MovieChat Forums > Take Me to the River (2015) Discussion > Great movie, but what exactly what was t...

Great movie, but what exactly what was the "family secret"?.....


...What was up with Molly and why was her dad pushing her on Ryder? And what was the true cause of Molly's bleeding?...

reply

I was also confused. This wasn't written well. The ONLY thing I can figure out that the father had told Molly to leave him in the woods to be lost or give time Molly and her father the chance to get their story straight. Which might explain that rather jaw dropping scene when she was on Ryder's shoulders when they were alone at the river.

I'm wondering whether Molly's dad was going to go after Ryder later or send someone to go after him. The reason for showing Ryder the gun and how to use it. Maybe an argument for "self defense" later.

However I suspect the secret was there was a history of sexual abuse, at least that was the implication. but that still doesn't explain why Molly's dad pushed her on Ryder.

As far as the girl bleeding, that can actually happen with activities such as horse riding or gymnastics. It's rare but it happens.

reply

The way I understood it was, Cindy and Keith had an incestual relationship as children and Cindy instigated it during games of chicken down by the river. Keith was pushing Molly on Ryder as a reminder? or as revenge for the Grandma believing he instigated their relationship or because she abandoned him in Nebraska. I'm not sure and this might be reaching because I thought he was creepy but I also think they were implicating that Keith is molesting Molly and that is why she was rubbing herself sexually against Ryder when on his shoulders and presumbaly that is what happened in the beginning but it caused some bleeding.

reply

the bleeding would only happen once though.

The chicken game would have definitely came from Keith, but it still makes no sense as why Keith was pushing Molly on Rider.I need to watch this again.

reply

I think Keith was pushing Molly on Ryder because when he was a little boy his sister pushed herself on him and he's been ashamed about it since his sister moved to California. I saw it as revenge for her leaving him and him being blamed for instigating their relationship as children. The weird behavior was meant to shame his sister and show that she wasn't actually better than him for moving away and forgetting their past.

reply

You raise a good point, but on the other hand, even though Ryder would not have molested Molly, why would Keith put Molly in that position or at risk? Seems cold hearted at best , borderline child abuse at worse.

I see where you are coming from though, and it's definitely viable.

reply

Isn't it obvious? Ryder's dad isn't really his dad. It's mentioned in the movie by the cousins. His mom ran away because she became pregnant with him. It's a partial explanation for Keith's complex and bizarre behavior toward Ryder.

It's a very twisted, ambiguous movie, much like "Shame," which people still don't seem to understand is about incest.

reply

....Yes, the movie is very ambiguous in many areas. It did seem that Keith was mad at his sister because of what she did to him when they were kids. He also seemed angry about the fact that his sister got money to go to college and he only got land. I still don't get why he felt the need to use his daughter and Ryder in what appeared to be his attempt to get back at his sister. Keith's behavior was very strange, to say the least.

reply

Well, if Keith did abuse Molly what could possibly be worse than that? Him using Molly as his twisted revenge to compromise the Californians as much as he can, seems "understandable", as he doesn't really care about his daughter.

reply

Yea okay
But no one was asking about that
We were asking why an overly protective father would basically prostitute out his 9 year old daughter and ask her to do the things she did

reply

Because, perhaps he's doing it to Molly himself. His line that he "trusts Ryder to be a real father figure to Molly" seems especially creepy. He wants Ryder, his sisters family, to get involved in something sinister as much as he can. He wants to prove they're not better than him, and he's not the only weirdo, because in his twisted mind it is still Cindy, his sister who's responsible for all of this, and Keith's own behaviour.

reply

He's 'overly protective' because that is exactly how incest fathers act. She's just his little sex toy, and she does what he tells her. It's no big deal to him to use his obedient little brainwashed slave to screw with his sister and their son.

reply

That makes no sense.
He was obviously very protective of his daughter (juicing by his reaction early on)
Then to get back at someone he prostitutes out his 9 year old daughter and tells her to seduce a 17 year old by grinding her vagina onto his neck?
It's insane! Lol
I'm not saying I have a better idea but there must be one.

reply

....Agreed. If Keith felt abused by his sister (when they were children), why would he push his daughter into situations with Ryder, when he knows that she could possibly be hurt too? Interesting. Oh well...

reply

If Keith abused Molly himself, it demands no explanation. His question to Molly "did he know how to play?" hints that Keith showed Molly the rules and all that that implies. His phrase that he "trusts Ryder to be a real father figure to Molly", said in that creepily cheeky voice, hints at that direction as well.

