MovieChat Forums > Sicario (2015) Discussion > Kate was vital to the story

Kate was vital to the story


I don't understand why so many complaints about Kate.

Without her presence Sicario would be a flat revenge thriller without any other perspective, than Alejandro + Brolin.
This is actually something that I'm concerned about the sequel. Kate's relationship with Alejandro and the overall conflict of what is right and what is wrong made this movie stand out.

Not to mention I thought it was super cool to witness the "side character" taking over the movie and becoming the protagonist aka the real "Sicario".

I haven't seen that in movies lately.

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It's already confirmed Emily Blunt can't do the sequel she signed on for another movie already.

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She totally doesn't need to be in the sequel.

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The screenwriter said with the initial draft of soldado Emily and Josh we're suppose to reprise their roles.

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I actually hope it's going to be a prequel since it has much more to tell

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" the overall conflict of what is right and what is wrong made this movie stand out. "

my own experience is that there was very little, to none at all, moral conflict throughout the movie. i don't recall any time that i was against, or angry, or disagreed with josh brolin and the team, on a moral level. kate didn't even know what was going on for most of the movie so neither she or people rooting for her could have a chance to be conflicted to begin with.

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my own experience is that there was very little, to none at all, moral conflict throughout the movie. i don't recall any time that i was against, or angry, or disagreed with josh brolin and the team, on a moral level. kate didn't even know what was going on for most of the movie so neither she or people rooting for her could have a chance to be conflicted to begin with.

Then the writer, director, and actors all failed miserably because they clearly wanted the audience to feel conflicted, particularly over the illegal blurring of lines between CIA and FBI. That's true even if you ultimately agree with what Brolin and Co. were doing.

TV: http://ihatemydvr.blogspot.com
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The complaints about Kate are justified. She was way too weak, passive, and ignorant for her background. She had been leading a FBI kidnapping task force in Phoenix for 3 years when we're first introduced to her in the film, and yet we watch the story unfold through her eyes and she never knows what the hell is going on and acts like it's her first day as a cop. Again, 3 years leading a FBI kidnapping task force in the kidnapping capital of the United States where most of the kidnappings are cartel-related and she acts like she doesn't know anything about the cartels and how they operate and how the US battles them. If she's leading a kidnapping task force in Phoenix, then she would know the cartels inside and out. It would be her job to know that sh!t because that's who she would be dealing with in most of her cases.

Now, if Kate was leading a kidnapping task force in say Detroit or Chicago, then it would make sense for her to be as ignorant about the cartels and how we battle them as she is in the film, but the fact of the matter is she's not in Detroit or Chicago, she's in Phoenix, so she should know her sh!t and not be at all green when it comes to the cartels.

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#One Eyed Jack:

Honestly,I'm tired of all these idiots whining about the main character---it sounds like a lot of men couldn't stand the fact that she was the main character, and not a man. That's basically what I'm getting from all these stupid complaints about her. I saw and liked the film,even though it was very dark, disturbing and extremely violent at times---but that's what made it such a compelling film to watch. And the thing is, she was deliberately being kept in the dark about what a part of the mission was going to entail. In fact, she and the other agent working with her pick up on that fact about halfway through, and realize that they're going to have to figure out what the hell's going on, since nobody being upfront with them about what the end result of the mission was actually going to be. So all this nonsense about her being stupid is just plain old ignorant sexism---if the character was a man, there would definitely not be all these threads bashing him about every little thing and for his mere presence in the film.

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it sounds like a lot of men couldn't stand the fact that she was the main character, and not a man.

It's absolutely not an issue of the character's sex for me. It's an issue with the writing. Now, I will say that Kate is the best-written character in the film, but that's really not saying a lot, as it was all very poorly-written. But Kate is certainly a more compelling and more fleshed-out character than Matt Graver and certainly more realistic than the cliche-riddled cartoon of a character that is Alejandro. But she's still a very poorly-written, cardboard cut-out stock character just like the rest of them.

