MovieChat Forums > Banished (2015) Discussion > The BBC should be ashamed

The BBC should be ashamed


This is the most absurd show the BBC has ever made. They have made a TV show where British taxpayers are paying, so that they can view a show where the heroes are the CONVICTS and the awful inhumane people are the British Army and the British Administration.

Now this would be acceptably if what they showed was even VAGUELY historically accurate, but it isn't it is all nonsense. It took me four attempts just to get through the first episode it was so bad. At no point did the army use the female convicts as sex slaves as shown.

Only in the UK could a national broadcaster produce a show with the publics money that belittles our own history. No other country on the planet does this.

What is worse is that there are already plenty of countries who will happily do it for us. America for instance regularly produces incredibly one sided American Rebellion dramas such as TURN or The Patriot where the British are shown to be 100% bad and the Americans 100% good. Even to the laughable extent in The Patriot where the British commit a war crime actually committed by the Nazi's and the American Hero uses free black slaves! The point is we have plenty of other nations who will produce historically inaccurate dramas where WE are the baddies, the BBC should not be spending money to duplicate such nonsense and instead should be producing historical dramas that show the huge benefit that this small island has done for the world.

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[deleted]

It took me four attempts just to get through the first episode it was so bad.


Did you wear sackcloth and ashes as you went through this masochistic trial?
Four attempts!? Really?

I might give something a second chance but...

Are you really this offended by fiction? You don't like those nasty-pasty foreigners picking on poor, ickle, fluffy Britain?

Get a grip!

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*Sigh*, why is it so hard for people to understand that a tv documentary or docu-drama does not equal a tv period drama?

There are plenty of excellent non-fiction books about this fascinating period in time. Surely there are documentaries too.

Banished is a period drama, i.e., it aims to entertain and not to educate!

You have to accept that non-documentary tv shows are about entertainment, medical shows are full of inaccuracies, science fiction shows devoid of (correct) science and period dramas are not historically correct.

So what? Be entertained or watch something different.

I hugely enjoy "Banished" despite some flaws in casting, writing and logic.












#JeSuisCharlie

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If you check your history u will find that the British where the oppressers they colonised half the known world and ruled with an iron fist it well documented

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Andorra
Belarus
Bolivia
Burundi
Central African Republic
Chad
Congo, Republic of
Guatemala
Ivory Coast
Kyrgyzstan
Liechtenstein
Luxembourg
Mali
Marshall Islands
Monaco
Mongolia
Paraguay
Sao Tome and Principe
Sweden
Tajikistan
Uzbekistan
Vatican City

These are the only places on earth, the British haven't invaded either through force, the threat of force, negotiation or payment.

I see this as a 'bucket list'! Mwaahahaha!

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why would you try FOUR times to watch something lol it's fiction, not a documentary. Stop watching it, immediately, for your sanity!

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So you are trying to say that the vast British Empire was formed with showering flowers and candy?

Every nation is in denial of its dark past except maybe the the Germans. That too only cuz they have been defeated, occupied and brainwashed ever since. But a hundred years down the road I have no doubt that they will say the same thing. Just you wait for a depression or two.

Ask any Russian what they think about USSR. Pretty much the same answer. "Good ol' days". Even Genghis Khan is national hero for the Mongols.


Let me paste few quotes from one of your most celebrated heroes:


I do not agree that the dog in a manger has the final right to the manger even though he may have lain there for a very long time. I do not admit that right. I do not admit for instance, that a great wrong has been done to the Red Indians of America or the black people of Australia. I do not admit that a wrong has been done to these people by the fact that a stronger race, a higher-grade race, a more worldly wise race to put it that way, has come in and taken their place.

Churchill addressing the Peel Commission (1937) on why Britain is justified in deciding the fate of Palestine



I am strongly in favour of using poisoned gas against uncivilised tribes…[It] would spread a lively terror."

-Churchill on how Britain should deal with the Iraqi Kurds against British rule -1920


I hate Indians. They are a beastly people with a beastly religion.

-Entry dated to September 1942 on a conversation held with Churchill in Leo Amery : Diaries


On the subject of India, Winston is not quite sane... I didn't see much difference between his outlook and Hitler's

-Leo Amery, British Secretary of State for India


Not much different mentality than Hitler's.

So my advice to you is that if you want to be taken seriously, stop repeating the 'benevolent British Empire' BS. it removes any credibility in your other statements.

There are too many nations today who celebrate their independence day each year from that empire. Volumes and volumes of text books written on the subject that are taught in schools and colleges. BBC isn't going to change their minds with few dramas.

