MovieChat Forums > Saat po long 2 (2016) Discussion > WOW! This Movie Just Killed Raid 2 And S...

WOW! This Movie Just Killed Raid 2 And SPL 1

posted 8 years ago by cyguration
21 replies | jump to latest

The ending was kind of weird and messy but oh man, this movie killed and buried Raid 2 and SPL 1.

Raid 2 tried to be really complex and stuff but it just didn't get it done. The action scenes were too over wrought and Rama turned into this superhero, which was just crap. It wasn't like the high-tension from the first Raid film.

SPL 2 combines the high tension from SPL 1 but with an even more complex story; the combination of human trafficking and prison corruption was an interesting mix. I also liked that Wu Jing and Tony Jaa weren't traditional good/bad guy buddy-up teammates.

This was some interesting storytelling with all the nuances and dynamics of real life. There were a lot of blurred lines in regards to morality -- and it's interesting that for a good portion of the movie Tony Jaa's character wasn't necessarily someone you could consider on the right side of the law. Just the same, Wu Jing's character was no saint either.

As I mentioned, I didn't like the messy ending... but man oh man that fight scene with the Warden was straight-up bada$$. There was a little bit of wire-fu involved but they tried keeping it fairly grounded. Great choreography and great action sequences!

Also that Riot scene... wow! That really put Raid 2's riot scene to shame. I should go on that board and make post about how much this movie took a crap on Raid 2 so people won't waste their time.

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[–] cousbrojs 8 years ago

The Raid 2 is still much better. Sure the story was too layered and action can be unbelievable, but it's much better made more consistent and everyone who has a main role are developed.

[–] stef-a 8 years ago

Action was better in SPL 2. That's the main point. Raid 2 only had the kitchen fight which was real great choreography, beside that the rest were just street brawls. SPL 2 had more scenes. Plot wise Raid 2 was better yeah, but not as good as SPL 1.

[–] cousbrojs 8 years ago

I'd say the prison riot, car chase and the big final half hour was amazing in Raid 2. SPL II had the prison riot (which yes is much better than The Raid 2, in terms of style and cinematography) and the end fight. I will say this, I loved SPL II more than SPL I, and I thought it couldn't even be topped! I love all 3 aforementioned films though, that's the kind of standard I expect from foreign action films. Good big name actors, great script and amazing action.

[–] cyguration 8 years ago

I think that was the biggest problem for me with the Raid 2, only the kitchen fight had really memorable, well shot choreography. Everything else just seemed like placeholder fights to get to the next scene, which was kind of disappointing.

In Raid 1 it was cool because the fights for the cops were necessary; they had to fight to survive. We got some awesome action scenes in the first one that were memorable, gruesome, brutal and well shot.

I guess I was just expecting more from the Raid 2 after the first one had so many great highlights.

[–] edit_reg 8 years ago

I'll have an ounce of what you're smoking. This movie sucked. The fights were piss poor in comparison to the Raid 2. Tony Jaa has seriously lost any ability he had back in his Ong Bak, Tom Yum Goong days and the other leads martial arts were average at best. As for the riot scene, do me a favour, you could see the extras laughing and waving their arms around as if they didn't know what to do and if Jaa had run through like that in reality he would have been beaten down instantly. Garbage.

[–] andrewhollingsworth 8 years ago

Yeah, Wu Jing was average. ?

[–] Ash_Hail_To_The_King_Baby 8 years ago

@edit_reg - If your brains were dynamite, you wouldn't have enough to blow the hat off your head. You speak like you actually understand martial arts; which is laughable. Then you top that by insulting the skills of those that actually put in a lot of training to hone their skills for our entertainment on the screen. These guys were in top form for these fight scenes and shared the screen time well in SPL 2. It wasn't a Jaa vehicle, it was a collaboration. Shared screen, shared fights. I am a fan of both Raids and both SPL's. But degrading yourself to petty insults of those with skills so high if you attempted it even in your dreams, you'd wake up with a headache for trying! You are a joke. The only way someone could explain martial arts to you in a way you'd understand is by drawing it out in crayons. Go back to your Xbox and show everyone your skills.

