IMDB so if one comes along, we can tell the other...

At times, Fringe would do this, and Continuum but they were mixing it with detective/mystery genre, and eventually, I lost interest. Another show, Believe http://www.imdb.com/title/tt2592094/?ref_=fn_al_tt_2, attempted this but was cancelled after one season. If you ever want to watch the episodes, You can frind them at http://www.tvmuse.com/tv-shows/Believe_35359/


God made man because he loves stories. —Rabbi Nachman

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amen XD And if you can find it, if your into mysticism and quantum physics you should see if you can find yourself a copy of "Path of Souls". It was really interesting.

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as a Christian I enjoy shows that have different takes on it.im not a fanatic and will not call people who don't believe names.i am however allways surprised at how many self proclaimed atheist flock to these sites to bash Christians,not all religious groups just Christians.and as for us being stupid and duped ,we are in good company,the president,qe2,mlk,jfk,newton, and billions of others through out history, and yes Christ did exist.it is a question of faith if you believe he is the son of god or not,as all religions even atheisem is based on faith.atheist have their zelots,fanatics,preachers,followers,converts and bibles,all they need is to be tax exempt which they are working on and they will be a card carrying religion.i have watched many series and movies based on atheist views and have enjoyed some of them, as long as they are not to preachy.i choose not to be narrow minded,and am secure in my faith as to not be afraid of what others believe.so I guess what im saying is watch this if you enjoy it based on its merits,if not don't watch,and don't be so ready to judge others lest you be judged.

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I'm with you. I am a woman of faith, but I'm not bible thumper, and I despise "religion" because the word these days is way too broad. I can't help but chuckle as you point out about atheists and those who seem driven to dispute the existence of God.....if God doesn't exist, then why get your shorts all in a wad over "seemingly" religious shows or anything else entertainment or otherwise?
This show is "so" far off scripturally it's dumb! Tonights episode was the first time I actually gave it a go, and I can't stand the show.
Not because it's off base. It lacks anything entertaining. I'm more upset over preempting Grimm than The Messengers due to meterologists who feel they need to give the public a crash course in tornadoes. (just tell me where it's at and when it'll get here for Pete's sake!)
Poor acting, poor storyline......who the heck writes this stuff? Too bad the writer doesn't have those gifts he writes about in the show!

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The Atheist who do that are insecure with their non belief and perhaps seeking answers they actually hope you have. They want to be convinced or are angry with a God they profess they don't believe in.

I'm an atheist comfortable in my skin and open with who I am. I don't get into debates or verbal persecutions. I used to be that way and that was before I really admitted to myself and embraced the fact that I am an atheist and it's okay.

There is absolutely nothing wrong with being an atheist and being peaceful and comfortable with that.

I have friends and family always saying they are praying for me. I say good and encourage the positive energy put forth.

There are no good excuses for bad manners.

Please don't lump all of us atheist together unless you like being lumped together with fanatics or Salem witch hunters or the late Spanish inquisitors.

Seems I recall a bible verse something like "do not judge lest you too be judged".

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I've always found that the bible makes for good fiction.

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Agreed.

I'm an atheist-agnostic who was raised Catholic, and even though I was never able to have faith in the religion, I always enjoyed the stories/mythology behind the religion.

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A pity for who? Did they not show enough promise of having plenty of the token gay dudes or the macho-babe lesbians to thrill you? Dude, the next bus leaving this country is in half an hour. You can just make it if you hurry.

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I'm not christian, but I have no problem with christian mythology/supernatural-based shows if they are entertaining and original and can keep me entertained. I enjoy "Supernatural", for example. That said, this show so far is just bland and there's too much about it that doesn't make sense. The writing seems mediocre at best. I've found with too many CW shows that the writing seems to be done by people who lack life experience as all of their characters (even the 'adults') tend to act like impulsive teenagers.

Furthermore, it really bothered me how no one seems to own a cell phone in this universe. Don't writers know that people carry cell phones nowadays? I guess having a cell phone made their story inconvenient so instead of fixing it, they just magically decided 'no cell phones'.

That's just careless writing.

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The teen kid has a smart phone and Joshua has a cell phone.

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I wrote my message after seeing only the pilot -- that's when I quite watching. But if what you are saying is true, that's even a worse sign of writing. It means that they acknowledge that cell phones exist, but they only exist when it is convenient to the plot for a character to have them. I gave up on the show after the pilot but I remember that what I was referring to were the scientists apparently not being able to talk to anyone.

If you are getting something out of the show, good for you. At least someone is.

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