It will be only seen as a positive sign that you have left your colonial past behind. Otherwise you sound just like a Russian who insists that USSR was a force for good and Stalin was the greatest Russian that ever lived (2008 vote: http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/europe/7802485.stm was actually first before the producer made an appeal lol)

Not much different than Churchill voted greatest Briton: http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/entertainment/2509465.stm

At least Stalin wasn't a racist prick.























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I quite like the British being the 'bad guy'! We're really good at it!

Unlike the OP, I am fully aware of the evils the British have perpetrated across the planet. There are many dark pages in British history and the pages on Ireland, our nearest kin, are some of the darkest - something to be ashamed of.

We are also, historically, a very inventive people. The industrial Revolution and the modern world was forged on these little islands - something to be proud of.

Or, perhaps, we should feel neither shame nor pride because we had ferk all to do with any of it!



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If Nazi Germany had won, they too would have said the same things. Nazi Germany was doing enormous strives in industry/technology/science etc in very short period of time. Both Soviet Union's (Operation Osoaviakhim) and American Space programe (Operation Paperclip) were build by Nazis. Wernher von Braun wasn't just German scientist in Nazi Germany but a Nazi himself. In other words Nazis were actually responsible for putting 'man on the moon'.

So technology and science is going to advance one way or the other. Which ever nation is dominant is most likely to advance the collective knowledge of human beings in that era.

Sure you can be proud of your nation's achievements. But that doesn't excuse it for racism, discrimination, war crimes, crimes against humanity etc.

I know the 'bad guy' good feeling. Its the same feeling when anyone is talking about Genghis Khan. Yes he murdered millions of people but man he was bad ass.

As long as you aren't on the receiving side, power is a good feeling.

Which is the reason Hitler & Nazi Germany is perceived quite differently in former colonial countries like India. He kicked so much ass of their colonial masters that they could no longer hold on to their colonies around the world.

The worst were the French, who even after being occupied for 4 years, went straight back to colonialism & killed millions more before being forced out (Algeria, Vietnam).

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Is that in response to what I said?

Sure you can be proud of your nation's achievements. But that doesn't excuse it for racism, discrimination, war crimes, crimes against humanity etc.


Which part of me recognising the 'dark pages in British history', flew over your head?

It amuses me that the British are often portrayed as villainous in films - The English, especially - and not even in a historical context! But, it has to be said, British actors play pretty good villains!

It amuses me that people are angry with the British people for something the people of this generation, had absolutely nothing to do with! It amuses me that some British people are proud of achievements that happened before they were born!

You are pouring out righteous indignation at what I wrote and you seem not to have even read it! You amuse me too!

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What amuses me is that you want to take credit for their achievements but distance yourself from their atrocities.

The reason I mentioned that is cuz even though you recognize the dark side, you still need to brag about the achievements as if that somehow neutralizes the crimes. Even though everyone knows that already and that wasn't the topic of discussion.

If you can't understand what wrong with it, then imagine if the Germans kept bringing up the achievements of the Nazi Germany whenever there was a talk about their atrocities and racism.

Because thats what the English do.

Note: The reason I keep bringing up Nazis is cuz their atrocities & racism seem to be the the only ones that the English find horrific/disgusting. :)

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What amuses me is that you want to take credit for their achievements but distance yourself from their atrocities.

You still haven't read what I said, I see.

The reason I mentioned that is cuz even though you recognize the dark side, you still need to brag about the achievements as if that somehow neutralizes the crimes.


"Or, perhaps, we should feel neither shame nor pride because we had ferk all to do with any of it! "

I distanced myself from both.

If you can't understand what wrong with it, then imagine if the Germans kept bringing up the achievements of the Nazi Germany whenever there was a talk about their atrocities and racism.

Because thats what the English do.


This English person didn't. But hey, don't let that stand in the way of yet another rant!

You have serious issues, not least of which is an inability to read. You amuse me!

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"Or, perhaps, we should feel neither shame nor pride because we had ferk all to do with any of it! "

I distanced myself from both.


The UK economy to this very day mostly comes from the atrocity you're great great grandparents committed. Most of the rich people of the UK are rich because 7 generations ago someone in their family did something that was unethical.

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True. So, what exactly has that got to do with me?

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Where are you from then?

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[deleted]

Stalin was a racist I don't know how you can reach an opinion that he was a prick or churchill was takes one to know one though.