My point is that the biggest problem with Kate's character and the reason she does not work in this film is because her ignorance and naivety are not justified by her background. Again, she has been leading a kidnapping task force in Phoenix for 3 years. Phoenix is the kidnapping capital of the United States, most of which are connected to the Mexican cartels. There is absolutely no reason why a person, man or woman, in Kate's position would be so ignorant when it came to the Mexican drug cartels because that's who she would be investigating in the majority of her cases, and she would certainly not be naive to how the US government battles them.

These are merely the facts. It has nothing to do with her sex.

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Your post is one eyed to be sure.

What you clearly failed to notice was her being perennially weak.

I think it rather curious that you think there was no flaw in her character, and that these complaints highlight some sort of misogyny. A feminist should be pissed off at them making her as weak as she was.

She was weak. And there was never a time when she was allowed to be strong.

Her demands and resistance to the process that she volunteered to be a part of (in ignorance) were pathetic, half-hearted, and girlish. The spooks didn't take her seriously, and merely humored her where it was required. The reason they did entertain her minor fits was because they needed her presence, and as a patsy. They never needed her skills. Her skills were never proven to be of any consequence, she never contributed to what they were trying to accomplish.

Did you notice this?

Her friend, that was not invited, had studied law, but had some sort of combat experience, was similarly weak, and dear I say it girlish, and similarly utterly ineffectual. He was a black chauffeur, and she insignificant eye candy, from the perspective of the CIA, and the executive that ordered the operation.

Contrasted with all the other characters: the assassin, her lover turned would-be assassin, the spooks, the criminals, the mercenaries... she was weak, fragile and vulnerable, and she possessed no power not easily taken from her.

When she stood up for herself, or resisted, she was subjected to masculine power until she submitted.

This is of course part of the narrative.

But what made this a flaw was the film shallowly tried to establish her legitimacy (as a woman operating in a masculine world) early on with her avoiding being killed by the guard at the kill-house, and killing him turn (in the process discovering the corpses).

Count how many people are killed, how many cops are there. What are the odds of her being the one to shoot them. Irrelevant. The point was simply to establish her not being average, or (if we consider the rest of the film) useless.

I for one would have felt a more convincing woman in her role, forced to reevaluate her place in the society she had felt herself a part of, would have made a more interesting narrative. If this were the narrative, Emily blunt, and the director, didn't pull it off.

Compare her character to the female operative in Haywire...

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I think that Kate was supposed to represent our own naive view on wars on drugs, and in that sense it work very nice. But I do like her character, her stubbornness and naivety together.

Although she never had a win since joining the task force, I do believe she got herself a little victory at the end. The act of signing that document under duress at the end almost break her completely (in a sense of her beliefs and principals) but when she pointed that gun at him angrily and ready to fire, she brought it down instead like a *beep* you, I'm not like you guys"

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I didn't read it like that at all.

She was angry, but he was her only friend through that whole story. He had taken the assignment to get her to sign the document or assassinate her because he wanted to protect her. He might have even convinced them not to just kill her before getting her to sign.

He trusted her not to shoot him, or at least judged her not to be inclined to based on the relationship (he presumed) they had.

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They need her signature, so I don't think they ever have any intention to kill her. He probably was sent because he know her, so he could try to plead to her, and also because he's a very "persuasive" person. We can see that she was afraid for her life, but most than anything it was obvious that she was frustrated because she already know that she's going to sign it.

And I'd like to think that after he got his revenge, Alejandro just doesn't care anymore, she could kill him there and it won't matter that much for him.

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You can forge a signature... do you think the CIA would be incapable of forging one woman's signature?

Of course signing that crap, and then killing yourself would be suspicious as hell. So I have an issue with that idea. They would more effectively threaten her family. He says "don't stand on a balcony for a while". With the document signed it would make more sense to assassinate her some time after the fact. It prevents her from recanting, and looks legit because her death comes days after signing the document.