If Keith didn't abuse Molly and her chicken-fight behaviour was coincidental, perhaps he realised that Ryder, regardless of being a weirdo from Keith's point of view, was actually harmless. And Keith just wanted to play a game; to involve Ryder, to confuse him and in a way - shame him. Just like Cindy, his sister, did to him, and still felt she was better. So there was no "prostitution" involved, he knew Ryder wouldn't harm Molly and didn't know what was happening. Anyway, Keith could've been spying on them all along, so he was in control.

reply

...yes, I think you're on the right track. And yes the movie was very creepy---especially Molly's "chicken game" behavior...

reply

Just like one person in this thread, after Keith showed him his gun..I actually kept looking at the background when they were in the river waiting for Keith to show up and shoot dead Ryder and since he can manipulate his daughter to say or do anything, he would claim Ryder was going to or was trying to rape her....but obviously, after it didn't happen and when he went home and they were talking whilst eating danish cookies, We learnt that Cindy did the same thing to Keith when they were younger and maybe along the way, Keith liked it but his parents found out and Cindy blamed Keith for instigating it..I doubt Ryder is Keith's 'son' because this was a 'childhood game' and cindy looks to be in her late 30's early 40 and Ryder is 17 so I doubt it went past when she was 16

So why did he let his daughter do the same to Ryder?..to teach his sister a lesson for getting him caught up in this and than running off to UCLA forcing him to deal with how his "extended" family treated him...I think the only flaw in the story was that as her father, he "pimped" out his daughter but also, there was a good Chance he knew Ryder was gay and he was not worried about him doing anything to his daughter thus why he asked him about why he left "Julie" (his girlfriend) during the Taco "dinner" ..Looks like Ryder's grandma told them stories about cindy and ryder and even though she did not figure it out herself, Keith did, realizing Ryder was gay (his attire didn't help either lol)...i think he invited ryder to dinner to make him feel awkward like he did when he was younger as his sister threw herself at him (not sexually though)...but yeah the story could have gone 3 or 4 other directions, they choose the safe option...I don't think Keith was 'abusing' his daughters but he realised his 2nd eldest daughter, Molly was showing signs of what Cindy was when she was her age (abby was older as its implied when ryder thinks molly is the eldest and the father says that its time for Abby to buy new clothes implying she was the eldest but Molly was the one who matured earlier probably by a year)..the story is weak in the sense that to get his revenge, keith didn't even bother to realise that he might actually put his own daughter, Molly on the same road as his own sister Cindy....and a possibility that she might try to "chicken fight" with other boys in the area including those twin brothers (who could take it a bit farther).......I think when Keith (during the family gathering in the beginning) when Molly came running and crying (which he obviously did not plan) he mentioned after they take her inside to Cindy was "the last thing we need is you playing doctor" sounded a bit odd to me..which made me double think about cindy taking the 'chicken dance' a bit too far when she was younger...

Life is a joke, but atleast its a good one.

reply

Many good points, but what about Keith's creepy question: Did Ryder know how to play?
And his "father figure" line? If chicken-fight is all there is to it, why such shocked reaction from Cindy, when she punches Ryder? To me it seems that both Cindy and Ryder may have learned that Keith is abusive, and now he's trying to implicate the blame partly on them also; and they feel they can't do anything about it. They must keep silent and live with that uncomfortable knowledge.

So maybe there's more to Keith's creepiness than just being an awkward father.

If he wasn't abusing Molly after all, his reckless desire to "initiate" Ryder into chicken-fighting, was stronger than his fatherly instincts.

reply

I think the father felt safe putting molly in that situation because he knew Ryder was gay so would have no interest in hurting or or being sexually attracted to her.

reply

but why did molly orgasm on ryders neck and who taught her that? no there was some serious sexual abuse in her past. that is a sign.

reply

how would molly even know how to chicken fight? and that has to be done with 4 people. so the dad is obviously implicating chicken fight is an incestuous act and asking her did he know how to play was a way of finding out if his sister had abused her son as he abused molly. then he told the story of his sister begging to go to the river. Blaming her for the incest. Seems like he was trying to normalize it.

reply

I don't know why you're so sure he didn't plan the blood and crying thing at the beginning. That's why he wouldn't let ANYONE look at her. There was no injury.
He absolutely IS molesting Molly, he taught her the chicken fight. Everything about them screams incest. He didn't care about 'putting her on that road,' she LIVED on that road, she was his obedient little sex toy. The whole thing was a game to her, daddy's game, which he planned from the beggining. Everything from she won't let anyone tie her shoes but Ryder.

reply

I feel like there's probably something to the fact that one minute Keith is screaming for Ryder to stay away from his daughter, and the next he's deliberately trying to put them in rooms and situations together.

Honestly I was most confused about Keith's wife, she was acting like she knew what was going on when Keith was acting creepy to Ryder, does that mean she knows and she's okay with it? Maybe the overtalking was a way of covering up things.

reply