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Most of you clearly know nothing of history. All these places Britain apparently ruled with an iron fist and colonised a) still have majority indigenous populations unlike say America which wiped out theres (the only white colonies were in areas very sparsely populated, Australia mostly desert, Canada mostly snowy, NZ so far off the edge of the world the population levels are and never have been that high compared to land max) b) were ruled before the British got there by despotic tyrants for whom the rule of law was their personal whim. The rule by the British was no worse than what went before and in many cases better. India the prime example was ruled by the British for to centuries. Before they got there it had been ruled for 100s of years by tyrants and warlords. Hindus, Muslims, Sikhs often ruling over peoples of different races, castes and creeds. There was no law no order but the whims of the tyrant similar to Britain in centuries ago. When Britain left, it left millions of miles of railways, schools, damn, roads, parliamentary procedure, the court system. Its greatest sons who fought for independence, Gandhi, Jinnah, Nehru, all of them were western educated in the UK, all of them went to the Inns of Court School of Law and were called to the Bar as barristers here in the UK. In fact Gandhi was shocked when he went to South Africa and experienced the racism there because he had not been treated like that when in the UK and Nehru was a public school boy. He went to Harrow, one of the most elite and prestigious schools in the Country - Winston Churchills school. Let us not forget the US didn't even integrate its own black citizens until almost a century after these men were given the benefit of a British education at some of the most prestigious schools and universities in the land.

Of course the British and their Empire was not all wonderful and great, there were dark episodes and bad people, it took place during a time where racisms by all nations was epidemic but it was no where near being evil. In fact in no way can the current American Empire maintain any sort of moral superiority over it.

All of this does not address my original point.

We have a State broadcasters paid for by British tax payers making a drama that is historically inaccurate as admitted by the producers making the British administration look bad and the convicts (people convicted of CRIMES) look good, except for one bad blacksmith. That is not acceptable. Lots of other countries will do that for us.

If the British state broadcaster is going to pump millions into making a historical drama they damn well best not deliberately making their own people, look WORSE than they were. Every other country on the planet when they produce drama make their countries look much BETTER than they were.

Finally the reason why most of you think the British Empire was so evil, is because your heads have been filled through either British marxist history taught since the second world war, if you are foreign, probably nationalist history of your native country or though TV DRAMAS MADE WHERE THE ENGLISH ARE THE BADDIES.

As someone who did both a undergrad degree, and post grad degree at one of the best universities in the world on British Imperial History, oh and also i am not white i am mixed race descendant of both the "oppressors" and the "oppressed" then i know a lot more than most of you on here seem too and it remains absolutely unacceptable for the BBC to produce such drivel.

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Let me assure you that I don't have any animosity against the English or even the British Empire. I think they ruled with one of the most well disciplined army in history. They also established law & order to every part of the world which they occupied (opposite to what US does today). That the colonial subjects were free to study in their most prestigious Universities (in later part of the Empire at least) and That the richest man on earth in the British Empire in early 20th century was not even an English/Scottish but an Indian. etc etc


You on other hand have no clue about what harms the British Empire did to its colonies. For example India was one of the richest countries on earth before the British came. It was India Columbus was looking for when he 'stumble' into the 'the world'. Which is the reason he called them Indians. A name that stuck. The most beautiful buddings in India, are pre British Raj. India wasn't some backward country when the British came. It was one when the British left. Even in military tech ( the main reason of colonism success elsewhere) Indians weren't behind. Tipu Sultan's army (the last threat to East India Company) had rockets that the British copied from later. India was well developed and rich region. She was just going through one of its fractious phase when the British came and took advantage off.

Now India has been ruled by foreigners before. The Mughals themselves came as foreigners. The difference is, they made India their home. They developed India as their home. India's future was their future.

The British ruled India as a colony. They stripped it of all its resources for England. British rule was for the interest of England, not India. India was the backbone of the British Empire both in resources and manpower. Yes they developed raid loads, bridges, and formed governance. But all of that was in the service for 'King & country'. Where the 'country' meant only England not any of its colonies.

Yes the British still treated India better than say the Americans treated native Americans. But there is a reason. Americans actually wanted to make it their home. They weren't stripping the Americas for their homeland in Europe. They wanted to settle in the land 'Red Indians' were occupying. Which lead to the clash and ethnic cleansing. While England had no benefit in wiping out the population of India nor She was capable of doing so.

Under the British Raj India did go through various famines. Which is so absurd cuz India was known throughout the world as one of the most resourceful regions. The worst famine was the Bengals famines. Probably the first major famine in Indian history was created when the British came (in form of East India Company) 1770. Ironically the last famine was when the British were about to leave (1943). Nice welcoming and parting gifts by the British :)

Lets not forget the 'Opium wars'. The British forced Indians to grow poppies instead of crops, then literally forced the Chinese to smoke it at gun point. They were actually worse than any drug cartels today. (The cartels don't actual force people to become drug addicts.)