If he didn't care about dying he wouldn't have been about to kill her.

He saw his daughter in her, and if he didn't care about her killing him he wouldn't have agreed to the mission, which possibly required killing her. Did you not think his threat of killing her was a genuine one? He read and understood, her character, from the start. This is why he wasn't afraid to let her point a gun at him. This was all over for both of them.

Anyway enough of this useless navel-gazing, there are much more interesting dialogues to be had.


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Kate was way in over her head, which was the main dynamic in the movie. She's never taken a desk job, she just likes to break down doors. And she. The CIA shows up, they're on another level entirely. You can see it in her relationship with Alejandro: first she was dismissive of him, then intrigued and finally terrified. So they may all be carrying guns but they live in different worlds...that was also obvious when they went to Juarez like an army, not a task force.

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not_even_one; I agree with your opinion regarding Kate; the character was not the badass we might have expected from the opening sequence. In fact, she seemed not strong enough, at least regarding this new assignment with the CIA. I just watched this movie for the first time this weekend after hearing so many good things about it. I was, honestly, not impressed. Alejandro is the badass and his story would be great to see. But Kate's character was just too girlish, in my opinion, to be involved. Guess someone wanted to capitalize on the success they had with Blunt in her great performance in "The Edge of Tomorrow" (in my opinion, a terrific movie). But, sadly, "Sicario" is not a movie I will watch again.

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I disagree, in hindsight.

I just posted this in another thread and consider those two characters in this light:

He had been a prosecutor, in one of the most corrupt countries in the world. The line between cop and robber was muddy to begin with. When his family were murdered, and presumably nothing happened (note: his colleague saying what happened to him was wrong, or he felt bad for what happened to him... he wasn't talking about his wife and kids! You don't tell someone you feel "bad" about "what happened" when their family gets melted in acid!).

So he disregarded that idea of good, bad, law, etc because his family had been killed and he had been shafted. What he thought as a law student, or a prosecutor is irrelevant.

He was her, before his family were butchered. Law and order. Good and bad. Right and wrong. Afterwards he realised the rules didn't apply, didn't work, and only got in the way.

Perhaps this was the tilting point for her at the end. He told her go someplace simpler where she could be police (and live the life that he had before his family were murdered).

She could have shot him, and disregarded their friendship, kinship, whatever, but that was on the other path of ruthlessness and necessity that he walked. She didn't want it. And he made her choose, essentially protecting her. Some sort of patriarchal thing there, makes sense given he kept banging on about her being his daughter.

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Interesting point about the parallels between them. And the patriarchal nature of his attempts to 'protect' her.

I liked that whatever fondness he felt didn't stop him from hurting her, though. He shot her when she got in his way, and he threatened to kill her, as he would have with any male character. Equality! 

"What race are you? If you don't tell me I'll just...assume the worst."

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Yes, he was bound to the path he had chosen, and absolutely driven, and a pawn like her, why he would have killed her in the end.

There was the thing he'd become, and she represented some small absolve or link to the old him.

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I clearly agree the INTENT of including Kate in the story was to make it something other than a simple revenge story. and up to a point the dynamic of the relationship between Kate and Alejandro served that purpose. Still I felt Kate's character as written was rather muddled and unclear as to her motivations.

In words I get why they included Kate's character in the story, but the net result of such inclusion given the character as written was problematic and ultimately what made for the weakest part of the film.

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Without Blunt this movie (which I liked) and the sequel (which I HAD been looking forward to) would be just another SWAT/drug/military film, which I personally am not into. Bummer.

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I concur. If every1 r wolvez then there r no rabbitz.

Werd 2 ur mudda, bruddafckka

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i just sat throught htis movie and i HATED the Kate character. soap opera acting, the focus on cigarettes and the silliness of having a woman in any of these scenes. would have been a fine pic without her.

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