[–] edit_reg 8 years ago

Xbox? lol, I'm no console peasant and I've watched plenty of martial arts movies thank you, going back to all the greats with Bruce, Jackie, Flash Legs Tan etc. but you're probably too young to remember proper martial art films, they didn't use wires and gimmicks, only their skill, that's why these movies are such a disappointment. How can you say they were on top form? Have you even seen Ong Bak or Tom Yum Goong? Jaa is a shadow of what he used to be and he didn't need wires!! You're such an expert clearly, I bow down to your deluded knowledge, I presume you're a second dan black belt in talking $hit, your understanding of martial arts is up there with console ownership and with your logic you probably think Ash Vs Evil Dead is superior to Evil Dead 2. Tool.

[–] tueher86 8 years ago

This was okay only.

Not bad but not good enough for me to remember like I did with SPL1 or The Raid.

The main villain being nearly untouchable against two guys who spent half the movie beating up groups of men at the same time? Killed the intense build up of the final fight for me.

[–] EnglishSummer 8 years ago

How is it any different from Mad Dog vs Andi and Rama in Raid 1?

SPL 2 is superior because it is more mature and evolved with decades of the genre fused into one fight with Jing matching equal pace with Jaa. Their enemy an example of the future of martial arts cinema. Just a lot of good stuff going on in that final scene.

I've said this before but this is easily Jaa's best modern actioner and he made 3 last year one with Michael Jai White and Dolph Lundgren and the o the Fast Furious cameo. In SPL 2 Jaa is with the best fighters and choreographers from the Chinese film industry. They did a perfect job fusing his fighting ability and screen presence with their style. References to his early works are noted like the chain fists OB3 and the one vs many TY2.

This film was created with great respect to the genre and came at a perfect time with the two leads in their prime.

[–] cyguration 8 years ago

Very well said, and I agree.

There was a lot of respect paid to the genre, to the style of cinema perfected by the Hong Kong action industry, and to the martial artists involved.

I also loved how Jaa nor Wu Jing out-did one another, I thought they kept their skills in line with their cinematic universe characters, which is what helped make it more engaging than a lot of the other crap both Wu Jing and Tony Jaa have been putting out in recent years.

[–] jack_face 8 years ago

Everyone has their opinion but this movie didn't come close, not anywhere near, to being as good as the Raid 2. Or 1 for that matter. There really wasn't even that much fighting in this movie. It's more plot-driven than action. It's a good production but the cgi (especially the wolf) and wire-fu weren't well done. Less of both would've made this better. If anything, it copies some of The Raid 2 (knife guy vs hammer girl, the prison riot). I would've given this a 5.5 if I could but had to give it a 6. This movie shouldn't be approached as a straight-up action flick. It's not that at all.

[–] Oneohtrixxx 8 years ago

I completely agree. This was one of the better Tony Jaa movies, but nowhere near The Raid films. That prison scene was Disney compared to The Raid 2, and the wire-fu didn't help much. Still, all around good movie, but to say that The Raid 2 had no tension, or was pretentious, or that Rama is a superhero (after the first Raid, it's not unbelievable) is missing the point. The Raid 2 was a crime epic that was sequenced perfectly and ended wonderfully. I couldn't say the same for Kill Zone 2.

[–] NiteOwl94 8 years ago

Wow, not a chance. There was some nice choreography, sure, but it paled in comparison to the fights in the Raid 2. The hammer girl and the subway fight? The raid on the porno house? The car chase? The mud pit riot? The kitchen fight? Way more intense, way more brutal. Kill Zone 2 was decent, but Raid 2 was friggin epic.

[–] mattatpt 7 years ago

This^^

The bum in the night club with a totally bangin tune, and the bong sound the bat made as it tw@ted those melons! sure the film was a bit absurd but it was next level *beep* start to finish, spl 2 was a fun flick though, both raids still much better though.

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