The first time I heard about it was in a Bruce Lee movie when the Japanese are taunting the Chinese as the 'sick man of Asia'. At the time I had no clue what was that about. :P

Well if I keep going, I will end up writing a book.

Case in point, stop kidding with yourself with the 'benevolent British Empire' propaganda. When people keep telling others lies enough times they start believing it themselves. Accept your dark history like the Americans have without excusing it with anything.

Today in America & even in Australia, the native people and blacks are respected and even apologized to. Even has a term associated with it 'The white guilt'.

While in England, immigrants, who are largely the descendants of the the colonies of the British Empire, are still considered outsiders and punching bags whenever the economy isn't doing well. They will never be considered equals. Forget about apology, you are still proud of your history as colonial masters.

As I said, no different then those Russians who are proud of good ol' days of USSR. Understandable when the debate is about 'powerful vast empires'. Not excusable when its about being nice caring people.











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any chance of running this through spellcheck so that it might be readable?

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Thank you puings...my though exactly. Nothing but cut and paste drivel with nonsensical sentences.

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If you were my history teacher, I would have paid attention in class. Great posts all.

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Nice of you to clarify where your misplaced rage stems from (India). You don't have any anonymity? I can only imagine you mean animosity. No need to thank me.

India *wasn't* even a country when the UK took over.
India was *far* behind in military technology, this is utterly obvious.

Your viewpoint is hopelessly at odds with the facts of the matter, I suggest you get some education. At least that'll be easier for you speaking English than it would be in some other language, eh?

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I am not an Indian. So your pathetic attempt to find my weakness based on my nationality is utter failure.

Rest of your post is as pathetic and pointless. No need to reply.


PS: The anonymity was a auto correction by spell-check in trying to fix my 'animosity' spelling. If you had any sense in your brain, you would have figured it out. But as usual the little racist prick in you couldn't hold himself.

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You're not Indian? So why do you care so much about India? I'm far from convinced. Say where you *are* from if you want me to believe you.

The rest of my post was poking holes in your feeble effort, so only only pathetic and pointless if you are yourself. It's surprising that you'd be so honest in that regard.

Auto-correction? So you typed animosity *wrongly*, your device 'corrected' it to 'anonymity' and you accepted it. That was the decision you made. I think that's indicative of your intellectual level.

You know nothing about me. Nobody has ever called me racist on these boards before and I've been in plenty of arguments. You're currently #3 on my list of the most worthless people I've come across on here, care to try for #1?

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Cuz the backbone of the British Empire was India you buffoon. You want me to talk about British Empire in South America? Pick a history book sometime.

Sorry, but you are out of your league here. No one cares about your lists. Go watch football and let the adults do the talking.

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That's barely a reply at all. 1/10 for effort. Famously, the Sun never set on the British Empire. India was one part of it, that's all.

If you can't be bothered to attempt to counter my points I can't be bothered to talk to you. Goodbye.

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Famously, the Sun never set on the British Empire. India was one part of it, that's all.


Before India, they got their ass kicked by a rebel militia and has been their bitch ever since they lost India.

I can play this game as well, so lets not go there.

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Sorry, that's too cretinous. I can't ignore stupidity like that. You need to be educated. One last post then. No doubt you're referring to:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/American_Revolutionary_War

Please look at the 'Belligerents' section (are you still with me?)

You may note that France, Spain, The Netherlands and Mysore all appear. You may also note that the strength that these countries brought to bear was greater than that of the United States. The freedom of the USA was paid for by the aforementioned countries. So few Americans understand this. I hope this has all been enlightening for you.

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Huh? Is there any strategic war involving world power that is 1v1? To be a 'world power' any war you fight will involve multiple enemies. Did the Napoleon France or Nazi Germany lost 1v1 battles? (And they were fighting combined world powers, not civilian militias).

How do you think the British Empire was formed? 'Divide and Rule' was the very core of British Imperial policies.

Fact of matter remains, they were humiliated in the New world by a militia. Keep making excuses.

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Today in America & even in Australia, the native people and blacks are respected and even apologized to. Even has a term associated with it 'The white guilt'.

While in England, immigrants, who are largely the descendants of the the colonies of the British Empire, are still considered outsiders and punching bags whenever the economy isn't doing well. They will never be considered equals. Forget about apology, you are still proud of your history as colonial masters.


You should have just kept to your historical points. I come from the position of having a American mother and English father and thus have spent 20 years living in England and 15 years or so in the US, so I'd consider myself having a bit of first hand experience of both countries.

You seem to know a bit about history, surely you must have heard of the saying 'post-colonial guilt' yes Britain has it's own version of it, just for those that feel that way.


I don't see in Britain Asians getting pulled up left right and center by the police for no reason, getting harassed and convicted to huge sentences for relative minor crimes and a huge Asian prison population per capita.
In the US I see areas where predominantly black populations are devastated by crime and drugs. If the US respects the black population so much, especially compared to British Asians, why are such a large percentage of them living in poverty and jail, while the complete opposite happens in Britain with the Asian community, especially if what you say is correct. Places like Detroit(83% black), St. Louis(48%) black), Memphis (63% black) as you can see all have majority black communities & are like war zones in places and some of the worst Cities to live in the US.

By the way, who are you to pass out grand sweeping statements as fact, that's nothing more than your opinion such as, 'you are still proud of your history as colonial masters. What have you taken a poll on the subject and that British Asians 'are still considered outsiders and punching bags whenever the economy isn't doing well. They will never be considered equals' seriously you haven't a clue what you're talking about as far as this subject and seems nothing more than some cheap shot at the English. While on the other hand you sit there seriously trying to big up race relations in the US. Do you really think the majority of the black Americans that live in the the Cities mentioned give a monkey about a token apology just because conditions are a little better than 40/50 years ago and in some places worse.

I'm not sure I've heard anyone blame the British Asian community for any Economic problem.Even the biggest numpty knows what caused the last one but I'm sure if you look hard enough you can find anything on the internet to fit your narrative.

By the way the immigration problem that is in the news, is about the amount of illegal immigrants getting into the Country and also because Britain is in the EU, the vast number of Eastern Europeans that have arrived, were they part of the British Empire?

The majority of people are more concerned about things like, Britain’s population has grown twice as fast as the rest of Europe for the last decade – gaining as many people in that time as in the entire previous generation and The Office for National Statistics also said the population would rise by 9.6  million by 2037, reaching 73.3 million people. For a Country already bursting at the seams (Britain is 2.5 times smaller than France but now has overtaken their population) with a already stressed Social services,Schools and NHS system. Not some racial blame game.

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By three to one, British people think the British Empire is something to be proud of
https://yougov.co.uk/news/2014/07/26/britain-proud-its-empire/


Now I can write another essay, but I think thats enough for now.

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You said: "They also established law & order to every part of the world which they occupied (opposite to what US does today). That the colonial subjects were free to study in their most prestigious Universities (in later part of the Empire at least)"


VERY amusing. For someone who pretends to be so authoritative of history, you certainly do pick and choose to show your bias. Why don't all you "historian" American haters return all the money we U.S. taxpayers hand out to the world? Go back to school and pay attention this time.

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We were b@stards! Wherever the children of these little islands went, misery was sure to follow for the indigenous population, wherever they were found, as sure as night followed day: Africa, The Americas, China, Australia, India and all other points of the compass.

Wherever there is trouble in the world, we were a party to it, somewhere along the line!

I had men and horses, arms and wealth. What wonder if I parted with them reluctantly? If you Romans choose to lord it over the world, does it follow that the world is to accept slavery?
Caractacus


Might is not right. Empires come and go and they all bring misery. Should we, as Britons, rejoice that Caractacus was defeated? Or, that Boudicca was too, because it brought 'civilisation' to our shores? Neither then, should others rejoice that Britain, in its turn, 'civilised' the world.

Now, please stop embarrassing yourself and your fellow Britons.

PS Serenity, I'm pleased you're focusing on the correct target this time. No apology necessary - crack on!


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The ancient Roman Empire would have brought a lot of advanced infrastructure and civilisation to British shores.

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The British Empire outlawed the practice of Sati in India. How can that be a bad thing?

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I never said that nothing good come out of it. Even the mongols did a lot of good things in regions they ruled.

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Now Now be good else ye be transported to Ulan Bator without your supper. I read a very impressive book that I bought while visting cousins in Australia which dealt with early post-Tasmanian and Cookian history and the accounts were every bit as savage a those depicted in this excellent BBC show. If the Britrh taxpayers -I also contribute annually to HMRC- resent subsidising such shows then stop behaving like sheep and refuse to pay for a TV licence.As most of the BBC TV series are AAA the old lady of Bush House should be able to stand on her own feet.

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As I read through your posts, I was reminded of the uproar when "In The Name Of The Father " was released. Several Tory MP's stood up in Parliament to protest about this film giving succour to terrorists. The fact that the film was a about one of the worst miscarriages of justice in British history and all eleven people (including a 14 year-old schoolboy sentenced to seven years) had no terrorist links, and were totally innocent seemed to have been lost on these MP's.

Twenty years on, and we can still find that Little Englander mentality alive and well.

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